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bman in 2288 posted:Question: I'm pretty sure there's an interim part here on the Dreadful Wail. Are you not going to focus on those parts because there's no plot there? Or did you come here straight from the hospital with Hypatia? My videos will cover those parts. It's best not to hope for intermission videos from Coolguy I think he still hasn't finished the Dishonored ones.
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Apr 1, 2018 13:42
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Yeah I need to record those, but unlike the Dishonored 1 videos I know what I want to do with the interludes - that is, not comment at all and simply upload them. I forgot I hadn’t re recorded them after the third hard drive crash. I will do that probably tomorrow; Easter has me occupied with family today.
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Apr 1, 2018 13:57
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I don't understand the problem with the nonlethal option. It's a pretty final solution.
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Apr 1, 2018 15:58
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I'm okay with it purely for turnabout reasons. Coolguye didn't grab every letter in the place, but they make it pretty clear that Jindosh used the electroshock machine a fair few times to produce... 'less disagreeable' employees. Anyone who used that machine more than once for their own personal benefit, and was looking to use it on Sokolov to burn out all the unwanted bits, deserves a go in the horror himself. On another note, I enjoy the Hiram Burrows fans earlier in the level. I tend to follow a loose idea of "only steal from jerks and safemakers." Corvo/Emily is going to steal any runes or bonecharms you have hanging around, and peruse all your mail to find your darkest secrets, sure; but as long as you're not a dick (or a safemaker, who is asking for it by trade) then you get to keep your valuables. It's nice to find an apartment I can loot the heck out of.
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Apr 1, 2018 18:02
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double nine posted:I don't understand the problem with the nonlethal option. It's a pretty final solution. Subtle.
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Apr 1, 2018 19:20
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I had mixed sentiments about the nonlethal solution, until I looked at it in military context. Emily and Corvo - Dunwall military officers - conducted a civilian rescue from a weapons laboratory, then shut it down. They lack the equipment and time to physically sabotage Jindosh's workshop, so they're forced to neutralize the only vulnerable part of the production line: Jindosh. It's a genuine tragedy to lose his genius, but it is the literal only alternative to his death that Corvo/Emily have for shutting down his workshop (assuming they're unable to capture and hold him for reasons). It's a grim choice either way - grant him a pristine legacy with a graceful death, or take everything from him that would allow him to stay alive? Interesting to think of what that choice is like for Emily to make, since these are the difficult choices that rulers have to make.
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Apr 2, 2018 05:41
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Malah posted:I had mixed sentiments about the nonlethal solution, until I looked at it in military context. The mixed or negative sentiments a lot of people had at the time and continue to have with this game is a lot of what bugs me about the perception of this mission and Jindosh as a whole. This goes to the root of what I talked about in the video in that 'smart' people are given way more leeway in what and how they do things than other folks when, by rights, if you buy into the idea that they're literally able to do more and do better than the rest of the mortals, they should be held to a stricter standard, not a looser one. Smart people, strictly rationally, should be given the things they need to do their task preferentially to less seasoned or productive colleagues, but precisely because they have that preference they have a greater responsibility to use their resources properly and ethically. If they refuse to, they're less than worthless when compared to a 'mortal' because they'll consume tons more resources for a similar result. Jindosh spends the entire second half of the level making it absolutely clear that he has no interest in using his resources properly or ethically. His first preoccupation is his pride, and his second is his greed. The first is trivially obvious, but the second takes some folks by surprise when I bring it up. However, consider this: The Clockwork Mansion is more richly adorned than the Duke's palace in pretty much every respect except the bedchambers (which are designed like poo poo in the Mansion for both form and function). This isn't talking about the gears behind the walls or whatever have you, I mean literally the things inside the individual rooms are nicer and more numerous than the loving Duke has in his goddamn palace. This goes beyond normal rich gently caress ostentation, Jindosh is, for whatever reason, focally concerned with amassing and displaying wealth. Yet, a large subsection of people look past that without even blinking and focus on Jindosh's own claim of a loss of an age of progress and squandered genius, and how uncomfortable it is to kill that genius without killing the shell. Sorry, but that promise was dead and buried before Meagan ever arrived in Karnaca with our hero/ine. Maybe Jindosh's actual hopes to serve humanity with his creativity and cleverness died when the Academy kicked him out and he lost faith in the humanity he was trying to serve. Maybe it died before that - perhaps he was always an egotistical gently caress happy to suck up the savory juices of all those around him. Maybe he only grew into that brand of lying parasite after the Duke made it obvious he could be one. I dunno. That's for the biographer. For me as the player and agent of his downfall, Jindosh is already playing a game he can't possibly hope to win. He bluntly admits to consuming multiple fortunes creating the clockwork soldiers (which have no high-minded purpose like 'ending war', they're explicitly for terrorizing motherfuckers and force projection), and obliquely admits to spending multiple more fortunes just creating his Rube Goldberg House. In what universe am I supposed to expect that if I give him a stern talking to and a time out, he'll change his ways and do good things that push the ball forward on human living standards? You know, without requiring over-the-top temples to his towering ego or bottomless acquisitive urges? And, even presuming that he were to do so, can we even begin to tally up the debt he's got to pay off to the society he's been ripping limb from limb? Jindosh has made the lives of everyone around him incalculably shittier and shows no remorse or even dissatisfaction with the situation, yet folks give him a gigantic amount of credit and feel uncomfortable with disabling him. I feel like the disable is a good solution beyond twisted justice and taste-of-your-own-medicine revenge - it forces people to consider the entire environment AROUND this man. How did any of this poo poo make sense? How ridiculous was it for us to pander to this overgrown baby and allow him to keep on with his dumbass little fiefdom, rather than demanding he at the absolute least teach some other people what he's been doing? How immensely hypocritical was it to ignore how lovely of a person this guy was? It's fine to value intellect, and yes, it is absolutely rare enough that it probably does justify a couple of quirks. If a brilliant engineer or incredible scientist wants to sleep in and come to the office at noon, well, that's probably okay. But intellect has never made a bad person into a good person, ever, and it stuns me that people act like it does. I've run into this a lot in my personal career, which is probably why I'm so sensitive to it. After I've worked at a corporation for a few months, bosses tend to treat me with such deference that I no longer feel like I can count on honest feedback from them. It's come up a lot in exit interviews that they didn't want to inadvertently offend me or make me uncomfortable because I was so bright and productive. Which always offended my sense of fair play on some level or another - I shouldn't be allowed to ignore basic rules of civility or professionalism just because I do good work. That doesn't make me a good person. What makes me a good person is doing good work, with a good attitude, for a good purpose. If I'm failing on those then I'm kind of a lovely person and I shouldn't blame people for acting on that.
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Apr 2, 2018 10:05
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Personally I find nothing wrong with making Jindosh stupid because that's what I am every day I'm sure he'll be fine.
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Apr 2, 2018 13:40
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Coolguye posted:Yet, a large subsection of people look past that without even blinking and focus on Jindosh's own claim of a loss of an age of progress and squandered genius, and how uncomfortable it is to kill that genius without killing the shell. I was also giving him a lot more credit than he deserves for what he's been doing. As much as he wants to be like Daddy Sokolov, his work isn't revolutionizing anything or even really circulating around at all. His claims of progress and genius don't mean much when he's selling it all to the highest bidder so he can jerk off in his mansion while he screws with house guests. Beautiful dressing down, btw.
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Apr 2, 2018 18:08
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Yeah, the loss of his "grand intellect" is pretty much just a net benefit to the world and everyone in it. Especially since I suspect he's not the type who supports other people inventing and making fancy stuff and instead prefers to be the only one in the city to further boost his inflated ego.
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Apr 2, 2018 19:03
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It always struck me that the non-lethal options are sadistic in proportion with their targets.
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Apr 3, 2018 09:34
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I think that's part of why they are so satisfying (with one exception). Like in the first game where Slackjaw throws the Pendelton psycho-twins to die in their own slave mine.
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Apr 3, 2018 09:53
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TheLastRoboKy posted:Personally I find nothing wrong with making Jindosh stupid because that's what I am every day I'm sure he'll be fine. And by inventing a device that can turn anyone into an Australian, what more was there for Jindosh to create?
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Apr 4, 2018 03:16
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The non-lethal options have to immediately neutralize the target's threat potential while addressing the reasons why we're otherwise killing them. Removing the targets from power in the first game, and so far this one, has required crippling them in ways that are often particularly brutal to what they most hold dear. Of course death seems the more merciful outcome - they don't have to deal with the consequences of what they did.
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Apr 4, 2018 03:49
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I'll be honest, removing one's collected knowledge and education is one of the more existentially horrifying things to do to a person.
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Apr 4, 2018 08:37
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The really terrifying part, to me, is implicated by something we'll see later on. There is a recording later on relevant to this low chaos decision, and I'm looking forward to the thread's response. My stance, I suppose, is "It's horrifying and horrible, but it absolutely couldn't have happened to a more deserving guy." And yeah, I like that the Low Chaos isn't Happy Rainbow Bunnies No-Bad-Feelings Path. Low Chaos Corvo, in just the first game: Permanently marked a man as subhuman, to be given no aid under penalty of also being excommunicated, in a time of plague. Sent two nobles to be scarred, mutilated, silenced, and sent into their own salt mines to labor. Sent a noblewoman off with a creepy stalker paramour who, while her fate gets slightly retconned, was still all "She'll come around to love me. She won't have any other choice." Stripped an ancient hag of her power and immortality and left her at the tender mercies of a criminal boss. And well, probably ended up with the admiral being court-martialed with all due misfortune to follow but Corvo's hands are clean! The outcome for Jindosh isn't unusual except in that we tend to pride ourselves on our intellects and severing him from his is particularly terrifying. Nekomimi-Maiden fucked around with this message at 16:59 on Apr 4, 2018 |
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Apr 4, 2018 16:53
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I have nothing concrete to add to the discussion, but I giggled a little listening to Jindosh's post-lobotomy babble. I might be a tiny bit of a psychopath. So I've started a new run of this, and done something I should have done a while ago: Given myself permission to have fun. I'm still aiming for low chaos, but I'm not gonna try and maintain Ghost or avoid deaths entirely. Instead, I'm going to gently caress with guards to the maximum allowable extent of the physics engine. After my initial Clean Hands run, the High Chaos everyone-must-die run, and the Flesh & Steel Ghost run (Why did I do that), it is remarkably liberating. Some highlights: A Long Day In Dunwall:  I swear I have only the vaguest idea how this happened. I was trying to hit one of the guards near the bar on the docks with fish parts (By hurling them from the balcony near the Rat Plague holdover), gave up after running out of chunks, and went about my business. When I got to the docks, I was mystified to find no-one around. I heard one guard yell "I'll back you up!" but had no idea where he was. After looking around, I found these guys on one of the ramps down into the water, having apparently shoved one of their own off. And of course, I threw a grenade at them. Edge of the World: I had an immense amount of fun with the Far Reach upgrade that hauls enemies to you. I was expecting something like Knife of Dunwall-style slowly pulling them into your arms, not sending them screaming and flying over your head. I also sidestepped those two guards playing cards over a flammable bottle by using Bend Time, grabbing the bottle, chucking it off the side of the stairwell, then hugging both of the men. The three guards by the telescope on the third-floor balcony got a time stopped stun mine, which left me with an unconscious guard with an active stun mine stuck to his face, so I hauled him up to Hypatia's office and threw him at the two men guarding it. The Clockwork Mansion: I found a corrupt bonecharm that makes Far Reach pull people silently. It makes Far Reach take more mana, but screw mana, EVERYONE gets to fly! I hosed up a room in the gaurd post in Upper Aventa, leading to a full eight guards in the room. I momentarily panicked before remembering I was a magic assassin with a wide variety of tools at my disposal, popped time stop, and planted a stun mine where I had been about to receive swords in the face. This was the first time I'd been able to buy the Monkey Wrench sword upgrade, and hoo boy is it ever satisfying to actually assassinate those robots. Also, I knocked Jindosh unconscious using his own bottled fingers. Which I hadn't even been aware of until skool mentioned them. e: Also, I discovered that witches will just teleport out of the Far Reach pull.  Also my Strong Arms x4 bonecharm has a drawback: Eating food hurts me. That puts a crimp in the kleptomaniac vacuum cleaner routine. Dareon fucked around with this message at 17:19 on Apr 4, 2018 |
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Apr 4, 2018 17:10
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Nekomimi-Maiden posted:The really terrifying part, to me, is implicated by something we'll see later on. There is a recording later on relevant to this low chaos decision, and I'm looking forward to the thread's response.  Dareon posted:A Long Day In Dunwall: 
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Apr 4, 2018 19:12
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Jindosh Backward was pretty great, not gonna lie. Shame the witches are somehow just... hunting down and killing all the guards. For reasons? Invading from Dunwall?
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Apr 6, 2018 04:26
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Bonus content: Science Emily in Dunwall: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CMibzVOKEQ
Coolguye fucked around with this message at 08:44 on Apr 6, 2018 |
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Apr 6, 2018 05:06
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Hey Coolguye, it seems that skool's run of The Good Doctor is not linked in the OP. Also, that was some good science. I look forward to any future science corners that may come.
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Apr 6, 2018 05:39
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There may be future science
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Apr 6, 2018 05:47
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Cat Army 
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Coolguye posted:Bonus content: Science Emily in Dunwall: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDrdeHvEhns 
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Apr 6, 2018 06:27
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AradoBalanga posted:Hey Coolguye, it seems that skool's run of The Good Doctor is not linked in the OP. fixed, thanks!
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Apr 6, 2018 06:35
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Science Emily may have issues getting her next grant proposal past an ethics panel.
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Apr 6, 2018 06:36
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What if she's the ethics panel?
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Apr 6, 2018 06:38
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It's gooooaaaaaaal!Bruceski posted:Science Emily may have issues getting her next grant proposal past an ethics panel.
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Apr 6, 2018 06:53
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In low chaos dunwall Emily is the ethics committee because it's still Dunwall In high chaos dunwall the ethics committee only grants money to projects with live human testing and at least a 95% fatality rate
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Apr 6, 2018 06:58
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SCIENCE EMILY UPDATED Bonus content: Science Emily in Dunwall: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CMibzVOKEQ NOW WITH 100% MORE COMMENTARY
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Apr 6, 2018 08:44
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I should not have taken a bite of my food just as you started playing football.
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Apr 6, 2018 15:25
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Dareon posted:I should not have taken a bite of my food just as you started playing football. You gotta get your head in the game.
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Apr 6, 2018 15:28
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Yiss! More Science!Emily! More!
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Apr 6, 2018 15:32
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VKing posted:Yiss! More Science!Emily! There are more but the posting of them is in time’s grubby hands
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Apr 7, 2018 00:22
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skoolmunkee posted:There are more but the posting of them is in time’s grubby hands TIME TURNS OUT TO BE QUITE GIVING Science in Karnaca: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyFTueJKa0o
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Apr 7, 2018 00:48
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Those fish are really scary..especially when I accidentally knocked a person out but they fell into the water.
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Apr 7, 2018 03:19
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Please stop taking inspiration for Science Emily from the Punisher on Netflix. ...Alternatively, never stop.
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Apr 7, 2018 03:40
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Science!Emily is an absolute joy and I can't wait for the next one 
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Apr 7, 2018 04:43
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Cythereal posted:Please stop taking inspiration for Science Emily from the Punisher on Netflix. But Science Emily is interesting, so she'd have to start taking inspiration first.
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Apr 7, 2018 05:00
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Cythereal posted:Please stop taking inspiration for Science Emily from the Punisher on Netflix.
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Apr 7, 2018 05:27
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AradoBalanga posted:To be fair, if this was Frank Castle we were talking about, Karnaca wouldn't exactly be a coastal town anymore. It'd just be a pile of burnt ash and corpses. It's a joke. In the Netflix series, there's a scene where Frank cuts a guy's head off, rubber-bands a grenade to it, and tosses it into the middle of the guy's buddies who never realized their rear guard had vanished. Netflix Frank is... actually shockingly restrained, by Frank Castle standards.
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Apr 7, 2018 13:33
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