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I agree with camel on that. People dont realize this, but in order to conduct business in China you're generally forced into a partnership with a Chinese firm and your IP is subject to the Chinese government. That leads to exactly what you would think it would once Chinese firms build out competencies.
Boon fucked around with this message at 15:23 on Apr 5, 2018 |
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Apr 5, 2018 15:16
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TulliusCicero posted:Can you give us an actual cited example of this Hillary supporter in the wilds, or are we just going to talk about nebulous "liberals" some more? FWIW I see plenty of Bernie bashing and retweeting from Indivisible/#Resist folks I met in person when I was in Austin, and between them and the pro-Bernie feeds I follow that constantly poo poo on centrist Dems that make news (they hate the Cory Bookers and Kamala Harrises of the world, etc), I do worry that 2016 is going to loom larger over 2018 and maybe even 2020 than we want it to. I'm honestly not sure what to do about that. People ITT are right, these two sides fighting each other means GOP wins more races. I'm hoping, having seen the most recent special elections, that my fears are overly paranoid and that come voting time, people are still managing to do the right thing. Here's hoping? But online at least, the divide is real.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:19
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The GOP wins races when their competition offers no material incentive to vote for them.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:22
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VH4Ever posted:FWIW I see plenty of Bernie bashing and retweeting from Indivisible/#Resist folks I met in person when I was in Austin, and between them and the pro-Bernie feeds I follow that constantly poo poo on centrist Dems that make news (they hate the Cory Bookers and Kamala Harrises of the world, etc), I do worry that 2016 is going to loom larger over 2018 and maybe even 2020 than we want it to. I'm honestly not sure what to do about that. People ITT are right, these two sides fighting each other means GOP wins more races. I'm hoping, having seen the most recent special elections, that my fears are overly paranoid and that come voting time, people are still managing to do the right thing. Here's hoping? But online at least, the divide is real. I think the only way is a new candidate emerges in 2020 that everyone can get behind. And everyone forgets about 2016.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:23
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Boon posted:I agree with camel on that. People dont realize this, but in order to dilo business in China you're generally forced into a partnership with a Chinese firm and your IP is subject to the Chinese government. That leads to exactly what you would think it would once Chinese firms build out competencies. I think in general Trump is able to identify things that are legitimate problems, but then trying to fix them in the least useful way possible. Illegal immigration? Build a wall, instead of cracking down on people overstaying visas, etc Immigrants taking our jobs? Don’t even address the H1B visa program’s issues ISIS/Islamic terrorism? Keep anyone brown from entering the country, even the ones who are trying to flee our incessant bombing of their homes So on and so forth
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Apr 5, 2018 15:23
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Vladimir Putin posted:I think the only way is a new candidate emerges in 2020 that everyone can get behind. And everyone forgets about 2016. Agreed. I know it's "only" 2018 but I have to say, I wonder who that person is still. I figured they'd have emerged by now.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:24
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VH4Ever posted:Agreed. I know it's "only" 2018 but I have to say, I wonder who that person is still. I figured they'd have emerged by now. Kasich is probably gonna run against Trump on the GOP side at least, and it'll be embarrassing for everyone involved. Edit: when was the last time a sitting president has had to deal with a remotely-credible challenge for his own party's renomination, anyway?
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Apr 5, 2018 15:25
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VH4Ever posted:I'm hoping, having seen the most recent special elections, that my fears are overly paranoid and that come voting time, people are still managing to do the right thing. Here's hoping? But online at least, the divide is real. unless some disaster happens, or outrage fatique sets in hardcore, things will probably be okay
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Apr 5, 2018 15:25
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enraged_camel posted:I actually agree with Trump that the way China steals tech from US companies is a huge issue. Not to mention the way they force US companies to bend over backwards in favor of their Chinese counterparts.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:25
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Taerkar posted:I can't help but feel like at least some of the downplaying of the Russian involvement/interference with the 2016 election is because people don't want to admit that seemingly low-effort stuff like trolling on twitter and facebook could change the way people vote. I've heard more than a few talking head and spokesperson arguments that 'noone's vote was changed' which directly clashes with things that I heard while standing in line to vote on November 8th, but it's something that's never challenged as a talking point. What they mean to say is "no one's vote was manipulated after it was cast" (which is true) because that's the only thing they understand as election tampering.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:25
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If I was going to make a serious run at 2020 I'd lay as low as possible for as long as possible to avoid giving the GOP Hate Machine time to wind up.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:26
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RottenK posted:unless some disaster happens, or outrage fatique sets in hardcore, things will probably be okay Don't handwave away outrage fatigue, I'm fighting it within myself right now. But come election day y'all can count on me. Taerkar posted:If I was going to make a serious run at 2020 I'd lay as low as possible for as long as possible to avoid giving the GOP Hate Machine time to wind up. That's a good point actually.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:26
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Boon posted:I agree with camel on that. People dont realize this, but in order to conduct business in China you're generally forced into a partnership with a Chinese firm and your IP is subject to the Chinese government. That leads to exactly what you would think it would once Chinese firms build out competencies. As Trump would say, that makes China smart. Modern Chinese history is, in a lot of ways, a massive reaction to the indignities forced upon the Manchus during the 19th century, where Europeans and the US forced China after military actions to allow foreigners special freedoms and legal protections. The west was mad that local Chinese law was getting in the way of their wholesome businesses like opium selling. The indignity of the situation was a massive psychological wound to the country and the culture that is nowhere close to getting healed. That business setup that you're describing is directly tied to that historical legacy. Asking the Chinese not to have what they view as an essential safeguard from foreign dependence is going to be like talking to a wall.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:27
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Taerkar posted:If I was going to make a serious run at 2020 I'd lay as low as possible for as long as possible to avoid giving the GOP Hate Machine time to wind up. Brilliant idea. You should just register yourself as the "Mystery Candidate" and have a question mark as your profile picture, and no other info. People will vote for you for sure!
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Apr 5, 2018 15:28
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Taerkar posted:If I was going to make a serious run at 2020 I'd lay as low as possible for as long as possible to avoid giving the GOP Hate Machine time to wind up. the GOP hate machine doesn't needs time to wind up, literally anyone without an R next to their name will be baby raping communazi satanist the second they're anywhere near a position of power VH4Ever posted:Don't handwave away outrage fatigue, I'm fighting it within myself right now. But come election day y'all can count on me. i'm not, i know it's a threat so far trump and his gang are insanely bad at letting things settle down, by the time people tire of talking about one bad thing there's already ten new ones, and each of those outrages probably permanently put at least some people into gently caress YOU GOP mode when they hit really close to home RottenK fucked around with this message at 15:31 on Apr 5, 2018 |
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Apr 5, 2018 15:28
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Boon posted:I agree with camel on that. People dont realize this, but in order to conduct business in China you're generally forced into a partnership with a Chinese firm and your IP is subject to the Chinese government. That leads to exactly what you would think it would once Chinese firms build out competencies. yeah this is a real problem and slapping tariffs on China until they knock it off was absolutely the right approach it's just trump, before doing that, decided to start trade wars with everyone else as well who would otherwise cooperate in isolating China until they stopped
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Apr 5, 2018 15:29
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enraged_camel posted:Brilliant idea. You should just register yourself as the "Mystery Candidate" and have a question mark as your profile picture, and no other info. People will vote for you for sure! you want to change your name to "Generic Democrat" actually
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Apr 5, 2018 15:29
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Brony Car posted:As Trump would say, that makes China smart. I think that’s an over interpretation. Most likely their industries are severely behind after decades of spastic communism (of course in the context of their struggles in the late/early 19/20th centuries) and they are just trying to catch up.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:30
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FlamingLiberal posted:I agree too, but that is just an excuse for what he is doing, and his main trade advisor has wanted the US to go after China in a serious trade war for years Who's that?
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Apr 5, 2018 15:30
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axeil posted:Yeah. Imperialism isn't good by any stretch but compared to all the other empires of human history (Roman, British, Mongol, French, Belgian, etc.) the US is miles ahead in terms of "not committing crimes against humanity". Still not great, but a big improvement. Ogmius815 posted:Moreover, alternatives would be worse. The possible future age of Chinese hegemony, for example, is going to be a doozy. Lmfao
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Apr 5, 2018 15:30
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is there a good write-up about china and IP theft? i'd like to read up on it before i trust my half-assed gut instinct on the issue.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:30
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RottenK posted:he's right about a lot of things, including the Russia investigation Maybe they do, but hamstringing their credibility while they are the only thing that could possibly save us from a VERY loving REAL intrusion into our democratic institutions by a hostile foreign power seems... idk... stupid as poo poo, and suicidal. You and Glenn are prepared to throw the baby out with the bathwater, as long as the FBI gets to look stupid while you do it, and it's infuriating. The Russia investigation is getting all the attention it deserves. CNN/WaPo/NYT are all covering it and any major developements. Fox and talk radio are calling it a witch hunt and ignoring new developments to drum up public opposition to the only checks we have against further intrusions because, at least in the near term, the effects of those intrusions are a net benefit for them. No one is blowing this out of proportion, and if anything we aren't making a big enough deal out of this because, again, 1/3 of the country KNOWS IT PROBABLY HAPPENED AND IS FINE WITH IT BECAUSE THEIR GUY WON. Get ~the gently caress~ out of here, poo poo-head.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:31
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Vladimir Putin posted:I think that’s an over interpretation. Most likely their industries are severely behind after decades of spastic communism (of course in the context of their struggles in the late/early 19/20th centuries) and they are just trying to catch up. Other massively corrupt despotic governments are perfectly happy with imposing rent-seeking payoffs. The CCP's motivations are more nuanced.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:31
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RottenK posted:the GOP hate machine doesn't needs time to wind up, literally anyone without an R next to their name will be baby raping communazi satanist the second they're anywhere near a position of power As was demonstrated in 2016 if it's given enough time the GOP Hate Machine can start to change the views and opinions on people who aren't fanatical Republican Base (and would never vote anything other than straight-R anyways)
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Apr 5, 2018 15:32
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The issue isn't necessarily right wing media (although it's the root) since they are going to report that [Democratic Candidate] is the Anti Christ regardless. It's letting their bullshit percolate long enough that idiots at other media outlets start picking it up. Hillary's email bullshit wouldn't have been nearly as big a deal if the New York Times wasn't broadcasting right wing talking points at every opportunity and pretending the Republican congressional investigation wasn't obvious political mudslinging. Both Bush and Trump did the same thing but since papers and TV that regular people aren't digesting don't hammer it every second it's not a problem. Laying low is actually not a terrible strategy since it would cut down the time it allowed for CNN to start just asking questions about Hannity or Glenn Beck's latest insanity when the right wing solidifies on their fabricated outrage. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 15:35 on Apr 5, 2018 |
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Apr 5, 2018 15:33
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Rinkles posted:Who's that?
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Apr 5, 2018 15:34
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Chilichimp posted:Maybe they do, but hamstringing their credibility while they are the only thing that could possibly save us from a VERY loving REAL intrusion into our democratic institutions by a hostile foreign power seems... idk... stupid as poo poo, and suicidal. How much did you donate to McCabe's GoFundMe?
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Apr 5, 2018 15:34
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Shifty Pony posted:I think that's fair to say. Like, it's important to point out that... no. Putin is not a mastermind. Russian fingerprints are all over the 2016 election and we should be loving annihilating his rear end, and Clinton probably had a plan to, but because she lost and we have a bumbler in office... no one is doing anything about a daylight robbery! These investigations are just looking for proof that it happened, which is hard to nail down, unfortunately. Not all criminals can't convert pdf's into word. Marijuana posted:How much did you donate to McCabe's GoFundMe? Thoughts and Prayers. Chilichimp fucked around with this message at 15:39 on Apr 5, 2018 |
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Apr 5, 2018 15:35
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evilweasel posted:yeah this is a real problem and slapping tariffs on China until they knock it off was absolutely the right approach If only we had some sort of partnership with geographic areas between the US and China...
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Apr 5, 2018 15:35
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Like say what you want about Russia but whatever they did pales in comparison the amount of influence that Capital has on every single election ever
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Apr 5, 2018 15:36
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RottenK posted:well for me the easiest examples are people like Peter Daou and Candice Aiston Who the gently caress are they? Other than people that Twitter friends/algorithms put in front of you to get you pissed off and reinforce your belief that you're oppressed by Big Powerstructures?
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Apr 5, 2018 15:37
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Pablo Nergigante posted:Like say what you want about Russia but whatever they did pales in comparison the amount of influence that Capital has on every single election ever So? That doesn't make it any better.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:37
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Chilichimp posted:Like, it's important to point out that... no. Putin is not a mastermind. Russian fingerprints are all over the 2016 election and we should be loving annihilating his rear end, and Clinton probably had a plan to, but because she lost and we have a bumbler in office... no one is doing anything about a daylight robbery! lol calm down
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Apr 5, 2018 15:38
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evilweasel posted:yeah this is a real problem and slapping tariffs on China until they knock it off was absolutely the right approach A "Chinese goods and Chinese investment money can only enter the US if equivalent US goods and money could enter China in the same manner" policy would be reasonable.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:39
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Mustached Demon posted:If only we had some sort of partnership with geographic areas between the US and China... Are you taking about the TPP? Pre election, the TPP was probably one of the most vilified deals on these forums. And it was so hated that Clinton had to reverse herself on it despite being part of the negotiations on it.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:39
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Marijuana posted:lol calm down Sup, bro. How you doing with all this?
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Apr 5, 2018 15:40
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Brony Car posted:As Trump would say, that makes China smart. American imperialism and libertarianism is simply a historical reaction to the massive psychological wound inflicted by the Stamp Act, and gives full legitimacy to all of American political actions ever.
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Apr 5, 2018 15:41
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Taerkar posted:So? That doesn't make it any better. I never said it did
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Apr 5, 2018 15:42
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Vladimir Putin posted:Are you taking about the TPP? Pre election, the TPP was probably one of the most vilified deals on these forums. And it was so hated that Clinton had to reverse herself on it despite being part of the negotiations on it. A theoretical TPP could have been a good idea The TPP we were getting was just Oligarchy: International Edition
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Apr 5, 2018 15:45
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Chilichimp posted:Maybe they do, but hamstringing their credibility while they are the only thing that could possibly save us from a VERY loving REAL intrusion into our democratic institutions by a hostile foreign power seems... idk... stupid as poo poo, and suicidal. things i support: investigating russian meddling and taking measures so it doesn't happen again, punishing people who willingly assisted with that to help their team things i don't support: lionizing the goddamn FBI im in favor of Mueller's investigation and I hope it succeeds, I also hate the FBI and don't want people to treat them like heroes because they're finally doing something good for once
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Apr 5, 2018 15:45
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