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Oh god, that sounds terrible but thanks for posting the link. I am going to save that for if I get really desperate.
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Apr 10, 2018 17:38
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John Charity Spring posted:A guy called Sidestrafe has been streaming 9 hour chunks each day but he's honestly infuriating
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Apr 10, 2018 17:45
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He's running around with a Thunderbolt with barely any weapons or armor. The Thunderbolt is nothing BUT weapons and armor. 
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Apr 10, 2018 17:52
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AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:So infuriating, and so, so wrong. An HBS person really needed to step in and tell him that he was wrong about so many assumptions he, or commenters on his stream, made. Such as your drop weight affecting the difficulty of the mission. So absurdly hard to watch. I have no idea if it was related to this streamer or not but there was a tweet chain from everyone's favorite isildur explaining how mission difficulty is calculated. e: stupid twitter integration breakin' my tweetchains just go read their twitter. There are a number of modifiers (global, system-specific, contract type-specific) which result in a final difficulty score, and then the game chooses appropriate unit compositions based on that number. what you choose to drop with is somehow missing from this list.  Psion fucked around with this message at 18:15 on Apr 10, 2018 |
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Apr 10, 2018 17:57
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AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:So infuriating, and so, so wrong. An HBS person really needed to step in and tell him that he was wrong about so many assumptions he, or commenters on his stream, made. Such as your drop weight affecting the difficulty of the mission. So absurdly hard to watch. I didn't get that far in but that does sound like something he'd latch onto and be convinced of in the face of all evidence. He'd already had a couple big rants complaining about people giving him advice in the stream chat before I took my leave.
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Apr 10, 2018 18:00
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vorebane posted:http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Category:Mercenary_Unit_Logo_Gallery Check out that maybe, I think the black heart roses could work, or maybe something i havent seen yet. As a new englander I'm amused by the Green Mountain Boys' conflation of Vermont and New Hampshire.
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Apr 10, 2018 18:10
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Xarbala posted:I'll be perfectly honest, a 3025 mech roster without the macross Unseen is kind of depressing on the Heavy side so I hope they get brought in as, like, DLC or something Light 'Mechs are relatively few and far between in general. The heavy 'mechs are in the same boat. In TRO 3025 there were: - 12 light 'Mechs (5 Unseen (4 HG contentious)) - 19 medium 'Mechs (5 Unseen (1 HG contentious)) - 14 heavy 'Mechs (7 Unseen (6 HG contentious)) - 12 assault 'Mechs (2 Unseen (0 HG contentious)) The only reason it looks stacked is because more of the assault 'Mechs were made for BattleTech at the time, of them we can nix the Goliath straight away (it's a quad) and the BattleMaster isn't one of the Unseen "problem children." 3025 didn't have a wide variety of 'Mechs in general, which is one of the reasons I always cringe a little when people hold it up as the 'best' era of the game. Later eras made the balance problems more obvious, but those existed straight from the start, and variety offers a lot more tools to deal with those issues. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 18:24 on Apr 10, 2018 |
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Apr 10, 2018 18:21
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Ok but there are more mechs available for a 3025 campaign than just what is in that one TRO. It’s more a sampling of what’s around than the be all end all.
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Apr 10, 2018 18:23
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Hey, random question for Isildur that popped into my head: Do LRMs 'bundle up' like they do in tabletop? It's kind of hard to tell from the graphics.
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Apr 10, 2018 18:24
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Cyrano4747 posted:Ok but there are more mechs available for a 3025 campaign than just what is in that one TRO. It’s more a sampling of what’s around than the be all end all. you tell that to all the nerds screaming that a Black Knight can't be in this game because there were only 5 across the entire inner sphere, period, forever, that number is set in stone and unchangeable also their 3025 campaign just discovered another castle brian because they want DHS and gauss rifles also in seriousness, as far as I know 3025 and 3025 revised are the two sources for this era? Are there others? e: I should explain, I'm a believer in more is better. So I don't personally hold up TRO 3025 as the holy grail by which all is to be judged, because I never got into TT and i also believe creators can extend and expand their universes even after publishing a book that's "further along" the timeline than 3025 - that is, they can go back and retroactively change things. I think that's healthy and good even if TRO 3039/3050/etc exist. but I also know a lot of people do care about that kind of stuff.  Psion fucked around with this message at 18:35 on Apr 10, 2018 |
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Apr 10, 2018 18:26
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Cyrano4747 posted:Ok but there are more mechs available for a 3025 campaign than just what is in that one TRO. It’s more a sampling of what’s around than the be all end all. 3039 adds the Wolfhound and basically nothing else but variants for existing designs, and the Star League TRO includes the advanced tech that often gets called out as being 'the beginning of the end' (of boring 4/6 play). All BattleTech is good and fun. You don't have to like the Clans or anything, but asymmetric battles can be fun to fight. I built an entire LP on stacking the deck against players and then giving them one huge advantage to compensate. XL engines were a boon to the game. To bring things back to Xarbala's point: yes, the game needs more light 'Mechs, but that pool isn't particularly deep and heavies have the same issue. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 18:34 on Apr 10, 2018 |
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Apr 10, 2018 18:28
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Drake_263 posted:Hey, random question for Isildur that popped into my head: Do LRMs 'bundle up' like they do in tabletop? It's kind of hard to tell from the graphics. What do you mean by 'bundle up'?
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Apr 10, 2018 18:33
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John Charity Spring posted:I didn't get that far in but that does sound like something he'd latch onto and be convinced of in the face of all evidence. He'd already had a couple big rants complaining about people giving him advice in the stream chat before I took my leave. I had checked it out because I noticed he had gotten into the heavy mechs but yeah... I am usually fine with just scrubbing through videos or letting them play in the background but the defensiveness over his decisions, analysis paralysis and refusal to just try things instead of asking if something works then making his own assumption for nebulous reasons just makes it too much to deal with. Cohh may be hammy but at least he tried stuff and didn't whine to his watchers that this is just how he plays every few missions.
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Apr 10, 2018 18:34
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Back Hack posted:What do you mean by 'bundle up'? Tabletop LRMs hit in groups of 5 (5 damage to one location, 5 damage to another location, any leftover to the next location) rather than doing 1 damage per missile to 20 locations.
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Apr 10, 2018 18:35
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Oh yeah I’m not saying that later poo poo isn’t fun. Most of my problems with 3050 and later comes from the kind of hell munchkins that frequently get drawn to it. Let me tell you about the dipshit I knew in middle school who insisted on playing a half elemental/ half mechwarrior (genetics wise) clan freebirth IS merc who despite being a freebirth had both an elemental suit and some clan heavy Omni. Or the way he and his buddy insisted on scavenging every bit of salvage to the point of fielding full lances of clantech within a few sessions of starting a new campaign. I’ve had great asymmetrical campaigns with clan poo poo but Goddamn if it doesn’t also give fuel for your gaming groups that guy
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Apr 10, 2018 18:36
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Back Hack posted:What do you mean by 'bundle up'? I read that as meaning hit clustering. is that right? something like TT rules have you rolling LRMs in clusters of five when rolling for crits? if that's correct, i believe this game handles LRM hits differently but I'm not confident in exactly what those differences are. I do know some changes were made to make LRMs less absurdly powerful as pilot injury weapons. they used to be way, way too good at just killing pilots via repeated injury. e: beaten by PTN Cyrano4747 posted:
I don't let shadowdragon ruin my enjoyment of robot punching and neither should you, imo i'm sure for every person who had to suffer some 3050 rear end in a top hat like you, someone else suffered a 3025 rear end in a top hat who got a mint Star League mech handed down through their family personally from Kerensky's father's brother's nephew's cousin's former roommate before the exodus. assholes are universal, the era of BT tech doesn't change that. Psion fucked around with this message at 18:44 on Apr 10, 2018 |
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Apr 10, 2018 18:37
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PoptartsNinja posted:3039 adds the Wolfhound and basically nothing else but variants for existing designs, and the Star League TRO includes the advanced tech that often gets called out as being 'the beginning of the end' (of boring 4/6 play). I think it also adds the Merlin and Raven.
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Apr 10, 2018 18:39
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Maybe I missed it in one of the streams but are you able to just repair a cored out mech with no cost beyond repair time and c-bills? I think I've seen at least two streamers get their spider and a black jack destroyed at least once and then field them again later. I don't mind the abstracted way HBS is doing salvage but it seems weird that the only drawback to getting your mech cored is possible pilot death. Speaking of salvage, is it a bug that completing a mech from salvage has it fully equipped with its stock loadout of weapons, sinks, etc?
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Apr 10, 2018 18:44
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Cyrano4747 posted:I’ve had great asymmetrical campaigns with clan poo poo but Goddamn if it doesn’t also give fuel for your gaming groups that guy BattleTech's got an issue with this in general because it's arithmetic heavy (and attracts grognards because it's a war game) and, being from the 80s, awareness of the Geek Social Fallacy wasn't really a thing so the same people you'd have tossed out of a D&D group for their insufferable dumbassery were the same sorts who'd memorize all the missile tables and hit charts (and being able to do that poo poo from memory really, really speeds up tabletop play).
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Apr 10, 2018 18:45
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InAndOutBrennan posted:Ok blue ball thread. Recommend me a good turned based game I haven't played yet. I liked Xenonauts
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Apr 10, 2018 18:52
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Chance II posted:Maybe I missed it in one of the streams but are you able to just repair a cored out mech with no cost beyond repair time and c-bills? I think I've seen at least two streamers get their spider and a black jack destroyed at least once and then field them again later. I don't mind the abstracted way HBS is doing salvage but it seems weird that the only drawback to getting your mech cored is possible pilot death. Based on the streams I've watched, repairing cored mech (not including refits and replacing destroyed section) is very expensive, especially when you start to get into heavy and assault mech. Also, having a mech knockout of commission for several months when you only have so many of them on stand-by isn't exactly a minor drawback.
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Apr 10, 2018 18:58
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if I remember a screenshot I saw saying "no cost besides time and cbills" is a little misleading when the cost in both time and c-bills is enormous. There's more of a drawback than just pilot death. You don't have that mech for a long-rear end time and you don't have a lot of money you could otherwise turn into another mech, weapons, repair costs for the rest of your lance, argo upgrades ... like didn't cohh obliterate a mech somehow and then just go  for a while at the repair screen?
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Apr 10, 2018 18:59
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From what I've seen it's a good balance. Punishing enough that you don't want to be a dumb rear end, but loosing a mech isn't an automatic reload and restart the way it can be in other games.
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Apr 10, 2018 19:09
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Psion posted:you tell that to all the nerds screaming that a Black Knight can't be in this game because there were only 5 across the entire inner sphere, period, forever, that number is set in stone and unchangeable also their 3025 campaign just discovered another castle brian because they want DHS and gauss rifles I think the setting works better if you assume the TRO’s are “Most likely to see” mechs. Mainly because of the whole ancient half broken down backwater mechwarrior nobility thing in the pre 3050 setting. You just know that there’s some minor Viscount somewhere who’s in charge of some “rear end in a top hat of the commonwealth” planet who’s only useful export is like one retarded breed of fish who protects his fiefs riches with a Mackie that has half the armor stripped off and a large laser in place of the PPC.
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Apr 10, 2018 19:12
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The list of games where losing a unit is an automatic reload is a lot smaller than most people think. I expect people to poorly deal with it here as well.
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Apr 10, 2018 19:12
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Drake_263 posted:Hey, random question for Isildur that popped into my head: Do LRMs 'bundle up' like they do in tabletop? It's kind of hard to tell from the graphics. They pick a specific location and cluster around that location, but roll to-hit for each individual missile. So no one-roll for your LRM20 to see if it wiffs completely, you get 20 chances to hit with one missile each. On the "only c-bills and time" cost - that's a big cost. When your finances are measured in low single digit "months-till-bankruptcy", having a huge c-bill cost and months of repair time (during which you still have to pay your pilots and other assorted upkeep) is a big deal. Also, no parallel mech-tech work means multiple mech related work tasks can get real bad (super glad armor replacement is free and instant though). DatonKallandor fucked around with this message at 19:18 on Apr 10, 2018 |
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Apr 10, 2018 19:14
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Psion posted:like didn't cohh obliterate a mech somehow and then just go He had a million in the bank, but after repairing two destroyed medium mechs, plus refits, he was down to less than 200,000.
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Apr 10, 2018 19:17
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Back Hack posted:Based on the streams I've watched, repairing cored mech (not including refits and replacing destroyed section) is very expensive, especially when you start to get into heavy and assault mech. Also, having a mech knockout of commission for several months when you only have so many of them on stand-by isn't exactly a minor drawback. If a player unit is CT-destroyed it is still repairable and the state of its other locations depend upon how they were battered during the fight. I think Cohh loses a mech on the third mission to a CT-coring but the rest of it is pretty untouched. In the repair bay he only had to replace the center. Cored enemy units have less salvage pieces (the 3 to assemble a new mech bits). Also from his stream when you got those three bits it put together a fully equipped mech. PoptartsNinja posted:In TRO 3025 there were: That's the original 3025 and not the 3025 w/Star League downgrades shoved in, right?
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Apr 10, 2018 19:21
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Psion posted:if I remember a screenshot I saw saying "no cost besides time and cbills" is a little misleading when the cost in both time and c-bills is enormous. There's more of a drawback than just pilot death. You don't have that mech for a long-rear end time and you don't have a lot of money you could otherwise turn into another mech, weapons, repair costs for the rest of your lance, argo upgrades ... Fair enough, although I think that either needing a piece of salvage to repair the mech or to make the repairs cheaper would be a neat idea. I guess I'm coming from mekhq where a cored mech is basically written off as a total loss as far as my company is concerned. Speaking of mekhq, it would be pretty cool if later games had something like the contracts in mekhq. Like instead of each contract being a single drop, you might be locked into a series of missions over a course of time where you are expected to stay in system to drop your lance when needed.
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Apr 10, 2018 19:32
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AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:So infuriating, and so, so wrong. An HBS person really needed to step in and tell him that he was wrong about so many assumptions he, or commenters on his stream, made. Such as your drop weight affecting the difficulty of the mission. So absurdly hard to watch. Psion posted:e: I should explain, I'm a believer in more is better. So I don't personally hold up TRO 3025 as the holy grail by which all is to be judged, because I never got into TT and i also believe creators can extend and expand their universes even after publishing a book that's "further along" the timeline than 3025 - that is, they can go back and retroactively change things. I think that's healthy and good even if TRO 3039/3050/etc exist. but I also know a lot of people do care about that kind of stuff. *Acktchually* a fairly fundamental retcon happened before the grog's golden age, because the first material had the Inner Sphere going full Mad Max and having no Mech factories left. Hesperus II wasn't a prodigiously productive Mech factory, it was a big warehouse they dug parts out of to keep their salvage running. Unsurprisingly a universe where everything is breaking down and dying didn't jive with either the robot-smashing gameplay or the story of lostech renaissance they wanted to do, so they changed it. Shame they didn't continue to change things when it was needed.
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Apr 10, 2018 19:38
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DeepThrobble posted:Yeesh, stopping that sort of misinformation is why I posted Cohh's stream here. I've only watched a bit of the other guy's stream, but he seemed to be on good terms with the NGNG guys. Could they step in so Mitch can concentrate his yelling at the HBS team at this critical time, or is NGNG part of the problem too? NGNG don't really seem that interested in the game, weirdly. They have access but have barely streamed any of it and for all of their pre-existing Battletech knowledge (and experience with the backer beta) I found them to be worse than Cohh for decision-making and presentation. And one of them kept alt-tabbing the game to check his slack messages which was really offputting to watch, even as someone who's already committed to wasting several hours in the day watching streams of an unreleased game.
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Apr 10, 2018 19:43
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John Charity Spring posted:NGNG don't really seem that interested in the game, weirdly. They have access but have barely streamed any of it and for all of their pre-existing Battletech knowledge (and experience with the backer beta) I found them to be worse than Cohh for decision-making and presentation. And one of them kept alt-tabbing the game to check his slack messages which was really offputting to watch, even as someone who's already committed to wasting several hours in the day watching streams of an unreleased game. Yeah, I would have expected Cohh to be the one I couldn't stand but honestly his streams were the most enjoyable for me.
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Apr 10, 2018 19:50
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Rhymenoserous posted:I think the setting works better if you assume the TRO’s are “Most likely to see” mechs. I agree with this, and I wish more people did. someone tells me king crabs are rare, that's fine - it means don't use them a ton as a GM. Same person tries to tell me there are literally x in the entire IS, no exceptions, and I'm going to just roll my eyes.
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Apr 10, 2018 20:04
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^^^ That's the best way to take it. ComStar thinks there are [x] remaining in the Inner Sphere, but who knows what some farmer's going to dig up in the periphery when he CombineMechs a field that's been overgrown for 300 years.Taerkar posted:That's the original 3025 and not the 3025 w/Star League downgrades shoved in, right? Right. John Charity Spring posted:NGNG don't really seem that interested in the game, weirdly. Nothing weird about it, NGNG are PGI's marketing department, they're not being paid to hype another company's game. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 20:12 on Apr 10, 2018 |
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Apr 10, 2018 20:09
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PoptartsNinja posted:Nothing weird about it, NGNG are PGI's marketing department, they're not being paid to hype another company's game. Well that does make more sense then.
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Apr 10, 2018 20:12
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I hope when they eventually do a Clan expansion or sequel they let you decide when to pop the seal on being honourless scum by breaking a zellbrigen for the easy mission win and then spending the rest of the campaign being focus fired by ER PPCs and the like.
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Apr 10, 2018 20:13
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Strobe posted:I think it also adds the Merlin and Raven. Actually (  ), wasn't the Merlin the example mech from the original Battledroids mech creation rules?
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Apr 10, 2018 20:14
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Psion posted:I agree with this, and I wish more people did. someone tells me king crabs are rare, that's fine - it means don't use them a ton as a GM. Same person tries to tell me there are literally x in the entire IS, no exceptions, and I'm going to just roll my eyes. If it helps, I think a dev has said King Crabs are going to be extremely rare. Like, they only saw one once while play testing the campaign rare. I agree about the rarity/near extinction thing. Who cares. Coolest moment of Strafe's otherwise painful stream yesterday was when his Lance had just finished chewing through two lances when the last mech, which had been slinging some modest LRM salvos out of sight finally advanced out of the fog of war. Everyone assumed it was a Catapult or something. Nope, it was a drat Highlander 
Galaga Galaxian fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Apr 10, 2018 |
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Apr 10, 2018 20:16
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Chance II posted:Fair enough, although I think that either needing a piece of salvage to repair the mech or to make the repairs cheaper would be a neat idea. I guess I'm coming from mekhq where a cored mech is basically written off as a total loss as far as my company is concerned. Yeah i think that would be good, maybe just as an option. Seems like mech bits aren't too hard to get and being excited to see that hunchbach 4sp or w/e so you can finally fix your cored one would be neat and not too punishing.
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Apr 10, 2018 20:28
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Galaga Galaxian posted:Its not in specifically because they haven't figured out a satisfying way to do E-War yet. Mmmm if the wanted to model it on reality then they could change the “fog of war” when EW is present to just show a general red haze near where enemies are instead of showing outlines of vehicles or mechs. Then you could put a -% chance to hit on any mech/vehicle that the EW platform has line of sight to... or convey a damage reduction to friendly mechs if chance to hit reduction is too aggravating. EW is an enemy force subtractor, it doesn’t have to be overly complicated to be both realistic and fun. Honestly ace combat modeled it the most accurately I’ve seen in a game yet with their EC130, it put static on your radar and made your missiles miss a lot.
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Apr 10, 2018 20:31
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