Eastern Europe: Olivier's sphere of influence

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Eastern Europe: Olivier's sphere of influence

mmkay: Oct 21, 2010

Paladinus posted:

I guess it's something inherited from the Soviet past, and people still think that good thing only exist West of border. At airport duty frees you can see plenty of Russia speaking tourists buying copious amounts of alcohol, even though the same stuff is available in the supermarket five minutes from their house, but maybe costs a dollar a bottle more. It's ridiculous.

I might be brain broken in the morning, but I feel like you missed the link that started the discussion: https://www.theguardian.com/inequality/2018/apr/11/eu-moves-ban-sale-lower-quality-branded-food-eastern-europe

# ? Apr 15, 2018 06:52

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# ? May 16, 2024 09:30

cinci zoo sniper: Mar 15, 2013

Gobbeldygook posted:

That's really weird; honey bees require very little labor or capital to raise. I'd have expecteed local production to ramp up.

This is extremely wrong.

# ? Apr 15, 2018 08:53

cinci zoo sniper: Mar 15, 2013

fishmech posted:

I gather the local producers have been selling their best out of country and possibly diluting or otherwise stretching the rest.

Also this yeah, it is normal to have all nice goods produced in domestic and export qualities, where the latter is much better than the former. Same vodka bottle in Rīga grocery store and Rīga airport will be two entirely different drinks.

# ? Apr 15, 2018 08:55

Shes Not Impressed: Apr 25, 2004

I think the honey is pretty good here if you get it from the bazaar. It�s more grainy than I�m used to but then I assume it�s straight out of the bee�s rear end.
As for chocolate, I don�t mind Roshen or Milka. But the prices have gone up on them since I�ve been here.

As for olive oil, the big local grocery store sells it but it�s too expensive for my peace corps budget. I just use sunflower oil for everything. 1 liter of sunflower oil is around 25 hrvs while a small bottle of olive oil will run you close to 100 sometimes.

# ? Apr 15, 2018 09:21

Doctor Malaver: May 23, 2007; Ce qui s'est pass� t'a rendu plus fort

cinci zoo sniper posted:

This is extremely wrong.

How's that? You can buy a bee hive (insects + their house) for a 100�. As for the amount of work, I'm sure it's less than keeping livestock and most other agriculture.

# ? Apr 15, 2018 09:54

cinci zoo sniper: Mar 15, 2013

Doctor Malaver posted:

How's that? You can buy a bee hive (insects + their house) for a 100�. As for the amount of work, I'm sure it's less than keeping livestock and most other agriculture.

A good friend's dad is a professional bee keeper. It's insane amount of work from what I know, and you actually need to know what you are doing. Granted, dude also sells honey good enough that the stock goes to friends&family or rich foreigners.

# ? Apr 15, 2018 10:05

Cat Mattress: Jul 14, 2012; by Cyrano4747

Doctor Malaver posted:

How's that? You can buy a bee hive (insects + their house) for a 100�. As for the amount of work, I'm sure it's less than keeping livestock and most other agriculture.

Sure, one hive won't be very expensive nor much work. But it'll bring you peanuts. You want to make bees your livelihood, you will need hundreds of hives. And taking care of hundreds of hives is a lot of work, so you'll need specialized tools to make it faster and easier on your back. Especially once you take into account that to make your hives really productive, you'll have to move them to where the flowers are, so that they can start sooner and finish later. That's where you get specialized forklifts and trucks, mechanical extractors, and so on.

And then we can add that beekeeping in the 21st century is a lot harder than beekeeping in the 19th century, because pesticides are ubiquitously omnipresent, varroa destructor and vespa velutina and aethina tumida and myriad other invasive species are incredibly professional at loving up bees, and so on. Any of these problems could be faced if it came alone, but since they're there all at once, the extinction of the bees is looking like a very plausible medium-term scenario.

In China, they're hand-pollinating their flowers because they don't have bees anymore, and they chemically make fake honey from raw sugar also because they don't have bees anymore. This is the future of beekeeping.

# ? Apr 15, 2018 11:08

cinci zoo sniper: Mar 15, 2013

Yeah, that guy I mentioned has a few hundred hives on himself and hundreds of thousands of euros in infrastructure and technology investments, after you exclude subsidies and other assistance from the Latvian government and the EU.

# ? Apr 15, 2018 11:20

Libluini: May 18, 2012; I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...; Grimey Drawer

Cat Mattress posted:

Sure, one hive won't be very expensive nor much work. But it'll bring you peanuts. You want to make bees your livelihood, you will need hundreds of hives. And taking care of hundreds of hives is a lot of work, so you'll need specialized tools to make it faster and easier on your back. Especially once you take into account that to make your hives really productive, you'll have to move them to where the flowers are, so that they can start sooner and finish later. That's where you get specialized forklifts and trucks, mechanical extractors, and so on.

And then we can add that beekeeping in the 21st century is a lot harder than beekeeping in the 19th century, because pesticides are ubiquitously omnipresent, varroa destructor and vespa velutina and aethina tumida and myriad other invasive species are incredibly professional at loving up bees, and so on. Any of these problems could be faced if it came alone, but since they're there all at once, the extinction of the bees is looking like a very plausible medium-term scenario.

In China, they're hand-pollinating their flowers because they don't have bees anymore, and they chemically make fake honey from raw sugar also because they don't have bees anymore. This is the future of beekeeping.

Bee thieves can also be a problem, if rare. Last year some local bee keeper in Germany lost like 50k Euros worth of bees. Someone just walked into his forest and absconded some of his hives.

# ? Apr 15, 2018 14:03

steinrokkan: Apr 2, 2011; Soiled Meat

I know the idea of Polish Death Foods is pretty much a meme now, but some months ago I read a test by a local consumer report magazine that pretty much said the quality of food in EE EU members and Germany is a toss up (sometimes they are worse, sometimes even better, sometimes the same), and the real problem is that the same quality groceries cost more in the East than in Germany. Unfortunately I don't think this regulation is going to address this absurd inequality.

# ? Apr 15, 2018 23:32

Truga: May 4, 2014; Lipstick Apathy

Libluini posted:

Bee thieves can also be a problem, if rare. Last year some local bee keeper in Germany lost like 50k Euros worth of bees. Someone just walked into his forest and absconded some of his hives.

Also bees have been getting genocided in many countries recently, which I'm sure has nothing to do with climate change or all the barely tested high tech disruptive pesticides being used, no sir. https://www.independent.co.uk/environment/nature/honeybees-decline-pesticides-study-a6925936.html

e: also, for how poo poo imported foods in EE can get, one just needs to try the warsaw pact nutella. at least the they try to make it taste like it's something else in the western versions, here it's just cheapest straight cocoa and sugar mixed from the nearest supermarket lmao

Truga fucked around with this message at 13:28 on Apr 16, 2018

# ? Apr 16, 2018 13:19

Doctor Malaver: May 23, 2007; Ce qui s'est pass� t'a rendu plus fort

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6Ep2uL3AfA

Serbian foreign minister sings a Bosnian song to Erdogan. A mufti tips him.

# ? Apr 16, 2018 23:50

HUGE PUBES A PLUS: Apr 30, 2005

https://twitter.com/ow/status/986130203960279040

https://twitter.com/ow/status/986160447152885760

HUGE PUBES A PLUS fucked around with this message at 14:45 on Apr 18, 2018

# ? Apr 18, 2018 14:43

cinci zoo sniper: Mar 15, 2013

HUGE PUBES A PLUS posted:

https://twitter.com/ow/status/986130203960279040

https://twitter.com/ow/status/986160447152885760

Yeah our Russian partners are literally on fire over this. It sucks major rear end. For more details, you can check my post history in yospos security thread (hard to repost from phone).

# ? Apr 18, 2018 15:45

mobby_6kl: Aug 9, 2009; by Fluffdaddy

AWS disappearing should definitely be a contingency though. Hasn't it happened before due to a fuckup on their end?

# ? Apr 18, 2018 16:44

cinci zoo sniper: Mar 15, 2013

mobby_6kl posted:

AWS disappearing should definitely be a contingency though. Hasn't it happened before due to a fuckup on their end?

Not at this scale, no. When Zello was being run out of Russia, 4.5k IPs were blocked and threat was to ban further 15 million if Amazon did not comply (which they did).

This time around, government just banned 11-12 millions of Amazon IPs and started DDoSing some of the proxy services and VPNs inside the country.

AWS, or any other Western something with no legal representation in Russia, disappearing should be a contingency, but as always everyone has underestimated how much a Slav can shoot themselves in a foot to prove a point.

# ? Apr 18, 2018 16:50

OddObserver: Apr 3, 2009

cinci zoo sniper posted:

Yeah our Russian partners are literally on fire over this. It sucks major rear end. For more details, you can check my post history in yospos security thread (hard to repost from phone).

And for extra fun, it sounded like they didn't actually manage to block Telegram anyway?

# ? Apr 18, 2018 17:30

cinci zoo sniper: Mar 15, 2013

OddObserver posted:

And for extra fun, it sounded like they didn't actually manage to block Telegram anyway?

They did not, in fact. I still use it to talk to Russian friends and coworkers on hourly basis, and most of them don't even use a VPN of sorts, to my knowledge.

Just so you understand how funny is that, just today Roskomnadzor's Telegram-related bans did manage to take down the system in place for enforcement of said bans, as it both got overloaded by the ban volume and relies on American cloud services for statistics management.

# ? Apr 18, 2018 17:32

Spergin Morlock: Aug 8, 2009

cinci zoo sniper posted:

They did not, in fact. I still use it to talk to Russian friends and coworkers on hourly basis, and most of them don't even use a VPN of sorts, to my knowledge.

Just so you understand how funny is that, just today Roskomnadzor's Telegram-related bans did manage to take down the system in place for enforcement of said bans, as it both got overloaded by the ban volume and relies on American cloud services for statistics management.

I'm imagining some Russian IT guys working on the ban project with Yakity Sax playing in the background.

# ? Apr 18, 2018 17:53

HUGE PUBES A PLUS: Apr 30, 2005

Chadderbox posted:

I'm imagining some Russian IT guys working on the ban project with Yakity Sax playing in the background.

I'm imagining Russian internet infrastructure as the digital Admiral Kuznetsov.

# ? Apr 18, 2018 18:09

Paladinus: Jan 11, 2014; heyHEYYYY!!!

I predict that someone's close friend is going to get a huge grant to integrate blockchain in Russia in order to avoid this sort of situation in the future.

# ? Apr 18, 2018 18:17

steinrokkan: Apr 2, 2011; Soiled Meat

Paladinus posted:

I predict that someone's close friend is going to get a huge grant to integrate blockchain in Russia in order to avoid this sort of situation in the future.

So Russia is going to turn from an energy exporter into an importer?

# ? Apr 18, 2018 18:39

a podcast for cats: Jun 22, 2005; Dogs reading from an artifact buried in the ruins of our civilization, "We were assholes- " and writing solemnly, "They were assholes."; Soiled Meat

This is a funny piece of news:

https://eng.lsm.lv/article/society/society/baltic-translations-for-fox-tv-undergo-russian-censorship.a275385/ posted:

Baltic translations for Fox TV undergo Russian censorship

The original content of Fox TV channel is translated for Baltic audiences along guidelines that have been developed in Russia and require glossing over certain topics seen as sensitive by Russian censors.

NEPLP spokesman Kalvis Gavars told LETA that Fox is a TV channel in Spain�s jurisdiction and its programs are rebroadcast in Latvia�s territory, which means that the translation issues have to be dealt with between the holder of the programs� rights and the translators, while the quality of the translations is outside the National Electronic Mass Media Council�s area of competence.

According to a letter to the translators of Fox programs which has been obtained by LETA, the translators have to follow Russian subtitling guidelines requiring glossing over or �softening content� concerning accidents, homosexual relationships, �anti-Russian propaganda�, narcotics, extremist activities and suicides.

For instance, the translators are instructed to �soften� all negative language about the Russian military and space program, policies of the Russian president and government, while positive texts about same-sex relationships have to be made more generalized so they could be attributed to relationships of any kind.

Authors of the letter admit that such an approach to translation cannot be consider good practice but that Fox content comes to the Baltic states through Russia which is why the subtitles have to be in line with the Russian law.

�Of course, such softening of language can be seen as controversial and may not be in line with the common practice, but it is required by law,� the letter to the translators says.

Sille Russ, Fox Marketing and PR Manager for the Baltics, could not be contacted for comment on the translation guidelines.

Igors Djacenko, the Latvian head of SDI Media subtitling company, said that the new guidelines do not require the translators to change or distort information but to �double check� their translation of texts concerning the aforementioned topics.

�In the process of their work, the translators focus their attention on sensitive topics, mark them and together with editors assess the definitions and terms,� Djacenko explained.

Anda Rozukalne, a media expert and associate professor at Riga Stradins University, said that Russia uses any channels and tools, including translation, to distort information wherever it can.

She admitted, however, that under the current regulation NEPLP is unable to reverse an intermediary�s requirements regarding the TV channel�s content.

# ? Apr 18, 2018 19:12

Nenonen: Oct 22, 2009; Mulla on aina kolkyt donaa taskussa

This is really hosed up:

https://www.aldrimer.no/ber-russiske-myndigheter-stoppe-gps-jamming/

googletranslated from Norwegian posted:

Yesterday, Aldrimer.no reported that Norwegian aircraft flying to Kirkenes on March 14 this year experienced a loss of GPS signals.

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs (UD) now confirms that the incident is due to "jamming" in connection with a military exercise on the Russian side of the border.

"We can confirm that in March this year were reported on several occasions about the loss of GPS signals in East Finnmark. This was due to Russian military exercise activity. It says Communications Manager in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Frode Overland Andersen, at Aldrimer.no.

Andersen says that Norway has taken up the matter with the Russian authorities twice: Only after a similar event in September last year (then the big Zapad exercise took place on the Russian side) and once again in connection with the new event in March this year.

Norway has asked Russia to avoid 'negative consequences' in Norwegian territory.

"Norway has taken up the matter with Russian authorities. We have asked that the Russian side take measures that make the practice activities not adversely affected on Norwegian territory, "says Andersen.

It was Wednesday, 14 March this year, that Norwegian passenger flights to Kirkenes airport H�ybuktmoen, a few kilometers from the Norwegian-Russian border in the north, reported to Avinor's air navigation service that there was a loss of GPS coverage in the area. Landing systems at Norwegian airports normally assume that Norwegian aircraft have continuous access to GPS data. In case of loss of GPS data, Norwegian aircraft may lose the opportunity to land at the airport, especially if there is bad weather and visual maneuvering is not possible.

Not satisfied with just shooting down Malaysian airliners in Ukrainian airspace, Putin is now interfering with civilian aviation safety in a neighbouring NATO country. If these kinds of shenanigans continue then it's only a matter of time when a plane crashes due to loss of GPS in bad weather.

# ? Apr 28, 2018 10:50

Cat Mattress: Jul 14, 2012; by Cyrano4747

They don't have inertial systems to serve as a backup when GPS craps out?

# ? Apr 28, 2018 12:02

Sekenr: Dec 12, 2013

welp, wrong thread

Sekenr fucked around with this message at 14:32 on Apr 28, 2018

# ? Apr 28, 2018 14:20

HUGE PUBES A PLUS: Apr 30, 2005

Cat Mattress posted:

They don't have inertial systems to serve as a backup when GPS craps out?

If not, they will very soon.

# ? Apr 28, 2018 15:16

TheDeadlyShoe: Feb 14, 2014

I don't think those are accurate enough for the landing system...

# ? May 1, 2018 02:03

Cat Mattress: Jul 14, 2012; by Cyrano4747

TheDeadlyShoe posted:

I don't think those are accurate enough for the landing system...

You don't use GPS for that either, normally.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_landing_system

# ? May 1, 2018 17:49

alex314: Nov 22, 2007

Anyone got a picture of a huge buttplug sign left before Roskomnadzor building? I cannot find it anymore.

# ? May 2, 2018 18:13

cinci zoo sniper: Mar 15, 2013

alex314 posted:

Anyone got a picture of a huge buttplug sign left before Roskomnadzor building? I cannot find it anymore.

# ? May 2, 2018 18:27

icantfindaname: Jul 1, 2008

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-04-26/why-orthodox-christian-nations-remain-stuck

quote:

Their religious roots, not their Communist experience, support authoritarianism and risk aversion.

It�s sort of amazing to see how quickly the conventional wisdom has degenerated to 1950s, High Cold War vintage �Slav Brains Work Different� orientalism

# ? May 4, 2018 18:54

Grape: Nov 16, 2017; Happily shilling for China!

icantfindaname posted:

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-04-26/why-orthodox-christian-nations-remain-stuck

It�s sort of amazing to see how quickly the conventional wisdom has degenerated to 1950s, High Cold War vintage �Slav Brains Work Different� orientalism

ahaha oh god that's some mountainous bullshit.

I especially loved:

quote:

Western Christianity (which gave rise to Catholicism and Protestantism) placed emphasis on rationalism, logical exploration, individualism, and the questioning of established authorities.

Just alter this to exclude Catholicism and you had (and sometimes still have) the sort of poo poo people were talking 50-60 years ago about why those gosh darned Southern Europeans and Latin Americans are so rife with the dictators and whatnots (and why those Irish chumps are so poor and blowing things up). Unlike the fine upstanding ubermensch of Protestantism.
Also lol at citing Poland as having successfully transitioned away the authoritarian past.

Do these types ever have an explanation for anyone bringing up the US South in regards to their first-world making Protestant magicks? Because I feel like they want us to keep thinking of the Dutch and Norwegians, and never Alabama and Arkansas.

# ? May 4, 2018 19:28

Rent-A-Cop: Oct 15, 2004; I posted my food for USPOL Thanksgiving!

Grape posted:

ahaha oh god that's some mountainous bullshit.

I especially loved:

That poo poo doesn't even make sense. How did "Western Christianity" give rise to Catholicism? The first Pope literally chilled with Jesus. Catholicism predates the entire concept of Western Civilization.

And Eastern Orthodox is basically OG Catholicism.

Rent-A-Cop fucked around with this message at 19:42 on May 4, 2018

# ? May 4, 2018 19:40

Baronjutter: Dec 31, 2007; "Tiny Trains"

Grape posted:

ahaha oh god that's some mountainous bullshit.
Do these types ever have an explanation for anyone bringing up the US South in regards to their first-world making Protestant magicks? Because I feel like they want us to keep thinking of the Dutch and Norwegians, and never Alabama and Arkansas.

They always bring out the next red flag talking point, see, those aren't aren't racially homogenous so of course there's going to be big problems. The nordics are nice countries because they're pure.

# ? May 4, 2018 19:49

Baronjutter: Dec 31, 2007; "Tiny Trains"

Wife found an old picture of her grandpa chillin' with some Mentat lookin' dude.

# ? May 4, 2018 20:39

icantfindaname: Jul 1, 2008

Grape posted:

ahaha oh god that's some mountainous bullshit.

I especially loved:

Just alter this to exclude Catholicism and you had (and sometimes still have) the sort of poo poo people were talking 50-60 years ago about why those gosh darned Southern Europeans and Latin Americans are so rife with the dictators and whatnots (and why those Irish chumps are so poor and blowing things up). Unlike the fine upstanding ubermensch of Protestantism.
Also lol at citing Poland as having successfully transitioned away the authoritarian past.

Do these types ever have an explanation for anyone bringing up the US South in regards to their first-world making Protestant magicks? Because I feel like they want us to keep thinking of the Dutch and Norwegians, and never Alabama and Arkansas.

It's even better/worse because Bershidsky has been one of the last holdouts against the new cold war stuff in the liberal commentariat. If even he has given into the oriental despotism stuff, that's pretty much it in terms of it becoming the standard narrative

# ? May 5, 2018 00:59

steinrokkan: Apr 2, 2011; Soiled Meat

I mean like two days ago I listened to a podcast by bunch of supposedly progressive west coast liberals about rasputin, and they basically kept talking about how the russian soul had been formed by siberia and how rasputin is the model for current russian politics because russians are too dumb to move past medieval mysticism

the cold war racism brain rot is here, and it is widespread

# ? May 5, 2018 01:40

icantfindaname: Jul 1, 2008

steinrokkan posted:

I mean like two days ago I listened to a podcast by bunch of supposedly progressive west coast liberals about rasputin, and they basically kept talking about how the russian soul had been formed by siberia and how rasputin is the model for current russian politics because russians are too dumb to move past medieval mysticism

the cold war racism brain rot is here, and it is widespread

link?

# ? May 5, 2018 02:48

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# ? May 16, 2024 09:30

jonnypeh: Nov 5, 2006

Meanwhile in Estonia things are getting better. "Better".

The Reform party, who were in government for 17 years until fall last year have gotten a lot of their popularity back, standing at about 33% now. They now have a new leader, the daughter of one of our former PMs from the same party. Currently a MEP. Law education. But they still keep some untrustworthy previous cadre around. Oh, and they are a bit broke. Their popularity has risen mostly on the account of the current government being poo poo.

The current government consists of the center party, the social democrats and The Fatherland. They all pushed through some unpleasant changes in the taxes, which I've covered before. They reek of incompetence all around. Ministers come and go pretty quickly, these days pretty much nobodies are getting those jobs in preparation for 2019 elections. Probably so the more well known politicians don't ruin anything by accident. The support for social democrats has fallen from their highest 19% down to 8%, which means that they are not far off from that 5% threshold and might not get into the parliament next time. Same with the Fatherland (formerly known as IRL), who are now down from about 15% to 6%.

We also have the conservative racist party, their support has gone up to 19%. Mostly on the account of other parties being poo poo. But they still play their typical populist cards, this is an approximate quote from some supporter of theirs: "Rail baltic will come and EU will use it to colonize us with muslim immigrants while using it to strip our country bare of our forests, phosphorite and oil shale" : ) Because we have special kinds of natural resources that refuse to get exported by anything else other than standard gauge railways.

It also doesn't help that a minister who had to resign for drunk driving (which went undiscovered for about a month) got 29 000� in compensation for having to leave the office. How hard will it be for those conservative racists to bring that up in front of an electorate consisting of old-age pensioners or people who get maybe 800� net? Never mind the center party and their generous compensations to themselves while running Tallinn. We in private sector don't get anything for quitting our jobs.

# ? May 5, 2018 10:31

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