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Vermain posted:Really glad to see the Sweeper change made it through. Support felt like this constant struggle between roaming to help lanes/set down vision and staying in lane to soak up enough EXP to crawl to level 9 before the game ended. I'm starting to think the only thing staying their hand on Janna is that she's seeing the overwhelming bulk of autofilled support picks and they're worried about knocking her too far down. it would be good if she were removed from the game entirely, and all memory of her erased from the collective consciousness
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Apr 17, 2018 19:46
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Wangsbig posted:it would be good if she were removed from the game entirely, and all memory of her erased from the collective consciousness You wouldn't see me shedding any tears, but at this point, I'll take what I can get.
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Apr 17, 2018 19:48
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Gonna steal so many dragons with new Varus Q.
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Apr 17, 2018 19:50
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gonna be a lot easier to gank bot lane
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Apr 17, 2018 19:54
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njsykora posted:Gonna steal so many dragons with new Varus Q. Eh I miss the poke lethality varus mid. So much fun. Nowadays Varus q poke does no dmg because of guinsoo build.
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Apr 17, 2018 19:56
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njsykora posted:Gonna steal so many dragons with new Varus Q. lmao @ it not being capped against monsters. A good change. Wangsbig posted:it would be good if she were removed from the game entirely, and all memory of her erased from the collective consciousness  Methinks if you don't like Janna, the best League of Legends character, this game might not be for you.
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Apr 17, 2018 20:04
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Oh I didn't see the new Varus w passive which is a q change...
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Apr 17, 2018 20:10
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Real Janna talk, they made a good decision making her E a way higher cooldown so you have to actually think about how you use it. I think they should go further, instead of lasting five seconds and giving a shield for 70-210 it should last 2.5s and shield for 140-400. That would make it devastating if you really time it properly but it gives her lane 15 seconds of downtime without a shield. E: maybe even a spell shield-esque mechanic that blocks damage from the next auto or ability while it holds kingcobweb fucked around with this message at 21:43 on Apr 17, 2018 |
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Apr 17, 2018 21:41
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janna should not be forgiving to play at all. if playing janna can forgive the mistakes of your allies, she should be punishing for misplays all the more
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Apr 17, 2018 21:43
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i think her hurricane maneuver should have friendly fire. i think the shield should have a DOT effect or something added to it. i think the lines of code that insert her character into the game should be deleted one by one with no chance of recovery
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Apr 17, 2018 21:47
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She just needs to have her ult buffed number wise, then have her ult cd gutted; additionally, narrow the hitbox on the nado. Make her bonus move speed a dead man plate effect that she can consume to amplify her next spell by a percentage. Finally, nerf her bases more and put it into her ratios. Any of these changes would give her more dynamic power, with less uptime overall. With CDr, her peel can be on a lower cooldown that many initiations, so it causes a similar issue to heal and ignite.
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Apr 17, 2018 21:58
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i think janna's fine as is and thats playing exclusively carry diving fighters/bruisers
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Apr 17, 2018 22:15
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I don’t think her tornado needs to be touched, it’s the most interesting part of her kit along with the knockback on R.
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Apr 17, 2018 22:16
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Verviticus posted:i think janna's fine as is and thats playing exclusively carry diving fighters/bruisers Once she starts interacting with top lane champs she's fun and cool. The issue I have with her is how boring and safe her laning is. I played Sona into her the other day, which is far and away Janna's worst matchup bot lane, and all she has to do is just use shield when Sona uses Q until both supports are out of mana and/or the Janna team's jungler comes and kills the defenseless Sona. Janna's second-worst matchup is Nami, and Nami's worst matchup is Janna. That's just crazy. The mini-rework to Janna was supposed to sharpen her identity as the anti-melee champ that can bully those champions in addition to just deciding not to fight them, but it also gave her more power to trade back against almost all of them evenly. And laning phase is her weakness. There's just no realistic way to punish her. If she's ever going to get behind (or the Janna pilot just doesn't feel like playing aggressively), she can always just choose to sit way back and go basically even during laning phase. Having a foolproof fallback of barely losing lane isn't healthy.
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Apr 17, 2018 22:30
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oh, thats fair. personally i feel bot laners should die of boredom so maybe my perspective is less valuable on her lane strength
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Apr 17, 2018 22:36
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no ward? no sweat!
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Apr 17, 2018 23:48
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Perfectly done, verv.
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Apr 17, 2018 23:49
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id like to use this time to showcase how to do the rift properly which is to hold dps at 2.2k until the eye appears and then pop it at ~1.5 so people cant smite it away from you. thank you.
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Apr 17, 2018 23:54
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Verviticus posted:id like to use this time to showcase how to do the rift properly which is to hold dps at 2.2k until the eye appears and then pop it at ~1.5 so people cant smite it away from you. thank you.
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Apr 17, 2018 23:57
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God I fucking love Diablo 3 gold, it even paid for this shitty title
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misguided rage posted:You should probably have it facing the other way though so the random support wandering past can't steal it from you. this too
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Apr 17, 2018 23:59
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her laning is strong, but her shield is on a higher CD early, so janna's that make bad trades around shield uptime can have a lot of HP removed really fast. Good jannas with carries that also don't trade around shield uptime can be similarly destroyed.
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Apr 18, 2018 00:33
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i'm really not sure varus q needed an execute but okay
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Apr 18, 2018 02:17
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It’s that time of year https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/zjf6dLzc-ryze-work-on-pbe
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Apr 18, 2018 02:24
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kingcobweb posted:It’s that time of year https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/zjf6dLzc-ryze-work-on-pbe death, taxes, ryze reworks
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Apr 18, 2018 03:38
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I think it's really funny that their Janna nerf, their shot against a champion that's #1 in win percent and #5 of all champions, is... FIVE MOVE SPEED and FIVE DAMAGE off one ability That'll show her!!!
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Apr 18, 2018 04:01
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Janna being good is inherently good for the game, as evidenced by her being good during the entire period of the game getting better and succeeding, therefore a significant nerf isn't needed and she's fine.
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Apr 18, 2018 04:04
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Bring back beta Ryze.
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Apr 18, 2018 04:05
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kingcobweb posted:I think it's really funny that their Janna nerf, their shot against a champion that's #1 in win percent and #5 of all champions, is... FIVE MOVE SPEED and FIVE DAMAGE off one ability Like I mentioned upthread, I'm convinced they're treating her with kid gloves solely due to the extenuating factor of support still being the least popular role in the majority of divisions and the majority of autofilled supports gravitating towards her due to ease of execution and airtight laning phase. There's just no other explanation for it. They absolutely gutted Sona during preseason without a second thought, but Janna is given nothing more than a placebo nerf despite being the best support in the entire game in every metric for, like, 4+ patches in a row. gently caress, they hit support Miss Fortune harder than they hit Janna! Vermain fucked around with this message at 04:15 on Apr 18, 2018 |
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Apr 18, 2018 04:13
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Anyways, in non-Janna news, they're testing out some huge changes to mana on the PBE. Broadly speaking: every midlane mage (with the exception of Karma) had their base mana increased, their base mana regen increased, and their scaling mana values halved, in addition to a whole bunch of mana items being reduced in power. The waveclear problem is probably one of the biggest issues they've been grappling with of late. I broadly agree with the proposal that it's too easy to effortlessly waveclear after Tear/Lost Chapter for the majority of mages, but reducing waveclear has a bunch of knock-on effects: you have fewer opportunities to roam, are more vulnerable to lane duelists, can be punished heavily if you take a bad back, and have fewer ways of stalling out the game (which can lead to cascading snowballs where turret after turret is taking without the ability to stop it beyond a Hail Mary all-in). I think the way they're doing it here is sensible: you'll have a good amount of mana early before your first back and can stall out really bad matchups or apply pressure to sidelanes, but your ability to endlessly waveclear starts to drop off a cliff comparatively by the time of your first back. Blue buff suddenly becomes very important for sustaining waveclear, which opens up opportunities to contest it to make sieges more of a reality. Biggest problem is that it's going to require a fair amount of tweaking to get the values in the right spot (where waveclear isn't unlimited but you also have enough mana to actually participate in fights and trade) and that there's a handful of edge cases - mainly Karma and Morgana - which are going to be a nightmare to balance due to them flexing to support/mid.
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Apr 18, 2018 04:48
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So if I'm reading the foxfire changes right we're going straight back to ahri maxing foxfire first and chunking her opponents with no effort required aren't we?
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Apr 18, 2018 05:32
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kingcobweb posted:It’s that time of year https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/zjf6dLzc-ryze-work-on-pbe The endless saga of Ryze always entertains me.
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Apr 18, 2018 06:51
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Vermain posted:Anyways, in non-Janna news, they're testing out some huge changes to mana on the PBE. Broadly speaking: every midlane mage (with the exception of Karma) had their base mana increased, their base mana regen increased, and their scaling mana values halved, in addition to a whole bunch of mana items being reduced in power. Combined with archangel staff going from 3% to 1% AP based on mana, it was nice getting to play karthus again before he went right back into the dumpster.
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Apr 18, 2018 07:02
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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:Combined with archangel staff going from 3% to 1% AP based on mana, it was nice getting to play karthus again before he went right back into the dumpster. It goes back up to 3% when it upgrades to Seraph's, so it's only a temporary setback. Still these mana changes are gonna be rear end, especially for weird off-build mids like Malphite or Gragas or whoever that aren't getting any buffs to compensate for the loss in Doran's Ring.
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Apr 18, 2018 07:10
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its a shame that the side-effect of making mages have access to less waveclear is that all the manaless champs just get stronger cause while i enjoy them, i actually enjoyed it when mana was something to give a poo poo about AND there were mages in the mid lane
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Apr 18, 2018 09:21
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Vermain posted:Anyways, in non-Janna news, they're testing out some huge changes to mana on the PBE. Broadly speaking: every midlane mage (with the exception of Karma) had their base mana increased, their base mana regen increased, and their scaling mana values halved, in addition to a whole bunch of mana items being reduced in power. This is a really big change and I hope that they do it right because the need for wave clear is probably the biggest problem in midlane right now.
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Apr 18, 2018 12:53
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If we're still on the topic of league clips, here is one of mine of sion ult + ryze ult combo. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/218154251
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Apr 18, 2018 14:11
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Verviticus posted:its a shame that the side-effect of making mages have access to less waveclear is that all the manaless champs just get stronger cause while i enjoy them, i actually enjoyed it when mana was something to give a poo poo about AND there were mages in the mid lane Yeah that's what I see happening here - Instead of people playing mana mages but being more conservative about mana, they'll just stop playing those characters and play Zed/Katarina/etc. instead because they'll be much better off relatively. Which really sucks because I enjoy zero of those characters.
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Apr 18, 2018 14:39
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they URGENTLY need to remove all the yellow mana hereos from this game
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Apr 18, 2018 14:54
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The manaless champions always had the advantage that while the mana champion is spending 800+ gold on sapphire crystals and dorans rings just to be able to throw out enough abilities to kill someone before they go oom, the manaless champion spent that same 800+ gold on damage items to murder them, it was only recently that items like the buffed lost chapter gave those mana mages some offensive stats on par with a warhammer. At least besides zed the manaless champions have to get somewhat close to a wave to be able to waveclear it and put themselves in danger. I'll admit champs like anivia and karthus are on the strong side right now since the mana item changes but this is probably a bad way to go about it.
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Apr 18, 2018 15:02
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Verviticus posted:its a shame that the side-effect of making mages have access to less waveclear is that all the manaless champs just get stronger cause while i enjoy them, i actually enjoyed it when mana was something to give a poo poo about AND there were mages in the mid lane I think it's mostly okay. The two poster children for manaless waveclear - Zed and Katarina - aren't in the same boat in terms of speed/efficiency/safety as champions like Taliyah, ASol, or Anivia, and this particular change seems more intended to solve mid/late-game clearing problems instead of early-game clearing problems. Early-game clearing is a more complex issue because a lot of it is about individual enjoyment, and that leads to competing viewpoints about what laning phase should ultimately look like (slow and controlled farming vs. fast-paced all-in aggression). I think Riot is understandably skittish about making early waveclear bad or too mana intensive because of the drive for optimality at the higher end. If safe waveclearing is no longer a viable option early (either because of mana costs or some other mechanic that reduces gold/EXP gained), then strong duelists become the undisputed kings of mid and getting counterpicked means an even more miserable time than before. The way forward in this regard is probably more towards something like the cannon minion changes (to encourage fighting in lane) versus nerfing early waveclear.
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Apr 18, 2018 15:22
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