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How much money do you spend on this game?
This poll is closed.
Thar she blows ($300/mo.) 9 5.52%
We got our hooks in 'em ($100-$300/mo.) 11 6.75%
They's taking the bait! ($20-100/mo.) 25 15.34%
Toss 'em back in the sea. (F2P - $20/mo.) 118 72.39%
Total: 163 votes
[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

 
  • Locked thread
Ugato
Apr 9, 2009

We're not?
I have no idea how it works so I can’t recommend that. That’s just the only possible way I can justify that much currency for a 5% moogle of a specific TM. Especially when you can get a 10% all for 1/3 the amount.

E: there are a lot of variables I can’t account for, but assuming a generous result of 10k currency per run average that’s still 5,000 lapis over 20 different mk events (all of which you need a high amount of bonus for, to maintain your high currency income). So, barring a lot of luck on random or a concentrated event you could get a single TM done in as early as 15 months.

E: found the release write up on reddit:

quote:

Blank Container Moogles:

Fuse a Specific Trust Moogle to "imbue it".
Get it to 100% to gain the trust mastery.
Reward for Rank 500+
(And hopefully milestones...)

Ugato fucked around with this message at 18:30 on Apr 17, 2018

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BBPattyMeltz
Apr 12, 2018
Hey all,

I was asked a couple pages ago to post up my player ID: 245.663.580

Looking for as many goony friends as I can gather up. I am going through the google doc and sending out invites like a madman. Gonna be a little while till I am ready to start rocking some 800+ ATK/MAG units but till then at least I can offer event units and Fullbreak +... heh...

Dana Crysalis
Jun 27, 2007
the title-less

PaybackJack posted:

So what you all are saying is, get the Dark Veritas TMR moogle and sit on it. I'm assuming Genji Glove isn't worth getting because by the time these container moogles come along we'll be into the True DoubleHand meta.

I honestly feel it's more likely to get a DV on a daily then your chances of a blank container.

Mischalaniouse
Nov 7, 2009

*ribbit*
When this TDH meta gets here is it really like using dual wield isn't even viable anymore and everyone has to use TMRs that only come from 5* base characters just to be competitive? Or is it just if you want to be optimal?

NinjaDebugger
Apr 22, 2008


Mischalaniouse posted:

When this TDH meta gets here is it really like using dual wield isn't even viable anymore and everyone has to use TMRs that only come from 5* base characters just to be competitive? Or is it just if you want to be optimal?

It's only something to worry about for the BIS whales. Dual wield is never going to be bad, and once 7 star hits, people start getting bonuses to equipment attack while dual wielding as part of their upgrades.

Ugato
Apr 9, 2009

We're not?
Eventually tdh is available from mk events, too. I know for a fact it was up when I played JP briefly - during the Reagan banner, so before 7* even drops.

But yeah tdh is for the super whales who want absolute BIS. There are plenty of super strong units who don’t do tdh well at all.

Cao Ni Ma
May 25, 2010



TDH is just plain stronger in the japanese meta but its balanced out by just how expensive it is. Right now there is no contest that DW is the undisputed king of overall damage unless you happen to have space in your party for a finisher like Ang/Olive/C.Artemios but once TDH chainers with w ability come up they become damage kings. They are just incredibly expensive to kit out.

There are some differences between global and JP that will make it even more expensive to trick out a TDH unit too. In JP you can stack weapon mastery materias so single wielding a weapon doesn't impact your %attack that much. In global you cant, so dual wielding will inherently be easier to get to the %attack cap (which goes up to 400% with 7*) because they can use two different masteries and they tend to have inherent masteries as passives too.

TDH units also run much hotter than dual wielding units. Having to W-Attack and T-Attack high MP cost abilities make them burn through MP really really quick so you need a very strong MP battery to keep them going.

If the damage creep between them gets too high then its a relatively easy fix, just add more sources of dual wield %equip attack and raise its cap a tad bit.

Cao Ni Ma fucked around with this message at 03:09 on Apr 18, 2018

Dana Crysalis
Jun 27, 2007
the title-less
FINALLY we're getting the FFXIV Garuda raid. Hope you saved those Spirit of Freedoms! True Spirit of Freedom is an amazing 15% dodge materia.

BDawg
May 19, 2004

In Full Stereo Symphony

Dana Crysalis posted:

FINALLY we're getting the FFXIV Garuda raid. Hope you saved those Spirit of Freedoms! True Spirit of Freedom is an amazing 15% dodge materia.

Save 1 of the original so you can stack.

pezzie
Apr 11, 2003

everytime someone says a seasonal anime is GOAT

Just watch the best anime ever
Maybe?

Adventurer materia of different levels don't let you stack, so who knows!

AegisP
Oct 5, 2008

Dana Crysalis posted:

FINALLY we're getting the FFXIV Garuda raid. Hope you saved those Spirit of Freedoms! True Spirit of Freedom is an amazing 15% dodge materia.

Is it 15%? The picture in the announcement seemed to imply 20%. But then, their wording isn't precise generally.

Scrublord Prime
Nov 27, 2007


AegisP posted:

Is it 15%? The picture in the announcement seemed to imply 20%. But then, their wording isn't precise generally.

20% ATK, 15% physical dodge.


also a banner where a rainbow has a 1/6 chance of being Mercenary Ramza :yikes:


Phoenix has the undead magic killer on it and Raise if you use Roselia and her Triple White. 40% AoE revive on summon too.

CAPT. Rainbowbeard
Apr 5, 2012

My incredible goodposting transcends time and space but still it cannot transform the xbone into a good console.
Lipstick Apathy

Scrublord Prime posted:

20% ATK, 15% physical dodge.


also a banner where a rainbow has a 1/6 chance of being Mercenary Ramza :yikes:


Phoenix has the undead magic killer on it and Raise if you use Roselia and her Triple White. 40% AoE revive on summon too.

Then I would have a 7* Merc Ramza, which would be okay.

It turns out I'm getting a 7* Ace as of today, though.

Shoenin
May 29, 2013

Everynight I wake up Screaming.
(and beating the dragon)
Xenogears is a thing in jp apparently

Policenaut
Jul 11, 2008

On the moon... they don't make Neo Kobe Pizza.

loving Rico made the list but not Citan?

Mile'ionaha
Nov 2, 2004

Policenaut posted:

loving Rico made the list but not Citan?



I do not approve.

pezzie
Apr 11, 2003

everytime someone says a seasonal anime is GOAT

Just watch the best anime ever
Emerelda as the 4 star is a travesty. Best unit in the game.

CAPT. Rainbowbeard
Apr 5, 2012

My incredible goodposting transcends time and space but still it cannot transform the xbone into a good console.
Lipstick Apathy
Citan will be in round 2 as a 5*, probably.

Along with Chu-Chu and Kim/Abel, with Billy or Maria taking the "not a 5*" hit for the team.

CAPT. Rainbowbeard fucked around with this message at 04:41 on Apr 19, 2018

Ugato
Apr 9, 2009

We're not?
Enhancements confirmed for after maintenance. :toot:

Shoenin
May 29, 2013

Everynight I wake up Screaming.
(and beating the dragon)
They're saving Citan for later

its loving Citan, they're not gonna blow all their load this early. Honestly im kinda surprised Bart is a 5* but I see they made it a triple a la SD3. Rico being a 3* is about right tho

Shoenin fucked around with this message at 04:52 on Apr 19, 2018

Dana Crysalis
Jun 27, 2007
the title-less
Frost Flower Blitz +2
Materials:
Black Alcryst: 30
Black Milcryst: 23
Black Heavicryst: 15
Black Giancryst: 8
Black Purecryst: 2
Cost: 1000000
Effect: Ice hybrid damage (10x, ATK & MAG) to one enemy,Decrease ice resistance (75%) for 3 turns to one enemy

=> FFB +1 and +2 frames changed from
[[40, 47, 52, 59, 66, 73, 80]] to [[70, 77, 82, 89, 96, 103, 110]]
identical to Divine Ruination. Though effect frame is 30 instead of 40, unsure if it'll perfect chain

Cao Ni Ma
May 25, 2010



Yeah we don't know if the effect frames is going to make the chain break in between but if it doesn't Fry is going back up to the top of the tier list with those enhancements

I was expecting a 60 or 65 % imperil at most, 75% is huge for a unit that already hit as hard as she does

PDQ Law
Aug 4, 2011

Dana Crysalis posted:


=> FFB +1 and +2 frames changed from
[[40, 47, 52, 59, 66, 73, 80]] to [[70, 77, 82, 89, 96, 103, 110]]
identical to Divine Ruination. Though effect frame is 30 instead of 40, unsure if it'll perfect chain

This is the first I ever heard of effect frames. However, I note that FFB used to start at 40 with effect frame 0, while FFB+ starts 30fr later at 70 with effect frame 30.
Also, data miners used to assume the data for cover skills was Physical vs. Magical mitigation instead of min and max values, since there is no documentation.

Given that Gumi tends to make their GL-exclusive units top tier, I am still cautiously optimistic about DR chaining.

Dana Crysalis
Jun 27, 2007
the title-less

PDQ Law posted:

This is the first I ever heard of effect frames. However, I note that FFB used to start at 40 with effect frame 0, while FFB+ starts 30fr later at 70 with effect frame 30.
Also, data miners used to assume the data for cover skills was Physical vs. Magical mitigation instead of min and max values, since there is no documentation.

Given that Gumi tends to make their GL-exclusive units top tier, I am still cautiously optimistic about DR chaining.

Honestly, if he hadn't said what he THINKS effect frames are, I would have assumed they're something to do with the animation effect, delaying it some to make it look right when attacking. So yeah. We'll see!

e: from Reddit -

Update: New update has been pushed, and FFB frames changes again to

"attack_frames": [[70, 77, 82, 89, 96, 103, 110]],
"effect_frames": [[40, 40]],
It will now (likely) chain with DW Divine Ruination perfectly ٩( 'ω ' )و

Dana Crysalis fucked around with this message at 11:19 on Apr 19, 2018

McSpankWich
Aug 31, 2005

Plum Island Animal Disease Research Center. Sounds charming.
Let's have a Xenogears villains banner with ID, Grahf, and the guy with the big X on his face.

Evil Fluffy
Jul 13, 2009

Scholars are some of the most pompous and pedantic people I've ever had the joy of meeting.

Cao Ni Ma posted:

Yeah we don't know if the effect frames is going to make the chain break in between but if it doesn't Fry is going back up to the top of the tier list with those enhancements

I was expecting a 60 or 65 % imperil at most, 75% is huge for a unit that already hit as hard as she does

Every time an attack got a (great) debuff boost its been 50 to 75 so if Fryevia had only gotten 60-65% that'd have really sucked.

I'm not sure if I should keep my 1110atk Orlandu as my friend unit or swap in Fryevia after enhancing. Orlandu is probably still much more useful to more people on my list since I'm not about to toss a holy weapon on Fryevia. Assuming I even have a holy sword worth using.

PDQ Law
Aug 4, 2011
That updated data dump sounds like I was wrong about effect frames, but if FFB+ perfect chains with DR I am fine with that.

pezzie
Apr 11, 2003

everytime someone says a seasonal anime is GOAT

Just watch the best anime ever

Evil Fluffy posted:

Every time an attack got a (great) debuff boost its been 50 to 75 so if Fryevia had only gotten 60-65% that'd have really sucked.

I'm not sure if I should keep my 1110atk Orlandu as my friend unit or swap in Fryevia after enhancing. Orlandu is probably still much more useful to more people on my list since I'm not about to toss a holy weapon on Fryevia. Assuming I even have a holy sword worth using.

Put your Fryevia up. Orlandu friends can still chain with her, and they can use the new ice Katana with sick killers (or some other one, lots of ice weapons out there). Plus 75% imperil instead of 50%!

Cao Ni Ma
May 25, 2010



Yeah orlandu and vod mains should switch to ice element swords and chain with a Fry since they a whole lot more out of it.

Dana Crysalis
Jun 27, 2007
the title-less
Fry, she's... pretty good now, yeah.

pezzie
Apr 11, 2003

everytime someone says a seasonal anime is GOAT

Just watch the best anime ever

Dana Crysalis posted:

Fry, she's... pretty good now, yeah.



Curse your crazy rear end ring


Evil Fluffy
Jul 13, 2009

Scholars are some of the most pompous and pedantic people I've ever had the joy of meeting.
So I enhanced Duelist Pose to +1 and the "Boost MAG increase (high)" didn't actually do anything. Fryevia was 875 before it and is still 875 afterwards. There's no drat way she's at a % cap already either. Anyone else notice this? Boosting from +1 to +2 boosted her from 875 to 926 though. :shrug:

990 MAG paired with Siren.

arisu posted:

Put your Fryevia up. Orlandu friends can still chain with her, and they can use the new ice Katana with sick killers (or some other one, lots of ice weapons out there). Plus 75% imperil instead of 50%!

Yeah that makes sense.

I even have a copy of the ice (and fire) katana TMs for my own Orlandu... :getin:

e: I guess I need to grind some Wadow TMRs to replace magistal crests, finish tim's TM, and then figure out who my best +mag robe TMR unit is. Probably Victoria.

Armitage
Aug 16, 2005

"Mathman's not here." "Oh? Where is he?" "He's in the Mathroom."
Is she duel wielding? Her first enhancement for Duelist Post boosts MAG if she’s only wielding one sword.

Evil Fluffy
Jul 13, 2009

Scholars are some of the most pompous and pedantic people I've ever had the joy of meeting.
Yeah she's DW. I'm dumb and misread the boost as a separate, flat +MAG boost.


Bring on Fryevia 7* and W-Attack please.

hamburgers in pockets
Jun 18, 2005

Yeah, that's blood. It'll get better before the show.
Yeah, seems like all the Duelist Pose enhancement really does is make it so that she gets the same ATK/MAG bonuses whether she's single or dual wielding, which is actually kinda cool because I would take the numerical hit to have her dual wield before.

Is there really any reason to enhance Second Intention? It's not all that much stronger than enhanced FFB, and you miss out on the chaining frames, too. Honestly I've had Fryevia since the Easter banner last year and I don't think I've ever actually used that attack.

pezzie
Apr 11, 2003

everytime someone says a seasonal anime is GOAT

Just watch the best anime ever
Might come in handy at 7*, but for now I'm not upgrading Second Intention.

Dana Crysalis
Jun 27, 2007
the title-less

hamburgers in pockets posted:

Yeah, seems like all the Duelist Pose enhancement really does is make it so that she gets the same ATK/MAG bonuses whether she's single or dual wielding, which is actually kinda cool because I would take the numerical hit to have her dual wield before.

Is there really any reason to enhance Second Intention? It's not all that much stronger than enhanced FFB, and you miss out on the chaining frames, too. Honestly I've had Fryevia since the Easter banner last year and I don't think I've ever actually used that attack.

Duelist Pose +2 is 30% ATK/DEF/MAG/SPR when wielding a sword, period. Regardless of DH or DW. It is a fantastic boost.

Second Intention is not a good investment, it ranks incredibly low on the finishers chart someone made.

Cao Ni Ma
May 25, 2010



Second intention might only be good if her 7* passives boost its damage further and if she can self finish with it once she gets w-ability. Right now there just isn't a reason to boost it.

Ugato
Apr 9, 2009

We're not?

hamburgers in pockets posted:

Yeah, seems like all the Duelist Pose enhancement really does is make it so that she gets the same ATK/MAG bonuses whether she's single or dual wielding, which is actually kinda cool because I would take the numerical hit to have her dual wield before.

Is there really any reason to enhance Second Intention? It's not all that much stronger than enhanced FFB, and you miss out on the chaining frames, too. Honestly I've had Fryevia since the Easter banner last year and I don't think I've ever actually used that attack.

I would say the only reason for enhancing Second Intention would be to use her as a finisher. DH build probably hits pretty hard, honestly.

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Garth_Marenghi
Nov 7, 2011

Is Nameless Gunner Jake any good, just got him from todays free roll.
Also it sounds like I should put Fryevia-- and my 3 Orlandu on a team.

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