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I cracked and bought in again on my xbox (all dlc etc). Did the customary visit to Johnny 5 aces before leaving good springs to shoot some powder gangers in the face. Still can't beleave they got that in there.
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Apr 20, 2018 08:06
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Discendo Vox posted:"all the robots that didn't suck, plus a few that did." Don't you poo poo on General Atomics! Skynet will have words for you. And when I say words I mean 2mm EC rounds.
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Apr 20, 2018 09:54
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So after a couple of year away, I came back into New Vegas, with the idea being that i'd play all factions as much as possible, before swerving them all, cannibalizing some and installing myself as glorious leader. I just completed Volare and went back to House to let him know the Boomers were on side, and I immediately failed Don't Tread on the Bear! Does this lock me out of all NCR side quests, such as helping the Misfits at Camp Golf, or just the NCR endgame? I don't want to miss out on that sweet XP, but my last save was just arriving at Nellis and I really don't want to have to kill a bunch of stupid ants again
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Apr 20, 2018 10:18
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That only locked you out of the NCR's main quest path. As long as your NCR reputation isn't bad, you can still do all the various side-quests given by NCR faction NPCs.
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Apr 20, 2018 11:06
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I mean, even in the most benevolent of readings House does not give a poo poo about anyone outside his immediate bubble at all. It's like people who think Elon Musk is the great hope for a spacefaring humanity instead of someone looking to expand the blood diamond industry off-world. He's pretty much The Institute in terms of "lol gently caress these mutants, not MY earth! It just seems callous to favor an autistic technocrat instead of a recovering earth littered with terraforming kits and factions that are actively trying to learn from humanity's past mistakes.
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Apr 20, 2018 11:21
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Raygereio posted:That only locked you out of the NCR's main quest path. As long as your NCR reputation isn't bad, you can still do all the various side-quests given by NCR faction NPCs. Oh great, thanks! I was worried I'd not be able to get a decent ending for the Kings, but if I'm independent it should work out
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Apr 20, 2018 12:18
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Neurolimal posted:I mean, even in the most benevolent of readings House does not give a poo poo about anyone outside his immediate bubble at all. It's like people who think Elon Musk is the great hope for a spacefaring humanity instead of someone looking to expand the blood diamond industry off-world. He's pretty much The Institute in terms of "lol gently caress these mutants, not MY earth! I agree, House just makes things a bit more ambiguous by being generally non malevolent and being way more competent than other figures. The independence ending seems thematically like it’s supposed to be the good option, but all I can think of when it comes to freedom and independence is 1 you’re the new leader and 2 Freeside and West Vegas are terrible exemplars of self-government. All the recent Fallouts have suffered from the need for a lovely clash of civilizations narrative structure; NV comes closest to justifying it by a (courier’s) mile, but it still can’t take close scrutiny the way something less open ended can. Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 13:33 on Apr 20, 2018 |
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Apr 20, 2018 13:30
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Neurolimal posted:It just seems callous to favor an autistic technocrat instead of a recovering earth littered with terraforming kits and factions that are actively trying to learn from humanity's past mistakes.
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Apr 20, 2018 13:31
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Neurolimal posted:It just seems callous to favor an autistic technocrat instead of a recovering earth littered with terraforming kits and factions that are actively trying to learn from humanity's past mistakes. Favoring House doesn't injure those factions, and killing him doesn't improve their lot.
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Apr 20, 2018 15:18
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Byzantine posted:Favoring House doesn't injure those factions, and killing him doesn't improve their lot. You know, besides Freeside.
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Apr 20, 2018 15:28
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Frankly if there was an ending that improved the lives of every single upstanding group of persons in the Mojave wasteland, I'd be very disappointed. It's a violent, desperate world with limited resources and you're just an individual siding with a faction (or not) with its own priorities and outlook. You do the best with what you have.
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Apr 20, 2018 16:46
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The weirdest part of the Mojave's politics is that despite the fact that most of the area is free and unclaimed while the two big powers fight over it, most of the settlements don't have any real self-government of their own. Nipton had a mayor, Novac has an...owner? but most places like Goodsprings or Primm or Westside or Outer Vegas just have nothing. It's only the more hostile groups around the Mojave like the Fiends, Khans, or Brotherhood of Steel that even have some kind of leadership. Maybe I'd be more sympathetic towards the little people of the Mojave getting taken over by a greater force if they literally had any interest in their own independence. Otherwise, it seems like no real loss. Neurolimal posted:It just seems callous to favor an autistic technocrat instead of a recovering earth littered with terraforming kits and factions that are actively trying to learn from humanity's past mistakes. Honestly, considering how there's a bunch of farming operations going on and there's a good amount of foliage, the earth's pretty much recovered, no real need for extra terraforming. Consider how the Mojave looked before the apocalypse:  It's one of those things where the most implausible part of the setting is the fact that everybody's deciding to use the blasted, infertile wasteland of the desert as the place to rebuild society. You'd think the areas that aren't a horrible desert where people have to struggle just to get water would be the centers around which people would rebuild society.
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Apr 20, 2018 18:37
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SlothfulCobra posted:The weirdest part of the Mojave's politics is that despite the fact that most of the area is free and unclaimed while the two big powers fight over it, most of the settlements don't have any real self-government of their own. Nipton had a mayor, Novac has an...owner? but most places like Goodsprings or Primm or Westside or Outer Vegas just have nothing. It's only the more hostile groups around the Mojave like the Fiends, Khans, or Brotherhood of Steel that even have some kind of leadership. Trudy is the mayor of Goodsprings and I think the Primm sheriff also acted as their leadership in addition to protection (the real Primm is only slightly larger than the in-game depiction). I think Westside is the only true settlement that's completely self-sufficient and has no bureaucracy or individual leader, since it canonically grew from an agricultural co-op. Also, the reason the Mojave is a comparatively great place to settle is that it's not blasted, infertile wasteland. House's missile defense system prevented almost all the incoming nukes from hitting the region, resulting in an area with large amounts of clean water and surviving infrastructure like the Hoover Dam. It's noticeably one of the most advanced and well-off regions of America after the NCR, whereas DC and the Commonwealth were hit so hard that huge chunks of land are too radioactive to live in and clean water is a precious commodity that requires either pre-war stocks or radiation scrubbing.
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Apr 20, 2018 18:47
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SlothfulCobra posted:It's one of those things where the most implausible part of the setting is the fact that everybody's deciding to use the blasted, infertile wasteland of the desert as the place to rebuild society. You'd think the areas that aren't a horrible desert where people have to struggle just to get water would be the centers around which people would rebuild society. People didn't live there before, so it didn't get nuked, so comparatively, its doing pretty well.
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Apr 20, 2018 18:54
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The worst things about the Mojave are the temperature extremes and the fact that it didn't get nuked, thus leaving some bunkers with their own warheads unlaunched so lunatics with story obsessions can pop them and blame it on mailmen. Conversely, the East Coast needed someone who wasn't coming off 200 years of accumulated rads in their genes to figure out "let's make farms and build walls around settlements." 
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Apr 20, 2018 19:03
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The mojave has a lot of biodiversity in real life, and in the game it's teeming with surviving vegetation that hasn't mutated. The water table hasn't been poisoned for the most part, as well. Most of the problems with growing crops have to do with the immense heat and lack of irrigation. But keep in mind that with proper irrigation, even the most inhospitable places can become gardens. The middle east used to be a huge network of irrigated fields before the Mongols annihilated the infrastructure.
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Apr 20, 2018 19:10
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No even with irrigation the Mojave is a blasted hellscape. Even just growing grass requires importing soil from somewhere else. Like last week we had 40+ mph winds and a sandstorm because spring is actually just sandstorm season.
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Apr 20, 2018 19:25
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Internet Wizard posted:No even with irrigation the Mojave is a blasted hellscape. Even just growing grass requires importing soil from somewhere else. Like last week we had 40+ mph winds and a sandstorm because spring is actually just sandstorm season. They seem to be growing fine in New Vegas. It might not exactly match how the real Mojave is, but Westside's whole deal is that they produce enough crops to have a surplus to sell and this has let them maintain independence from the rest of the city. And "needing new soil and irrigation systems" is still a lot better than "this is a radioactive wasteland where nothing will grow for 5000 years".
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Apr 20, 2018 19:35
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Well, some things grow in the radioactive wasteland.
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Apr 20, 2018 20:35
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Bogart posted:The worst things about the Mojave are the temperature extremes and the fact that it didn't get nuked, thus leaving some bunkers with their own warheads unlaunched so lunatics with story obsessions can pop them and blame it on mailmen. Somebody better send some aloe vera to The Divide, because Ulysses just got burned. Bogart posted:Conversely, the East Coast needed someone who wasn't coming off 200 years of accumulated rads in their genes to figure out "let's make farms and build walls around settlements." Now, to be fair, even people without 200 years of accumulated rads in their genes are stupid as Hell on the East Coast: The Institute is literally the dumbest collection of evil "geniuses" that has ever existed.
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Apr 20, 2018 20:43
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Glad to see this thread will go on forever. That being said, gently caress NCR forever. Either go independent or have House as a boss.
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Apr 20, 2018 20:46
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jokes posted:Well, some things grow in the radioactive wasteland. I was talking more about The Glowing Sea and places like that. There's expanses of the East Coast where just miles and miles are likely to be inhospitable for generations, whereas the Mojave is more like small patches of radiation or toxic waste dumps. Plus the difficulty in getting fresh water in places like DC until the Jefferson Memorial is able to be turned on (which, optionally, may kill everyone who drinks from it depending on if you add FEV to the purifier). Actually, where the gently caress are all those noodles on the East Coast coming from? Everyone at the Brass Lantern in Megaton is eating noodles when they have no agriculture and fresh vegetables are so rare that they only exist in Rivet City. Are they dirt noodles?
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Apr 20, 2018 20:56
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fallout 3 is not a well-thought-out world
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Apr 20, 2018 21:06
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All the reasons they give for why these people are staying in the middle of a desert to rebuild their society are pretty contrived. What it boils down to is a bunch of contrived excuses to have an environment similar to Mad Max's Australian deserts. Fallout 3 just kinda imports the desert environments of the other Fallouts into the northeast, regardless of how well it fits. The muddy, swampy land of DC is all dried out and bleached white. The water is still there, it just somehow doesn't seep into the earth.
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Apr 20, 2018 21:21
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turboraton posted:Glad to see this thread will go on forever. That being said, gently caress NCR forever. Either go independent or have House as a boss. This is a thread that deserves it though, it's really great game. Personally I support the NCR in what they do to stop the legion, but after that I agree with you. House is a self professed ruthless autocrat. But so was Vetinari in Ankh-morpork. I'll be his Vimes.
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Apr 20, 2018 22:38
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Discendo Vox posted:I agree, House just makes things a bit more ambiguous by being generally non malevolent and being way more competent than other figures. Ehhhhhhh, I dunno about this part. House's competency is directly dependent on the play-style of the courier. If you agree to work with him then yeah he seems to know what he's doing, but it's really just you doing all the work. But if you accidentally murder him like I did on my first play-through then he comes off as a dingus who failed to get an idiot savant mailwoman to do his bidding after his first choice betrayed him because he couldn't be bothered to tell her "HEY! Don't touch that terminal! That's what keeps me alive!" and then she killed him with a golf club.
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Apr 20, 2018 22:56
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chitoryu12 posted:Actually, where the gently caress are all those noodles on the East Coast coming from? Everyone at the Brass Lantern in Megaton is eating noodles when they have no agriculture and fresh vegetables are so rare that they only exist in Rivet City. Are they dirt noodles? I always assumed that it was a nod to the pre-packaged ramen stuff, much like how the twinkies and TV dinners are still around, just like in Fallout 1.
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Apr 20, 2018 23:09
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Space Cadet Omoly posted:Ehhhhhhh, I dunno about this part. House's competency is directly dependent on the play-style of the courier. If you agree to work with him then yeah he seems to know what he's doing, but it's really just you doing all the work. But if you accidentally murder him like I did on my first play-through then he comes off as a dingus who failed to get an idiot savant mailwoman to do his bidding after his first choice betrayed him because he couldn't be bothered to tell her "HEY! Don't touch that terminal! That's what keeps me alive!" and then she killed him with a golf club. Same but NCR, if you don't step to fix every single branch of corrupted fuckup they have they will end in misery for the masses. gently caress the NCR. I didn't aid that little girl in Fallout 2 for this.
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Apr 20, 2018 23:51
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What NCR needs is more Fallout protagonists to come in every decade or so to kill a whole lot of people and sweet talk their way into mutual cooperation. It's not exactly a sustainable system since it's predicated on a metafictional mandate to produce west coast fallout games, but it does seem to be the best thing to advance their progress
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Apr 21, 2018 00:02
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turboraton posted:Same but NCR, if you don't step to fix every single branch of corrupted fuckup they have they will end in misery for the masses. quote:I believe you find life such a problem because you think there are good people and bad people. You're wrong, of course. There are, always and only, the bad people, but some of them are on opposite sides.
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Apr 21, 2018 00:25
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turboraton posted:Same but NCR, if you don't step to fix every single branch of corrupted fuckup they have they will end in misery for the masses. Basically every side is awful and incompetent unless the courier personally makes the effort to solve there problems in a humane way. The NCR, Mr. House, and independent New Vegas are all directly shaped by you. The one exception to this is the Legion, who are awful assholes whether you help them or not.
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Apr 21, 2018 03:40
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They just become efficient and successful awful assholes. Arizona Killer is such a fun quest. It sucks that the opposite side's version isn't nearly as fun.
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Apr 21, 2018 03:48
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Malpais Legate posted:They just become efficient and successful awful assholes. This is true, you can make the Legion incredibly competent, just not un-horrible.
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Apr 21, 2018 03:53
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I want stronger DLC/main plot integration so 'Courier sets up Muggy as the figurehead New Vegas deserves, while ruling from the shadows' is an explicit ending slide and not just in my head.
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Apr 21, 2018 04:25
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turboraton posted:Glad to see this thread will go on forever. That being said, gently caress NCR forever. Either go independent or have House as a boss. Yeah! gently caress the NCR! Who needs representative government, legal protection for the rights of man, separation of powers, and a democracy with nearly a century of success in improving the lives of its citizens to nearly pre-war standards, only with more concern for the protection of minorities? What the wasteland really wants is a totalitarian dictator! Because everyone knows that's a form of government that never goes wrong.
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Apr 21, 2018 05:23
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chiasaur11 posted:Yeah! gently caress the NCR! It's not a good idea to judge a government just by reading its press releases. Singapore in the Mojave turning back the Legion and forcing the NCR to reconsider the path that's been taking it further and further away from those ideals is probably a better net result than most possible outcomes.
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Apr 21, 2018 05:54
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Paracelsus posted:Singapore in the Mojave gently caress you, Lee Kuan Yew! *chews gum*
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Apr 21, 2018 06:11
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Paracelsus posted:It's not a good idea to judge a government just by reading its press releases. I'm judging by the end slides. Although it takes intervention from Courier Six to get the best outcomes in most cases, the NCR is still capable of delivering positive results for almost every faction, and the best possible results for a healthy portion of that group. House, meanwhile, is an rear end in a top hat. The Kings are as good an illustation as you could like of their comparative approach. With the NCR, as long as the Kings aren't in a state of open war, they're left in charge of Freeside. Assuming you help smooth things out, the NCR provides relief aid and allows the Kings to maintain control of the region (even if they'd prefer to be in charge). Meanwhile, unless the Kings outright attack NCR civilians, (which is pretty loving stupid on House's part, since he's depending on NCR tourist money for his project) House murders all of them. As I keep pointing out, the NCR was actually active in the region before House did anything, despite the fact House had decades when he could have been starting things off on his own, rather than waiting for a civilization to leech off of. The NCR committed blood and treasure to defend the people of the region before they had any prospect of payout (See: Ranger Unification Treaty). Meanwhile, House drove people out into the streets as soon as he saw money in it. The NCR's pretty far from saints, but they're the only one of the three main factions who ever act out of purely humanitarian motivations.
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Apr 21, 2018 06:46
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I read this guy post and his ideas but in reality all I see is Mr. Fantastic or Dr Hildern or ANY of the biggest empowered assholes you may ever see in charge of something. Man, gently caress the NCR. The cool NCR quests like the one where you have to rescue the troop husbando because command control wont save him or the one where you talk man to man with Hanlon are the ones where you really learn that ENOUGH is ENOUGH with the NCR. Begin again and far away.
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Apr 21, 2018 07:00
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Wait, what little girl in Fallout 2? Because, if its the one with the doll, I have never not chosen to gleefully destroy it in front of her.
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Apr 21, 2018 07:03
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