|
zoux posted:The year that Ultimates #12 came out was also the year we lost our poo poo at France over opposing the Iraq War and started calling them "freedom fries" so I'd hardly call it anachronistic for 2003. I imagine it's a direct reference to that. That’s… what I was getting at. It was a topical reference/critique/mindless repetition for the authors to make; it was an extremely anachronistic statement from a man born either during or shortly after The Great War, when France had fought on its own territory for four bloody years at the cost of millions of dead, who then fought in World War 2, where the complete destruction of the French army and ability to fight preceded said surrender, and who presumably, like his 616 counterpart, did at least some fighting alongside the French Resistance. The point I was going for is that the “French surrender-monkeys!” narrative is decidedly post-WW2 and mostly post-9/11.
|
#
?
Apr 26, 2018 21:26
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 21, 2024 19:06 |
|
|
Ah I see. Sorry for misunderstanding.
|
|
#
?
Apr 26, 2018 21:33
|
|
|
Pieces of Peace posted:That’s… what I was getting at. It was a topical reference/critique/mindless repetition for the authors to make; it was an extremely anachronistic statement from a man born either during or shortly after The Great War, when France had fought on its own territory for four bloody years at the cost of millions of dead, who then fought in World War 2, where the complete destruction of the French army and ability to fight preceded said surrender, and who presumably, like his 616 counterpart, did at least some fighting alongside the French Resistance. Though the idea of American servicemen from the era having no great regard for French leandership isn't at least completely foreign. The little my grandfather spoke of the French when he served in WW2 basically boiled down to a glowingly favorable opinion of the French people, but a complete disdain for their military and political leadership. He also wasn't a fan of Patton, so your mileage may vary.
|
|
#
?
Apr 26, 2018 21:51
|
|
|
Zaodai posted:Though the idea of American servicemen from the era having no great regard for French leandership isn't at least completely foreign. The little my grandfather spoke of the French when he served in WW2 basically boiled down to a glowingly favorable opinion of the French people, but a complete disdain for their military and political leadership.
|
|
#
?
Apr 26, 2018 22:16
|
|
Zaodai posted:Though the idea of American servicemen from the era having no great regard for French leandership isn't at least completely foreign. The little my grandfather spoke of the French when he served in WW2 basically boiled down to a glowingly favorable opinion of the French people, but a complete disdain for their military and political leadership. That's generally how the French see it, so that's kinda understandable.
|
|
|
#
?
Apr 26, 2018 22:18
|
|
|
Endless Mike posted:WW2 France was complicated to put it lightly. I honestly doubt your typical American GI at the time was going to know a whole lot about the specifics of what was going in other than "the French government decided to suck Hitler's cock rather than fight but there's also a bunch of Frenchmen fighting alongside us." Honest question — how well known in America (and the UK, etc.) were the struggles of the Maquis, the “Underground”, and other French resistance groups? My only historical source is Victory, the Sly Stallone WWII soccer movie where the French Underground gets him a fake passport, and it’s vague on the topic.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 00:24
|
|
|
Probably more people know about the Maquis from Star Trek than WWII
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 00:31
|
|
|
Nonvalueadded User posted:Honest question — how well known in America (and the UK, etc.) were the struggles of the Maquis, the “Underground”, and other French resistance groups? More Americans know the Maquis from Star Trek than History class.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 00:31
|
|
|
Nonvalueadded User posted:Honest question — how well known in America (and the UK, etc.) were the struggles of the Maquis, the “Underground”, and other French resistance groups? The French Resistance played a big part in the hit film "Top Secret".
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 00:37
|
|
|
I can't believe you guys have never watched Allo Allo.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 00:41
|
|
|
Shouldn’t have gone for the obscure reference mocking one of Stallone’s effortmovies when asking for information. I meant knowing about these things in a contempory sense. During WWII, were there newsreels played before movies extolling the valor of the scrappy never-say-die French partisans who’d never knuckle under to Fritz? That sort of thing.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 00:42
|
|
|
I played Medal of Honor II, that one had you play as someone in the French Resistance. Also, they mention Himmler and some point and I remember thinking to myself "Why did they censor Hitler's name?" I was not a smart boy.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 00:51
|
|
|
Wasn't that game the saboteur about a guy in the French resistance
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 01:01
|
|
|
Nonvalueadded User posted:Shouldn’t have gone for the obscure reference mocking one of Stallone’s effortmovies when asking for information. I meant knowing about these things in a contempory sense. While I don't know for sure, I'd venture to guess that newsreels were largely pro-US, anti-Axis than really attempting to tell the full story.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 01:15
|
|
|
Nonvalueadded User posted:During WWII, were there newsreels played before movies extolling the valor of the scrappy never-say-die French partisans who’d never knuckle under to Fritz? That sort of thing. It's important to remember that Hitler was a vocal advocate for national identity that many Americans at the time agreed with, and that the world was just exiting the era of empires so his aggressiveness toward neighbours was often described as "regrettable" rather than being seen as an alarming expansion and consolidation of power. He wasn't really anything more than an unusually ideological politician until the war was in full swing, and even then he wasn't a monster until the end of the war revealed what he'd been doing inside his territory.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 01:15
|
|
|
site posted:Wasn't that game the saboteur about a guy in the French resistance Yes but he was Irish because certainly no American audience is going to buy a game with a French main character and hero. Really fun game regardless.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 02:23
|
|
|
Android Blues posted:You're right about the "France surrendered!" thing, though. That's pretty anachronistic. That said, France did surrender in Steve's time, and by the same token that people from the past aren't necessarily collections of stereotypical attitudes, it's entirely possible he, who lived through it, thought that was a cowardly move. Who's to say? There was a really good issue in the regular Cap title a little after the Ultimates one, where he talks about his memories of working alongside the French Resistance and how much he admired their refusal to give up in the face of overwhelming odds and the literal occupation of their own country.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 02:29
|
|
|
Jerusalem posted:There was a really good issue in the regular Cap title a little after the Ultimates one, where he talks about his memories of working alongside the French Resistance and how much he admired their refusal to give up in the face of overwhelming odds and the literal occupation of their own country. ETA: Dammit, doesn’t work on craptastic image host I used because for some reason I can’t get into my imgur account on mobile. Open the pic as a new tab then click to embiggen, and I promise to use imgur or a real host from now on. And one of the best related jokes, from Nextwave: 
Admiralty Flag fucked around with this message at 03:38 on Apr 27, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 03:31
|
|
|
What is this, a panel for Ant-Man?
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 03:32
|
|
|
Ghostlight posted:
ArchRanger posted:Yes but he was Irish because certainly no American audience is going to buy a game with a French main character and hero. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 04:03
|
|
I would be surprised...
|
Well, when war comics were still a thing, DC had Mademoiselle Marie...  (You can tell she's French because she wears a pencil skirt and ballet slippers to a firefight.)
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 05:15
|
|
|
Selachian posted:Well, when war comics were still a thing, DC had Mademoiselle Marie... I would hope this comic is as fuckin' rad as the cover promises.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 06:10
|
|
|
Nonvalueadded User posted:Honest question — how well known in America (and the UK, etc.) were the struggles of the Maquis, the “Underground”, and other French resistance groups?
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 06:14
|
|
|
davidspackage posted:I would hope this comic is as fuckin' rad as the cover promises. Yeah that's a pretty awesome cover. You can't really genuinely have "wanted by the gestapo" on the cover of comics anymore.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 11:45
|
|
|
ArchRanger posted:Yes but he was Irish because certainly no American audience is going to buy a game with a French main character and hero. Fun fact, the game is loosely based on a real race car driver who joined the French resistance and fought the Nazi's. Only in real life he was British, not Irish. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Grover-Williams So the game designers correctly figured that audiences would rather play as an Irishman over an Englishman. The same line of thinking was used in Nioh.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 12:37
|
|
|
Selachian posted:Well, when war comics were still a thing, DC had Mademoiselle Marie... I like that her mugshot also has a beret and turtleneck. It's a thin cigarette and a baguette away from perfect.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 15:56
|
|
|
davidspackage posted:I would hope this comic is as fuckin' rad as the cover promises. I started reading the wiki on her because I was curious who that cover artist was (still looking) but I just had to share that she was Sgt Rock's only love interest, and at one point in DC canon had a daughter. The father? Alfred muthafuckin' Pennyworth. On reading about the woman who inspired Mlle Marie, Simone Segouin, I learned that "nom de guerre" is a thing, and was used extensively in the French resistance. You adopted a nom de guerre, and then if you got killed or went MIA, someone else would take up the name, to confuse the enemy and hide your identity. Just like comics! Pretty cool to read about real-life Batgirls.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 16:02
|
|
|
Push El Burrito posted:I like that her mugshot also has a beret and turtleneck. It's a thin cigarette and a baguette away from perfect. It looks like it should be out of an Airplane! style film, where she's hanging from a rope and shooting, and a guy walks up, snaps a photo with an old-timey giant flashbulb camera, ducks down out of frame, stands back up with that wanted poster, pastes it on the wall, and walks away, all during the roaring gun battle.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 20:15
|
|
|
Fantastic Four - Dark Reign #4  
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 21:27
|
|
|
JacquelineDempsey posted:The father? Alfred muthafuckin' Pennyworth. Seriously, the bit of lore about Alfred being a combat medic hints at a past that stretches far beyond the simple, unremarkable biography one expects of a rich family’s servant. Forget the panel about “Get out of my Batcave” from Injustice, even skip the admittedly cool Michael Caine black ops counter-insurgent hunting down evil Robin Hood story from The Dark Knight, just that this guy was a corpsman says a lot about him. TheCenturion posted:It looks like it should be out of an Airplane! style film, where she's hanging from a rope and shooting, and a guy walks up, snaps a photo with an old-timey giant flashbulb camera, ducks down out of frame, stands back up with that wanted poster, pastes it on the wall, and walks away, all during the roaring gun battle. ETA: “The Battle Doll?” I know it’s an artifact of the time but that’s just a lazy appellation. ETA 2: To contribute, some more WWII-related stuff. Not sure which is better, Fury smoking a cigar in his highly combustible oxygen-filled spacesuit, or Dum-Dum Dugan getting a helmet that fits over his bowler hat. 
Admiralty Flag fucked around with this message at 22:44 on Apr 27, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 22:36
|
|
|
Isn't Alfred canonically a SAS medic?
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 23:15
|
|
|
I think the specifics depend on the writer.
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 23:17
|
|
|
I love that Alfred got this multiple options past like the Joker but he's actually interesting
|
|
#
?
Apr 27, 2018 23:58
|
|
|
I found those pictures I was talking about :  I'm not sure what the source is, though.
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 00:11
|
|
Wheat Loaf posted:I found those pictures I was talking about : He's talking about Merlin I think.
|
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 00:21
|
|
|
Wheat Loaf posted:I found those pictures I was talking about : I haven’t taken the Super-Soldier serum so the only chances I get to compare myself to Jesus in a spoken monologue are when I help old ladies across the street or put an extra dollar bill as well as the coins I get back in change in the tip jar when I buy coffee.
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 00:29
|
|
|
I do it any time I let someone else have the last slice.
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 00:36
|
|
|
Autism Sneaks posted:Fantastic Four - Dark Reign #4 No wonder Osborn usually relies on bombs, he's a terrible shot.
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 01:17
|
|
Lobok posted:No wonder Osborn usually relies on bombs, he's a terrible shot. Just once I'd like to see Batman just get shot by a guy he's charging at and die.
|
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 01:59
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 21, 2024 19:06 |
|
|
JacquelineDempsey posted:I started reading the wiki on her because I was curious who that cover artist was (still looking) but I just had to share that she was Sgt Rock's only love interest, and at one point in DC canon had a daughter. The father? Alfred muthafuckin' Pennyworth. I'm pretty sure the earlier cover is Jerry Grandenetti. As for Rock and Marie, well...  It's a bit surprising to remember that Sgt. Rock ran for over 400 issues when he's barely remembered today.
|
|
#
?
Apr 28, 2018 02:10
|
|