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CharlestheHammer posted:That would completely change your point so yes I think it would have helped. I don't think it would have changed my point, but I'm mired in "well I know what I meant". I'm distracted this week. Sorry for communicating poorly and derailing the thread. My posts did not age well.
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May 11, 2018 22:33
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I think Elementary handles cops well. Some are ok and some are corrupt as gently caress or lazy or incompetent or unwilling to learn, at the rate of most other people on the show in other jobs. They’ve had cops get fired though which is pretty out there Season 6!
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May 11, 2018 22:33
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sexpig by night posted:my friend, you can gently caress them robots "Buddy, they don't even let ME gently caress the robots."
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May 11, 2018 22:33
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It's because literally nobody thinks a show about police officers is a "fantasy show" unless they literally have dragons and swords in it? Like they know these are actors and they are doing and saying funny things that cops probably don't do irl but it's presented against a backdrop of their job that 99% of people aren't going to question the accuracy of any more than the average person knows or cares that CSI doesn't actually solve the case and arrest the perp
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May 11, 2018 22:34
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Besesoth posted:If I had ended my original post with "...people shouldn't take it as a representation of reality any more than they take any other fantasy show, and I'm sad that they do", would it help you to understand a little better? I've got a thread full of people insisting that I said something I didn't actually say and I'd like to know how to communicate my actual intent better. i mean the difference there is you're talking about what people should do, when what matters is what people actually do people shouldn't ingest fiction and expect it to reflect real life but that doesn't stop people from getting lovely ideas from rom-coms or porn or police procedurals or lots of other things
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May 11, 2018 22:35
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Pick posted:I think Elementary handles cops well. Some are ok and some are corrupt as gently caress or lazy or incompetent or unwilling to learn, at the rate of most other people on the show in other jobs. They’ve had cops get fired though which is pretty out there Elementary is very good about most normally bad tropes. Some cops are corrupt assholes, some want to help but all in all the system rewards the corrupt more often than the noble. The loner 'no lies I'm just being honest' is rightly called a prick constantly and HE has to choose to expose his vulnerability more rather than force everyone around him to just live with it. Also he's played as more genuinely 'I don't lie' where he says things he views as truths even when they're nice. Like him telling Joan that she's objectively improved his life by being his friend and that's a good thing and all. It's super rare for a hyper honest type to have actual relations other than just spouting insults and going 'no but it's TRUE though'. A male and female team who (I swear to god if I'm wrong on this I'm gonna lose my poo poo I'm only on almost season 4 on Hulu) don't actually wind up romantic and instead just decide they're good friends!
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May 11, 2018 22:40
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purple death ray posted:It's because literally nobody thinks a show about police officers is a "fantasy show" unless they literally have dragons and swords in it? Like they know these are actors and they are doing and saying funny things that cops probably don't do irl but it's presented against a backdrop of their job that 99% of people aren't going to question the accuracy of any more than the average person knows or cares that CSI doesn't actually solve the case and arrest the perp I'm sincerely curious about what kind of media you imagine people will not just skew to fit their beliefs, regardless. Like, if we make a completely 100% non-problematic show (somehow) do you believe that that will end racism, classism, sexism, random violence, misrepresentation of people with mental illness, littering, whatever? All of these behaviours predated television and likely would persist if we were to wish it out of existence. We're talking about the CSI effect and the importance of representation and I acknowledge that these are serious issues that are affected by television representation - I'm not saying hardline that FICTION IS FICTION and never changes the real world - but if we're concerned about people struggling to grasp that a clearly billed hijinx filled comedy show that takes place in a police station is comparable to the daily reality of law enforcement I think the problem is more in people's instruction of interpretation of fiction, rather than the existence of the fiction itself. We shouldn't cater to this mindset, because then we are only allowed to create things that are absolutely safe, interpretable by the lowest common denominator, and morally instructive.
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May 11, 2018 22:50
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Adult Illiteracy posted:I'm sincerely curious about what kind of media you imagine people will not just skew to fit their beliefs, regardless. Like, if we make a completely 100% non-problematic show (somehow) do you believe that that will end racism, classism, sexism, random violence, misrepresentation of people with mental illness, littering, whatever? All of these behaviours predated television and likely would persist if we were to wish it out of existence. We're talking about the CSI effect and the importance of representation and I acknowledge that these are serious issues that are affected by television representation - I'm not saying hardline that FICTION IS FICTION and never changes the real world - but if we're concerned about people struggling to grasp that a clearly billed hijinx filled comedy show that takes place in a police station is comparable to the daily reality of law enforcement I think the problem is more in people's instruction of interpretation of fiction, rather than the existence of the fiction itself. We shouldn't cater to this mindset, because then we are only allowed to create things that are absolutely safe, interpretable by the lowest common denominator, and morally instructive. I love goons that clearly struggle understanding people. It’s the funniest poo poo. You think they wouldn’t be so open about it but nope. Just to help you out it’s not the lowest common denominator it’s actually most people.
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May 11, 2018 23:14
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Most people can watch a light hearted comedy with out having an internal struggle with the realism of it. That's why they exist.
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May 11, 2018 23:24
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Solice Kirsk posted:Most people can watch a light hearted comedy with out having an internal struggle with the realism of it. That's why they exist. I think you're vastly misreading things if you think 'yea it kinda sucks to portray NYPD cops as lovable goofballs even if the show is really good' is some massive moral struggle. ~you can enjoy problematic media as long as you understand it and are measured in what exactly you support~
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May 11, 2018 23:32
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Sherlock and Watson have still never been an item at all.
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May 11, 2018 23:32
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Adult Illiteracy posted:I'm sincerely curious about what kind of media you imagine people will not just skew to fit their beliefs, regardless. Like, if we make a completely 100% non-problematic show (somehow) do you believe that that will end racism, classism, sexism, random violence, misrepresentation of people with mental illness, littering, whatever? All of these behaviours predated television and likely would persist if we were to wish it out of existence. We're talking about the CSI effect and the importance of representation and I acknowledge that these are serious issues that are affected by television representation - I'm not saying hardline that FICTION IS FICTION and never changes the real world - but if we're concerned about people struggling to grasp that a clearly billed hijinx filled comedy show that takes place in a police station is comparable to the daily reality of law enforcement I think the problem is more in people's instruction of interpretation of fiction, rather than the existence of the fiction itself. We shouldn't cater to this mindset, because then we are only allowed to create things that are absolutely safe, interpretable by the lowest common denominator, and morally instructive. That came within centimeters of being a "PC police are ruining comedy" post, nice job
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May 11, 2018 23:32
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All comedy is problematic because this fallen world is too inherently miserable for anything to ever be funny.
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May 11, 2018 23:38
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Pick posted:Sherlock and Watson have still never been an item at all. I am happy to hear that
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May 11, 2018 23:40
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Pick posted:Sherlock and Watson have still never been an item at all. So it’s barely even Sherlock Holmes.
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May 11, 2018 23:49
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sexpig by night posted:
Where the gently caress is Phil Greaves when you need him?
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May 12, 2018 00:21
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Rosa Diaz and Amy Santiago from B99 are really attractive and it’s sad they’re going away
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May 12, 2018 01:38
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oldpainless posted:Rosa Diaz and Amy Santiago from B99 are really attractive and it’s sad they’re going away Their actors are still around, it’s not like they’re dissolving into the aether or anything.
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May 12, 2018 01:40
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fruit on the bottom posted:Their actors are still around, it’s not like they’re dissolving into the aether or anything. Sadly, Thanos was executive producer
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May 12, 2018 01:46
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fruit on the bottom posted:Their actors are still around, it’s not like they’re dissolving into the aether or anything. It won’t be the same 😪
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May 12, 2018 01:57
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fruit on the bottom posted:So it’s barely even Sherlock Holmes. Literally it would be less out of character if the BBC ones hosed.
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May 12, 2018 02:01
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And god I hate the BBC one
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May 12, 2018 02:02
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fruit on the bottom posted:Their actors are still around, it’s not like they’re dissolving into the aether or anything. You don't know that.
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May 12, 2018 02:06
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I've never watched B99 outside of a few clips here and there; but if a show portraying cops as "lovable goofballs" is problematic, then Klink and Schultz elevate Hogan's Heroes to nothing less than full-on Nazi propaganda.
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May 12, 2018 03:57
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JoshGuitar posted:I've never watched B99 outside of a few clips here and there; but if a show portraying cops as "lovable goofballs" is problematic, then Klink and Schultz elevate Hogan's Heroes to nothing less than full-on Nazi propaganda. you get that Klink and Schultz weren't the good guys you were supposed to like right, or did we just hit a really weird nazi with a humiliation fetish thing here
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May 12, 2018 04:26
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JoshGuitar posted:I've never watched B99 outside of a few clips here and there; but if a show portraying cops as "lovable goofballs" is problematic, then Klink and Schultz elevate Hogan's Heroes to nothing less than full-on Nazi propaganda. It's different because Klink and Schultz were still the antagonists. Look you can like B99 while acknowledging its message might be interpreted poorly by some people. There's not really a contradiction there.
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May 12, 2018 04:27
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To think that this entire derail began because someone tried to make a joke.
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May 12, 2018 04:55
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Samuringa posted:To think that this entire derail began because someone tried to make a joke. The internet, my friend.
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May 12, 2018 05:00
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I like cops
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May 12, 2018 05:04
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And a completely pointless derail now https://twitter.com/thelonelyisland/status/995151709709025280 https://twitter.com/melissafumero/status/995152163839102976
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May 12, 2018 05:07
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sexpig by night posted:I am happy to hear that The show is actually really respectful of, like, what it does with itself. It's a show that respects the characters in it. And man, the S6 opening has some of JLM's best acting, god drat.
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May 12, 2018 05:10
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Pick posted:Literally it would be less out of character if the BBC ones hosed. All I know is that I reread the Sign of Four and you can’t tell me the homoerotic subtext isn’t there.
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May 12, 2018 05:56
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RagnarokAngel posted:It's different because Klink and Schultz were still the antagonists. I haven't watched Hogan's Heroes since I was like 12 but I got the distinct impression that Klink and Schultz knew what Hogan et al were doing and the whole goof was on K&S's more hardcore superiors Like didn't Hogan literally sit around drinking booze in Klink's office and they were basically chums until the camp got (inevitably, constantly) inspected? I'm not looking this up because the guard gives me all the schnapps I can drink but Wikipedia is blocked on the camp wifi for some reason
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May 12, 2018 06:16
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Samuringa posted:And a completely pointless derail now And the new masters might have some different ideas on how they run the show. Shows jumping networks can get... changed.
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May 12, 2018 07:28
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MrUnderbridge posted:And the new masters might have some different ideas on how they run the show. Shows jumping networks can get... changed. Eh, I think they’ll be fine. It’s a Michael Schur produced show, and he’s the same guy who did the US Office, Parks and Rec, and The Good Place which are all NBC. They’ve had a long enough working relationship with him that NBC is probably the one network that won’t meddle too heavily.
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May 12, 2018 07:39
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purple death ray posted:That came within centimeters of being a "PC police are ruining comedy" post, nice job Nah I just think miserable people prefer finding things that are wrong with stuff than proposing better ways to do them.
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May 12, 2018 10:03
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CharlestheHammer posted:Just to help you out it’s not the lowest common denominator it’s actually most people. except for you and all the special people in this thread, maybe we could solve this problem if goons got a special pass to tv shows like this and Reno 911 since we are able to fight the corrupting influence to put 'blue lives matter' bumper stickers on our car after watching a comedy show involving police better than most
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May 12, 2018 11:27
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Terry Crewes is saying B99 is okay for another season on facebook.
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May 12, 2018 11:35
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ulex minor posted:except for you and all the special people in this thread, maybe we could solve this problem if goons got a special pass to tv shows like this and Reno 911 since we are able to fight the corrupting influence to put 'blue lives matter' bumper stickers on our car after watching a comedy show involving police better than most I wouldn't use Reno 911 as an example.
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May 12, 2018 12:04
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How about Barney Miller?
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May 12, 2018 12:44
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