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Ola posted:active battery cooling. After only 8 years, many warranty battery replacements, some lawsuits, and every other EV on the market utilizing it... they finally realized they hosed up? stevewm fucked around with this message at 19:28 on May 25, 2018 |
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May 25, 2018 18:52
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stevewm posted:After only 8 years, many warranty battery replacements, some lawsuits, and every other EV on the market utilizing it... they finally realized they hosed up? Also changing supplier to LG Chem. I'm guessing contract duration had something to do with it, but this glacial (insert ironic temperature joke) pace of change is normal for major car manufacturers after all.
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May 25, 2018 19:57
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Ola posted:Also changing supplier to LG Chem. I'm guessing contract duration had something to do with it, but this glacial (insert ironic temperature joke) pace of change is normal for major car manufacturers after all. Seems LG Chem is the new hotness right now... The Volt, Bolt, Ioniq, and a few others all using LG batteries, and in many cases battery management systems, and even parts of/or the entire drivetrain.
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May 25, 2018 20:10
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Yeah, I'm down 5 bars on my '11 Leaf and have been lazily putting off calling in the warranty replacement cause I want that supposed extended range '19.
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May 25, 2018 20:50
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But an 11 is no longer under warranty?
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May 25, 2018 23:57
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Elephanthead posted:But an 11 is no longer under warranty? And they aren't going to give you a '19 model in exchange even if it were? I'm totally confused here
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May 26, 2018 00:23
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Everybody creaming over driver profiles: how am I supposed to reach the touchscreen if my other driver has the seat all the way forward? Or is the seat still operated in the normal way?
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May 26, 2018 00:57
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Voice activated. Back. Back. Little more. No too much. Now forward. Touch more. Stop. Now a little back. Little less forward.
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May 26, 2018 01:08
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Goober Peas posted:And they aren't going to give you a '19 model in exchange even if it were? I'm talking about purchasing a new car. Speleothing posted:Everybody creaming over driver profiles: how am I supposed to reach the touchscreen if my other driver has the seat all the way forward? Or is the seat still operated in the normal way? A reaching stick.
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May 26, 2018 01:11
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I hate electric seats, yes I want to wait 45 seconds for the seat to move from all the way back to all the way forward to get in the back seat. All you suckers lifting a bar and sliding the thing forward in .5 seconds don't know what you are missing!
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May 26, 2018 01:12
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Having finer levels of adjustment is the nice part, it's just that an intelligent carmaker puts the button near the door.
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May 26, 2018 01:24
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Speleothing posted:Having finer levels of adjustment is the nice part, it's just that an intelligent carmaker puts the button near the door. Could be super confusing though like the mercedes that puts the buttons on the door. I ended up having to call car2go once because I couldn't even drive the drat car because the seat was ALLLLLLL the way back and I couldn't find the buttons on the side or front of the seat. When I called the person said they were getting a ton of calls about it and like 2 days later they sent out a wide email pointing it out in pictures. Also profiles are usually linked to keys. Its linked on the S and was on the lexus as well. The model 3 auto moves my seat the second I snap the seatbelt. Also the Model 3 does have side seat controls. I dinked with it on and off for a few weeks and every time you hit a button it prompts you to save the profile changes. silicone thrills fucked around with this message at 01:52 on May 26, 2018 |
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May 26, 2018 01:37
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Speleothing posted:Having finer levels of adjustment is the nice part, it's just that an intelligent carmaker puts the button near the door. Does the 3 not have seat-side controls?
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May 26, 2018 01:39
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I don't know that's why I'm asking!!
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May 26, 2018 01:47
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https://www.press.bmwgroup.com/global/article/detail/T0281381EN/work-begins-on-bmw-plant-leipzig-extension So maybe the i3 or at least a similar carbon fiber city car is not dead after all? There was a lot of talk about the X3e replacing the i3 but unless the X3 is going to have a radical structural redesign an electric BMW city car may be sticking around. Speleothing posted:Everybody creaming over driver profiles: how am I supposed to reach the touchscreen if my other driver has the seat all the way forward? Or is the seat still operated in the normal way? Profiles linked to keyless entry keys?
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May 26, 2018 01:48
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Speleothing posted:Everybody creaming over driver profiles: how am I supposed to reach the touchscreen if my other driver has the seat all the way forward? Or is the seat still operated in the normal way? On the 3 it goes into easy entry where it goes into a neutral configuarable set position. Goes into driver profiles after you first tap the brake pedal.
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May 26, 2018 18:31
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Preparing my home for a new EV. Hope this information is useful to anyone looking at getting a EV in the near future. FWIW I live in Denver, CO USA so all costs / electrical terms are listed in ‘merican. I will be taking delivery of a Tesla Model 3 next Saturday afternoon (LOL Tesla time notwithstanding…) I needed to get my house ready to charge a EV. I had a lot of options and ended up adding a Tesla HPWC (high powered wall charger) in my garage with a 60amp 220 volt hardwired circuit. This will give me a continuous 48amps to charge the car (Model 3 long range max non-supercharger capability) and should charge at a rate of about 44mph. I could have gone with a NEMA 14-50 outlet and a 50amp circuit, giving me 30mph (30amps) charging rate, but for an extra $600 I got the Tesla wall charger, because it looks cool and I only paid about $100 extra in wire for the 60amp circuit vs 50amp circuit. This charger only works with Teslas, no other EVs but for now not a problem for me. I probably won't really notice the faster charging time as I will be charging primarily at work and overnight but overall it did not cost to much more and if I ever get another Tesla I can add a additional HPWC and they can share / balance the 60amp circuit for 2 vehicles. I can also swap out the HPWC for a NEMA 14-50 outlet pretty easy, just need to swap the breaker and wire in the outlet, probably only $100 to do so. Unfortunately, my whole house electrical service was only 125amps and my breaker box was full. So I needed to upgrade my home's electrical service to 200amps and get a new breaker panel installed before I could add the additional 60amp charging circuit. This added significant cost to the project. Buying a Tesla is definitely not a financially sound decision at this point, at least not for me but I knew this going in. I can afford it, but it is in no way saving me any money on transportation. Here is my existing 125amp panel, from the year 1983. I filled up all the available breaker spots last year remodeling the kitchen.  The 3 big wires from the meter to the panel had to be upgraded for the 125amp -> 200amp upgrade. The new wires are the same gauge 0/1, but are copper rather than aluminum. Aluminum wires would have been quite a bit bigger. The wires coming into the meter from the ground / utility are good for upto 200amps, so no new wiring was needed from the utility company. This may not be the case for all homes, especially if they are older. Some homes may need updated infrastructure from the utility, I imagine this cost a shitload more and is a great big hassle if you have underground cables but thankfully I did not have to find out.    This is about $650 worth of 6 gauge romex, around 80’  Routed through the partially finished basement, to the garage all the way on the other side of the house.   And here is the ready to use charger.  Someone is excited about getting our Tesla, but she keeps calling it a Lexus??  The whole job took 2 electricians about 8 hours. My home was without any power for around 6 hours. I also painted my whole garage, it is roughly finished with drywall on 3 of 4 sides and the ceiling. Priming and painting the garage was 3 Saturdays of suck, I don’t recommend it. So, now all I need is a car to plug in and I’m all set! Total cost breakdown: Home service upgrade / new panel - $3000 60amp Car charging circuit est 80’ from panel - $800 Tesla HPWC (high powered wall connector) - $500 Paint / primer / painting supplies for garage - $200 TOTAL - $4,500 and three ruined Saturdays of painting. I’m probably on the highest of the highend for installing a home charger. If I just needed the charger and no upgrade I would have been around $1k to $1.5k. If I just wanted a 50amp run plus NEMA 14-50 outlet $1k or less. If you don’t have a long run from your electrical panel and are handy enough to do the work yourself you could install a NEMA 14-50 outlet for a couple of hundred dollars, it does not have to be to expensive. Hope someone finds this useful / interesting. Let me know if you have any questions I did not cover.
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May 27, 2018 00:08
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Great post!
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May 27, 2018 00:27
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Ola posted:Great post! Thanks! Slim Mill is now my Finnish I thought they were eastern European before I looked it up homie https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKa_eD37Rf8 If anyone can find English subtitles I will love you forever.
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May 27, 2018 01:02
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Nice post! Our infrastructure is going to feel the pain going forward from the chargers going in. I wonder if certain models are smart enough / connected enough to negotiate among themselves? Charger: “Hey, so there’s like 10 of us on this block that all need to charge by 8AM and it’s midnight now. If we timeslice and 2 of us go for a few hours at a time, we’ll all be happy and won’t stress the local electrical grid!  “And then of course they will shittalk their owners as well. :skynet:
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May 27, 2018 01:25
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The grid has very low demand on it overnight. Utility size batteries and baseload generation will do fine for night charging for quite a while yet.
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May 27, 2018 02:40
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Hmm. Was there a cat up there?
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May 27, 2018 03:26
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movax posted:Our infrastructure is going to feel the pain going forward from the chargers going in. I wonder if certain models are smart enough / connected enough to negotiate among themselves?
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May 27, 2018 04:10
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spandexcajun posted:60amp Car charging circuit est 80’ from panel - $800 I've been charging on 120 since January (Hasn't been a huge deal, I commute 18 miles round trip for work) and last time I got bids for a charger it was $600 to install the charger 15 feet from the breaker outside. I need to work on this.
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May 27, 2018 04:12
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Three Olives posted:I've been charging on 120 since January (Hasn't been a huge deal, I commute 18 miles round trip for work) and last time I got bids for a charger it was $600 to install the charger 15 feet from the breaker outside. I need to work on this. I got a quote for over $5k for this work, and that was only upgrading my home electrical service from 125amp -> 150amp. I got another bid that was $6200. For sure if I did not get the whole house upgrade the car charging circuit would have been more like $1200 - $1500. I ended up using a friend of a friend who is a commercial electrician that does side work, he was legit, has a license / insurance / LLC and all that. So for sure look around. I was offended by some of the bids I got. On Tesla forums people recommend requesting a RV outlet rather then a outlet for a Tesla as some electricians hear Tesla and jack up the bids. I can believe this happens, unfortunately. Agronox posted:Hmm. Was there a cat up there? I have a cat I can try to shove up there, but I think he would claw my eyes out 
spandexcajun fucked around with this message at 04:44 on May 27, 2018 |
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May 27, 2018 04:35
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Can someone explain how this EV tax credit thing works for lease vehicles? I'm learning the absolute joy of working with Southeastern Chevrolet dealerships as of recent. I've never seen a company so hell-bent on not selling their own inventory like Chevrolet: - Walk into the first dealer inquiring about the Chevrolet Volt. The dealer's website listed $4k off of MSRP, so I asked about what a lease payment would be. The salesman told me that the federal EV tax credit "doesn't exist anymore" and that "we don't offer any discounts on these cars". When I prodded him about how many they sold he said "we really don't sell any of these anymore" in a tone so mopish it would make loving Eeyore call him a drag. FWIW I've also emailed their "internet salesperson" twice about the Volt on the lot and never received one email or call about it. - The second dealer seemed to want to play ball so I drove the 30 miles there to talk. When I walked in I was greeted by a salesman and his manager, and I asked them what happens with the EV tax credit, etc. when leasing a Volt. They agreed to go look up a lease. The manager sent back a sheet with 3 monthly payments written on it, all in the $550+ per month range at a lower mileage and longer term than I wanted. They didn't have the final price of the car listed on the sheet, but as best as I could tell they had no EV tax credit applied and their "$5k off MSRP" was left off as well. They told me the $550 is what everyone paid for these cars and they wanted me to sign on that payment. Now I'm a moron, but everything I've read about the Federal EV tax credit is that, if you are buying, you get a $7,500 tax credit on certain vehicles provided you paid more than $7,500 a year in taxes. Great. For leases, I read that they instead give the tax credit to the financing company, the financing company applies it like they would a down payment, and then you pay your lease based upon the sale price, less residual, less down payment (including tax credit). Is that wrong? I can't seem to get some of these dealers to even believe the tax credit exists, which if I were a Chevrolet rep I'd be threatening to yank the rights from the dealership unless they get their meat-headed salespeople into a room and explain how this poo poo works. Every bit of information I see online says "confirm with your dealer" but when your dealer keeps pushing you away from the EVs and towards the Silverado, it doesn't surprise me when you read hot takes on the internet from car rags saying EV adoption is next to zero.
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May 27, 2018 15:26
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spandexcajun posted:Thanks!
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May 27, 2018 15:35
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Ripoff posted:Can someone explain how this EV tax credit thing works for lease vehicles? Or get a used model. I can believe they try to push other models since the EV would require less maintenance (and that means less lucrative oil change turned into a torque nut relubrication / transmission flush because your car is falling apart without it buddy). Leasehacker seemed to be pretty good about finding deals and dealers that were willing to offer you terms without the "come by so we can tell you the car is gone but drive this one instead" song and dance.
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May 27, 2018 15:40
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FilthyImp posted:Leasehacker seemed to be pretty good about finding deals and dealers that were willing to offer you terms without the "come by so we can tell you the car is gone but drive this one instead" song and dance. Gonna read the hell out of that website, thanks! Yeah, I had a bad feeling they were trying to pocket my credit, and it honestly pissed me off to the point where I'm tempted to write off the Volt and go talk to a Honda dealer about the Clarity PHEV. Chevrolet really needs to develop a secret shopper program of sorts to understand how dumb their dealers are. If I dumped millions in R&D into a new type of car to find that my end sales folks are crapping on it and leading people away from it, I'd be pretty livid as a supplier. This tech is the only thing keeping them competitive with the Japanese, Korean and European makes in any sort of small-car stuff, and if gas prices in the US start to rocket upwards like they did back in 2006-2007 it'll be no fun whatsoever for them. Edit: Holy poo poo, according to the Leasehackr calculator the dealers were asking me to pay $43k before tax, title, etc. for a $40k Volt they marked down to $36k. 
funeral home DJ fucked around with this message at 16:00 on May 27, 2018 |
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May 27, 2018 15:55
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GM can't do anything to fix or get rid of dealers, they know they are bad. Dealers have bought and paid for every state legislature.
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May 27, 2018 16:05
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With this particular problem though if GM really wanted to move EVs it seems like they could tweak the incentives for dealers to do something like making one EV sale equal to 3 ICE sales for purposes of end of month volume numbers. But they don’t.
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May 27, 2018 16:30
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Ripoff posted:Can someone explain how this EV tax credit thing works for lease vehicles? I'm learning the absolute joy of working with Southeastern Chevrolet dealerships as of recent. I've never seen a company so hell-bent on not selling their own inventory like Chevrolet: The Federal tax credit can be claimed by the owner of the vehicle. Which on a lease is the leasing company. For most automakers this will be factored into their lease program. Kia for example on the Soul EV currently has $16,400 in lease cash rebates. A big chunk of that is them passing along the $7,500 tax credit they are able to redeem, the rest is just it being a compliance car that they need to move. The best way to figure out what you should be paying on a lease is to go to the car makers website, build the car you would want and see what their lease comes out to. That will be a full MSRP lease price. From there look at how much money is required to be put down. Once you have those two numbers you can adjust how much you want to put down. Every $1k is going to move the payment ~$27/mo up or down on a 36 month lease. You can also go onto truecar to get an idea of how much of a discount you can expect as well. I'm looking at a lease on the Volt on Chevy's website with a vehicle MSRP of $36,805. The lease price shows at $337/mo on a 36mo/12k/yr lease with $3746 due at signing (not including your local sales tax or DMV) On Truecar a similarly priced Volt shows an average market discount to be around $3k off MSRP. If you roll $3250 of that downpayment into the monthly you would be at a payment of around $425/mo with just 1st payment, DMV, Tax up front at MSRP. You can now negotiate off that number knowing what a true MSRP deal is. If you think you can get them to discount the car by the full $3k then you would get the payment back down to ~$345/mo w/1st/tax/dmv up front. The tools to estimate a fair lease price are on the internet. If you go in knowing these numbers you should be able to get to them or at least close enough.
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May 27, 2018 17:05
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$550 a month for a volt lease is laughably high. 250 to 300 should be the range for a 3 year lease. Just read a volt forum they all have a deals section and volt friendly salespersons that will get you the same deals.
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May 27, 2018 20:36
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Elephanthead posted:$550 a month for a volt lease is laughably high. 250 to 300 should be the range for a 3 year lease. Just read a volt forum they all have a deals section and volt friendly salespersons that will get you the same deals. Hell $550 is more than I'm paying on a loan for my 2017.
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May 27, 2018 20:49
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Bloomberg is calculating that electric vehicles will reach cost parity with ICE vehicles 6 years from now in 2024 (last year they estimated 2026): https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-05-22/more-luxury-electric-vehicles-will-soon-be-available-for-lease I'm guessing this is total cost of ownership (maintenance, gas vs electricity, etc.), so the purchase price will probably still be higher. One thing I am wondering...we have a lot of electric vehicles coming over the next few years. Where are these non-Teslas going to recharge on a road trip or in some other non-home/non-work environment? And who is going to be building out the infrastructure for this?
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May 29, 2018 02:07
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They're going to be city or medium distance commuter vehicles for people with ICE vehicles for long trips, who can charge at their home or work. Like me. Anything 150 miles or better is good enough for me; at that point I want interior/exterior quality and style and a low price point. This Means You, 2019 Nissan Leaf and 2020 Hyundai Ioniq. And whatever VW is doing, I forget
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May 29, 2018 02:20
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Arkane posted:Bloomberg is calculating that electric vehicles will reach cost parity with ICE vehicles 6 years from now in 2024 (last year they estimated 2026): https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-05-22/more-luxury-electric-vehicles-will-soon-be-available-for-lease I thought VW was building a huge charging network, but they are the only major conventional automaker I've heard of doing it. I think there is an incentive for mall/merchant real estate owners to install ev chargers to attract customers, and I'm sure that more public utilities will start installing the infrastructure, like the Indianapolis Power and Light company has tried (https://www.iplpower.com/Business/Programs_and_Services/Electric_Vehicle_Charging_and_Rates/). Of course, if you are in Eastern Nevada or most of Wyoming, for example, you're on your own for charging for the foreseeable future
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May 29, 2018 02:25
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Arkane posted:Bloomberg is calculating that electric vehicles will reach cost parity with ICE vehicles 6 years from now in 2024 (last year they estimated 2026): https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-05-22/more-luxury-electric-vehicles-will-soon-be-available-for-lease I have my doubts (can the upstream supply chain do that while simultaneously lowering prices?), but that'd be awesome if true. quote:One thing I am wondering...we have a lot of electric vehicles coming over the next few years. Where are these non-Teslas going to recharge on a road trip or in some other non-home/non-work environment? And who is going to be building out the infrastructure for this? There is a hodgepodge of providers in the US--it's a little better standardized from what I understand in Europe and China--but the one to watch going forward is Electrify America, which is well capitalized ($2 billion) and has the backing of Volkswagen.
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May 29, 2018 02:28
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Arkane posted:Where are these non-Teslas going to recharge on a road trip or in some other non-home/non-work environment? And who is going to be building out the infrastructure for this? I constantly hear this question and everytime I respond by asking how often do you take road trips I get the same blank stare response of "Never?" I mean maybe it is my demographics (Which can't be that far from the market in the foreseeable future of electric cars) but are road trips really that much of a thing for most people that you make an entire car purchase decision based on them?
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May 29, 2018 03:55
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Three Olives posted:I constantly hear this question and everytime I respond by asking how often do you take road trips I get the same blank stare response of "Never?" I mean maybe it is my demographics (Which can't be that far from the market in the foreseeable future of electric cars) but are road trips really that much of a thing for most people that you make an entire car purchase decision based on them? Yes.
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May 29, 2018 04:10
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