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It’s nothing but pandering to the corporate world. Trudeau has aggressively pushed for privatization of infrastructure and to fail to have this pipeline built scares off further foreign investment.
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May 29, 2018 18:06
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Dukemont posted:It’s nothing but pandering to the corporate world. loving neoliberalism.
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May 29, 2018 18:15
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Le Saboteur posted:Lol I live next to a Polish Hall and within a two block vicinity of another Polish Hall. I like to get food from them every so often. Whoa chances are you've probably met my mom, then. And if you've been to a wedding or other weekend function, possibly me. DariusLikewise posted:I have a friend that immigrated from Poland with his parents when he was young. His parents and the entire Polish community in Winnipeg are hardline conservatives that call anyone that doesn't vote Conservative/PC "komunistas". You should hear my cousin who came here in the late '80s at the age of 18. Dude really has a loud mouth and will not shut up when not-Conservatives are mentioned. He's also getting a divorce because he and his wife don't communicate all that well  . They'll shout communists, but they're mostly FYGM-ers with a disdain for minorities and taxes, and ironically big business. It's really frustrating to talk to them (even just to get them to shut up during a family function, but I digress).Ironically, my old man grew up with the Polish diaspora in Toronto in the '50s and '60s and were mostly ardent Liberals thanks to Trudeau's immigration policies. He used to tell me about it and contrast it to the Ukrainian groups who were pro-Conservative because of their staunch anti-Communist stances.
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May 29, 2018 18:17
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cowofwar posted:Haha this might be a LPC boondoggle legacy for the ages. No way that they don’t eat poo poo on the deal. To be honest, I've always been in the 'Trudeau will pull out another term basically whatever happens' camp but this is literally a government killer. Hard to imagine something less popular than this with people that would conceivably vote LPC.
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May 29, 2018 18:28
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they only need quebec and ontario to vote for them
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May 29, 2018 18:34
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THC posted:they only need quebec and ontario to vote for them ‘Wasted several billion dollars bailing out Kinder Morgan’ isn’t going to play well in those provinces either.
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May 29, 2018 18:41
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Can someone help me find an article that was posted (I'm pretty sure in here) sometime in the last month or so? It had something to do with the expansion of an American port which is now able to receive extra-large/specially designed oil tankers from China which are capable of holding incredibly large amounts of oil for transpacific distribution. I swear I saw it in here but I don't have search to find it, does anyone know what I am talking about? It was talking about how these specialized tankers are or will soon be able to dock at only very specific locations on the west coast and that they will basically make any land to coast pipeline in Canada obsolete within the next 10-15 years...
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May 29, 2018 18:43
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I don't know the article you're talking about but that might be Seattle the city; they recently built a giant port?
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May 29, 2018 18:47
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THC posted:they only need quebec and ontario to vote for them Good news! It looks like Quebec is turning hella conservative. Bad news! It looks like Quebec is turning hella conservative.
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May 29, 2018 18:47
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IKillForPie posted:Can someone help me find an article that was posted (I'm pretty sure in here) sometime in the last month or so? It had something to do with the expansion of an American port which is now able to receive extra-large/specially designed oil tankers from China which are capable of holding incredibly large amounts of oil for transpacific distribution. I swear I saw it in here but I don't have search to find it, does anyone know what I am talking about? This one?
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May 29, 2018 18:50
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The implications of the pipeline receiving every regulatory approval but still being cancelled are enormous for the Canadian energy sector. I know it isn't popular saying so on this forum but we're already losing substantially vs. our southern neighbors in an energy golden age.
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May 29, 2018 18:50
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Wilhelm posted:The implications of the pipeline receiving every regulatory approval but still being cancelled are enormous for the Canadian energy sector. I know it isn't popular saying so on this forum but we're already losing substantially vs. our southern neighbors in an energy golden age. That's because our oil is lovely and expensive to extract to the point of barely being worth extracting without massive subsidies.
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May 29, 2018 18:51
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DariusLikewise posted:I have a friend that immigrated from Poland with his parents when he was young. His parents and the entire Polish community in Winnipeg are hardline conservatives that call anyone that doesn't vote Conservative/PC "komunistas". I used to work in an very low wage industry that was mostly composed of newer immigrants, many from Sri Lankan, Pakistani and eastern Europe. Nearly all of them were voting conservative, both because they had visible minorities for their mpps that reflected their community, they talked tough on old fashion social values (like anti sex ed) and they were able to convince them the reason they were struggling to pay their bills were because their taxes were too high. Not because labour was regulated against. And this was in the gta where you would think ndp and liberals would be more prominent
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May 29, 2018 19:18
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patonthebach posted:I used to work in an very low wage industry that was mostly composed of newer immigrants, many from Sri Lankan, Pakistani and eastern Europe. Nearly all of them were voting conservative, both because they had visible minorities for their mpps that reflected their community, they talked tough on old fashion social values (like anti sex ed) and they were able to convince them the reason they were struggling to pay their bills were because their taxes were too high. Not because labour was regulated against. And this was in the gta where you would think ndp and liberals would be more prominent ths is literally the usa republican party's dream but then trump ruined it
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May 29, 2018 19:20
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Both sets of my grand parents immigrated from Poland in the early 1920s and they and everyone else they came over with were hard core Liberals. It seems that since the late 1970s the people coming over usually ended up supporting the Conservatives.
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May 29, 2018 19:24
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I think it's this one https://www.nationalobserver.com/2018/03/07/opinion/fatal-flaw-albertas-oil-expansion quote:There is no business case for an expansion of Alberta’s oilsands on the scale needed to justify the Keystone XL and Trans Mountain export pipelines because of one bare fact: there are zero foreign buyers who today will commit to decades-long purchase contracts for unrefined bitumen at a fixed price near US$80 per barrel. Instead, global traders will literally buy future oil by the boatload, then book terminal time at any deepwater ocean port like the LOOP, anywhere in the world, to embark with two million barrels in a single cargo.
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May 29, 2018 19:37
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The people coming over are conservative, but their kids I find tend to be much more Liberal/NDP than their parents.
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May 29, 2018 20:03
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On his way into the cabinet meeting Tuesday, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau was tight-lipped about the risks of his pipeline plan to taxpayers or the environment, saying only that “we’re going to get that pipeline built.”
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May 29, 2018 20:08
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HookShot posted:The people coming over are conservative, but their kids I find tend to be much more Liberal/NDP than their parents. I wonder if that's because they're coming from conservative countries and so that mindset is sort of ingrained, but they are coming over so their kids have the freedom to choose, and that mindset being encouraged here?
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May 29, 2018 20:13
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blah_blah posted:‘Wasted several billion dollars bailing out Kinder Morgan’ isn’t going to play well in those provinces either. Just say Bombardier is involved.
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May 29, 2018 20:13
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Do we have a rundown of what they are buying for the 4.5b?
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May 29, 2018 20:14
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https://twitter.com/dianemarieposts/status/1001489403838017537?s=21 lel
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May 29, 2018 20:15
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Tsyni posted:Do we have a rundown of what they are buying for the 4.5b? they're literally just paying off kinder morgan so that kinder morgan don't announced they're cancelling the project because it no longer makes economic sense
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May 29, 2018 20:18
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Reince Penis posted:I think it's this one Both are good thank you! I couldn't remember the name of LOOP and both of these describe why pouring billions of dollars into the pipeline is such a huge waste of money... *EDIT* This was specifically what I was looking for in terms of more forward thinking and wondering why the Liberals haven't even seemed to consider any of these factors, because I'm sure as hell that any privately held company will before deciding to purchase the pipeline. • Potential foreign refiners and customers will demand that future oil price, quality, shipping costs, and delivery speeds match those that LOOP can offer. • For marine safety reasons, the maximum oil tanker cargo allowed through B.C.’s Burrard Inlet is an Aframax class ship at 80 per cent capacity carrying 550,000 barrels, only about one-quarter the load of a VLCC. That means a refiner in Asia would need to book and pay for four tankers to ship the same amount as from the LOOP terminal, then wait longer for the full order to arrive. • The diluted bitumen Alberta wants to export has chemical and combustion properties that make it far inferior to the higher-quality oil LOOP has access to from U.S. formations in the Dakotas and Texas, or OPEC countries, or North Sea producers. Tar sands/oil sands bitumen can be upgraded and refined, but that adds significant costs and requires dedicated facilities. • The terminus of the Keystone XL will be refineries on the Texas Gulf Coast near Houston which are not connected to the LOOP. Even if future Alberta bitumen were to be refined there, it would take three fully-loaded Aframax tankers leaving Texas for ship-to-ship transfers to each VLCC. IKillForPie fucked around with this message at 20:26 on May 29, 2018 |
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May 29, 2018 20:23
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When you want the government to seize the means of production, but not like this. Anything but this!
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May 29, 2018 20:31
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Arcsquad12 posted:I wonder if that's because they're coming from conservative countries and so that mindset is sort of ingrained, but they are coming over so their kids have the freedom to choose, and that mindset being encouraged here? I think it's really just that while the parents come from (especially) socially conservative countries, and have grown up with those values, the kids grow up Canadian, where our values aren't particularly socially conservative, and so they end up making their decisions like other Canadian kids. In a lot of cases the parents immigrate for economic reasons, not for freedom-related reasons.
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May 29, 2018 20:32
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HookShot posted:The people coming over are conservative, but their kids I find tend to be much more Liberal/NDP than their parents. second generation immigrants in canada are pretty bog-standard millennial liberal types a lot of older first generation are the equivalent of trump voters in their bigotry against other minorities/gays/hates welfare etc Typo fucked around with this message at 20:53 on May 29, 2018 |
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May 29, 2018 20:46
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La Presse has an article about the status of the new Champlain Bridge in Montréal, which is supposed to open for traffic on 21 December and cost the government $4.2 billion. I'll summarize the article here. The current Champlain Bridge, built in 1962, is one of the busiest bridges in Canada, with 50 million vehicles passing through each year. According to the Auditor General of Canada, Michael Ferguson, several factors have led to additional costs of $500 million and delays to the timetable of the project. Most of these factors can be traced back to poor management by Ottawa. $500 million too much Structural problems with the current Champlain Bridge have been known since 1999, but the federal government has been slow to act with the planning of a new bridge, instead opting to repair the old structure. This would have set off a chain of delays in the decision process and avoidable expenses of around half a billion dollars. This number does not count the economic costs of road congestion in the Montréal area caused by the patching work. Problematic PPP Ottawa chose the Public-Private Partnership (PPP) option for the Champlain project in 2011, two years before its own report on the project's finances was completed. The federal government claimed that choosing the PPP model was going to save $227 million over more traditional methods, though this assessment was based on an incomplete study of all the options. Blurry estimates The assessment of the cost of the project itself was done in an imprecise way. These estimates were based on a conception plan that was 5% completed, rather than the 30% that is the norm for such large projects. Ottawa also vastly underestimated management costs. In 2014, these were estimated to be $15.9 million. The following year, this number had ballooned to $158.6 million, practically ten times the original amount. Under-evaluated risks While the governance of the project has been generally efficient, more than 20 notices of change have been published by Infrastructure Canada during construction, of which most were caused by third parties. For example, the Caisse de dépôt et placement du Québec required a modification to the bridge's deck to allow passage of its new electric train, the REM. Elimination of the toll The Trudeau administration eliminated the idea of a toll to pay for the bridge in 2015. These tolls were expected to recover the majority of the bridge's cost within 30 years of operation. More importantly, a "free" Champlain Bridge is expected to receive 20% more traffic than a tolled Champlain Bridge, which requires the revision and upgrade of access ramps leading to and away from the bridge. Durability in question The life expectancy of the bridge, according to the project, is 125 years. The Auditor's report, however, casts major doubts that the bridge will last that long. It states that some of the bridge's components are clearly not meant to last that long. How much of that is due to the changes in the project's budget and timetable remains to be determined. Reaction of the government The Minister of Infrastructure and Communities, Amarjeet Sohi, thanked the Office of the Auditor General for the report and confirmed that many of its recommendations have already been initiated at the federal level. Mr. Sohi blames the Harper government for many of the delays. Though the bridge is only 75% completed, Mr. Sohi reaffirms that it will be open by 21 December. --- Additionally, the Office of the Auditor General released other reports this morning. On the Phoenix pay system Those responsible for the new Phoenix pay system prioritized budget limits and the calendar over functionality and security. The system has therefore not met the needs of its users, has cost the federal government hundreds of millions of dollars, and has caused financial difficulty to tens of thousands of employees. On the efficiency of consulates Global Affairs Canada has not collected enough information on its performance to ensure that it has adequately met the needs of Canadians who are living or working abroad. Its capacity for providing services varies too much from office to office. On the social-economic status of First Nations Similarly, Indigenous Services Canada has not adequately measured the progress to overcome the wealth disparity between the First Nations and the rest of Canada. The Ministry had also not used data at its disposal to improve the quality of education services to the First Nations. On the administration of justice in the armed forces Finally, the Office of the Auditor concluded that the Canadian armed forces had not administered its military justice system adequately, noting long delays in court procedures. It also observes systemic weaknesses, such as a lack of communication and absence of normal timetables, in the military justice system.
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May 29, 2018 20:55
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Can we just divide up the 4.5 billion and give it to AB people to shut them up cause that's an actual better use of the money.
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May 29, 2018 20:56
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I really like the position of Auditor General. It is good to hear this kind of crap.
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May 29, 2018 21:03
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Heavy neutrino posted:Good news! It looks like Quebec is turning hella conservative. I feel embarrassed since this is literally where I live, but I don't really know why we've been doing that. I kind of get depressed when I read about local racists so I tend to focus on racists far away, and as a result I have no idea why we're turning into MAGA-lite. I mean yes there's been issues with anti-muslim sentiment for ages now, but I don't understand why we're swinging hard right, especially considering how massively incompetent the conservative options keep proving themselves to be.
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May 29, 2018 21:08
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patonthebach posted:I used to work in an very low wage industry that was mostly composed of newer immigrants, many from Sri Lankan, Pakistani and eastern Europe. Nearly all of them were voting conservative, both because they had visible minorities for their mpps that reflected their community, they talked tough on old fashion social values (like anti sex ed) and they were able to convince them the reason they were struggling to pay their bills were because their taxes were too high. Not because labour was regulated against. And this was in the gta where you would think ndp and liberals would be more prominent Mr. Apollo posted:Both sets of my grand parents immigrated from Poland in the early 1920s and they and everyone else they came over with were hard core Liberals. It seems that since the late 1970s the people coming over usually ended up supporting the Conservatives. I know in my friends case his dad was a member of the Poland Communist party which would have been back in the 1970s-80s? I think? And some event within the party caused them to lose their status and immigrant and hate anything vaguely politically-left for the rest of their lives. They are also incredibly xenophobic and don't want Canada to bring anymore immigrants or refugees in, ever.
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May 29, 2018 21:13
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DariusLikewise posted:I know in my friends case his dad was a member of the Poland Communist party which would have been back in the 1970s-80s? I think? And some event within the party caused them to lose their status and immigrant and hate anything vaguely politically-left for the rest of their lives. They are also incredibly xenophobic and don't want Canada to bring anymore immigrants or refugees in, ever.
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May 29, 2018 21:19
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HookShot posted:I think it's really just that while the parents come from (especially) socially conservative countries, and have grown up with those values, the kids grow up Canadian, where our values aren't particularly socially conservative, and so they end up making their decisions like other Canadian kids. A lot of it has to do with exposure, I think. When you grow up in this country and having a neighbour be of a different skin colour or religion than you are is no big deal. Having said that, you'd also be surprised exactly how much of a blind spot the next generation can have with this poo poo. Then again, so do a lot of liberal millennials. DariusLikewise posted:I know in my friends case his dad was a member of the Poland Communist party which would have been back in the 1970s-80s? I think? And some event within the party caused them to lose their status and immigrant and hate anything vaguely politically-left for the rest of their lives. They are also incredibly xenophobic and don't want Canada to bring anymore immigrants or refugees in, ever. My dad told me a few times how some meetings at one of the old Polish halls in Toronto devolved into people just accusing each other of being Communists and coming over here to destabilize the community.
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May 29, 2018 21:19
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that explains why my polish landlord angrily tossed my ndp sign in the trash 3 times
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May 29, 2018 21:42
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My mother’s side of the family is ethnically Polish and they are the most hateful bunch of bigots that claim moral high ground because they go to church on Sundays.
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May 29, 2018 21:53
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IKillForPie posted:Can someone help me find an article that was posted (I'm pretty sure in here) sometime in the last month or so? It had something to do with the expansion of an American port which is now able to receive extra-large/specially designed oil tankers from China which are capable of holding incredibly large amounts of oil for transpacific distribution. I swear I saw it in here but I don't have search to find it, does anyone know what I am talking about? https://www.nationalobserver.com/2018/03/07/opinion/fatal-flaw-albertas-oil-expansion
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May 29, 2018 21:55
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RBC posted:that explains why my polish landlord angrily tossed my ndp sign in the trash 3 times if you want to rile him up, tell him that he's acting like the Communists did. One party rule, am I right?
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May 29, 2018 21:55
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Oxyclean posted:Where's some good places to read up on my riding / candidates? Going to be voting in Kanata-Carleton if anyone has particular opinions on that riding. Best would be to look at the platforms. Maybe the Ottawa Citizen has a piece on KC. I don't recall seeing one on the CBC News website yet. NDP: John Hansen - longstanding member of the EDA (provincial and federal); has been NDP candidate several times; STEMlord engineer; overall cool guy LIB: Stephanie Maghnam - generic businessperson Liberal candidate PC: Merrillee Fullerton - family doctor, Islamophobic, wants to privatize healthcare Trillium: Jack Maclaren - former PC MP, islamophobe, francophobe; unlikely to vote split Green: Andrew West - ??? https://eregistration.elections.on.ca/en/election/2-general-election-jun-7-2018/43-kanata-carleton?pollDivisionId=10138951&tab=candidates has a few more comedy candidates Full disclosure I'm volunteering for the NDP in the riding (and others). Initially they were hoping for second place. I don't want to be too optimistic but we get a lot of positive feedback on the ground. People are requesting lawn signs. It's crazy. Vote NDP. Edit: Our feeling is that its mostly CON vs. NDP right now in Kanata-Carleton. Anecdotal evidence: we get a lot more "anything but the loving Liberals" than people claiming they'll vote conservative (there's more of them for sure). And people seem to have a generally good impression of the NDP, especially since the polls show vote intentions. It's really hard to tell how we'll do but I'm pretty the NDP candidate will get more votes than the Liberal, Green, etc. candidates. EvidenceBasedQuack fucked around with this message at 22:09 on May 29, 2018 |
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May 29, 2018 21:59
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Excelsiortothemax posted:My mother’s side of the family is ethnically Polish and they are the most hateful bunch of bigots that claim moral high ground because they go to church on Sundays. performative christianity
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May 29, 2018 22:07
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