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Post poste posted:My friend in Chicago just got and installed a large Avista AC unit, and the first time they started it up, it blew the fuse, tripped the breaker and melted the plug connection where it was plugged into the extension cord. Besides rushing the plug, what other steps should be taken to stop it from blowing the replacement internal fuse? Looks like they use a 15a plug. Check the outlet for proper voltage (and a ground). Get rid of the extension cord. Check the hot and neutral terminals on the ac cord to ground for continuity (ohms) to see if there's a short in the ac unit.
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Jun 2, 2018 01:57
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Blackbeer posted:Looks like they use a 15a plug. Check the outlet for proper voltage (and a ground). Get rid of the extension cord. Check the hot and neutral terminals on the ac cord to ground for continuity (ohms) to see if there's a short in the ac unit. The AC unit had it's test/reset thingy broken, it no longer resets. I'll upload the pictures tomorrow when I have WiFi.
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Jun 2, 2018 02:00
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It blew everything when they switched it on, not when they plugged it in? There's a short and its probably in the motor windings and you can't fix that, take that POS back where it came from. E: the test/reset is a GFCI which is also hosed and melted now, just take the drat thing back to the store. shame on an IGA fucked around with this message at 03:17 on Jun 2, 2018 |
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Jun 2, 2018 03:06
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shame on an IGA posted:It blew everything when they switched it on, not when they plugged it in? There's a short and its probably in the motor windings and you can't fix that, take that POS back where it came from. I'll pass along the advice, here's the minor carnage, as promised. Pop!
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Jun 2, 2018 17:09
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Post poste posted:I'll pass along the advice, here's the minor carnage, as promised.  : The connector
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Jun 2, 2018 23:18
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Post poste posted:I'll pass along the advice, here's the minor carnage, as promised. My guess is that it briefly draws more current when the compressor first kicks on, and that 16ga/50ft extension cord was woefully unfit. Does the manual say anything about recommendations for extension cords (including "don't use with one"?)
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Jun 3, 2018 01:23
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Hubis posted:(including "don't use with one"?) It surely says that, and this was likely the entire problem. Do not use extension cords on devices like this. If you absolutely must use an extension cord temporarily (they are only for temporary use) you're gonna need a drat good one.
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Jun 3, 2018 01:46
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Hubis posted:Does the manual say anything about recommendations for extension cords (including "don't use with one"?) This is basically what I told them, but I wasn't sure if it was fixable it if there was more damage than I could think of, and you all helped, woo!
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Jun 3, 2018 02:11
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So can I just like, throw another 12/2 romex connection onto a junction box and run it down a wall? There's a junction box right above the wall I need to out an outlet on, but I'm not sure what it junctions to/from. Probably the bathroom and back room but everything is windy and goes under plywood and insulation  I guess I could try popping fuses out and seeing which fuse it's on. e: As an update to my prior burned-wires post. There was not any slack on the wires to pull more down and retwist, so I put a piece of heatshrink over the hot wire nearby and retwisted the two melted ones to make sure they were getting as good a connection as possible. I think I'm going to try and rerun that entire wire assuming I can find where it comes up into the attic. (It should be the junction box mentioned above but I can't find any wires that go down that wall) e2: I also confirmed that the outlet I was hoping to take off the switch is indeed run off the bathroom light, as another goon predicted. So oh well. SpartanIvy fucked around with this message at 03:31 on Jun 3, 2018 |
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Jun 3, 2018 03:28
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SpartanIvy posted:So can I just like, throw another 12/2 romex connection onto a junction box and run it down a wall? There's a junction box right above the wall I need to out an outlet on, but I'm not sure what it junctions to/from. Probably the bathroom and back room but everything is windy and goes under plywood and insulation Do you mean like this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JEy4vE9HKM
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Jun 3, 2018 03:43
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Hubis posted:Do you mean like this? In theory yes, but I want everything in the wall, and to run it from the attic down the wall. Although where I want the outlet is actually the opposite wall of where the light switch with the burned wires are. So now I'm thinking I might just tear out some sheet rock in the water heater closet, and put the water heater outlet box opposite the bathroom switch, rerun the wire from the attic down the wall, and kill 2 birds with one stone. I'd have to put the sheetrock back, but it's in a 20"x20" closet that literally no one but me will see.
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Jun 3, 2018 03:59
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My little sister closed on a house. I did a walkthrough with her and my dad yesterday and made some Crappy Construction tales-worthy discoveries. Previous owner installed a new ac unit on a 30A circuit running outside. Nice short run, panel is on the other side of the exterior wall from the ac unit. But the line is run through here.  No big deal, maybe it's an external switch or something.  Oh. Looks like an old fuse wired in-line in an exterior box that isn't really weatherproof anymore. As I recall, the inspector didn't think this was a big deal. I'm not so sure.
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Jun 3, 2018 19:59
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Brute Squad posted:
It's probably safe enough, but you could check for water damage inside. It's a pull-out disconnect, cheap to replace. That is a lot of rust; was the latch on the bottom center of the enclosure swiveled in like that? If it's not swiveled out, holding the cover on and up, it's not going to keep water out like it should. Edit: that does look like a fuse holder, but if it's on a properly sized breaker you don't need a fused one. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 21:46 on Jun 3, 2018 |
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Jun 3, 2018 21:31
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Brute Squad posted:Looks like an old fuse wired in-line in an exterior box that isn't really weatherproof anymore. As I recall, the inspector didn't think this was a big deal. I'm not so sure. It's just a disconnecting means within line-of-sight of the unit. You'd only pull that out once the breaker inside is off to guarantee that the outdoor unit can't become energized while you're working on it. It really only has one function: to carry current when plugged in, and not do so when unplugged. If you need to use it and it breaks, then you can replace it. Until then, if it's not getting hot in use, then yeah, it's no big deal at all. It's about as safe as the cracked insulation on the cable right next to the box (quite, until it dramatically fails and catches fire, tripping the breaker).
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Jun 4, 2018 02:20
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Added the new outlet to my water heater closet, and fixed a splice in the attic that was just sitting under insultation. Put everything in a proper junction box and mounted it on a rafter. Redid the wiring 3 times to make sure I had good contact and pretwists on the nuts. Then I discovered I had spliced it off of the living room fuse instead of the bathroom  Might just leave it because the whole living room is on a 30 amp fuse and I don't think my TV setup, a ceiling fan, and some lights will ever get close to that.
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Jun 4, 2018 05:09
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I can almost promise your whole living room isn't supposed to be on a 30A fuse. Go change it to 15 asap
shame on an IGA fucked around with this message at 06:02 on Jun 4, 2018 |
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Jun 4, 2018 05:58
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shame on an IGA posted:I can almost promise your whole living room isn't supposed to be on a 30A fuse. Go change it to 15 asap Maybe? Oh god does this mean the whole box is supposed to be 30 amps total?  
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Jun 4, 2018 06:11
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You should consider replacing that panel. In the interm, make sure your smoke detectors are less than 10 years old and functioning properly. https://inspectapedia.com/fpe/Federal_NoArk_Electrical_Panels.php
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Jun 4, 2018 07:50
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The Gardenator posted:You should consider replacing that panel. In the interm, make sure your smoke detectors are less than 10 years old and functioning properly. Yeah, but he's showing a fuse panel. Those are significantly harder to invisibly fail. I mean, putting a 30A fuse in where a 20 should be? Obvious. Putting a penny behind a blown fuse? Obvious.
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Jun 4, 2018 11:00
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The Gardenator posted:You should consider replacing that panel. In the interm, make sure your smoke detectors are less than 10 years old and functioning properly. That is a specific problem with the Stablok breaker panels. The fuse boxes are okay. I am considering replacing it and upgrading the rest of the houses wiring as well but it's a very expensive proposal so for the time being I'm making due. (But yes I do have smoke/carbon monoxide detectors)
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Jun 4, 2018 13:36
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SpartanIvy posted:Maybe? Yeah that box is rated for a total of 30A at once split across 4 circuits which each have individual smaller fuses on them, which is fine as long as the fuses installed are the right size for the wires. 15A on 15A circuit, 15A fuse blows. 12A on each of 3 15A circuits, 30A main fuse blows. I thought you were talking about a single circuit of regular 15A outlets on a 30A fuse. shame on an IGA fucked around with this message at 13:44 on Jun 4, 2018 |
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Jun 4, 2018 13:42
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shame on an IGA posted:Yeah that box is rated for a total of 30A at once split across 4 circuits which each have individual smaller fuses on them, which is fine as long as the fuses installed are the right size for the wires. 15A on 15A circuit, 15A fuse blows. 12A on each of 3 15A circuits, 30A main fuse blows. Right now it is wired up with 30 amp fuses on all 4 circuits. So I'm definitely going to be changing those out. Funny thing is the fuses are the old solid glass type so it must have been that way for a long time. I guess that's why none of them have blown.
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Jun 4, 2018 13:57
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I admit, I zeroed in on the company name immediately and did not pay attention to the rest of the picture. Would bet that previous owner upped the fuses to avoid them tripping. That or they say 30amp and assumed it was per circuit.
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Jun 4, 2018 14:24
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Hey, maybe all his wiring is 10awg v v
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Jun 4, 2018 14:44
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Hubis posted:Hey, maybe all his wiring is 10awg v I wish. The wire heading to the living room was 12 gauge. Not sure if that was the only wire going to it, but I'd bet money it is.
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Jun 4, 2018 15:20
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The amount of rust on both the box and the fuse itself set off alarm bells. I understand the importance of a LOS shutoff for a large spinning fan blade, but at least it works for now. I'm encouraging her to replace it with something less rusty.
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Jun 4, 2018 16:22
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We're putting in a small room at the back of our garage that needs a baseboard heater. If I put it on the exterior wall that gets the brunt of the cold air blowing at it during the winter, it'd be right below our main panel and a subpanel - I'm assuming it would be best not to put it there to avoid overly heating up the panels? The other option would be along the new interior wall. In either case I'm making sure the thermostat is far away from the heater and not directly above to avoid messing with the thermostat's reading (which we've had issues with some preexisting baseboards/thermostats, instant the heaters turn on the thermostat thinks its 90 when its still really cold in the room). I figured the heater would have the same effect on the panel/subpanel but not sure if it'd be an issue long term.
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Jun 4, 2018 19:19
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sadus posted:I figured the heater would have the same effect on the panel/subpanel but not sure if it'd be an issue long term. Assuming everything is installed correctly your panels are likely made to sustain ambient temperatures well above the radiant heat you're putting out. If you can touch it with your hand and not get burnt it should be fine. You can look up the ambient rating for your panels and breakers online I presume.
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Jun 4, 2018 19:43
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sadus posted:We're putting in a small room at the back of our garage that needs a baseboard heater. If I put it on the exterior wall that gets the brunt of the cold air blowing at it during the winter, it'd be right below our main panel and a subpanel - I'm assuming it would be best not to put it there to avoid overly heating up the panels? The other option would be along the new interior wall. If the panel is at least 3' above the heaters I don't think the panel would get warm enough to worry about. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 23:57 on Jun 4, 2018 |
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Jun 4, 2018 23:53
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What should I start investigating for a ceiling fan that keeps blowing bulbs? A cfl failed after a month, and back to back LED bulbs have gone out after less than a month as well. They are in an enclosed dome but don't feel like they're getting overly hot. I put a voltmeter on the fixture and get a steady 119v, but I'm guessing I wouldn't detect a spike/momentary short? Could a failing switch put excessive wear on a bulb? Arcing wiring? I'm considering replacing fans in three rooms regardless as one of them stops turning after an hour.. bad brushes? This isn't the same fan that is burning out bulbs.
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Jun 6, 2018 00:15
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Are there signs of arcing at the base of the lamp socket? I'm thinking slightly loose socket + fan wobble could be causing very short interruption of contact on the center pin
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Jun 6, 2018 02:04
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You can also try "rough service" bulbs. However, the enclosed dome is probably what's really killing them. LED bulbs DO NOT like heat. Any heat. What may feel OK to you, or to an incandescent bulb, is probably too hot for them.
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Jun 6, 2018 02:12
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shame on an IGA posted:Are there signs of arcing at the base of the lamp socket? I'm thinking slightly loose socket + fan wobble could be causing very short interruption of contact on the center pin Seconding that the tabs at the bottoms of the sockets got smushed down too much. Turn off the power, get a flathead screwdriver and bend up each tab ever so slightly. Oh, and don't hulk out when you put the bulbs back in.
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Jun 6, 2018 04:11
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Since we're kinda in the middle of panel chat, I'm gonna do a 200A service upgrade since the wife and I are going to add AC to our 100 year old house. Currently we have a 100A service and the panel is completely filled (but, to be honest, probably not overloaded as major appliances are gas). Obviously there are a few details here that depend on what version of the NEC the town is on, but I was curious if anyone had any insights onto my current plan (click for big):  I've seen a few different opinions about the use of Schedule 80 over Schedule 40 for exposed/above ground sections and from what I can tell it really just comes down to the inspector/AHJ. It also looks like dual grounding rods may be required? I'm waiting to hear back from the permitting/inspection company to see what version of the NEC the town uses. 30 TO 50 FERAL HOG fucked around with this message at 16:52 on Jun 7, 2018 |
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Jun 7, 2018 16:46
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NEED MORE MILK posted:Since we're kinda in the middle of panel chat, I'm gonna do a 200A service upgrade since the wife and I are going to add AC to our 100 year old house. Currently we have a 100A service and the panel is completely filled (but, to be honest, probably not overloaded as major appliances are gas). If PVC is exposed to physical damage it needs to be schedule 80. NEC 352.10(F). Sch 40 is fine below grade or in the walls, 80 where it's exposed. New services require two earth grounds, so if you don't have a ufer (rebar in the foundation) or metal water service pipe to clamp on to you'd need two ground rods (8 feet apart?).
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Jun 7, 2018 18:26
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Blackbeer posted:If PVC is exposed to physical damage it needs to be schedule 80. NEC 352.10(F). Sch 40 is fine below grade or in the walls, 80 where it's exposed. New services require two earth grounds, so if you don't have a ufer (rebar in the foundation) or metal water service pipe to clamp on to you'd need two ground rods (8 feet apart?). I've got a the water pipe entering about 15 feet away from the panel, and was planning on grounding that since I thought it was a requirement anyways. Jumper before and after meter. I'm assuming 6GA CU minimum?
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Jun 7, 2018 18:31
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NEED MORE MILK posted:I've got a the water pipe entering about 15 feet away from the panel, and was planning on grounding that since I thought it was a requirement anyways. Jumper before and after meter. I'm assuming 6GA CU minimum? #4 bare copper (based on the 2/0 service conductors). Not sure I know what you mean by jumper before and after the meter; if your main panel is the service disconnect (looks that way) then you'll go from the panel to each grounding electrode. Ground and neutral will be bonded in the main panel (again, assuming there's no other service disconnect). edit: oh poo poo, before and after the water meter, I'm a little slow. Blackbeer fucked around with this message at 18:46 on Jun 7, 2018 |
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Jun 7, 2018 18:39
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Blackbeer posted:#4 bare copper (based on the 2/0 service conductors). Not sure I know what you mean by jumper before and after the meter; if your main panel is the service disconnect (looks that way) then you'll go from the panel to each grounding electrode. Ground and neutral will be bonded in the main panel (again, assuming there's no other service disconnect). I believe water meters are potentially non-conductive, so a jumper before and after the meter makes sure that the metal piping inside and outside of the house are all grounded to the same earth.
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Jun 7, 2018 18:47
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NEED MORE MILK posted:I believe water meters are potentially non-conductive, so a jumper before and after the meter makes sure that the metal piping inside and outside of the house are all grounded to the same earth. Yeah, I just didn't get it. Now that I think about it a bit more, you're right on the #6 bare per 250.66(A). If the grounding runs are separate, you don't need bigger than #6 for ground rods.
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Jun 7, 2018 18:56
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I guess the last question is, "Is this something I can do?" I'm getting permits and inspections and all the good stuff but am I still hosed because I'm not an electrician and something happens? If that's the case, how much CAN I do, and then have an electrician come out and wrap up the rest?
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Jun 7, 2018 19:00
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