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Colostomy Bag
Jan 11, 2016

:lesnick: C-Bangin' it :lesnick:

lmao

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Tokamak
Dec 22, 2004

This is the Derek Smart drama that I crave.

thatguy
Feb 5, 2003
Shatner confirmed for SQ:42?

Dark Off
Aug 14, 2015




G0RF posted:

E3 is finally upon us!

Can you feel the magic in the air people? It’s a season of traditions and technological miracles — they’re already beginning.

CIG stumbled into 3.2 while losing much of what made it seem like a big step forward!

We’re getting days worth of game updates and surprises from studios that actually make games!

Derek just had a dust-up with Captain Kirk about Twitter app functionality or something! (Classic!)

https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005417817666129920
https://twitter.com/WilliamShatner/status/1005418139545268224
https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005421780608135169
https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005428795535478786
I don’t even know what they’re fighting about. But it’s great!

:pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance:
this aint star citizen related but cant help it this is pure comedy, and deserves to be quoted.
:five: :wtchris:

Thoatse
Feb 29, 2016

Lol said the scorpion, lmao

Bootcha posted:

It rhymes with "shill".


In true :cig: fashion it's a cross between shill and sale

Colostomy Bag
Jan 11, 2016

:lesnick: C-Bangin' it :lesnick:

Tier 0 shale

Beet Wagon
Oct 19, 2015





G0RF posted:

Derek just had a dust-up with Captain Kirk about Twitter app functionality or something! (Classic!)

https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005428795535478786
I don’t even know what they’re fighting about. But it’s great!

:pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance:

I was gonna write a big thing about how Montoya's a piece of poo poo (I know, I know, broken record) and how insidious the "it actually wasn't a citizen" stuff is going to be when the game goes under and people start actually attacking each other over this poo poo, but I think... I think today I'm just going to bask in the loving weirdness that is Derek Smart getting owned by William Shatner on Twitter.

Beet Wagon fucked around with this message at 13:59 on Jun 9, 2018

Thoatse
Feb 29, 2016

Lol said the scorpion, lmao

G0RF posted:

E3 is finally upon us!

Can you feel the magic in the air people? It’s a season of traditions and technological miracles — they’re already beginning.

CIG stumbled into 3.2 while losing much of what made it seem like a big step forward!

We’re getting days worth of game updates and surprises from studios that actually make games!

Derek just had a dust-up with Captain Kirk about Twitter app functionality or something! (Classic!)

https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005417817666129920
https://twitter.com/WilliamShatner/status/1005418139545268224
https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005421780608135169
https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005428795535478786
I don’t even know what they’re fighting about. But it’s great!

:pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance:



SMAAAAAART!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynfu6hSqViI

tooterfish
Jul 13, 2013

Set phasers to owned.

Wise Learned Man
Apr 22, 2008

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Lipstick Apathy
So did I have a stroke, or am I dreaming? Am I in a coma?

Hav
Dec 11, 2009

Fun Shoe

Zaphod42 posted:

Okay I thought I knew what bind culling and object streaming and all that referred to but I've seen people interpret it different ways and something was bothering me so I went and looked up more or less wtf CIG is even talking about...

...these are basically all just networking optimizations... even if they complete them they won't change the frame rate. At all. It'll make the game more responsive if there's network lag, but it will absolutely not modify frame rates.

So even IF they deliver it in some patch not now because they suck, it still won't fix the problem of the game running 15fps.
They made a bunch of ridiculously high resolution assets in an existing off-the-shelf engine without any idea what they were aiming for and made something that simply doesn't run on modern hardware.
I guess if they delay the game until 2028 maybe then we'll have machines so fast that it'll render at 60 fps, and that's why they're not concerned about performance :haw:

Neither bind culling nor object container streaming refer to render culling. They're networking, they improve server performance.
And if the game is running at 15fps not because of graphics but because its waiting on network packets, then CIG have done something truly unholy.

Yes, yes, let the hatred flow. Feel the dark side rise, and look at their development of serialized variables.

Seriously, i’m at a loss to explain this professionally without the ‘that’s not how this works’. They’re standing on a rickety seesaw between latency and bandwidth, and have not innovated one jot.

And it’s going to work on commercial tier amazon networking hardware. I backed for another wing commander, i got the longest disaster movie in history.

Sabreseven
Feb 27, 2016

G0RF posted:

E3 is finally upon us!

Can you feel the magic in the air people? It’s a season of traditions and technological miracles — they’re already beginning.

CIG stumbled into 3.2 while losing much of what made it seem like a big step forward!

We’re getting days worth of game updates and surprises from studios that actually make games!

Derek just had a dust-up with Captain Kirk about Twitter app functionality or something! (Classic!)

https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005417817666129920
https://twitter.com/WilliamShatner/status/1005418139545268224
https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005421780608135169
https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005428795535478786
I don’t even know what they’re fighting about. But it’s great!

:pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance:

This is literally both funny and very surreal. Derek going at Captian Kirk and viceversa, over twitter, on a Saturday. :eyepop:

Ok, I'm ready to cross over now, my life is complete, have literally seen it all :roflolmao:

UNCUT PHILISTINE
Jul 27, 2006

Atta boy warlord, don't take any poo poo from that old geezer

Agony Aunt
Apr 17, 2018

by LITERALLY AN ADMIN

UNCUT PHILISTINE posted:

Atta boy warlord, don't take any poo poo from that old geezer

You talking to Kirk or Smart? :D

Tokamak
Dec 22, 2004

IIRC Shatner's twitter is managed by a 4channer. Still funny though.

Thoatse
Feb 29, 2016

Lol said the scorpion, lmao
That's because Captain Kirk obviously doesn't understand twitter development

Beet Wagon
Oct 19, 2015





Tokamak posted:

IIRC Shatner's twitter is managed by a 4channer. Still funny though.

I_want_to_believe.jpg

Colostomy Bag
Jan 11, 2016

:lesnick: C-Bangin' it :lesnick:

Appears Kirk won another no-win scenario.

Hav
Dec 11, 2009

Fun Shoe

Zaphod42 posted:

This is extremely ambitious but at least somewhat sane, if that's your goal, that's more or less the right way to go about it.

Although implementing the server in AWS may present some real headaches in itself.


This however is extremely terrible double plus ungood

Think physical bandwidth limitations on shared occupency hardware that you don’t control and merely consume. Think variable performance for nominally identical setup requests. Think software defined networking.

Amazon is very clear in what it supports and what it doesn’t support, and nothing they do supports low latency. That’s one reason why the networking intrigues; You can do this kind of thing through lambda/microservices, and you can scale, but not at the speeds required for twitch gameplay, and you still have a dependency on the persistence store.

They claim the numbers of Jita without even contending with the sheer bandwidth consumed by everyone of those idiots typing ‘!raffle’ at the same time.

Hav
Dec 11, 2009

Fun Shoe

Nyast posted:

That isn't correct. While it's true that those are networking optimizations, bind culling removes the existence of entities that are far away from the player. Render culling does not display them, but the game still has to update (/simumalte) them, check its properties etc..

For example, right now, without bind culling, if a ship is a million Km away from you, it won't get rendered ( good ), but it'll still simulate the IFCS and physics on it.

So there is framerate to be gained with bind culling, as the reduction of network entities to simulate will boost fps a bit. How much, nobody can tell yet. Could be from +10% to doubling the framerate (unlikely).

OCS is supposed to address the "framerate spikes". You know, when you wake up in your pod and for many minutes you can barely move ? But during fractions of a second you can see your framerate go to 40-50 fps ? The renderer actually is able to sustain a half-decent framerate, but is getting hammered with streaming requests; and CIG hasn't implemented asynchronous streaming yet. So streaming data, textures, 3D models etc.. causes a temporary freeze.

In theory they're not lying: bind culling will increase your average framerate and async streaming will address the stuttering/freezes. If they can get those 2 things right, there's hope to have a decent framerate in SC. But of course, none of that is going to fix the design issues.

I think you’re falling into the trap of assuming that when the rubber meets the road, it’s attached to a wheel, hub, transmission, powertrain and engine, rather than just a jpeg of rubber.

They’ve been at the networking for two years. I have no confidence, or if ocs depended on bind culling, would it not have a dependency someplace?

Hav
Dec 11, 2009

Fun Shoe

Agony Aunt posted:

You talking to Kirk or Smart? :D

Yes.

Dogeh
Aug 30, 2017

ShitMeter: -------------|- 99%
One is a cantankerous old fart who ruins relationships with friends and allies....

thatguy
Feb 5, 2003

Beet Wagon posted:

I was gonna write a big thing about how Montoya's a piece of poo poo (I know, I know, broken record) and how insidious the "it actually wasn't a citizen" stuff is going to be when the game goes under and people start actually attacking each other over this poo poo, but I think... I think today I'm just going to bask in the loving weirdness that is Derek Smart getting owned by William Shatner on Twitter.
You've been basking in the Brown Sea too long.

Beet Wagon
Oct 19, 2015





thatguy posted:

You've been basking in the Brown Sea too long.

Yeah I have. Not gonna lie, usually I can just laugh at the funny things the internet idiot mans say, but the conspiracy theory stuff pushes my buttons in a weird way that - somehow - even getting weird death threat stuff of my own doesn't.

Need to turn off my monitor for a bit lol.

stinch
Nov 21, 2013
this is a tier zero post

The Titanic
Sep 15, 2016

Unsinkable

G0RF posted:

E3 is finally upon us!

Can you feel the magic in the air people? It’s a season of traditions and technological miracles — they’re already beginning.

CIG stumbled into 3.2 while losing much of what made it seem like a big step forward!

We’re getting days worth of game updates and surprises from studios that actually make games!

Derek just had a dust-up with Captain Kirk about Twitter app functionality or something! (Classic!)

https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005417817666129920
https://twitter.com/WilliamShatner/status/1005418139545268224
https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005421780608135169
https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/1005428795535478786
I don’t even know what they’re fighting about. But it’s great!

:pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance:

I laughed at this. Because it is so absurd. So very Derek. How could you get in a fight with William Shatner? I don't even like Star Trek but the man is iconic (and I loved him as Denny Crane).

TheAgent
Feb 16, 2002

The call is coming from inside Dr. House
Grimey Drawer
makes me wish crobbers would tweet more

Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now.

Nyast posted:

That isn't correct. While it's true that those are networking optimizations, bind culling removes the existence of entities that are far away from the player. Render culling does not display them, but the game still has to update (/simumalte) them, check its properties etc..

For example, right now, without bind culling, if a ship is a million Km away from you, it won't get rendered ( good ), but it'll still simulate the IFCS and physics on it.

So there is framerate to be gained with bind culling, as the reduction of network entities to simulate will boost fps a bit. How much, nobody can tell yet. Could be from +10% to doubling the framerate (unlikely).

OCS is supposed to address the "framerate spikes". You know, when you wake up in your pod and for many minutes you can barely move ? But during fractions of a second you can see your framerate go to 40-50 fps ? The renderer actually is able to sustain a half-decent framerate, but is getting hammered with streaming requests; and CIG hasn't implemented asynchronous streaming yet. So streaming data, textures, 3D models etc.. causes a temporary freeze.

In theory they're not lying: bind culling will increase your average framerate and async streaming will address the stuttering/freezes. If they can get those 2 things right, there's hope to have a decent framerate in SC. But of course, none of that is going to fix the design issues.

No, this isn't correct. You can still do physics culling just like render culling without network culling.

If you can say "this is far away so don't render it" you can say "this is far away so don't calculate physics on it"

That doesn't require network changes AT ALL.

The server will have to calculate all physics anyways so you can just get the updates and then start calculating again when they're close enough to matter.

The only calcs the server should not be performing would be purely cosmetic client-side ones that don't affect gameplay, and thus can safely be dropped.

You're also misinterpreting OCS. It SOUNDS like what you said, I assumed it was at first. But go look at what CIG have officially said about it, and its just more network optimizations. OCS is NOT asset streaming.

E: both terms are horrible misnomers that don't really do what they say they do. Its seriously buzzword design. Maybe somebody at CIG misunderstood and thinks they're doing more than they are. Either way, these are all network optimizations and there's no reason you need to do that before implementing asset streaming or physics culling on the client.

Zaphod42 fucked around with this message at 15:17 on Jun 9, 2018

Dooguk
Oct 11, 2016

Pillbug

tuo posted:

Star Citizen is rock science, right?

In Robert's case it's pocket science.

The Titanic
Sep 15, 2016

Unsinkable

XK posted:

"This new mining mechanic, what material should we put in for mining?"

"Hmm, how about shale."

What the gently caress is even going on?

I feel like this is Chris Roberts trying to build up reality by making the mundane. If he can build enough stuff in for the basic elements, it will make his world seem more alive. This is basically his version of "ice mining"

The only problem is, despite having theme writers on hand, and no doubt smart people who can think of stuff for him, he may not listen. It's also possible he's no longer even involved at this level, and other people are trying to run with the ball.

But I guess this is it then. Mine on a moon for shale. Which... I guess you can bring it home to make bricks? Patio blocks for your space trailer?

IncredibleIgloo
Feb 17, 2011





That's him, in the Enterprise!

Bofast
Feb 21, 2011

Grimey Drawer

Colostomy Bag posted:

Appears Kirk won another no-win scenario.

TheLastRoboKy
May 2, 2009

Finishing the game with everyone else's continues
Everyone (with no brain) talks about how the Goons are against Star Citizen because they didn't get things their way, but the way Montoya carries on in defense of every single bone-headed thing CIG does is indicative of his investment and desires to be important in Star Citizen. The guy desperately wants to be the top dog at the head of one of the big boys that can say "WE WERE THERE" at the start of Star Citizen. Forge a big identity that would echo throughout the game's life if it actually came out and managed to keep its promises. But it won't. He's smart enough to notice that bad news and the extended lengths of time CIG takes to gently caress up makes people drop out or not buy in, and he absolutely can't have that happen or all the time and money he's already thrown into trying to get ready for Star Citizen goes belly up.

There's almost no way this isn't his motivation. He wants to be the big dick spaceman masterboss, and if Star Citizen looks terrible in people's eyes he's not going to be able to convince anyone to join him and mop his space-deck, let alone managing to trick other TEST members into buying in. It's a big task to try to turn around public perception of this game and while I give him enough credit to be smart enough to see what could go wrong, I don't think he's capable of actually forging a winning argument in the face of CIG's calamitous decision-making.

It's probably a good thing he's seemingly awful at it though, Star Citizen is not coming out and I imagine if he was actually convincing people to opt in a lot of them would be kinda pissed off at him after it all falls down.

Koil
Jun 24, 2005

two weeks

Daztek
Jun 2, 2006









:eyepop:

Xaerael
Aug 25, 2010

Marching Powder is objectively the worst poster known. He also needs to learn how a keyboard works.

Montoya is a South African. We Brits worked out what a collective bunch of idiotic tossers they are a long time ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxEweP2TiMk

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry

ITS NOT FAKE CONCERN BECAUSE IM TELLING YOU ITS NOT FAKE CONCERN! :smuggo:

Scruffpuff
Dec 23, 2015

Fidelity. Wait, was I'm working on again?

Colostomy Bag posted:

Appears Kirk won another no-win scenario.

:five:

Scruffpuff
Dec 23, 2015

Fidelity. Wait, was I'm working on again?

Hav posted:

I think you’re falling into the trap of assuming that when the rubber meets the road, it’s attached to a wheel, hub, transmission, powertrain and engine, rather than just a jpeg of rubber.

This is the trap most professionals fall into when trying to figure out what the gently caress is happening with Star Citizen. They're like a mechanic trying to figure out why the car won't start, "Maybe it's this, maybe it's this" and it's their competency that makes it impossible for them to actually see the real problem.

A professional mechanic won't see why the car isn't starting, because a mechanic would assume the car is otherwise ok, and would not expect it to be a JPEG of a car with a beehive where the engine should be, no gas tank, Twizzlers sticking out of the beehive as "wires", and a watermelon in the back with a piece of cardboard stuck to it that says "Fuel."

This project is a loving hacked-together cargo-cult joke from stem to stern. There's nothing to troubleshoot.

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Frank_Leroux
Mar 24, 2018

G0RF posted:



Derek just had a dust-up with Captain Kirk about Twitter app functionality or something! (Classic!)

I don’t even know what they’re fighting about. But it’s great!

:pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance::pgabz::eonwe::sandance:

Ya know, every time I think "That Derek Smart is actually not all that outrageous of a fella. Sure, he can be a little excitable, but..."

And then, just as I think that, some dangling chain off of that unique brain of his wraps around an axle and rips out the undercarriage like the climax of a chase from Mad Max.

Whether it's the whole 'Comma vs. Period' debate, or like now getting into slap-fights with Captain loving Kirk over exactly which Twitter version is correct, Derek just does something to make me shake my drat head and say. "Welp, that's our warlord." I'm reminded of a line from "Fear And Loathing In Las Vegas.

“There he goes. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die.”

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