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 Frog bong is best bong
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Jun 17, 2018 08:08
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night slime posted:Season 3 is just David going on Reddit to figure out why he didn't do anything wrong DAVID HALLER: [pointing at his phone] actually Syd, you're the rapist
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Jun 17, 2018 14:11
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ekeog posted:DAVID HALLER: [pointing at his phone] actually Syd, you're the rapist Syd is actually a rapist, but that doesn't preclude david being one as well.
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Jun 17, 2018 14:33
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Both David and Syd are super rapists and have destroyed lives with their powers
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Jun 17, 2018 15:54
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Hey maybe I suck at watching TV but why did Farouk revive Lenny using David's sister? As in, what was his motivation to do that? As far as I can tell, after her revival, the only way she affected the outcome of this season was by sniping a rando boxhead, the choke, and the bullet Syd shot at David. Am I to assume that Farouk planned so far in advance that he even used Lenny as a pawn to make David hate Farouk more? Using his sister was, after all, the thing that made him go from wanting to help Farouk to refusing to help Farouk. Except, didn't Farouk talk to future Syd (and thus understand he was to be the hero) after he did that?
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Jun 17, 2018 20:41
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He was just being a dick to David like he always does. He didn’t talk to future Syd till after he transformed Lenny.
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Jun 17, 2018 20:46
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Yeah I guess but then that sorta 1: Disqualifies any "I wanted you to love me" talk Farouk was doing and 2: Continues to make me bothered that David doesn't once say "he killed my sister" when he's jailed and trying to explain himself to the gang. I'm not apologizing for David being a traitor but, ugh, it just rubs me the wrong way when you don't point out the most important recent aspect of why the villain is still a villain. Hey, so, box head people? What was that about? Also, minotaurs are real now? Huh? Was that a mutant? Did they just kill an X-man?
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Jun 17, 2018 20:53
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DaveKap posted:Yeah I guess but then that sorta 1: Disqualifies any "I wanted you to love me" talk Farouk was doing and 2: Continues to make me bothered that David doesn't once say "he killed my sister" when he's jailed and trying to explain himself to the gang. I'm not apologizing for David being a traitor but, ugh, it just rubs me the wrong way when you don't point out the most important recent aspect of why the villain is still a villain. I'm still not sure Farouk was even there physically. Plus yeah that'd be the thing to say, but when you have a dozen personalities talking to you at once, Farouk manipulating you always, your gf and everyone saying you need drugged or killed for possible future crimes etc etc, it's hard to think rationally. gently caress I probably would have peaced out too. e: drat, I never read the comics so I didn't know much of what Legion actually had. I hope they go balls out next season with this poo poo: quote:The son of Charles Xavier and Gabrielle Haller, David Haller is the powerful Omega-level mutant known as Legion.He possesses hundreds of mutant abilities ranging from telekinesis to reality warping, but each power is controlled by a different persona. Barreft fucked around with this message at 23:29 on Jun 17, 2018 |
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Jun 17, 2018 22:54
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so when Cary was reviewing the footage did he just miss the part where Syd tried to kill David to stop him from killing the villain that their entire organization was ostensibly working to destroy? like its fair to freak out about david messing with her mind but how did he only notice 1 of the 2 extremely treacherous actions going on there?
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Jun 17, 2018 23:30
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i mean he probably heard the conversation as well where she said that he was the one who destroys the world blahdeefuckingblah but we should keep ignoring the part where david is responsible for the destruction of earth
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Jun 18, 2018 00:25
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I mean they absolutely should be at the very least skeptical of that information given that the source is the shadow king himself, yeah. Nobody ever acts as the straight man to express skepticism or alarm at the madness on display, and the longer that goes on it's getting harder and harder to read these characters as even being human.
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Jun 18, 2018 01:26
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Sio posted:I mean they absolutely should be at the very least skeptical of that information given that the source is the shadow king himself, yeah. Nobody ever acts as the straight man to express skepticism or alarm at the madness on display, and the longer that goes on it's getting harder and harder to read these characters as even being human. Maybe they aren't real
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Jun 18, 2018 04:39
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And I totally believe Farouk wanted David to love him cause then he’d be the most powerful being in the universe.
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Jun 18, 2018 06:06
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You would be pretty weird to spend all your time with a baby and not grow attached. Hes basically the creepy uncle
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Jun 18, 2018 06:11
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night slime posted:You would be pretty weird to spend all your time with a baby and not grow attached. Hes basically the creepy uncle Right down to the molestation
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Jun 18, 2018 06:35
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I am kinda hoping that season 3 introduces another threat, I don't see Lenny and David on the run constantly getting hosed up and the Section 3 people failing to catch them episode to episode to be that compelling outside of the weird imagery we'd see. twistedmentat fucked around with this message at 07:32 on Jun 18, 2018 |
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Jun 18, 2018 07:29
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Syd trying to kill David is particularly dumb because she later says that she just want David to get treatment. Then why did you try to kill him? Why is no one else questioning this? You can hardly blame David for assuming she must be under mental control and trying to fix her.
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Jun 18, 2018 08:00
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bad writing
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Jun 18, 2018 08:53
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SimonChris posted:Syd trying to kill David is particularly dumb because she later says that she just want David to get treatment. Then why did you try to kill him? Why is no one else questioning this? You can hardly blame David for assuming she must be under mental control and trying to fix her. it's almost like somebody hosed with her head right after she pulled the trigger
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Jun 18, 2018 09:02
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AtraMorS posted:it's almost like somebody hosed with her head right after she pulled the trigger before she pulled the trigger, too. To be fair, someone hosed a little with David's head beforehand, too.
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Jun 18, 2018 09:22
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AtraMorS posted:it's almost like somebody hosed with her head right after she pulled the trigger it's almost like somebody hosed with her head right before it too I really can't argue with people getting the impression that Farouk was messing with Syd from the scene in which he pretended to be a close associate and presented her a with a series of scenes that were both deceptive and completely out of context while she appeared to be under some sort of mental assault, judging by her behaviour, her ignorance of her hand injury and her disinterest in the how nothing about the situation she was in made any sense.
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Jun 18, 2018 09:28
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I thought Syd trying to shoot David made sense? It's not that she thinks he's evil, worse than Farouk, or deserves to die or whatever, she's just decided he's too dangerous to live and this moment when he's depowered might be literally the only chance anyone ever has to take him out (he does indeed try to do something to her with his powers, but they're switched off). As soon as he's trapped she wants to get him in therapy, not kill him. Same when they trap him in the energy sphere in the courtroom - everyone realises that's a hosed up thing to do and not the right way to go about reaching out to someone. However, they're loving terrified. He might snap his fingers and murder everyone in the building, they've seen him do that in season 1. He might reach into their heads and gently caress around with their memories until they think he's a great guy and be convinced that's the right thing to do, they've just seen him do that, too. They have evidence that he literally destroys the world! The tragedy is his power forces everyone to treat him like this. If he was a normal dude or a more normally powerful mutant they'd take some reasonable proportions and stage an intervention with all his friends. But because he is what he is, everyone feels like they have no choice but to strike first when they have a chance. This treatment totally pushes him further towards going crazy/evil as everyone realises it would, but the just don't feel like they have any choice. (All slightly undercut by Farouk being in the courtroom which seems real crazy. I imagine he is definitely not possessing everyone or orchestrating the entire scenario or anything, but is manipulative enough that he's convinced people they need him there.)
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Jun 18, 2018 22:20
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All of this is sorta stymied by the fact that we SEE what happens to Other Davids in alternate realities and he doesn't necessarily become an evil world destroyer. Sometimes he's an invalid, sometimes he's a (dont get him angry) homeless dude, sometimes he's just a creepy captain of industry type (with a still-living but controlled sister). But this David got pushed to become what he is by the people who were supposed to be on his side. Division 3 ended the world, they just used David as the device. He could have become whatever but now he's got no allegiances to anybody except Lenny.
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Jun 18, 2018 22:36
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Magnus Manfist posted:(All slightly undercut by Farouk being in the courtroom which seems real crazy. I imagine he is definitely not possessing everyone or orchestrating the entire scenario or anything, but is manipulative enough that he's convinced people they need him there.) farouk was the only guy around with a shot at handling david if the containment doesn't work not that he did, but hey... Prav fucked around with this message at 22:49 on Jun 18, 2018 |
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Jun 18, 2018 22:47
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How do we know that Farouk's manipulations didn't cause David to turn? I hate time travel plotlines.
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Jun 18, 2018 22:51
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Prav posted:farouk was the only guy around with a shot at handling david if the containment doesn't work They just seemed to think it was gonna work though. And they were hoping to talk to him which definitely isn't gonna happen if his nemesis walks in like he's owns the place. I mean my point was that they know they're treating him badly and potentially pushing him towards the exact thing they're trying to prevent, but they don't feel like they have a choice. And although teaming up with Farouk is in line with that thematically, his entrance (was an cool scene) but just seems dumb. I mean at the very least you'd just make him wait outside while you try to talk to David. The fact that he didn't probably means he's convinced them they desperately need him, which gives him the power to make demands, which lets him walk in like that which he knows will push David over the edge and leave him as Division 3's only hope - which is what I meant by not orchestrating the whole situation from the start but definitely manipulating it bring back old gbs posted:All of this is sorta stymied by the fact that we SEE what happens to Other Davids in alternate realities and he doesn't necessarily become an evil world destroyer. Sometimes he's an invalid, sometimes he's a (dont get him angry) homeless dude, sometimes he's just a creepy captain of industry type (with a still-living but controlled sister). That's the point though. Seems like he becomes a terrifying supervillain in at least one universe and destroys the world in at least one other. What percentage probability of literally ending the loving world is too high? Before you decide just taking out one innocent-ish dude while you have a chance is your only option? That's literally Division 3's entire job, and what they were trying to do way back in season 1 when he was way less dangerous than now. Acting like that absolutely is (partially) what pushes him towards going crazy. And they knew it would. But... they really thought it would work. That's why I thought it was a pretty good tragic story. No one except Farouk is being pointlessly evil, everyone's making what seems like the only rational choice and only making things worse.
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Jun 18, 2018 23:27
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Prav posted:farouk was the only guy around with a shot at handling david if the containment doesn't work Did the giant tuning fork get destroyed? I don’t actually remember. Kinda weird that Division 3 never thought to employ it against either of the god-tier psychics they were up against in either season. Maybe David willed it into existence.
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Jun 18, 2018 23:45
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In the finale battle Farouk is wearing a red tie, and David is wearing a red shirt with a green jacket. He can take off the jacket...
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Jun 18, 2018 23:46
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Barreft posted:I'm still not sure Farouk was even there physically. I'm honestly wondering what this end would have looked like without the extra episode Hawley was granted.
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Jun 19, 2018 01:46
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Magnus Manfist posted:I thought Syd trying to shoot David made sense? Syd wakes up in a tent with David after navigating an unreal desert. She steps out and sees a giant hole and a giant pink drainplug. A white rabbit on a hook is tossed out of the hole; she frees the rabbit but then is snagged by the hook and pulled into hole, which she somehow survives. She then navigates a maze that is similar to Division 3 before finding a mind-controlled Melanie. Melanie shows Syd context-less images, including information that Melanie shouldn't have which Syd calls out or that Syd should know is incorrect (like the video of David roaming the hall in S1). Kerry somehow enters the labyrinth where the minotaur (or Jabberwock, maybe) runs around on the ceiling and kills a Vermilion. Kerry then teams up with Syd to fight the minotaur and the sequence ends with, seemingly, Syd losing to the minotaur (although maybe she shifted bodies). The next episode picks up with Syd apparently having cut off the minotaur's head, dragged it out of the maze and through the monastery and back to where David is. The main problem is that Syd should be questioning what she's seeing and does question what she's being told, but is either convinced off-camera (which means she's either an idiot or the audience should have been shown this) or mind-controlled by Farouk... which kinda supports David just erasing the last few hours in the heat of the moment. Even if she completely accepts that the future info from Mel-Farouk is true, and stopping David from killing Farouk is indicated to be the correct action by Future Syd, that doesn't mean that killing David makes sense, vs simply ensuring that Farouk survives to counter David if/when David turns bad. quote:They have evidence that he literally destroys the world!
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Jun 19, 2018 03:34
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Zachack posted:I don't think the show ever shows Syd going through this thought process except maybe when talking to Two-Face. I think it does though. I mean it's supposed to come as a surprise because our viewpoint is aligned with David, but if you think about it it's natural endpoint for her character. We've known about the super hosed up thing she did with her mum's boyfriend since season 1, and she always says "who teaches us to be normal when we're one of a kind". And for several episodes she's been saying she thinks David is losing the ability to know (or care) what's real and what isn't. Her whole character is that she understands exactly how easy it is to do something unforgiveable when you have crazy powers. But the difference is she did it once as a messed up kid and has basically spent her whole life regrettig it and trying to avoid doing it again, while David, as an adult with powers vastly more dangerous than hers, is pushing the envelope further and further and obviously revelling in his powers. She's been blinded for a long time by a basically immature relationship with him based on shared trauma and him being the only person who can touch her but ever since season 1 people have been telling her she goes to a lot of trouble to convince herself he's a good guy, she's been gradually losing faith in his ability to learn to be normal (kind of the cornerstone of her character), and when she sees everything he's done from an outside perspective it tips her over the edge. Yeah, she's obviously being manipulated by being shown that, but that doesn't mean it's not true - Farouk just knows exactly what to show her. Most of it she knew was true, it was just an outside perspective on it. It's not the case that she was entirely into him before getting sucked into the cave an comes out ready to kill him, that's just how David sees it. That's why she turns on him immediately again when Kerry tells her - it's not just that the rape is a single thing that turns everyone against him, it's that David presumably just wiped the last 24 hours or so memory, but actually she's been worrying that he's losing track of what's real and what isn't for much longer than that, and him reaching into her head and screwing with her mind to make her love him again is absolute confirmation of that Zachack posted:What evidence? Dr Robo-nerd says something like there's a 98% probability the pokeball was built by Kerry in the future, the implication is clearly that they've assessed the evidence and decided to believe the message from the future that David destroys the world
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Jun 19, 2018 20:55
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So I just finished the last episode What the gently caress was the point of that minotaur? Or the monks? I didn't get any of that Then they kill the minotaur offscreen? wat
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Jun 19, 2018 21:42
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Zzulu posted:So I just finished the last episode we ran out of budget. Sorry. Farouk ate it all.
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Jun 19, 2018 21:53
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Zachack posted:The main problem is that Syd should be questioning what she's seeing and does question what she's being told, but is either convinced off-camera (which means she's either an idiot or the audience should have been shown this) She is convinced on camera during the penultimate episode when she is at the bottom of the hole with Farouk. She is repeatedly shown David's Yellow Shirt personality enjoying the hell out of being an evil jerk.
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Jun 20, 2018 03:20
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Magnus Manfist posted:She's been blinded for a long time by a basically immature relationship with him based on shared trauma and him being the only person who can touch her but ever since season 1 people have been telling her she goes to a lot of trouble to convince herself he's a good guy, she's been gradually losing faith in his ability to learn to be normal (kind of the cornerstone of her character), and when she sees everything he's done from an outside perspective it tips her over the edge. Yeah, she's obviously being manipulated by being shown that, but that doesn't mean it's not true - Farouk just knows exactly what to show her. Most of it she knew was true, it was just an outside perspective on it. quote:Dr Robo-nerd says something like there's a 98% probability the pokeball was built by Kerry in the future, the implication is clearly that they've assessed the evidence and decided to believe the message from the future that David destroys the world quote:She is convinced on camera during the penultimate episode when she is at the bottom of the hole with Farouk. She is repeatedly shown David's Yellow Shirt personality enjoying the hell out of being an evil jerk.
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Jun 20, 2018 04:45
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Farouk did nothing wrong. He wasn't a God-Emporer ruling from a skull throne in the recent past. He was just a chill dude hanging with some fly ladies when some imperialist ivory-tower academic wanted to start some poo poo.
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Jun 20, 2018 08:51
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Chef Boyardeez Nuts posted:Farouk did nothing wrong. He wasn't a God-Emporer ruling from a skull throne in the recent past. He was just a chill dude hanging with some fly ladies when some imperialist ivory-tower academic wanted to start some poo poo.
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Jun 20, 2018 09:13
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SimonChris posted:Yeah, I always wondered why Farouk getting his body back was treated as this potentially apocalyptic event, when all he did with it in the past was rule some random middle eastern country. I mean, the characters do technically work for the US Government... 
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Jun 20, 2018 12:58
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Zachack posted:I don't disagree with the gist of this, but think it accelerated way too much at the end (partly because the season seemed really interested in long, visually pleasing but overall low-value shots) and when the provider of the perspective is the series' villain merged with a shambling drug addict Syd should be at least not rapidly accepting it to the point of committing murder. Well she doesn't really have the option of accepting the perspective or not because it's all clearly true, she's just forced to confront everything she's been trying to avoid acknowledging at once. She knows she's being manipulated but she can't refute that it's the truth. And the kicker is that immediately after she's seen all that, she comes out to see him going to fight Farouk, looking loving bonkers. I mean yeah Farouk needs to go down and deserves everything he gets, but David isn't exactly behaving rationally and regretfully doing what must be done, he's levitating across the desert blasting out sick synth-rock tunes. And the point about rapidly escalating to murdering him is that with David the unhinged possible world-ender there aren't really any half measures. She doesn't want to murder him and as soon as she thinks he's under control in the forcefield she dials it back to "let's get you some therapy". But she's finally come round to the point of view that all of D3, Clark, Ptonomy, now Melanie, etc have been pushing, that he's too dangerous to live, and she thinks this is the only chance she or anyone will ever get Zachack posted:Sure, what I'm saying is how do they know what the message was? There are only two people who went into the future: David and Farouk. Why would they ever believe that Farouk is telling the truth? I think she tells David that she figured it out? Future her comes back from the end of world to convince David to help the only dude who can stand up to him, so.... Farouk's good at manipulating people. He doesn't just show up and tell her stuff, because she obviously wouldn't believe him. He shows her stuff that's obviously true and guides her to a conclusion that, although she doesn't trust him, still seems logically irrefutable. Basically there were definitely problems with the season but I thought this part was fine. For me it hit a decent balance of being suprising because we're seeing most of this from David's perspective, but (especially in retrospect) telegraphed from a long time back and kind of inevitable
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Jun 20, 2018 22:17
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Magnus Manfist posted:
I see your point but I'm not especially convinced. In support of it their relationship has been fairly brief and full of super dangerous stuff so how clear a picture can she have. I just don't buy that you can convince someone that someone is totally different to what you thought as if it were a reality tv show and you're only showing the audience their best or worst moments if you know them for a reasonable enough length of time. Syd doesn't seem weak willed and easily turned. We have another season to see how it plays out I guess.
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Jun 20, 2018 22:29
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