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chumbler posted:The final case of AA7 is Athena v. Provinstate of Japanifornia to allow Nick to marry Edgeworth. I don't know how this would result from a murder case, but who cares about details? That would be bigamy though, the reason for Gumshoe's absence is that he's Edgeworth's househusband and takes care of their doggies.
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May 4, 2018 06:51
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surf rock posted:- I might be (and probably am) wrong about this, but it feels like the number of secondary characters in a given case has dropped over time. In any given case, it feels like I can say, "OK, our defendant is innocent, so one of the two witnesses did it. If one of them is a recurring character, it's the other person. If not, it's whoever gets less testimony initially." I feel like there's a dearth of minor characters and therefore possible red herrings. If you look at the whole cast, you've got a total of four people who are not main protagonists, main antagonists and/or criminals, clients, or victims: Bonny and her sister, Uendo, and Sarge. By comparison, case 1-3 alone had three in Cody, Penny, and Sal. This is very noticeable in SoJ. Every case has two witnesses and one of them did it. I think it may be a consequence of the 3D shift: in the old days you could draw two sprites for the unimportant side character and be done with, but now you'll have to create the full model anyway so might as well make the best use of it.
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May 4, 2018 10:05
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How is Ema a bad investigator, exactly? She always correctly outlines the facts of the case and gives accurate testimony, and she’s capable of handling the usual Ace Attorney plot twist and following it through. The only exceptions are 4-3, where Klavier is actively dicking around and withholding evidence, and 6-6, which was written for Gumshoe. She may not be all that professional, but she was always the most competent of the detectives. Also Godot was a good and unique prosecutor besides having a gimmick.
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May 4, 2018 11:18
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TheKingofSprings posted:Detective Gumshoe also finished his arc; his salary went so negative it wrapped around i know this is a joke but (AAI2) at the end of the game Edgeworth actually gives him a raise and that's the real ending of his arc. Play AAI2 everyone
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May 4, 2018 12:39
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The White Dragon posted:so you're saying, he's perpetually renting a gatewater suite with victor kudo where girls dressed like maids fan them and feed them grapes all day Capcom makes money off of Nick being a bachelor so this is unlikely to happen
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May 4, 2018 13:28
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Also the best way to resolve that would be to have a returning witness actually be the murderer
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May 4, 2018 13:29
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It's gonna be wild when Maya does commit a murder and Nick gets an innocent verdict before finding out.
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May 4, 2018 13:40
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don't tell me you think wendy oldbag hasn't killed before
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May 4, 2018 13:50
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She killed my desire to keep playing at least
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May 4, 2018 13:55
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Apollo still needs to be accused of a murder before he can join the family. Pearl too.
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May 4, 2018 14:12
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surf rock posted:- I think there's a lot of circumstantial evidence about Inga having a decent side and getting pushed around by Ga'ran, but it's super weird to me that the last case didn't really circle back to wrap up his story. Typically the series is really heavy-handed about stuff like that; I was sure that after the case we would have to present some kind of evidence to Rayfa to prove he loved her or something like that and it didn't happen. another thing I thought was weird was people still assumed Inga was the one trying to steal the Founder's Orb for power even after Inga was discovered to have prosopagnosia. So clearly he wasn't trying to use it in a coup
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May 4, 2018 18:24
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mabels big day posted:i know this is a joke but (AAI2) at the end of the game Edgeworth actually gives him a raise and that's the real ending of his arc. Speaking of AAI2 and SOJ y'all ever notice that Yamazaki has a thing for killer clowns? Makes me wonder if it's a middle finger to Turnabout Big Top.
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May 5, 2018 04:47
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mabels big day posted:i know this is a joke but (AAI2) at the end of the game Edgeworth actually gives him a raise and that's the real ending of his arc. you are mistaken, this is the end of the Instant Noodles arc. Next is the Maggey Byrde Saga arc.
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May 5, 2018 04:54
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AAI2 is set after AA3.
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May 5, 2018 11:11
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TheKingofSprings posted:Also the best way to resolve that would be to have a returning witness actually be the murderer Darn right. if they're gonna try to make the most of their assets this seems like the best way. Would be interesting to have more legal twists on the case like the original Steel Samurai one, where the murder is self-defense, or manslaughter in the orca case. Or hell, for once to have a non-murder trial that remains so through the entire game. I was kinda hoping the second-last case of Spirit of Justice would come down to a genuine legal conflict of the Fey Clan and Kingdom of Khu'Rain having a conflict over the ownership of what amounts to a holy relic.
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May 5, 2018 11:50
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Pretty sure the orca case was 100% an accident, which is why the culprit was able to get out of prison so quickly.
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May 5, 2018 17:19
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Kaiser Mazoku posted:Pretty sure the orca case was 100% an accident, which is why the culprit was able to get out of prison so quickly. ...I think I'm gonna be in my 40s when we're kayfabeposting that case. Jesus Blackfishing Christ.
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May 5, 2018 17:47
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mabels big day posted:i know this is a joke but (AAI2) at the end of the game Edgeworth actually gives him a raise and that's the real ending of his arc. this its so good
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May 5, 2018 18:02
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VivaLa Eeveelution posted:...I think I'm gonna be in my 40s when we're kayfabeposting that case. Jesus Blackfishing Christ. My sister just finished Yakuza 6, which takes place in 2016, and learned about Project X Zone 2. We theorized (spoilers for both AA1 and Yakuza 6) Mia was working on getting Daigo, Majima, and Saejima out of prison when she was murdered in 1-2 and Phoenix picks up the case between 1-3 and 1-4, which is roughly mid-October to early December of 2016. The timeline in Yakuza 6 is more unclear beyond it appears to be Chinese New Year at the start of the game, but it could work. 
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May 5, 2018 23:09
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SUPERMAN'S GAL PAL posted:My sister just finished Yakuza 6, which takes place in 2016, and learned about Project X Zone 2. We theorized (spoilers for both AA1 and Yakuza 6) Mia was working on getting Daigo, Majima, and Saejima out of prison when she was murdered in 1-2 and Phoenix picks up the case between 1-3 and 1-4, which is roughly mid-October to early December of 2016. The timeline in Yakuza 6 is more unclear beyond it appears to be Chinese New Year at the start of the game, but it could work. That's good enough for me! Man, we still got ten years of kayfabe ahead of us. And who knows what the games to come add. But seriously tho, that Mask De Masque guy on the news is pretty slick. Maybe it's because of P5, but a noble thief sounds good for the world right about now...
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May 5, 2018 23:41
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I'm at the third case of SoJ and the pacing in this game is weird. Supposedly this and the final case are the only "full length" ones? The first is the tutorial (though it definitely felt longer than usual), case two was 1 trial and investigation, and from what I've read the fourth case is only a trial again. I'm not going to complain since the investigation bits in all the games tend to drag (especially in the filler cases) and things have gotten too long once they switched over to 5 cases since that's way too much padding for its own good. Also, those seances are a really dull gameplay feature and half the things they introduce in these games that aren't the trial bits don't tend to work too well - Athena's magical psychoanalysis computer still feels underdeveloped one and a half games in, and Apollo's bracelet powers might as well not exist. I think a ton of the issues these games have could be fixed if they went back to having one main character, but after AJ's failure and how reactionary Capcom (and especially game companies in general) tend to be I doubt that'll happen. There's a ton of interesting character development for Apollo in DD/SOJ so far, but it's ruined by having to share screen time with Phoenix whose character arc already ended three games ago*. I don't mind Athena and think her case in DD was the highlight of the game, but she's also another character who should have her own game instead, which is even less likely considering she's a ~~female character~~ and, once again, this is Capcom we're talking about. * It's also disappointing that the first case of DD (and his interactions with Apollo/Athena in their chapters) has him being competent and a good mix of his trilogy/AJ self then the writers slowly give up on it and by the end of the game - which has the weakest and dullest final case/antagonist in the series so far- he's fully reverted back to his original trilogy self and is an absolute moron to the point where even Edgeworth lampshades it. SoJ isn't being too good about this aspect either.
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Jun 22, 2018 17:15
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I share your objections and thought case 3 dragged on a bit, and I'll add that I hate how they insist that every game needs to have higher stakes than the last. 3 had my favorite ending since they wrapped up the high-stakes stuff halfway through and dedicated rest the trial to resolving Godot's character arc. Stick with the game, though. I think you'll like where it goes.
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Jun 22, 2018 17:35
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I'm going to be so annoyed if the next Ace Attorney game just goes ahead and puts Phoenix at the center of everything again. Or, alternately, if they introduce another male attorney protagonist. I mean, there are problems with Athena, but they're easily resolvable by putting her in the foreground and giving her the chance to prove herself without serious back-up. Maybe have her first case be by herself with no co-counsel? also I like her emotions thing much more than the Seance, or Apollo's bracelet. More could be done with it, and it was under-utilized in SoJ (as was Athena in general). Maybe I'd make a few tweaks, but I like the idea that confused emotions can distort people's memories of events. It's true to life! and this imagines a method by which those distortions could be cleared up, to get more accurate testimony out of a witness. and even if DID was portrayed a bit weirdly (although honestly Uendo is closer to actual DID than 90% of DID pop culture portrayals), using it to throw the mechanic for a loop was clever. I don't know how I'd improve it. Maybe have it so there's times where two emotional reactions in different bits of testimony contradict each other? My feeling about SoJ is that it isn't as coherent as DD, but it has a more satisfying final case and better endgame villain. Also the first part of the 5th case is one of my favorite trials in the series, for numerous reasons, but at least 50% SARGE. 
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Jun 22, 2018 22:18
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I wonder if since Takumi is done with vs Layton and DaiGyaku, if he's going to be brought back to the main series in 7. Not that I don't like what the new writing crew is doing, it's just dude's gotta do SOMETHING. E: Ghost Trick 2! Make me Ghost Trick 2!
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Jun 22, 2018 22:24
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Tbh I wouldn't be that upset if Takumi never came back, considering the weaknesses that Apollo Justice and Layton Vs. had. I played all of Ghost Trick and can remember almost nothing about it, so I'm gonna consider that a huge mark against the game and therefore Takumi as well.
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Jun 22, 2018 22:29
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Raxivace posted:Tbh I wouldn't be that upset if Takumi never came back, considering the weaknesses that Apollo Justice and Layton Vs. had. Actually it's a huge mark against you.
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Jun 22, 2018 22:44
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Yeah for real, I tend to forget cases here and there with AA. Ghost Trick however has burned itself into my brain because I was so into it
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Jun 22, 2018 22:52
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I feel like making a sequel to Ghost Trick would be a bad idea. Even though I really don't like how it ended, it was still a very nice contained story, and I think Takumi is better off doing more of those.
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Jun 22, 2018 22:54
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Sudden Javelin posted:Yeah for real, I tend to forget cases here and there with AA. Ghost Trick however has burned itself into my brain because I was so into it Ghost Trick left me with basically nothing despite the unique premise.
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Jun 22, 2018 23:04
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I’m honestly not a fan of Athena and would much rather see more Apollo if we’re moving forward with one of the main attorneys, but I will grant that she has far more room to grow. I would love to see a post-time skip Franziska or a more established and grown up version of Athena though. I’m not sure what my objection is, because I loved rookie Mia but hated the Dahlia cases.
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Jun 22, 2018 23:32
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Sudden Javelin posted:Yeah for real, I tend to forget cases here and there with AA. Ghost Trick however has burned itself into my brain because I was so into it the only thing ghost trick burned into my brain was how awful the puzzles in the park were Zulily Zoetrope posted:I loved rookie Mia but hated the Dahlia cases. spoken like a true believer in edgewright otp
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Jun 22, 2018 23:55
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The White Dragon posted:spoken like a true believer in edgewright otp I don’t see how that follows from what I said? I mean, not that you’re wrong. Edgeworth is clearly hella gay for Nick, even if the reverse is more ambivalent.
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Jun 23, 2018 00:07
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:I don’t see how that follows from what I said? because all the dahlia cases involve nick getting lovey dovey with iris instead of miles edgeworth
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Jun 23, 2018 01:47
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Yeah, that’s fair.
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Jun 23, 2018 02:14
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not having Franzy back yet is a missed opportunity. Though I get why it would've been hard to do for either DD or SoJ. but the way AAI 1&2 use her is very, very cool, and bringing her back as a badass globetrotting crime-syndicate fighting prosecutor would be neat.
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Jun 23, 2018 10:05
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Franzy is cool and if they do any more spin-off things she should definitely show up, but the mainline games need way less returning characters not more. I guess it'd be alright if instead of the one case Edgeworth appearance she showed up instead though.
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Jun 23, 2018 10:17
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If she comes back, she should be a supporting character to the new prosecutor, who is her protege. I just decided this.
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Jun 23, 2018 18:12
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Bongo Bill posted:If she comes back, she should be a supporting character to the new prosecutor, who is her protege. I just decided this. Kameleon von Karma
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Jun 23, 2018 18:45
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Bongo Bill posted:If she comes back, she should be a supporting character to the new prosecutor, who is her protege. I just decided this. The new prosecutor...... is Adrian Andrews
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Jun 23, 2018 18:59
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i've been replaying AA6, and I think my favorite part of the game is the point where Phoenix and Apollo start a political revolution within a few days of getting there also, Apollo's powerful final finger point is really good
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Jul 24, 2018 20:45
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