|
Open Marriage Night posted:Bart was the worst Flash. Bart was fine, he just suffered from a crappy writing team (Bilson / DeMeo). Plus DC panicking when he didn't catch on right away and rushing to return Barry instead.
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 14:29
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 18, 2024 07:38 |
|
|
That whole thing with the Flash: TFMA was kind of weird. Didn't they kill Bart horribly in the last issue?
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 14:36
|
|
|
The Question IRL posted:That was the origin in Alex Ross’ Justice series. I found that series just a bit too much of Alex Ross “the thing you think you know. It’s really the opposite!! WOO!!!!” Narrative spin that he used a lot in his Earth X trilogy for Marvel. Riddler cheating actually predates that, there's an annual called "questions multiply the mystery" from 1995 that is a Riddler origin story. Don't know if it is referenced even earlier but it is from the 90s at least.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 14:49
|
|
|
irlZaphod posted:That whole thing with the Flash: TFMA was kind of weird. Didn't they kill Bart horribly in the last issue? If you were following Countdown (and why the gently caress would you do that anyway) you would have had one issue where the Rogues say "lets do the plan. the plan is awesome. The plan will work" etc only to have the next issue have the rogues go "I can't believe Flash is dead now" I found it very jarring.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 19:12
|
|
|
I'm kinda surprised at the lack of love for COIE here. It's not nearly as convoluted as people make it out to be, and while it hasn't aged particularly well -- which I blame on the myriad other Crises that followed after and ran the "universe changing event" idea into the ground -- it was a monumental creative effort in its era.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 19:33
|
|
|
SonicRulez posted:Wally/Barry and any other answer is super wrong. There's some debate with the Lanterns. Also the Robins. Never with the Flashes though. Dick Damian Carrie Stephanie hopefully someone I'm forgetting Jason you might swap Tim and Dick or Carrie and Damian.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 19:38
|
|
|
Skwirl posted:Tim This is indisputably correct.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 19:40
|
|
|
Skwirl posted:Tim Which one was played by Burt Ward?
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 19:40
|
|
|
Skwirl posted:Tim Tim Dick Carrie Damian Stephanie That Robot Robin in one of the annuals A ham sandwich Jason Todd Yes I know I am being hard on Todd and he was actually a really good Robin in Batman: Cult and For the Man who has everything but his biggest contribution to the Batman/Robin lore is being dead.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 19:42
|
|
|
Madkal posted:
I knew I was forgetting one. Was there a future Robin in DC One Million (or is that the robot)? I think Tim would have been the current Robin in the present day timeline.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 19:47
|
|
|
Madkal posted:Tim He does absolutely nothing in Cult that would indicate to a new reader that it wasn't Dick in the mask. Dick wouldn't have been starstruck meeting Superman in For the Man Who Has Everything but otherwise there's nothing you'd lose by just find/replace "Jay" with "Dick' in the dialogue. Anyway the best Robins are Tim Dick Damian Stephanie Duke in that weird possible future thing The entire cast of We Are Robin Carrie Jason
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 20:01
|
|
|
Skwirl posted:Tim I'd probably swap Carrie and Stephanie in my list but otherwise right on. I like the idea of Jason coming back (as a plot by Ra's al Ghul; not SBP punch BS) and being a bad guy. Maybe push him on that anti-hero angle - Make him DC's Punisher. He's not a good guy, he's not a hero, but he's slightly better than the people he kills. Trouble with that is, you can't let him kill anyone interesting or popular, so he's either ineffective or just boring. Really, as much as I like the idea, Jason should have stayed dead.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 22:57
|
|
|
ecavalli posted:I'm kinda surprised at the lack of love for COIE here. It's not nearly as convoluted as people make it out to be, and while it hasn't aged particularly well -- which I blame on the myriad other Crises that followed after and ran the "universe changing event" idea into the ground -- it was a monumental creative effort in its era. Reading Crisis and Who's Who as a kid probably are what made me a comics fan for life, but I feel like the wordy Bronze Age style of melodrama that it runs on is really dated. I kind of find Marv Wolfman's stuff embarrassing to read nowadays. I wouldn't recommend to it to somebody that hasn't read it unless they're a big Geoff Johns fan.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 23:11
|
|
|
Servoret posted:Reading Crisis and Who's Who as a kid probably are what made me a comics fan for life, but I feel like the wordy Bronze Age style of melodrama that it runs on is really dated. I kind of find Marv Wolfman's stuff embarrassing to read nowadays. I wouldn't recommend to it to somebody that hasn't read it unless they're a big Geoff Johns fan. I got into comics at the perfect time, 1985-86. I started reading G.I. Joe, Transformers, DC Who's Who, Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe: Deluxe Edition, and Marvel Saga, which was like the Wikipedia of its day; Silver Age plot summaries in text form, with key panels included. Spider-Man was featuring Daredevil, Punisher, Black Cat, and Falcon and unmasking Hobgoblin in Amazing and there was a hardcore Spider-Man vs. Wolverine one-shot. Avengers had Zemo's Masters of Evil invading Avengers Mansion and loving everyone up. My first exposure to the X-Men outside of the Amazing Friends cartoon was two concurrent miniseries, X-Men vs. Fantastic Four and X-Men vs. Avengers. Meanwhile, DC was wrapping up Crisis, but we had a new event book, Legends, coming out of it. There was also a new Superman book, Man of Steel, that seemed to be starting at the beginning of his career, although I'll never forget how it hosed with my head as a kid when Magpie killed one of her henchmen by putting a lit stick of dynamite in his mouth after he failed her. Thanks, Byrne. And I got almost all those comics from newsstands. I can't think of many better eras to start reading comics as a kid.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 23:31
|
|
|
Big Bad Voodoo Lou posted:I got into comics at the perfect time, 1985-86. I started reading G.I. Joe, Transformers, DC Who's Who, Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe: Deluxe Edition, and Marvel Saga, which was like the Wikipedia of its day; Silver Age plot summaries in text form, with key panels included. This was all good stuff.  (I was a Marvel zombie; didn't read any DC stuff until much later.) prefect fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Jul 11, 2018 |
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2018 23:36
|
|
|
I'm late to the discussion on who's had the most origin retcons and it's not really an origin retcon per se, more of a gaping plot hole being introduced, but it's one I like to talk about. So Kyle Rayner's history got all kind of messed up when the New 52 hit, mostly as a consequence of Green Lantern not really getting rebooted. So Kyle was dating a fellow GL (and Sinestro's daughter), Soranik Natu. During a battle during Blackest Night, Kyle dies. While a bunch of lanterns fight trying to prevent any black rings from reviving Kyle into a zombie, this Star Sapphire named Miri comes down and using some vague power of love bullshit revives Kyle by using Soranik's love. Like 2 storylines later, Miri seemingly goes nuts on some planet forcing Kyle and Soranik to get sent on a mission to stop her, but then after they do, Miri says her going nuts was only a ruse because their relationship was starting to get rocky and as a Star Sapphire she can't abide breakups I guess. Kyle reveals that it's awkward because when he came back from the dead, he saw his true love... Jade, Alan Scott's daughter. Soranik gets pissed and they break up. But in the New 52, Alan Scott doesn't exist except as a gay man on Earth-2. So Jade never existed, so Kyle never could have had a relationship with her. Yet he and Natu are still broken up only it's for no reason and nobody can ever address it because to do so would point out the gaping problem with the half-assed non-reboot the Green Lantern books went through at same time as the rest of the DCU. Oh also instead of being the last Green Lantern as his origin, there's a couple of flashbacks in stories to him being a new lantern receiving training on Oa, and people call him "Torchbearer" even though that makes no sense if the GLC never died. Anyway that was kind of drawn out but it's pretty much the first thing I always think of whenever I see people mention comics being weird.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 00:45
|
|
|
Speaking of Earth-2, whatever happened to it after Rebirth? I had the first trade and generally liked it, but I'm not sure where it really went.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 02:07
|
|
|
It ended with Earth 2 Society in 2017, but that was more a DCYou comic that refused to die than having anything to do with Rebirth. Hopefully you continue cause it'd be fun to hear someone have to read through Convergence years later 
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 02:14
|
|
|
Teenage Fansub posted:It ended with Earth 2 Society in 2017, but that was more a DCYou comic that refused to die than having anything to do with Rebirth. What part of Convergence does it tie into? I have a couple of trades from it backlogged but I might be missing out on stuff. Also I'm not sure if that's really a good thing. It isn't, right?
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 02:16
|
|
|
They were the main characters of it. There was a year of an Earth 2 weekly series called World's End and at the end of it the world ended They lived through Convergence happening and ended up with a new Earth created for the E2 survivors, which is the Society series. The only genuinely good parts of Convergence were some of the tie-ins like Greg Rucka Question, and Jeff Parker Shazam stories, but the main was bugfuck nuts enough that I'm kinda curious about revisiting it. Might be fun. Teenage Fansub fucked around with this message at 02:25 on Jul 12, 2018 |
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 02:22
|
|
|
TwoPair posted:So Kyle was dating a fellow GL (and Sinestro's daughter), Soranik Natu. During a battle during Blackest Night, Kyle dies. While a bunch of lanterns fight trying to prevent any black rings from reviving Kyle into a zombie, this Star Sapphire named Miri comes down and using some vague power of love bullshit revives Kyle by using Soranik's love. Like 2 storylines later, Miri seemingly goes nuts on some planet forcing Kyle and Soranik to get sent on a mission to stop her, but then after they do, Miri says her going nuts was only a ruse because their relationship was starting to get rocky and as a Star Sapphire she can't abide breakups I guess. Kyle reveals that it's awkward because when he came back from the dead, he saw his true love... Jade, Alan Scott's daughter. Soranik gets pissed and they break up. That really shot a hole in the Sapphires' shtick. Soranik: "I saw you as my true love, Kyle!" Kyle: "Uh, yeah, me too! I mean, I saw you!"
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 03:31
|
|
|
Dick, who is literally the best character in the DC Universe Tim Damian Stephanie Carrie Jason Jason should be dead. He's much like the aforementioned Barry Allen in that way. I don't even hate Red Hood, he just should definitely always be dead if Tim is around in the universe.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 04:01
|
|
|
Dick might be the best Robin but I'd much prefer to see him as Nightwing or Batman.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 04:10
|
|
|
Dick is best as Nightwing. But I do like him as Golden Age Robin where he's like "My parents are avenged! But...I can't give up being Robin. I really like ambushing people and beating the poo poo out of them."
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 04:12
|
|
|
Tim is the better Robin mostly because Dick is way better as Nightwing, and ever better as Batman too. That period with Dick as Batman, Damian as Robin and Tim as Red Robin was the real sweet spot as far as I'm concerned. Who needs Bruce? X-O fucked around with this message at 04:17 on Jul 12, 2018 |
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 04:15
|
|
|
X-O posted:Tim is the better Robin mostly because Dick is way better as Nightwing, and ever better as Batman too. Were there any Justice League comics that had Dickbats? I know Superman would have likely been all "Yeah, Dick Grayson can absolutely be on the Justice League as Batman."
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 04:19
|
|
|
I remember Bruce Wayne being a total Dickbat in the leadup to Infinite Crisis.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 04:29
|
|
|
X-O posted:Tim is the better Robin mostly because Dick is way better as Nightwing, and ever better as Batman too. And also Steph is Batgirl. I am very okay with that being Batman's status quo for a long time if anyone wants to Thanos snap that into existence.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 04:32
|
|
|
So is this original Captain Marvel that it seemed like the 90s/early aughts creators loved so much really basically based on a memory of maybe like one year of the comic? It's really boring or Rick Jonesy before Starlin, then Starllin establishes the Cosmic Awareness and yeah, it's pretty cool, and he beats Thanos and his minions with cosmic judo over a year of stories that also dip into Iron Man and Avengers, but this only goes about a year. Starlin leaves, and the stories fall off a cliff. At first I was blaming Englehart since he was a cowriter on a lot of issues and at first his solo stories were in fact the real stinkers and the comic is going nowhere, but he seems to find the character and they're okay even though not wonderful. I am guessing there were a lot of delays and poo poo too? They reference it a few times directly in the comic and I notice the issues aren't coming out monthly. Englehart just starts adding more weird twists and batshit stuff, that sometimes makes almost zero sense, and the cosmic judo is all but forgotten, but it's at least going somewhere and finally builds to the point where his multi-year story is about to finally pay off and . . . . then is gone? Suddenly Claremont is solo writing the climax to this story and it's okay, if a bit tame compared to what had been happened, but it at least all made sense. Then Unlimited just basically skips a year for a single Blackbolt storyline and then stops. Rick fucked around with this message at 04:56 on Jul 12, 2018 |
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 04:43
|
|
|
Dick Grayson is the best character in all of mainstream superhero comics
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 04:59
|
|
|
I think most of what people loved about Captain Marvel (original) was the Starlin stuff. At least that's what I loved. I also like Genis-Vell as done by Peter David. I don't know what the prevailing opinion on that is but I loved it. Also the design of Genis-Vell is rad. The Captain Marvel design from that run that is. The long white ponytail from the '90s? Not so much.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 05:00
|
|
|
Dick is the best Nightwing but I have mixed feelings as him as Batman. On the one hand he made a great Batman in GMos run, but I kind of like the idea of Nightwing being a rejection/growth beyond the Batman ideal and it feels like Dick was groomed to take over for Bruce but that isn't what he wants.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 05:41
|
|
|
Madkal posted:Dick is the best Nightwing but I have mixed feelings as him as Batman. On the one hand he made a great Batman in GMos run, but I kind of like the idea of Nightwing being a rejection/growth beyond the Batman ideal and it feels like Dick was groomed to take over for Bruce but that isn't what he wants. I agree, but there's gonna always need to be a Batman and Dick is a great Batman and personally I think a better Batman than Bruce. I think better than any other Robin would be, including Tim who is my favorite DC character. I say this coming from a place where of all the Bat Family, besides Jason, Bruce is probably my least favorite. That's just me though.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 05:50
|
|
|
Madkal posted:Dick is the best Nightwing but I have mixed feelings as him as Batman. On the one hand he made a great Batman in GMos run, but I kind of like the idea of Nightwing being a rejection/growth beyond the Batman ideal and it feels like Dick was groomed to take over for Bruce but that isn't what he wants. Black Mirror is pretty good. I'm just pissed he spent less time as Batman than loving Azrael, who was named either after an Angel who betrayed God or Gargamel's' loving cat who was constantly trying to eat the Smurfs.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 05:53
|
|
|
Madkal posted:Dick is the best Nightwing but I have mixed feelings as him as Batman. On the one hand he made a great Batman in GMos run, but I kind of like the idea of Nightwing being a rejection/growth beyond the Batman ideal and it feels like Dick was groomed to take over for Bruce but that isn't what he wants. I think Dick taking over Batman and doing it his way totally fits into that
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 05:58
|
|
|
Honestly I find Terry was probably the best Bat replacement because he didn't have any other persona before. I say this never reading a Batman Beyond comic though
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 05:59
|
|
|
Madkal posted:Honestly I find Terry was probably the best Bat replacement because he didn't have any other persona before. I say this never reading a Batman Beyond comic though My only issue with the Batman Beyond cartoon is they never addressed what the gently caress Dick had been up to for the past 20-30 years or whatever.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 06:02
|
|
|
Madkal posted:Honestly I find Terry was probably the best Bat replacement because he didn't have any other persona before. I say this never reading a Batman Beyond comic though Oh absolutely, I mean Dick taking the persona but not necessarily permanently. I love Terry.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 06:04
|
|
|
Skwirl posted:My only issue with the Batman Beyond cartoon is they never addressed what the gently caress Dick had been up to for the past 20-30 years or whatever. They did in the terrible follow up comic. And you don’t want to know.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 06:15
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 18, 2024 07:38 |
|
|
X-O posted:They did in the terrible follow up comic. And you don’t want to know. You say poo poo like that and now I have to know
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2018 06:18
|
|