Gen. Ripper posted:I checked the top posts on that Mandela Effect reddit and Putting aside how dumb this conspiracy is at its core, that is some incredibly bad evidence, he could not have picked a more falsifiable angle. I made this in exactly 3 minutes in photoshop.
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Jul 13, 2018 04:36
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:I mentioned even the quaintest and mildest conspercy theory of the Mandela effect getting scary radicalized and boy are they ratcheting that up. They are definitely going to shoot up cern. There just can’t be nonviolent conspiracy anymore Is this loony suggesting CERN will cause DOOM? Because I feel like that is something I can get behind tbh.
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Jul 13, 2018 14:54
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The "CERN IS GOING TO CAUSE A BLACK HOLE AND DESTROY US ALL WE NEED TO KILL THEM FIRST" people have been freaking out in that way and making those threats for over 10 years now, before the LHC was even finished. Especially since a lot of lovely news reports used the hyped up "god particle" name for the higgs boson and others which were to be investigated with it, and a bunch of people see that and think it means literally summoning or creating a god etc. A bunch of people even killed themselves over reports of times the LHC was going to be advocated because of various reasons from "it'll summon hell" to "it'll make us all slaves". Mandela effect/qanon/etc types are way later, they're just also participating in the old conspiracy theory.
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Jul 13, 2018 18:17
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I laughed a lot when one of the CERN scientists tried to dispel those fears by saying that there was only a "very small probability" of the collider creating some kind of black hole.
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Jul 13, 2018 22:24
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Scientists also thought that nukes might ignite the entire atmosphere. Look at nuclear power today! Oh poo poo.
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Jul 14, 2018 00:30
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Argas posted:Scientists also thought that nukes might ignite the entire atmosphere. I mean they didn't think it would, they just had someone do the math on it to make sure that testing nukes wouldn't turn our planet into a giant fireball.
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Jul 14, 2018 02:25
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Perhaps giant fireball is preferable.
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Jul 14, 2018 02:46
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Fun fact: the "god" in "the god particle" is short for "goddamn".
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Jul 14, 2018 02:52
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My God is No Particle.
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Jul 14, 2018 03:05
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no gods no particles
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Jul 14, 2018 03:35
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Mantis42 posted:My God is No Particle. What does God need with a particle?
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Jul 14, 2018 03:58
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It was actually supposed to be the large hardon collider but nobody corrected the typo
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Jul 14, 2018 07:56
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since rabid morons never stop getting shittier and dumber, i am looking forward to marvelling at the next, even worse, conspiracy that they will eventually latch onto
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Jul 14, 2018 09:21
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RottenK posted:since rabid morons never stop getting shittier and dumber, i am looking forward to marvelling at the next, even worse, conspiracy that they will eventually latch onto
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Jul 14, 2018 09:44
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RottenK posted:since rabid morons never stop getting shittier and dumber, i am looking forward to marvelling at the next, even worse, conspiracy that they will eventually latch onto This one's new to me. Climate change isn't manmade, the earth is pulling in electrons from space somewhere? https://twitter.com/hashtag/ElectricUniverse
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Jul 14, 2018 14:53
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Polygynous posted:This one's new to me. Climate change isn't manmade, the earth is pulling in electrons from space somewhere? The only thing Electric Universe people hate more than Einstein is the dirty snowball model of comets. They will go on at length about how comets are actually really solid and dry but they glow because they're electrically charged. Of course, being alternative physics, the electric universe cranks tend to get latched onto by flat earthers and Nibiru crazies to justify why their idiot ideas don't make any physical sense.
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Jul 14, 2018 21:50
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Luigi's Discount Porn Bin posted:Electric Universe is way old. They think gravity doesn't exist, it's just electromagnetism, and those physicist dummies got jealous that their hero Einstein didn't figure it out so they're conspiring to keep it secret. Yes, and possessed of some very wierd ideas about the sun, such as suggesting that it's a giant ball of solid iron lit by glow discarges. A lot of it starts from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worlds_in_Collision
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Jul 14, 2018 22:00
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One of my favorite podcasts covers Electric Universe stuff pretty regularly. https://pseudoastro.wordpress.com/2014/11/18/episode-120-james-mccanneys-views-on-comets-part-1/ https://pseudoastro.wordpress.com/2014/12/01/podcast-episode-121-james-mccanneys-views-on-other-stuff-in-the-universe-part-2/
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Jul 14, 2018 22:33
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Hot off the press: another SerialBrain2 novella https://www.reddit.com/r/greatawakening/comments/8yy65h/mr_president_we_see_you_want_to_continue_our_b2/ I’m now convinced that this guy is a TobleroneTriangular-style fake. Even inside of a thoroughly-ridiculous conspiracy theory, this guy manages to be too ridiculous for even the regulars to take seriously.
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Jul 15, 2018 18:44
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With the last couple of posts our friend SB2 has graduated to full-on "the man on television is sending me personal secret messages" level of crazy. It's no surprise that the Q crew is mostly eating it up but it's hilarious how many of the comments are basically "wow, this makes absolutely no sense to me, I guess you're really smart for having figured it out!" Here's the interesting question, though. The qult has Trump as its God and Q as its prophet. SB2 has positioned himself as like an interpreter of the prophetic texts. Will be interesting to see whether this is a stable situation long-term. Q couldn't really sell out Trump, but SB2 could try to make a play for Q's following by saying Q's account got usurped by deep staters, or Q could kind of obliquely fatwa SB2 if he gets too big for his britches.
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Jul 15, 2018 22:10
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Luigi's Discount Porn Bin posted:With the last couple of posts our friend SB2 has graduated to full-on "the man on television is sending me personal secret messages" level of crazy. It's no surprise that the Q crew is mostly eating it up but it's hilarious how many of the comments are basically "wow, this makes absolutely no sense to me, I guess you're really smart for having figured it out!" Pretty sure that's the plot of the Sith Warrior storyline in that failed Star Wars MMO.
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Jul 16, 2018 00:08
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I wonder if drug use plays a part in the believers or creaters of this type of insanity? My friend's brother is a meth addict, and today the delusions and paranoia got heavy. He started telling my friend that "they" were after him. He said a Russian agent tried to run him off the road and kill him because he "knew" and was woke. When my friend asked why he didn't call the cops, of course he said they were in on it. Then his neighbor walked outside and got on his lawnmower and began mowing, so he said something about him watching again and that he was an FBI agent who was doing surveillance.
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Jul 16, 2018 09:02
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Honestly part of me thinks SB2 is Q/part of the group that runs Q and basically is used for damage control. Q makes some bullshit predictions that don’t come true/fucks up like the iPhone Air Force One reflection and SB2 appears with these overwhelming graphs and excuses to make sure the Qult doesn’t falter as prediction after prediction falls flat on its face
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Jul 16, 2018 11:58
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Dr. VooDoo posted:Honestly part of me thinks SB2 is Q/part of the group that runs Q and basically is used for damage control. Q makes some bullshit predictions that don’t come true/fucks up like the iPhone Air Force One reflection and SB2 appears with these overwhelming graphs and excuses to make sure the Qult doesn’t falter as prediction after prediction falls flat on its face You've missed one other function: if someone ever hacks or otherwise impersonates Q, SB2 is there to call them a fake.
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Jul 16, 2018 12:24
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Aumanor posted:You've missed one other function: if someone ever hacks or otherwise impersonates Q, SB2 is there to call them a fake. I'm actually starting to see PJ's arguement that this is a possible GRU ( or at least Russian backed Americans, such as Stone and others) psy ops campaign. The new wrinkle of having an intermediary show up just when Q was exposed as a fraud speaks to a level of organization not seen before with this insane nonsense. The odds that some random crank pulls out all these charts and graphs backing and "vindicating" Q are pretty low. Could also be one lone nut sockpuppeting his way through things, but I find it increasingly unlikely. TulliusCicero fucked around with this message at 15:51 on Jul 16, 2018 |
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Jul 16, 2018 15:48
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Flooger posted:I wonder if drug use plays a part in the believers or creaters of this type of insanity? I mean it is not a requirement, but it does help get some people there. Psychotic breaks with reality can occur for no reason due to an undiagnosed mental disorder.
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Jul 16, 2018 16:21
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Flooger posted:I wonder if drug use plays a part in the believers or creaters of this type of insanity? Yeah I think you are right, drugs definitely have to play a big part in at least a portion of the population that heavily follow the Qanon stuff and conspiracy theories in general. Every tweaker I have ever known has believed in some sort of delusional idea ranging from faking of the moon landing to whatever it is they call the airplanes poisoning the environment theory. I mean a lot of the people who believe Qanon are just dumb CHUDS and bored housewives but my bet is that percentage of the people active on these forums who are tweakers is way higher than other crazy communities online.
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Jul 16, 2018 16:31
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Bath Tubs posted:Yeah I think you are right, drugs definitely have to play a big part in at least a portion of the population that heavily follow the Qanon stuff and conspiracy theories in general. Every tweaker I have ever known has believed in some sort of delusional idea ranging from faking of the moon landing to whatever it is they call the airplanes poisoning the environment theory. I mean a lot of the people who believe Qanon are just dumb CHUDS and bored housewives but my bet is that percentage of the people active on these forums who are tweakers is way higher than other crazy communities online. Chemtrails! And in the vein of conspiracy theory nesting dolls, chemtrail theories have been woven into drat near every overarching conspiracy theory, and in turn have completely embraced both Orgone and Agenda 21 conspiracy theories.
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Jul 16, 2018 16:39
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Man, chemtrails seem so quaint now
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Jul 16, 2018 18:33
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Goon Danton posted:Chemtrails! And in the vein of conspiracy theory nesting dolls, chemtrail theories have been woven into drat near every overarching conspiracy theory, and in turn have completely embraced both Orgone and Agenda 21 conspiracy theories. It's even more convoluted and hilarious than that. Chemtrails originally started out as a conspiracy theory being propagated by a group that was trying to sell orgone "cloudbusters". The idea was that you could set up a cloudbuster (basically some shaped quartz crystals connected by copper wiring and a couple other bits of woo woo) in your backyard and it would chase away all the nasty population control chemicals that they were spraying on us with aircraft. I remember the website that had all this extensive photo evidence of chemtrails being broken up by various cloudbusters. Going out even further into the weeds I remember there used to be an entire subset of UFO conspiracy theorist who believed that gaseous Cloud aliens from Venus were on our planet and helping heal our atmosphere. Back in the web 1.0 days there used to be websites filled with all kinds of pictures of unusual looking clouds next to breathless descriptions of how this or that venusian was clearly devouring a chemtrail and purifying the air. I even remember that early on chemtrails was considered so fringe and so strongly associated with the filibuster nutterx that Alex Jones was extremely hesitant about discussing it. It used to be something that he would resist embracing when his callers brought the topic up. Prester Jane fucked around with this message at 05:36 on Jul 18, 2018 |
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Jul 16, 2018 18:41
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Why couldn't I live in the reality where Venusian cloud beings eat chemtrails instead of the one where Trump is president.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:22
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I strongly urge everyone here with even a passing interest in conspiracy history: get a hold of Martin Gardner's Fads And Fallacies In The Name Of Science. It's a 1957 book that was the revised edition of a 1952 book, covering the major pseudosciences of its day and the conspiracy thinking arranged around them. Most of the stuff in the book is stuff people still try to push today, and it even has neat glimpses of things like how L Ron Hubbad was still all on the Dianetics base yet and hadn't quite yet built the Scientology religion for it, yet the Scientology name had just been established.
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Jul 16, 2018 19:28
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TulliusCicero posted:I'm actually starting to see PJ's arguement that this is a possible GRU ( or at least Russian backed Americans, such as Stone and others) psy ops campaign. The new wrinkle of having an intermediary show up just when Q was exposed as a fraud speaks to a level of organization not seen before with this insane nonsense. Also to throw a log on the "Alex Jones is knowingly colluding with Russia" fire: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0j6DRSqLnRY Weird how even though Alex Jones has publicly denounced Q Anon he is basically arguing for the exact same worldview that Q Anon appeals to. 
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Jul 16, 2018 20:04
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In fairness I can't actually imagine alex jones agreeing with anybody or anything. He seems to be his own fount of information.
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Jul 16, 2018 20:07
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OwlFancier posted:In fairness I can't actually imagine alex jones agreeing with anybody or anything. He seems to be his own fount of information.
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Jul 16, 2018 20:12
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It's weird because obviously he monetizes the poo poo out of his stuff so he must have some grip on reality, but at the same time he really seems genuinely crazy, like there's some implant in his head that's just feeding him markov generated insanity and it goes straight out his mouth and he believes at least half of it. Like, just... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUIcCyPOA30 I listen to it and my brain starts doing the bit from 2001 where he flies through the monolith. Hobnob posted:The sad thing about reading the book is that occasionally Gardner will comment that some bit of flim-flam seems to be dying out, and yet here we are 60-odd years later and it's still going strong. (Though some really do seem to have gone. You don't hear much about iridology or Wilhelm Reich's Orgone theory nowadays). Orgone stuff is really in with the chemtrails stuff actually, you use orgone and cloudbusters to stop the chemtrails. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 20:16 on Jul 16, 2018 |
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Jul 16, 2018 20:14
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fishmech posted:I strongly urge everyone here with even a passing interest in conspiracy history: get a hold of Martin Gardner's Fads And Fallacies In The Name Of Science. It's a 1957 book that was the revised edition of a 1952 book, covering the major pseudosciences of its day and the conspiracy thinking arranged around them. Most of the stuff in the book is stuff people still try to push today, and it even has neat glimpses of things like how L Ron Hubbad was still all on the Dianetics base yet and hadn't quite yet built the Scientology religion for it, yet the Scientology name had just been established. The sad thing about reading the book is that occasionally Gardner will comment that some bit of flim-flam seems to be dying out, and yet here we are 60-odd years later and it's still going strong. (Though some really do seem to have gone. You don't hear much about iridology or Wilhelm Reich's Orgone theory nowadays).
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Jul 16, 2018 20:15
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OwlFancier posted:It's weird because obviously he monetizes the poo poo out of his stuff so he must have some grip on reality, but at the same time he really seems genuinely crazy, like there's some implant in his head that's just feeding him markov generated insanity and it goes straight out his mouth and he believes at least half of it. How do I explain this without coming off as crazy, whilst citing the fact that you and I are perceiving the bolded very differently because I am literally crazy? Well, here goes to attempt to square that Circle. It looks random and insane to you because your brain is processing reality and information in a very different way. However, if you are the target audience of Alex Jones (what I call a Narrativist) then what he is saying makes perfect sense and constantly provides them a sense of both if an enemy vile enough to justify indulging in their violent fantasies- as well as a genuine sense of security that there are other like-minded individuals experiencing reality in the same way. Where you perceive chaos and Markov bot style random nonsense, I see the artful execution of an intelligent predator appealing to a very particular kind of prey in an extremely complex and cunning way. The tell to look for if you are a healthy thinking individual who doesn't understand how these psychological predators operate is thus: Alex Jones has accrued a gigantic cult audience while still understanding reality well enough to fleece his rubes. It's all one gigantic game to Alex Jones, and the way he preys on people is with an incredibly sophisticated tool kit that he has been steadily developing and experimenting with throughout the entirety of his adult life. He's been teaching himself how to do the specific thing and reaping the rewards, that's all Alex Jones actually cares about. He sees enough rewards and praising Putin and praising Russia to keep doing it whenever he finds a pretense of doing so- and that's why I say it rings like a bell in the night if you understand how a pathological operator like Alex Jones conducts their affairs. Ordinarily whatever appeals he would be using to his audience would be chaos constructed in the moment, consistency isn't really a priority. When you see consistency over a long period of time in whatever a cynical con man like Alex Jones is saying- recognize then it's an artificial structure, and it's important to pay attention too. It's going to be there for a reason, and usually the reason isn't too hard to Divine if you wash their pattern of behavior. Alex Jones is doing this for the money, and so all Putin really has to do is give him money and Alex Jones will sing whatever tune Putin wants. Don't get me wrong, Alex Jones is a master of his craft who genuinely enjoys what he is doing for a living- but he's doing it primarily for the money. Prester Jane fucked around with this message at 05:39 on Jul 18, 2018 |
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Jul 16, 2018 20:28
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I suppose I find it hard to distinguish between someone carefully imitiating a crazy person so perfectly that most people can't tell the difference, who has recurrent themes because he's secretly trying to indoctrinate his audience of actual crazy people, and just an actual crazy person who has recurrent themes because he's crazy and fixates on things and the human mind is obviously not truly random. And also the former seems less likely to exist than the latter and I've spent my entire life not really being disappointed by the most mundane explanation so it would be a bit weird for me to change from that. The former is a... little bit conspiratorial I suppose. The only incongruous element is the existence of infowars as a money making scheme which, well, he has a production team, so it's also not far fetched that he went off the deep end at some point but the rest of the people around him with a bit more of a grip on sanity managed to keep the brand bringing in the money. I mean clearly we don't see the world the same way but I guess I think there's a pretty mundane explanation for Jones being as he is, there's also a complicated one but I trend towards occam's razor. I suppose I'd suggest that Jones encapsulates in 1 man, the kind of directionless-but-themed noise you get with, say, right wing facebook memes. Obviously the production of those is quite distributed and I would be skeptical of a suggestion that they're all controlled by russian psyops or whatever, especially as variants of them have been around for a long time, but they also are not consistent between or even necessarily within themselves, but they definitely have a noticeable theme which is just republican party talking points. It's possible, I think, for loud, kind of crazy people to just reflect their environment and find an engagement with other kind of crazy people, who then echo back at them. I guess I think that right wing crazy is kind of self sustaining and doesn't really need a big mastermind behind it, to the point that even if there was one, you probably couldn't tell and it arguably wouldn't entirely make a lot of difference beyond the effect that donald trump tweeting about how much he likes bad boi putin would already have. If the signal is barely distinguishable from the noise, does its existence make much difference? OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 21:48 on Jul 16, 2018 |
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Jul 16, 2018 21:37
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OwlFancier posted:occam's razor. a lot of people cut themselves on that rusty old blade- I don't think it's generally useful to default towards simplicity of theory, especially with regard to social analysis falsifiability testing replaced William of Ockham's method centuries ago, and I do believe PJane's theories are falsifiable, it's just going to take a while for the necessary data to trickle to the public
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Jul 16, 2018 21:51
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