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Bernie would have some atrocious old white man version of socialist music, I'm sure. Itd be rad.
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Jul 21, 2018 11:23
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i will fight buckley-loving dudebro alexandria "hernan cortes" ocasio-cortez til my last breath
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Jul 21, 2018 17:02
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Calibanibal posted:i will fight buckley-loving dudebro alexandria "hernan cortes" ocasio-cortez til my last breath Revenge is like servin cold cuts
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Jul 21, 2018 17:03
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Nonsense posted:Bernie is gonna destroy Biden. Biden isn’t even gonna be the big hurdle tbh. I think last round is gonna be Bernie vs Booker or Bernie vs Harris. I think Booker gives Bernie a huge run for his money (in terms of potential popularity) but I think Harris gets torched once people start dragging her prosecutor record out.
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Jul 21, 2018 20:55
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Lightning Knight posted:Biden isn’t even gonna be the big hurdle tbh. My prediction is that the Democratic establishment coalesces around Warren and then it's Bernie vs. Warren. Whichever wins, they pick Booker as VP.
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Jul 21, 2018 21:13
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:My prediction is that the Democratic establishment coalesces around Warren and then it's Bernie vs. Warren. Whichever wins, they pick Booker as VP. This seems plausible but Booker would have to totally flame out first, I don’t see him dropping out unless he somehow only pulls single-digit numbers.
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Jul 21, 2018 21:24
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Lightning Knight posted:This seems plausible but Booker would have to totally flame out first, I don’t see him dropping out unless he somehow only pulls single-digit numbers. I'm going by his speeches at the last DNC where he kinda flamed out. He's got charisma but I think people are overestimating him because everyone's looking for the Next Obama.
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Jul 21, 2018 21:27
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Booker's likely gonna be destroyed by things like his Bain Capital comments and not even being able to bring himself to even symbolically vote to do a drat thing about pharma costs here.
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Jul 21, 2018 21:36
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Oh Snapple! posted:Booker's likely gonna be destroyed by things like his Bain Capital comments and not even being able to bring himself to even symbolically vote to do a drat thing about pharma costs here. I think the big question is how much this matters to the average person versus “that time he saved someone from a burning building” that’s gonna play in political ads 24/7. Booker essentially has the perfect background to impress people who aren’t in the know, which is most people. That said, I think the pharma stuff is actually more likely to come back to bite him than the bank stuff. Edit: also with both Warren and Booker in bed with charters, it really frustrates me that protecting and expanding public education isn’t pushed as ferociously by the current left as healthcare.
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Jul 21, 2018 21:40
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ftr I think the Bain stuff will, ironically, bite him more due to it being a scolding directed at Obama than for defending Bain.
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Jul 21, 2018 22:09
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Oh Snapple! posted:ftr I think the Bain stuff will, ironically, bite him more due to it being a scolding directed at Obama than for defending Bain. That’s true. I’m anticipating the pharma stuff to be the hard slam from Bernie and other MFA candidates. I’m also genuinely curious to see if any House reps or retired senators run. I really want my Lee/Feingold ticker god dammit.
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Jul 21, 2018 23:51
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Honestly I think what's going to hurt the centrist candidates is the same thing that hurt Hillary. "Why are you even running?" Booker, Biden, etc really have no reason to run other than naked ambition since they really can't point to anything that has helped anyone (outside of pulling that one guy out of the fire) or plans to fix anything and I think not being Trump isn't really enough especially in the primary where everyone is not Trump. People don't get excited to help some politician get another line on their resume so when the conservative Democrats start talking about how awesome their 20 part plan to have wealth trickle down from corporate tax credits is everyone is going to tune out. I'm really hoping people nostalgic for Obama don't just vote Biden because of name recognition since his presidency would probably be incredibly damaging long term. At least people hate Trump so much that it's making in roads for thinking about fixing huge systemic issues. Biden will get into power, say that we need to all get along, then work with Republicans to help their agenda, do nothing about the courts that have been flooded with fascists, then shrug his shoulders in 2024 when Trump But Smart gets elected and scoot off to some lobbyist job.
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Jul 22, 2018 00:05
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I think the biggest "threat" is actually Warren running, because a large number of Democrats who supported Sanders in 2016 did so just because they perceived him as "more liberal," and many have the same perception of Warren. I'd still give Sanders better chances than her overall, but I wouldn't be surprised if she at least siphons off a lot of people who would have otherwise gone for Sanders (instead of someone like Booker or Harris).Lightning Knight posted:Biden isn’t even gonna be the big hurdle tbh. I hate to say this, but I seriously doubt that her record as a prosecutor will actually hurt her much with the broader Democratic electorate. I wish it were different, but a very large number of Democratic voters don't really mind stuff like being a prosecutor or cop or whatever. I don't think Booker has a very good chance. I won't be super surprised if he does well, but I won't be expecting it. Don't think he has the right "kind" of charisma.
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Jul 22, 2018 00:24
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Ytlaya posted:I hate to say this, but I seriously doubt that her record as a prosecutor will actually hurt her much with the broader Democratic electorate. I wish it were different, but a very large number of Democratic voters don't really mind stuff like being a prosecutor or cop or whatever. Being a prosecutor in and of itself, no, but stuff like the "arrest parents whose kids are truant" thing can probably be used against her really easily. Even here in California, where that can have a parallel drawn between it and how down in Riverside County they're trying to put kids on probation for bad grades and "pre-delinquent behavior". A lot of the specifics of her career don't look good, even the ones some people here have tried to argue aren't actually big deals, and would get a lot more focus in a presidential primary. I think that and some other things have a good chance of turning off enough people to keep her from winning. Or I hope so, at least.
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Jul 22, 2018 00:55
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Roland Jones posted:Being a prosecutor in and of itself, no, but stuff like the "arrest parents whose kids are truant" thing can probably be used against her really easily. Even here in California, where that can have a parallel drawn between it and how down in Riverside County they're trying to put kids on probation for bad grades and "pre-delinquent behavior". A lot of the specifics of her career don't look good, even the ones some people here have tried to argue aren't actually big deals, and would get a lot more focus in a presidential primary. I think that and some other things have a good chance of turning off enough people to keep her from winning. Or I hope so, at least. There are very few states in the primary that both matter and that would make this an issue. Harris isn’t a shoe-in, but that won’t knock her out by itself. Also before you make Bernie predictions: a lot of the people we’re talking about are sprinting towards 80. If Trump has a heart attack or something in office there’s no way age doesn’t come up. We’re way too far out to predict anything, just comment on who wants to run.
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Jul 22, 2018 06:52
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dont fckin tell me whatr to do
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Jul 22, 2018 18:04
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bernie will win
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Jul 22, 2018 18:04
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More importantly, I think Bernie has learned what went wrong with his messaging to people of color. It was embarrassingly bad in the '16 primary, and yet younger people of color basically forgave him for it. That's amazing in itself. He's going to fix that messaging this time, and combined with what we now know of america's distaste for Hillary and centrists in general, he's going to have some serious momentum. Not even the DNC rigging the system will slow him down.
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Jul 22, 2018 21:28
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Freakazoid_ posted:More importantly, I think Bernie has learned what went wrong with his messaging to people of color. It was embarrassingly bad in the '16 primary, and yet younger people of color basically forgave him for it. That's amazing in itself. He's going to fix that messaging this time, and combined with what we now know of america's distaste for Hillary and centrists in general, he's going to have some serious momentum. Not even the DNC rigging the system will slow him down. They'll just leave the convention and back Bloomberg, then the networks will be promoting Bloomberg as the only man that can save America. Bloomberg still get's third, but Trump is reelected.
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Jul 22, 2018 22:52
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Crowsbeak posted:They'll just leave the convention and back Bloomberg, then the networks will be promoting Bloomberg as the only man that can save America. Bloomberg still get's third, but Trump is reelected. Source your quotes please.
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Jul 22, 2018 23:09
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Roland Jones posted:Being a prosecutor in and of itself, no, but stuff like the "arrest parents whose kids are truant" thing can probably be used against her really easily. Even here in California, where that can have a parallel drawn between it and how down in Riverside County they're trying to put kids on probation for bad grades and "pre-delinquent behavior". A lot of the specifics of her career don't look good, even the ones some people here have tried to argue aren't actually big deals, and would get a lot more focus in a presidential primary. I think that and some other things have a good chance of turning off enough people to keep her from winning. Or I hope so, at least.
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Jul 23, 2018 02:01
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Infinite Karma posted:In 2018 America, it's still a fringe opinion that cops are bad and prosecutors are bad and fascism is bad. Smart leftists see a lot of red flags and dealbreakers with Harris, but if their opinions were popular, they would be standard Democrat ones already. It makes Harris a bad progressive, but the fact that she likes boots stomping on "criminal" faces forever is a feature, not a bug. Idiots love "tough on crime" politicians and supporting cops/troops. The damning evidence you're citing against her is literally a 50-year-old white liberal's wet dream. If that's what you think a 50 year old white liberal's wet dream is that, you don't actually know the difference between them and a republican. Or they just say they're a liberal and vote straight ticket R anyway or some such poo poo. The problem with moderates isn't that they want fascism, it's that they don't give a poo poo whether it comes or not. It's splitting hairs, but a liberal's wet dream would be for hillary to come back and win in 2020 and prove their electoral strategy was right all along and all these dirty leftists need to sit the gently caress back down because the adults are back with the west wing in their pocket and stars in their eyes.
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Jul 23, 2018 05:47
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I'm about as interested in the dreams of a centrist as I am in those of a crocodile
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Jul 23, 2018 06:23
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Calibanibal posted:I'm about as interested in the dreams of a centrist as I am in those of a crocodile Gotta know your enemy.
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Jul 23, 2018 07:42
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Calibanibal posted:I'm about as interested in the dreams of a centrist as I am in those of a crocodile Crocodiles are, if nothing else, honest.
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Jul 23, 2018 16:14
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Serious question. Is it just me that thinks Bernie, Warren (and Biden come to that) are to old? Warrens the youngest, and she'd be what 72 in her first year in office. I don't want to be ageist, but age takes it's toll. We don't allow 70 year old Firefighers, I just think that with the incredible demands of the modern presidency (obviously this doesn't apply if you're going to just half-rear end it like Trump) in terms of stamina, flexibility, and sheer workload to do it properly, nobody who's going to see 70 in their next term should run. Oh and yes I thought Clinton and Trump were both to old last time as well.
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Jul 23, 2018 17:17
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Deptfordx posted:Serious question. Beyond the demands of the presidency, someone who is that age simply doesn't have the same stake in the future that someone younger does. Also, the word is 'too'.
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Jul 23, 2018 17:19
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Deptfordx posted:Is it just me that thinks Bernie, Warren (and Biden come to that) are to old? Warrens the youngest, and she'd be what 72 in her first year in office. Deciding not to run the most popular politician in America so you can purposely lose to a senile cheeto fascist, but at least you can say you didn't nominate an old dude is...a bad strategy.
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Jul 23, 2018 17:27
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PT6A posted:Beyond the demands of the presidency, someone who is that age simply doesn't have the same stake in the future that someone younger does'.
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Jul 23, 2018 17:48
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PT6A posted:Beyond the demands of the presidency, someone who is that age simply doesn't have the same stake in the future that someone younger does. *cranes neck to see Bernie talking about how young people are getting hosed over since the 90s* Yeah, no.
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Jul 23, 2018 17:59
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Radish posted:Honestly I think what's going to hurt the centrist candidates is the same thing that hurt Hillary. "Why are you even running?" Booker, Biden, etc really have no reason to run other than naked ambition since they really can't point to anything that has helped anyone (outside of pulling that one guy out of the fire) or plans to fix anything and I think not being Trump isn't really enough especially in the primary where everyone is not Trump. People don't get excited to help some politician get another line on their resume so when the conservative Democrats start talking about how awesome their 20 part plan to have wealth trickle down from corporate tax credits is everyone is going to tune out. I'm really hoping people nostalgic for Obama don't just vote Biden because of name recognition since his presidency would probably be incredibly damaging long term. At least people hate Trump so much that it's making in roads for thinking about fixing huge systemic issues. Biden will get into power, say that we need to all get along, then work with Republicans to help their agenda, do nothing about the courts that have been flooded with fascists, then shrug his shoulders in 2024 when Trump But Smart gets elected and scoot off to some lobbyist job. Don't worry, it's going to be russia poo poo and trump bad.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:00
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Look at this old guy not having any stake in or advocating for the future back in 2005. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoHBCHc13uw
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Jul 23, 2018 18:03
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It's pretty telling that the establishment fanboys can't even fathom that somebody might be doing the right thing despite not having a personal stake in the matter.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:08
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I’m more worried about wheeling out an 80 year old man as president. There’s gotta be someone younger who is as or more progressive.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:11
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LITERALLY MY FETISH posted:I’m more worried about wheeling out an 80 year old man as president. There’s gotta be someone younger who is as or more progressive. Not with the same name recognition. The best option is bernie with a younger protege as his running mate
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Jul 23, 2018 19:17
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Condiv posted:Not with the same name recognition. The best option is bernie with a younger protege as his running mate Or, failing that, if there is some left-Dem senator, rep, or governor who we've all somehow overlooked, who has a lot of charisma and can be A Good Candidate, and who Sanders would feel comfortable endorsing. I'm not seeing that left-Dem anywhere at this point, though.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:19
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I'm constantly baffled that Democrats would rather lose than win, if losing means they can smugly pat themselves on the back for sensibly choosing the candidate with the best resume (*according to them) rather than the one with the best ideas who would actually win.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:27
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LITERALLY MY FETISH posted:I’m more worried about wheeling out an 80 year old man as president. There’s gotta be someone younger who is as or more progressive. There isn't. Everyone who came of age in the 90s and has any political experience is irreversibly tainted by end of history centrism.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:38
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VitalSigns posted:I'm constantly baffled that Democrats would rather lose than win, if losing means they can smugly pat themselves on the back for sensibly choosing the candidate with the best resume (*according to them) rather than the one with the best ideas who would actually win. Yeah, I'm particularly struck by how out-of-touch the whole "Bernie's too old!" criticism is. Have centrists just not noticed who is President right now? The greater-than-300-pound syphilitic anti-exercise fancy-lad from Queens? Yeah, people voted for him. The fact that he's probably the least healthy president we've had since WH Harrison didn't deter anyone who wasn't already deterred from voting for him.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:41
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Majorian posted:Yeah, I'm particularly struck by how out-of-touch the whole "Bernie's too old!" criticism is. Have centrists just not noticed who is President right now? The greater-than-300-pound syphilitic anti-exercise fancy-lad from Queens? Yeah, people voted for him. The fact that he's probably the least healthy president we've had since WH Harrison didn't deter anyone who wasn't already deterred from voting for him. I don't object to Bernie's oldness because I think people wouldn't vote for him, I object to it because I personally think anyone 70+ is not in ideal shape for the presidency. It's a demanding position, and the fact that y'all elected someone who's completely unqualified and unsuited to it on literally every level this time around doesn't make it a good idea.
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Jul 23, 2018 19:44
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