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wet_goods
Jun 21, 2004

I'M BAAD!
I played a shadow warrior in war. poo poo was dope every 6 minutes when you could one round a chosen from a mile away.

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ChickenWing
Jul 22, 2010

:v:

I think War was the premier example in the field of how to level through PVP, and public quests. Nothing else though.

People have learned the public quests lesson, but it really feels like there aren't many games where levelling through PvP is good at all

Dr. Kyle Farnsworth
Apr 23, 2004

Didn't one side get their knockback before the other so that tier of PvP was just knocking people into lava for big laughs and there was nothing they could do about it?

The Moon Monster
Dec 30, 2005

ChickenWing posted:

I think War was the premier example in the field of how to level through PVP, and public quests. Nothing else though.

People have learned the public quests lesson, but it really feels like there aren't many games where levelling through PvP is good at all

I haven't played any games where the public quests were anywhere near as cool and involved as WAR's tbh. The last one I tried was FFXIV at the relaunch and the public quests were almost entirely "run to this point and kill 50 of this mob" or "click 50 of these glowies".

Of course it's not like I've played every MMO out there.

bagrada
Aug 4, 2007

The Demogorgon is tired of your silly human bickering!

Dr. Kyle Farnsworth posted:

Didn't one side get their knockback before the other so that tier of PvP was just knocking people into lava for big laughs and there was nothing they could do about it?

I think that battleground with the lava was added after release and if I remember right, bright wizards had the knockback for Order and Chaos Magus had it for Disorder. Way more people played wizards.

clone on the phone
Aug 5, 2003

Dr. Kyle Farnsworth posted:

Didn't one side get their knockback before the other so that tier of PvP was just knocking people into lava for big laughs and there was nothing they could do about it?

I did this on the lava map with my dwarf tank lady, it was the best.

Lux Aeterna
Feb 19, 2005

bagrada posted:

I think that battleground with the lava was added after release and if I remember right, bright wizards had the knockback for Order and Chaos Magus had it for Disorder. Way more people played wizards.

tor anroc punt parties were awesome

WAR was amazing because it was beyond hosed up for balance

sorcs could use channel spells on the GCD because the first tick would do damage so you could chain someone down almost instantly in 3-4 buttons 100% of the time

gtaoe targeting was absurdly easy to exploit in keeps since you could stay at the top of stairs in a corner and target the bottom floor without anyone seeing you

magus and engineer vacuum skills were beyond broken since people would get stuck in one another's hitboxes and couldn't escape

there was nothing better than roaming in party as a magus and charging into an order warband fullspeed and watching them scatter from your little demon surfboard.

for like 3 days also some goons found items with 100% dispel ratings also so we were immune to bright wizards before they hotfixed the items. that was super fun

Lux Aeterna fucked around with this message at 19:34 on Jul 21, 2018

2DCAT
Jun 25, 2015

pissssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss ssssssss sssssssssssssssssss sssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss ssssss ssssssssssssssssssssssssssss sssssssssssssss

Gravy Boat 2k
I keep getting emails to join the beta but I'm too busy. Is it looking fun or :rip: another good idea

Orv
May 4, 2011

2DCAT posted:

I keep getting emails to join the beta but I'm too busy. Is it looking fun or :rip: another good idea

Might be fun eventually.

Bait and Swatch
Sep 5, 2012

Join me, Comrades
In the Star Citizen D&D thread

2DCAT posted:

I keep getting emails to join the beta but I'm too busy. Is it looking fun or :rip: another good idea

It’s not worth setting aside time for currently, imo. If you find yourself with nothing better going on it’s not a bad diversion for a bit though.

ccubed
Jul 14, 2016

How's it hanging, brah?
Camelot Unchained just announced start of beta for this Tuesday (July 31st), assuming they can get 500 testers to log in today (28th)

Lux Aeterna
Feb 19, 2005

Played a few rounds today on a TDD archer and it really brought back a good warham/daoc vibe

Highest scenario count was maybe 75 total people (+bots) and there were some fun fights

Bait and Swatch
Sep 5, 2012

Join me, Comrades
In the Star Citizen D&D thread

Looks like it’s official now :toot:

eonwe
Aug 11, 2008



Lipstick Apathy
keep us updated how the beta is

ExHumus
Aug 30, 2006

BOOM BOOM!!
The game seems fine for where it is at in the development cycle. Keep in mind that what CSE is calling "Beta 1" is not what people are accustomed to with modern betas. It is definitely too early to answer the question, "Will this be good?" but I definitely think it has the potential to be great.

I said come in!
Jun 22, 2004

Just going to wait patiently for the final release headstart to go live. Absolutely all over this game but I want it to be out of beta first.

malhavok
Jan 18, 2013

ExHumus posted:

The game seems fine for where it is at in the development cycle. Keep in mind that what CSE is calling "Beta 1" is not what people are accustomed to with modern betas. It is definitely too early to answer the question, "Will this be good?" but I definitely think it has the potential to be great.

This game started development in 2012, nothing about it is too early. Where it is in its development cycle is "way behind schedule and with a poo poo ton of time still to go".

2DCAT
Jun 25, 2015

pissssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss ssssssss sssssssssssssssssss sssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss ssssss ssssssssssssssssssssssssssss sssssssssssssss

Gravy Boat 2k

eonwe posted:

keep us updated how the beta is

:same:

ExHumus
Aug 30, 2006

BOOM BOOM!!

malhavok posted:

This game started development in 2012, nothing about it is too early. Where it is in its development cycle is "way behind schedule and with a poo poo ton of time still to go".

When I say development cycle, I mean progress-wise, not time-wise.

Byolante
Mar 23, 2008

by Cyrano4747
Will there be a point that this isn't a wonky rehash of guild wars 2 wvwvw?

ExHumus
Aug 30, 2006

BOOM BOOM!!

Byolante posted:

Will there be a point that this isn't a wonky rehash of guild wars 2 wvwvw?

Guild Wars 2 WvW is a wonky rehash of Dark Age of Camelot RvR, which is what this game is a spiritual successor to.

Evernoob
Jun 21, 2012
The main difference between GW2's WvW and Camelot's RvR is that for GW2 each side is a different server, each with exactly the same classes and style that rotate on a schedule, auto balancing the clusters.
For Camelot you have classic "servers" with each of them three totally distinct sides battling eachother forever, thus creating the possibility of true rivalries and feuds.

I think both mechanics have their upsides and downsides.
WvW automatically balances the game by putting servers of equal strength against each other. But your opponents feel more nameless.
RvR you always face the same groups of enemies, making reputation a big thing ("carefull, Trauma is roaming the frontier!")... but can result in one realm dominating. This can be mitigated by the two realms cooperating somewhat (more by targetting the leader than really helping eachother out)

Third World Reagan
May 19, 2008

Imagine four 'mechs waiting in a queue. Time works the same way.

Byolante posted:

Will there be a point that this isn't a wonky rehash of guild wars 2 wvwvw?

hopefully by not putting in all the dumb poo poo in wvwvw where you want to avoid players

Evernoob
Jun 21, 2012
Avoiding players while ninja harvesting good materials in enemy frontiers sounds like fun to me though...

RagnarokZ
May 14, 2004

Emperor of the Internet

Lux Aeterna posted:

tor anroc punt parties were awesome

WAR was amazing because it was beyond hosed up for balance

sorcs could use channel spells on the GCD because the first tick would do damage so you could chain someone down almost instantly in 3-4 buttons 100% of the time

gtaoe targeting was absurdly easy to exploit in keeps since you could stay at the top of stairs in a corner and target the bottom floor without anyone seeing you

magus and engineer vacuum skills were beyond broken since people would get stuck in one another's hitboxes and couldn't escape

there was nothing better than roaming in party as a magus and charging into an order warband fullspeed and watching them scatter from your little demon surfboard.

for like 3 days also some goons found items with 100% dispel ratings also so we were immune to bright wizards before they hotfixed the items. that was super fun

Also, any class with a kick attack of any sort, on a map with lava.

Always good times flinging people into the lava.

MF_James
May 8, 2008
I CANNOT HANDLE BEING CALLED OUT ON MY DUMBASS OPINIONS ABOUT ANTI-VIRUS AND SECURITY. I REALLY LIKE TO THINK THAT I KNOW THINGS HERE

INSTEAD I AM GOING TO WHINE ABOUT IT IN OTHER THREADS SO MY OPINION CAN FEEL VALIDATED IN AN ECHO CHAMBER I LIKE

Evernoob posted:

The main difference between GW2's WvW and Camelot's RvR is that for GW2 each side is a different server, each with exactly the same classes and style that rotate on a schedule, auto balancing the clusters.
For Camelot you have classic "servers" with each of them three totally distinct sides battling eachother forever, thus creating the possibility of true rivalries and feuds.

I think both mechanics have their upsides and downsides.
WvW automatically balances the game by putting servers of equal strength against each other. But your opponents feel more nameless.
RvR you always face the same groups of enemies, making reputation a big thing ("carefull, Trauma is roaming the frontier!")... but can result in one realm dominating. This can be mitigated by the two realms cooperating somewhat (more by targetting the leader than really helping eachother out)

Ehh I'd argue that your opponents aren't nameless in WvW, my buddy was the lead of a top tier of guild and they knew every guild/group that they ran into because they typically ran into the same people all the time.

clone on the phone
Aug 5, 2003

Was the beta up this weekend? Any big changes over the alpha?

clone on the phone fucked around with this message at 03:31 on Aug 6, 2018

jerk irl
Apr 26, 2018
One good thing about WAR imo was that you didn't need to do much PvE to do RvR, aside from some LotD, etc. I kind of don't like having to do a lot of PvE to be efficient in PvP.

feller
Jul 5, 2006


jerk irl posted:

One good thing about WAR imo was that you didn't need to do much PvE to do RvR, aside from some LotD, etc. I kind of don't like having to do a lot of PvE to be efficient in PvP.

:same:

Third World Reagan
May 19, 2008

Imagine four 'mechs waiting in a queue. Time works the same way.

jerk irl posted:

One good thing about WAR imo was that you didn't need to do much PvE to do RvR, aside from some LotD, etc. I kind of don't like having to do a lot of PvE to be efficient in PvP.

One bad thing about WAR imo was that you had to do PvE at the start in order to get wards so you could attack the border keep before the city or the bosses AOE would one shot you.

clone on the phone
Aug 5, 2003

jerk irl posted:

One good thing about WAR imo was that you didn't need to do much PvE to do RvR, aside from some LotD, etc. I kind of don't like having to do a lot of PvE to be efficient in PvP.

I did enjoy being able to do battlegrounds on a fresh level 1 character

Evernoob
Jun 21, 2012
I still don't understand why we are still using "levels" in a PvP game.
Make progress unlock extra abilities, boons&banes, and other shenanigans... but I don't see the point of levels anymore.

jerk irl
Apr 26, 2018

Evernoob posted:

I still don't understand why we are still using "levels" in a PvP game.
Make progress unlock extra abilities, boons&banes, and other shenanigans... but I don't see the point of levels anymore.

I still don't understand why we are still using logic while commenting on what games should be like, more so PvP ones.
On a more serious comment, you are absolutely right.

jerk irl fucked around with this message at 13:16 on Aug 8, 2018

Byolante
Mar 23, 2008

by Cyrano4747

Evernoob posted:

I still don't understand why we are still using "levels" in a PvP game.
Make progress unlock extra abilities, boons&banes, and other shenanigans... but I don't see the point of levels anymore.

I don't understand why anyone would want a pvp mmo anyway. Surely a mmo style combat game but with a lobby system like dota or overwatch will happen?

Groovelord Neato
Dec 6, 2014


mmo combat sucks why would anyone play that.

Byolante
Mar 23, 2008

by Cyrano4747

Groovelord Neato posted:

mmo combat sucks why would anyone play that.

The answer is within your grasp

jerk irl
Apr 26, 2018

Byolante posted:

I don't understand why anyone would want a pvp mmo anyway.

It's usually Americans who do not grasp why a PvP MMO is needed, probably because they can PvP in their everyday (real) life :P

Khorne
May 1, 2002

Groovelord Neato posted:

mmo combat sucks why would anyone play that.
The entire MOBA genre exists.

WoW combat was pretty good during WotLK and at the tail end of TBC and some parts of Cata.

Groovelord Neato
Dec 6, 2014


toolbar cooldowns with autoattack combat stinks!

mobas are rts combat.

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Khorne
May 1, 2002

Groovelord Neato posted:

toolbar cooldowns with autoattack combat stinks!
There's not really much auto attacking in WoW pvp. Or wasn't.

MMOs shifted toward more ARPG combat ages ago, and that's pretty much what MOBAs are. I mean yeah, there are still sluggish, snail paced bar MMOs. But who plays those?

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