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uniball posted:the cars only crew is still at it. The squad doing cars-only in the final circle may be idiots, but what does that make the squad trying to take the cars out with shotguns?
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Aug 2, 2018 22:22
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I know you pointed it out specifically but it does seem silly to have issue with a floating marker and not the bars describing health, numbers displaying current ammo and stock, compass, minimap, or even team mate health bars ruining the ~realistic immersion~
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Aug 2, 2018 22:27
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Hippie Hedgehog posted:The squad doing cars-only in the final circle may be idiots, but what does that make the squad trying to take the cars out with shotguns? People playing the shotgun only event.
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Aug 2, 2018 22:35
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Hippie Hedgehog posted:PUBG is fundamentally a simulation game. By that, I mean it makes no effort at all at plot, it just throws you into a fight to the death. There is no tutorial, no voice acting and very bare-bones in game descriptions, so you're left to figure out the mechanics on your own (or google for info). edit: haha, wall of text Of course, everything we're talking about here is trying to put a narrative on something we have a gut feeling about, so don't take what I'm saying as a dig or anything...just exploring an idea. There's lots of things in the game that are magical but people are OK with them because they're used to them. How the heck are you communicating with all your squadmates without radios? How are you talking to them while you're dead? What's this magical map you have that shows where everyone you have in your squad is currently located? Whats the deal with the markers you can already place on the map? You can do all sorts of things in this game world but you can't point your finger at something? What are all these words and numbers and graphics floating in my vision? I don't view in-game markers as being part of some sci-fi HUD, I view them as aids to make up for the fact that we're playing the game on flat screens with mice and keyboards separated from the people around us in the game world by a thousand miles in the real world. To me, if it was a more ideal simulation, I could say "the guy is over there" and my squad mates could see to which building window my finger was pointing. (I would support in-game markers not being visible to squad mates who couldn't see me as well. If they couldn't see where I was pointing in real life, I'm fine with them not being able to see my markers. Would be cool if the markers were only visible while I was holding a key down or something to simulate how if I was pointing at something that hand would not be free to operate a weapon.) (but I'm not terribly bothered by a simpler less-true-to-life system either) Much like the HUD we already have in the game shows us our ammo and weapons because we can't feel the weight or pull our backpack out and rummage through it, in-game markers let us point at poo poo because our technology limits us. I would guess some not insubstantial portion of people who have a problem with in-game markers would not bat an eye at them if the game had come out with them from the beginning. I suppose I can see some people really getting "into" the simulation and this one particular thing broke the camels back. Nothing to say there other than I'm sorry.  (cue me actually getting to try this poo poo out and thinking it sucks)
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Aug 2, 2018 22:39
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If they add this floating marker thing, hopefully they give up on all the lovely game mechanics that exist for the sake of "realism", like limiting frags to 2 per player, allowing item use in vehicles even if they shake on terrain, letting you see your teammates' loadouts from the inventory, etc.
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Aug 2, 2018 22:42
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Hellsau posted:like limiting frags to 2 per player What? This sounds like a horrible idea. I think the backpack is actually quite well balanced right now.
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Aug 2, 2018 22:52
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Tweak posted:I know you pointed it out specifically but it does seem silly to have issue with a floating marker and not the bars describing health, numbers displaying current ammo and stock, compass, minimap, or even team mate health bars ruining the ~realistic immersion~ Yeah, you're making a good point. As Thermopyle said above, I think it's because they're what we're used to. The crosshair was there in wolf3d, I think, and hasn't really left us since. FPP mode does partly do away with the crosshairs at least, by making ADS (mostly) superior, but I suppose since they were there in TPP, they didn't dare remove them completely even from FPP. The compass might be the only HUD element I haven't already seen in a million other shooters, but I can see how squad play would get really annoying without it. I don't think it should be in solo mode. I've seen FPS games try to do away with the health bar in the name of immersion, but I don't think it's been successful. Generally I associate that with more casual games which tend to have some regeneration mechanic. Visualizing damage on a player model only works in TPP, and also kind of sucks in games that have healing mechanics. Why did the wound on my arm disappear when I bandaged, yet there is no bandage on my arm? You see how simulational immersion is hard to achieve there. The health bar also provides an interesting meta where you can determine in detail when to heal if you're in the blue. Didn't some game try to do away with ammo numbers? I forget. Real soldiers make do, I'm sure the game would still be decently approachable, but I'm not sure counting bullets is a very interesting meta. I wish there was a way to turn off the contextual button hints. I know it's a door, you don't have to tell me how to open it after the third time, unless my little brother changes my key binds again. Solo mode doesn't really need the minimap either. Removing it would both lower the skill floor and raise the skill ceiling. Map memorization is already a large part of the game, but I'm not sure it needs to be harder on beginners than it already is... Edit: Thermopyle posted:I don't view in-game markers as being part of some sci-fi HUD, I view them as aids to make up for the fact that we're playing the game on flat screens with mice and keyboards separated from the people around us in the game world by a thousand miles in the real world. To me, if it was a more ideal simulation, I could say "the guy is over there" and my squad mates could see to which building window my finger was pointing. Interesting point, and I like your idea for an alternative marker implementation. I've been thinking about voice comms as every player having an invisible radio with an earpiece. They could have put it in the inventory like in ARMA but I'm not sure it would help the meta game plus it would be even more confusing to noobs (and squads playing with noobs: "He dropped the radio to carry more bandages?") Magic maps, I'm willing to hand-wave away. I'm perfectly on board with most of the unrealistic stuff in PUBG. * Instantly dropping items * Instant pickups if drag-and-dropping * Able to attach a choke to a shotgun without tools, while running * Able to sprint at 15 km/h for an indefinite time * Completely eliminated chance (bullet spread) when aiming down sights * Shoot a car enough and it invariably explodes in a cloud of flame * (even if out of fuel) * Getting sprayed in your milvest with an m249 doesn't knock you off your feet * Not getting injured by vaulting through glass windows All of these are in name of making an interesting meta, and game would be less fun if done realistically. Things I would like to work better/realistically because it would improve the game: * Melee - Why is my swing so darn slow, why is it so hard to hit, and why does a pan do more damage than a machete? * Bullet penetration could be used in more places. Like, say, the grass houses on Sanhok, and yellow houses on Erangel. Would make camping less comfortable. Things they made more realistic already, which worked out fine: * Hand grenades don't throw people around much. (They kill by shrapnel.) * Can't hold breath underwater as long as before VulgarandStupid posted:People playing the shotgun only event. You're right of course, I saw the S12 on his back and mistook if for an AR... Hippie Hedgehog fucked around with this message at 10:37 on Aug 3, 2018 |
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Aug 2, 2018 22:54
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Thom P. Tiers posted:What? This sounds like a horrible idea. I think the backpack is actually quite well balanced right now. The portable red zone is kind of silly, though maybe that's just because grenades are quite inconsistent.
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Aug 2, 2018 22:55
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Hippie Hedgehog posted:Things they made more realistic already, which worked out fine: This one I thought was bullshit; you can run marathons without breaking a sweat but being underwater for 12 seconds makes you instantly start drowning; iirc the hold breath meter for sniper shots is also tied to same system? (also drowning meter is insanely quick, ideally it would be closer to 2nd or 3rd blue zone hits so you could trade off diving for extra time versus getting shot)
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Aug 3, 2018 00:06
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I just want to be able to take attachments off dropped guns 
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Aug 3, 2018 00:08
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Seriously just watch that Swag clip to see why their implementation of the marker is bad. Jesus. And what's this about 2 frags? Did they change that in this update? I must not have seen that line in the patch notes (not sarcasm), because I know I had 4 frags just the other day. Riot Carol Danvers fucked around with this message at 05:34 on Aug 3, 2018 |
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Aug 3, 2018 05:30
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shroud dont like the ping poo poo either. i agree it seems dumb as gently caress
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Aug 3, 2018 06:42
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i don't like the pings because it makes the game easier, i put in minimal effort to get my friends to figure out where im shooting without putting a map marker out and now that effort was wasted. maybe playing in the discord will get better though because it seemed like most people couldn't figure out where people were shooting most the time.
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Aug 3, 2018 07:40
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Personally i look forward to never again hearing “guy over there!” *huge spray of AR fire*
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Aug 3, 2018 08:15
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I didn’t try them myself yet but it seems like markers will make playing with random casuals much easier because they’re often either too talkative or totally silent, either way unable to get bearings across quickly. As always non-casuals with out-of-game comms will learn to use this new feature far more effectively in very little time but they already had an advantage by being organized in the first place so they may not get noticeably better unrelated: patched up and played for the first time in months yesterday. game feels good, too early to really tell but it feels way smoother/less buggy. sanhok good, being in low rated matches, good, shooting people, gooood
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Aug 3, 2018 10:19
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Party Plane Jones posted:This one I thought was bullshit; you can run marathons without breaking a sweat but being underwater for 12 seconds makes you instantly start drowning; iirc the hold breath meter for sniper shots is also tied to same system? OK, we might not agree on what's realistic here, but from a game balance perspective I think the devs were right that hiding in water was OP.
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Aug 3, 2018 10:39
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Maybe just have pinging in TPP. You can already see the enemy without exposing yourself from cover, so the pre-firing markers part won't have as much difference as in FPP.
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Aug 3, 2018 10:53
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I dunno, I know people who have run marathons with a 70 lb ruck, but swimming with 70 lbs is nearly impossible. Pinging sounds super dumb, but maybe I'll hear my brother yell ON ME ON ME ON ME less from his room.
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Aug 3, 2018 18:30
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I just want event modes all the time
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Aug 3, 2018 18:49
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I don't understand the swag clip because he acts like because someone in a window is marked the person in the window is frozen
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Aug 3, 2018 18:53
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Tweak posted:I don't understand the swag clip because he acts like because someone in a window is marked the person in the window is frozen You’re not allowed to move once your position as been marked by your enemies, gentleman’s rules of war.
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Aug 3, 2018 19:08
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Ping is good 
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Aug 3, 2018 19:08
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#1 pro tip for this event mode: Get an airdrop. Get a vektor. Get a 4x scope. Congrats, you have the only sniper weapon on the map. It's garbage but I still completely owned everyone else who was trying to ironsight me.
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Aug 3, 2018 20:01
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Agreed, just won one with goons today partly because of this
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Aug 3, 2018 21:34
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I wish there was a playstyle selector. Personally, I like moving from cover to cover as a unit. I like the tension. After 15+ event games, that's been one game. Every other game has been hot drops and teams that play like they're doing solo, just running off in random directions.
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Aug 3, 2018 23:22
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Accretionist posted:I wish there was a playstyle selector. "on me...." "on me..." *automatic fire, teammate dies* "yo come get me come get me hes so low, yo right there" "why are yall so far away? you guys suck"
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Aug 3, 2018 23:32
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Ping chat: I don't like it. Moving out of cover will be a death sentence as every squad within sight only needs one person to get eyes on you. A big part of sneaky plays and successful flanks is the element of surprise often breaks the team coordination as whoever is under fire struggles to articulate the position of their attacker while trying not to die. This is another change in a long line that shows the devs don't know what made PUBG so incredible in the first place imo
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Aug 4, 2018 01:09
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abigserve posted:Ping chat: I don't like it. Moving out of cover will be a death sentence as every squad within sight only needs one person to get eyes on you. A big part of sneaky plays and successful flanks is the element of surprise often breaks the team coordination as whoever is under fire struggles to articulate the position of their attacker while trying not to die. 
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Aug 4, 2018 01:15
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abigserve posted:Ping chat: I don't like it. Moving out of cover will be a death sentence as every squad within sight only needs one person to get eyes on you. A big part of sneaky plays and successful flanks is the element of surprise often breaks the team coordination as whoever is under fire struggles to articulate the position of their attacker while trying not to die.  1 vs squad seems like it would be even more futile now
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Aug 4, 2018 01:50
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I think I'm just done with non-solo modes, especially events. Pubbie filth. Pubbie filth everywhere.
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Aug 4, 2018 04:40
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In Arma 3 BR you had visible markers with range that on you could see but had to be placed on the map. You could also mark an X on the map for your teammates but then they’d have to try to place their marker on it accurately. Being able to mark which individual tree someone is behind sounds absurd though.
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Aug 4, 2018 08:09
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-Ii7hSOoiM lol
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Aug 4, 2018 14:33
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You can't see where someone is pointing their finger unless you are standing behind them looking down their arm. Markers will widen the skill gap. Good players in well organised teams have a super accurate way to point something out and give contextual information. Bad players in uncoordinated, random squad teams will still be uncoordinated and ignore each other while giving no/poor information regarding the marker they have placed on who-knows-what, if they even make use of it. I got to thinking about what a similar level feature would be for other aspects of the game and one that came up was one that comes up here often enough as well. I'm good at driving but in order to be good I had to memorize the maps, learn the best routes, learn the terrain, learn the vehicle physics and practice honking the horn as often as possible while blasting past people shooting at us without losing control. Lots of you have complained about how the vehicles handle or how hard it is to drive across the maps, but I'd bet anyone who has played with me knows that I barely mess it up. I mostly don't roll, if I do I land on the wheels and speed off anyway. Imagine if there was a button you could press to make the vehicle always land safe. Do you feel that would be on par with this new marking feature? What would you say to something like that? Should being a good player mean using basic elements of the game and combining them with non-game aspects? Or even combining multiple game-present elements in an way that isn't obviously intuitive? I assume this is perhaps a way to offer the same quality level of callouts to all players regardless of squad organisation or ability. But where do you stop at? How do you balance for things like situational awareness, tactics (flanking, distracting, elevation, pathing, cover), driving or mouse1-ing heads? At some point if people want to get good, they have to learn all the things required. Or is the new marking feature a good quality-of-life change and makes the game more accessible like ammo counts, mini-maps and many other things? How far do we stray from "gamey" elements while balancing and keeping the game fun? Some things like that have a real effect on the pacing and flow of games. Can you imagine if we had to carry actual magazines and repack them if we reloaded without spending all the rounds? I personally fall on the side of having a game provide the basic tools, but for the player to find a way to use them. We already have the tools.
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Aug 5, 2018 10:28
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I’d just have the marker on the minimap. I’m not against the marker appearing on the HUD but to me a minimap marker seems more PUBG.
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Aug 5, 2018 10:44
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Markers do show on the mini-map. I'm not sure what you mean.
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Aug 5, 2018 11:47
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Slim Mat posted:Markers do show on the mini-map. I'm not sure what you mean. I mean the ability to target something, press a key, and have a marker appear on the minimap at that location. So you can be like ‘dude here’ mark appears on minimap “he’s top floor rightmost window” or whatever.
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Aug 5, 2018 11:50
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Schneider Inside Her posted:I mean the ability to target something, press a key, and have a marker appear on the minimap at that location. So you can be like ‘dude here’ mark appears on minimap “he’s top floor rightmost window” or whatever. I think it currently does do that in addition to the HUD marker. I'm not a fan of the HUD marker at all. Even though I've abused the hell out of 3D spotting in BF for years, this is a totally different game that runs at a different pace. It's so much slower, that there is time for people with good communication skills to convey that kind of information. If they do keep the HUD marker, it should ping for like a second or something at least and be more of a general direction thing rather than pointing out a specific window.
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Aug 5, 2018 12:30
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LampkinsMateSteve posted:I think it currently does do that in addition to the HUD marker. I'm not a fan of the HUD marker at all. Even though I've abused the hell out of 3D spotting in BF for years, this is a totally different game that runs at a different pace. It's so much slower, that there is time for people with good communication skills to convey that kind of information. If they do keep the HUD marker, it should ping for like a second or something at least and be more of a general direction thing rather than pointing out a specific window. Yeah, I’m saying it would be more in line with PUBG if it was just a minimap marker, rather than a minimap marker and a marker on the HUD. I think just having the minimap marker makes it more of a quality of life change, rather than a game-changing mechanic.
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Aug 5, 2018 12:50
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Slim Mat posted:You can't see where someone is pointing their finger unless you are standing behind them looking down their arm. So you're saying every time someone points at something you have to walk over behind them to understand where they're pointing? Anyway... They could add a feature where you have to do math problems to open your inventory. Something requiring skill says nothing about whether it contributes to the game. I've got a lot more to say about how your analogy is not relevant but I'm sure people are tired of long posts about the subject. Thermopyle fucked around with this message at 15:39 on Aug 5, 2018 |
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Aug 5, 2018 15:36
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Thermopyle posted:So you're saying every time someone points at something you have to walk over behind them to understand where they're pointing? To get the exact location without talking yes. You can get the general location without though.
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Aug 5, 2018 16:54
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