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I'm not going to say that I'm a genius at heat management, but the simple version is that if your farms get to hot, the plants die and everybody starves. Heat comes from two major sources. Industrial machinery like power generators produce heat when they run, and oxygen generators output oxygen at 40 C, which is hotter than plants like. Heat radiates through solid tiles fairly slowly, so the best thing to do is put your power plants outside the starting biome. A good midgame goal is to set up a cool oxygen loop. Take the oxygen from your electrolyzers and run it through a radiant ventilation duct in an ice biome. Then take that nice cold oxygen and send it to your base. I keep the electrolyzers outside the cold biome itself to keep the water pipes from freezing, and use insulated ducting to keep it from heating up again on its way back to base. As for food, more is better, unless the space in my base can be put to better use. Food in a sterile atmosphere doesn't go stale, so I have ration boxes in a CO2 sump at the bottom of the base.
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Aug 5, 2018 21:57
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Do you need to use a fridge or is the atmosphere enough?
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Aug 5, 2018 22:22
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I found this thing looking for heat management and it works amazingly well for me. https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/87548-self-powering-oxygen-module-mkii-production-and-cooling/ Ties your oxygen generation directly to your water supply so I generally only do it after I find at least one, preferably two, water geysers and I will even supplement it with a pressure sensor that kicks in extra water supplied by a sieve if things get too low. It's a non-stop source of like 2 degree celsius oxygen for about 8 dupes that can siphon off an excess of hydrogen to run an AETM or power a hydrogen generator for occasional extra energy.
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Aug 5, 2018 22:35
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heat management isn't something you can just do. it relative and complicated. so don't expect a simple answer. the basic idea is that everything (including wires, dupes, plants, aliens, etc) produce heat. heat will dissipate into the air around it. putting something in a vacuum will cause it to overheat quickly because there is no medium for heat transfer. different gasses have different amounts of thermal conductivity and thermal capacity. just remember this as a guiding principle. basic cooling: there is cooling your living quarters, cooling your crops, and cooling machines. the easiest way to cool machines doesn't involve cooling at all. just make them using gold amalgam. that gives about 80-90 degrees of addition thermal capacity (to prevent overheating) the easiest way to cool bases is pipe cold water or air around it. the easiest way to cool plants is irrigate them with cold water, or hot water for hot plants. I could explain why but it all about the water absorbing ambient heat and converting it into another medium (food, waste, etc). build your industrial machines in a separate biome from your living quarters.
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Aug 5, 2018 23:04
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BattleMaster posted:Do you need to use a fridge or is the atmosphere enough? e. and last heat chat someone pointed out the anti-entropy inherent in filtering near boiling dirty water puts wheezeworts and the anti-entropy machine to shame so the general progression is babbys first AC with wheezewort in your farm and O2 chambers until you can set up an air conditioner with clean water cooled by an aquatuner in dirty water which doesn't get filtered till its near boiling, and then you can still use wheezeworts and the anti-entropy machine for more specific spot cooling with hydrogen loops. zedprime fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Aug 5, 2018 |
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Aug 5, 2018 23:42
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So I got a wild gulp fish to spawn on my map, and they seem really useful. Swimming around converting polluted water to water basically for free. I set up a fish tank, feeder, station and all that stuff, captured the fish and let him start munching away to tame himself. He just vanished. Curious, I spawned another one and tried again. Gone. Eventually decided to spawn one, fast forward the game and just do nothing but watch them. They're dying at 41% tameness for absolutely no reason. 25/25 health, 4/25 age, still eating, no exclamation marks on the status panel. They just swim around, stop, and die with no warning. Anyone know what the gently caress is going on?
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Aug 6, 2018 01:29
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Heat management sucks. It’s easily the worst thing about this game: it’s both poorly explained and not at all obvious. It can gently caress up your base in a slow and irreversible way unless you know to watch for it and know exactly how to deal with it, which involves reading guides and tutorials and trying to replicate the insane setups people have come up with. SPOM is a great example. What really sucks about it is that basically all ways of dealing with heat rely on magic. You either have wheezeworts and AETNs magically sucking up heat, or stuff like water purifier that outputs things at a static temperature and are inevitably used to delete heat from the colony. The whole thing is just frustrating and dumb.
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Aug 6, 2018 07:40
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The heat system is surely pretty dumb, but what non-magical ways could they put in? All I can think of is big radiators on the surface. Or throwing hot matter off the asteroid.
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Aug 6, 2018 08:11
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I'm not sure how they'd make it less dumb but currently the only ways of dealing with it are either really convoluted, rely on space magic or needs to be thought out in advance. If they can make it fun, i'll be the first to sing their praises. Failing that i'll just find a way to get a mod that turns all the heat aspects of the game off because its easily my least favourite part.
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Aug 6, 2018 11:49
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Do they plan to have robust mod support? That would be huge for replayability for me. Letting the mod community go wild on a game has always resulted in cool stuff once you filter out the titty mods and game breakingly overpowered stuff.
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Aug 6, 2018 13:12
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WithoutTheFezOn posted:The heat system is surely pretty dumb, but what non-magical ways could they put in? All I can think of is big radiators on the surface. Or throwing hot matter off the asteroid. Radiating into the vacuum??
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Aug 6, 2018 20:49
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Yeah that's why it's a radiator rather than a heatsink and fans 
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Aug 6, 2018 20:54
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dogstile posted:I'm not sure how they'd make it less dumb but currently the only ways of dealing with it are either really convoluted, rely on space magic or needs to be thought out in advance. If they can make it fun, i'll be the first to sing their praises. When I get mad at it, I just go into sandbox and freeze everything in sight.
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Aug 6, 2018 21:03
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Really only three things I do for a huge amount of the game to deal with heat. Keep industrial stuff out of the main base, pump cold air into the main base and pump cold water into the main base. Those three steps manage heat for a long time for me. Eventually, like hundreds of cycles into the game, I put up a ring of vacuumed out tiles around the main base to insulate from like 99% of the rest of the asteroid, but for hundreds of cycles the first three steps are all I do.
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Aug 6, 2018 21:13
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How do you guys handle expanding into neighboring biomes?
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Aug 6, 2018 22:10
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From a heat perspective you can rig up a trio of mechanized airlocks and weight plates so when the outer doors close the inner one cycles, creating a vacuum. It will stop heat from bleeding between biomes. Exploration wise I tunnel through abyssalite biome seperaters, then breech in the order Cold -> Caustic -> Swamp -> Oil Cold first because it gives you a larger water supply and the heat management tools to deal with the rest of the biomes. Caustic once I have some gas storage in place and can divert chlorine into sanitation rooms and hydrogen into cooling systems or generators. I'll need abyssalite and wheezeworts to help deal with the heat. Swamp next because Chlorine is invaluable for dealing with slime lung.
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Aug 7, 2018 00:13
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I have never had to use chlorine for anything since I started playing a year and a half ago.
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Aug 7, 2018 00:28
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Do the hot biomes contain a fixed amount of got it do they magically generate more heat? Like, if I somehow cooled all the contents of the hot biome would it stay cool?
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Aug 7, 2018 00:36
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Splicer posted:Do the hot biomes contain a fixed amount of got it do they magically generate more heat? Like, if I somehow cooled all the contents of the hot biome would it stay cool? Geysers are infinite sources of heat to varying degrees but other than that it'll stay cool if you freeze it down. Likewise the cold biome stays hot if you warm it up, barring intervention by wheezeworts or the anti entropy machine.
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Aug 7, 2018 01:27
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I did get a slush geyser once that put out like -11c polluted water, that was crazy good at cooling things off. Probably one of my most favorite geysers.
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Aug 7, 2018 01:46
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Splicer posted:Do the hot biomes contain a fixed amount of got it do they magically generate more heat? Like, if I somehow cooled all the contents of the hot biome would it stay cool?
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Aug 7, 2018 01:55
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They do not. They just have a lot of heat energy (or lack thereof) stored away in the blocks that bleeds out over time. The natural abyssalite acts as an insulator between the biomes.
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Aug 7, 2018 02:04
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WithoutTheFezOn posted:I know you can heat up ice biomes with electrolyzers, and if you turn them off for a while it cools down. So I assume yes. This is because the existing ice and snow cools the biome back down. But those melt eventually.
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Aug 7, 2018 02:36
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enraged_camel posted:This is because the existing ice and snow cools the biome back down. But those melt eventually. Well cleared of everything but a puddle of polluted water at the bottom.
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Aug 7, 2018 04:34
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how many people have to tell you a thing before you believe it
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Aug 7, 2018 04:40
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Usually two or three. I’ll take the L here gladly. I missed Sage's comment and my idea of “eventually” is probably too short term to be correct.
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Aug 7, 2018 05:00
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Sage Grimm posted:They do not. They just have a lot of heat energy (or lack thereof) stored away in the blocks that bleeds out over time. The natural abyssalite acts as an insulator between the biomes. In that case my only peeves with temperature are the fixed temperature output buildings and a lack of gravity feeding/passive throughput for pipes and vents. The former because they're either a crippling problem or an easy solution depending on whether you exploit heat deletion, and the latter because it makes more intuitive solutions unnecessarily complex.
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Aug 7, 2018 10:30
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I had the output of my forge draining into the same basin as a polluted water well and discovered that >50°C water kills food poisoning. And oxygen kills slimeling. A vali strategy to disease management I've found is to run hot and overpressure. I don't know if melting all the snow and burning all the slime to oxygenate the entire asteroid is valid beyond cycle ~100, but it works pretty good until then. Except for food. Food needs to be insulated in it's own special little cold room. By the way, do you get temperature related crop failures in real life? It would be pretty fun if the way global warming killed us all is we starved to death.
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Aug 7, 2018 19:57
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DreadLlama posted:By the way, do you get temperature related crop failures in real life? It would be pretty fun if the way global warming killed us all is we starved to death. Is this a serious question?
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Aug 7, 2018 20:21
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DreadLlama posted:By the way, do you get temperature related crop failures in real life?
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Aug 8, 2018 12:30
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In case that was actually a serious question, your daily dose of despair: https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3750508 A more lighthearted read would be getting into some basic gardening and learning about hardiness zones which are divided by temperature https://garden.org/nga/zipzone/ Bhodi fucked around with this message at 12:40 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 12:38
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Just like in the game, nothing can grow in extreme heat, thus the concern about the Earth heating up. Also why we won't be colonizing Mercury anytime soon.
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Aug 8, 2018 12:53
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Now I want there to be ONI cows to eat all your food and fart in your base to make the problem even worse.
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Aug 8, 2018 16:49
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I actually wish farming was a bit more nuanced and that the speed of plant growth was on a spectrum, e.g. if you keep the temperature between 20-25 C, blossoms grow at full speed, but as they get outside their "ideal" range, their growth slows down. I also wish farming skill increased the amount of calories farmed from each plant, at least slightly. Right now it only affects farming speed and seed chance, both of which become fairly useless quickly.
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Aug 8, 2018 16:58
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I built the SPOM but I hosed up because I didn't turn the insides into vacuum so i've got chlorine and polluted oxygen and some CO2 loving up the machinery. Any ideas on how to do that?
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Aug 8, 2018 22:14
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When I built an electrolysis chamber I wired it so there were manual automation switches connected to the pumps and electrolyzer so I could run the oxygen pumps without the electrolyzer or hydrogen pumps running until it was pumped down to a vacuum, which didn't take that long.
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Aug 8, 2018 22:25
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hosed my electrical set up so bad, should just add some transformers, but that takes actual work
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Aug 8, 2018 23:13
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Jinnigan posted:I built the SPOM but I hosed up because I didn't turn the insides into vacuum so i've got chlorine and polluted oxygen and some CO2 loving up the machinery. Any ideas on how to do that? Yeah, SPOM is very annoying for this reason. If you built the Mark II version though, you don't need to deal with manual switches like BattleMaster says. You can manually adjust the atmo sensors - one should be connected to the upper pump, and one should be connected to the lower two pumps. So the steps are: 1. Cut off water to the electrolizer so that it stops. 2. Dial the upper atmo sensor all the way up (e.g. "above 10000g") so it turns the hydrogen pump off 3. Wait until the two oxygen pumps pump out all the gas in the chamber - hydrogen, oxygen, everything. During this time you can also go in and repair the hydrogen generator, although you'll need to wait a bit longer to suck out the air that comes in during this time as well. 4. Then turn on the electrolizer, and turn the two groups of pumps on and off as needed to recalibrate the chamber. Anyways, building and managing a SPOM is pretty annoying for this reason. That's why I actually build a gas filter in the hydrogen chamber and filter the hydrogen into the generator, and everything else outside. This makes the thing not energy-neutral but whatever, it's connected to the rest of my grid anyway so it doesn't matter. Here's mine:  I built the waterlock to go in and temporarily modify some wiring (because I'm OCD). It's not a permanent part of the setup - you don't need it once the thing is built correctly and starts running.
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Aug 8, 2018 23:39
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Oh yeah, I forgot to add that the chamber I built was a naive design I came up with on my own that didn't include sensors. edit: here's my version that pales in comparison:  The petroleum was because I had an accident with deconstructing a petroleum pipe near the steam geyser I'm feeding the electrolyzers with I also didn't know that pumps didn't need supports when I built it. Why did I build the hydrogen pump not right at the ceiling?  edit 2: drat this base is a poorly-planned trash fire, no wonder I decided to take a break for a few updates and start over. I am proud of the insulated service tunnels I ran around the place though BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 00:00 on Aug 9, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 23:42
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I tend to put a hamster wheel on my SPOMs to provide start-up power, though sometimes I'll say "gently caress it" and just get them running off base power. Either way I'll add in temperature sensors inside that are set to like negative a bajillion degrees and I can flip stuff off and on without needing dupes to break into the walls by going into their menu and selecting above or below, which allows the hamster wheeled or base powered generators to get everything to a vacuum to start. Biggest frustration for me is setting up the wheezewart hydrogen chamber the first time around without a SPOM running to siphon an initial source off of. Then I have the battery power for the internals on a smart battery that disables the hydrogen generator when it's at 100%, allowing me to siphon off excess hydrogen that I will then put up some automation to leave a small trickle running to AETNs for water cooling and all the excess goes to an external hydrogen generator that feeds back into my heavi-watt wire backbone. That much less power I need to generate off of my natural gas geysers, and makes the next SPOM a poo poo ton easier to prime. I still think gas management blows major rear end in this game with only a pump that takes from the immediate area. I'd kill to have the little utility guns dupes walk around with have a buildable upgrade station that allowed them to act like portable, spot pumps so you can say stuff like "go here and vacuum out all the chlorine because it sucks and is in my way" and then give you canisters of chlorine or whatever. Power cost per gram of gas could be higher than built pumps and it would require dupe labor all around so the opportunity cost is there, but drat does there need to be some extra flexibility in the system somehow.
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Aug 9, 2018 00:27
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