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Another stupid question. In my dumb lumbering T3 French BB, should I be firing AP trying to get good citadels and damage, or should I just spam HE unless I am close and have a sweet broadside to shoot at? I've been trying to shoot AP at long and close range, but I'm getting a lot of those 'hit' sounds without any damage so I'm wondering if I would be better off just spamming HE like it seems everyone else does until I get within 8-10km? I also feel like there must be a big range increase at T4 because everything on the map seems to outrange me and I keep getting myself over committed and then get slaughtered when 4 or 5 ships focus me, but if I hang around in the rear I'm useless because my guns don't shoot far enough to hit anyone.
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Aug 8, 2018 07:51
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Battleships should be shooting AP except in two situations: A: Your only target is a destroyer and there is literally nothing else to shoot at: DD's don't have citadels so you'll pretty much only do overpen's on them. Sometimes this is still enough to kill them. Sometimes it's not and you'll want to switch to HE. B: You're being bow-tanked by another BB and you can't overmatch their bow armor: HE will do more damage than overpenning the superstructure but it's tricky to judge: sometimes people broadside a bit when they get in knife fighting range and AP would cut their ship to ribbons. BB's are all about the AP damage. 3 citadels from their guns will pretty much delete a cruiser from the game and good penetrations on enemy battleships will still do giant wodges of damage. The trick is getting into angles where you'll get those shots without being the target for them yourself. The other trick is that Repair Party (the hp restoring consumable that every BB and tons of Cruiser's have) can fully repair HE and fire damage done. It can only repair 10% of AP damage done. Tier 3 BB's are all pretty bad. Tier 4 is where BB's really start to come into their own and you can get a feel for your line. French BB's are faster on the straight and they have a good arrangement of guns but the caliber's are a bit lacking compared to other nation's BB's and their armor isn't as good.
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Aug 8, 2018 08:07
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EponymousMrYar posted:...Tier 3 BB's are all pretty bad. Tier 4 is where BB's really start to come into their own... HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Tier VI is where BBs really start to come into their own. IV is just where they stop completely sucking and upgrade to "mostly sucking". Even V is a shitshow.
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Aug 8, 2018 08:13
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Just getting tier 6-7 cruisers. Boy, I love my strategic options of immediately exploding or sitting behind an island for 20 minutes lobbing HE at distant targets.
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Aug 8, 2018 08:16
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Ah that's true, there's a reason all of my non American/Jap BB's are still at tier 4 while I pushed to t5 on the cruisers... HOWEVER:Cobbsprite posted:Even V is a shitshow. The Kongo's only held back by the same thing every BB is (rng) and the New York's broadside is something to be respected even in T7 games (even if it's got the achingly slow American BB speed.) Every tier of the game is a shitshow with the right (or in this case, wrong) teammates. That's not the ship's faults!
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Aug 8, 2018 08:20
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Real talk: Kongo dispersion is not the problem. The range (which seems incredible when you're first running up the tech tree) seems incredible, which means you're taking shots that you have no chance in hell of hitting. Yes, RNG is what kneecaps the Kongo. Yes, RNG is what you fight in most BBs. But in Kongo, you can't take advantage of your guns range because you won't hit reliably, and you can't take advantage of their caliber because you won't score those big hits reliably unless you're in close. Don't get me wrong - Kongo is a step up, and definitely marching towards the ships that are actually GOOD BBs later down the line. But Kongo is only good on a relative basis. You shouldn't keep her after you level up past her. And New York is just glacially slow. If you turn left instead of right and chose wrong, you're out of the match. You can't recover from a bad positioning. If you're broadside, you have to wait THREE enemy volleys before you can start to adjust your armor angle. She's okay for her tier, but you don't have the whole toolbag, yet. And I'm being nice. I could say BB game doesn't really finish growing until Tier VII and not actually be wrong. But Tier VI is the line in between "had a lobotomy in the drydock" and "a good ship who can fight" for battleships.
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Aug 8, 2018 08:33
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Cobbsprite posted:HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Orion
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Aug 8, 2018 08:51
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NTRabbit posted:Orion Also the Arkansas Beta. Although that's a function of having all 6 upgrade slots at tier IV
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Aug 8, 2018 09:36
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:
It's you edit: Cobbsprite posted:HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Kongo is good just by virtue of having battleship guns on a boat that goes 30 knots. It's very RNG dependent but so is almost every battleship in the game. The accuracy at max range is bad but you shouldn't be shooting from max range unless you're a pubbie or someone got spotted 45 seconds into the match. König is pretty good. New York and Bretagne go at 20 knots and are therefore pretty bad. Iron Duke does too but it has the bullshit orion guns which compensate for some of that. James Garfield fucked around with this message at 09:58 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 09:51
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Assuming CVs stay in the game, I wonder if it would be better to have a loose skill-based MM only for CVs. Those of you who have played WoT with XVM know there's a loose colour scale of "goodness" from dark red - through to green then up to blue and unicums are dark purple. Or WoT also has a personal rating system, WoWS could use that but only to look at your CV stats, maybe give em some naval ranks so we call the total shitters "Ensigns" or something so they don't cry about it. WoWS already has an Account rank, maybe we need a CV rank too. What I'd like is when the MM sets up a game with CVs in it, it tries to match the CVs on each side in skill. So if it finds an "Ensign" level CV player it tried to find another to face off against him, if it can't do that it tried to match him vs the next highest level etc. Stats of the rest of the team and stats in the CV player's non CV stats don't matter either. The point of this is that if you have a CV in your team, the enemy CV should be in the same ballpark of skill. Having a poo poo CV player isn't so bad if the enemy CV also has no hands. Facing an amazing CV player is awful, but it can be mitigated if you're protected by your own sky-god. The downside for CV players is they would have less matches where they can just feast on the enemy team, and they really good ones will end up fighting each other a lot, but honestly I think that's just something they have to deal with for the good of the game as a whole. Darkrenown fucked around with this message at 11:28 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 11:26
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I am focused in almost every game by a CV running M3, or recognises my name/clan. It is incredibly unfun having a squadron hovering over you the entire game. My revenge is being in a fishing division these past few days and that's worked out well.
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Aug 8, 2018 11:34
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:weekly reminder that CV's are pieces of poo poo that ruin every match they're in and especially gently caress the needle-dicked pedants that play them A-loving-men. Lord Koth posted:Literally 1-in-10 games total you've played are in Conqueror, you're not particularly great in it, and it's a ship infamous for farming incredible amounts of damage while contributing virtually nothing to actually winning the game. It's a ship(and line, for that matter) despised on the same level as CVs, and a hell of a lot more common than them at high tiers so it shits up far more games. This is not real. CVs and Conquerers are not even loving close to the same level of broken. Furthermore, being in a game with a Conquerer is not being in a piloted NPC in someone else’s 1v1 rts game. ZombieLenin fucked around with this message at 14:07 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 14:01
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ZombieLenin posted:A-loving-men. careful, some Extremely Not Mad person might try to stat-shame you 
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Aug 8, 2018 14:05
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i don't pay attention and frequently ask others to do things for me: when is the expected CV rework? also, gas all CV players
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Aug 8, 2018 14:09
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The fact that WG has even admitted that CVs are totally broken by announcing and teasing a complete and total mechanical rework of the entire class, and has mentioned the change is so drastic there will be complete compensation for anyone who doesn't want to play them at all who has previously purchased a CV tells you that it is completely and utterly broken from a gameplay perspective. Far beyond the Conqueror or any other annoyance. Honestly if it weren't so hideously unpopular at the moment (especially at the only tiers they seem to care about), they probably would have done something more drastic already, the only reason it's allowed to fester is because maybe 1 in 1000 people are playing a CV. Since someone mentioned it though - why isn't the MM skill based for all ships? It doesn't even need to be exact just, when you get a batch of matching tiers/ships, swap players around to make it as balanced as possible. There are lots of matches where you can look up and see, for instance, 4-5 well above average/unicum cruisers on one side, and 4-5 average/below average cruisers on the other. Why not just take that pool and swap it around so it's more balanced?
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Aug 8, 2018 14:13
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^^ WG are real against skillbased MM. A lot of WG's design is based around the real or imagined idea that Russian players loving love stomping all over lesser players and are OK with having to spend a lot of time getting stomped as long as they get their turn.
Darkrenown fucked around with this message at 14:32 on Aug 8, 2018 |
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Aug 8, 2018 14:29
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I'd be on-board with skill-based matchmaking. I'm surprised it isn't a thing already.
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Aug 8, 2018 14:30
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ban all cv players then delete all cvs
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Aug 8, 2018 14:38
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pokchu posted:ban all cv players then delete all cvs I own a Saipan I never ever play, and if Wargaming deleted it (and all CVs) I wouldn’t be upset even if they did not compensate me.
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Aug 8, 2018 15:31
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ZombieLenin posted:I own a Saipan I never ever play, and if Wargaming deleted it (and all CVs) I wouldn’t be upset even if they did not compensate me.  except Enterprise.
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Aug 8, 2018 15:34
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Do we have any kind of idea when the next version comes out and the sharks/eagles event ends? I missed the first couple of days of it, and I'm trying to figure out if I'll have enough loyalty tokens to get the fancy Worcester skin or not.
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Aug 8, 2018 16:46
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Heartcatch posted:Please stop fighting and let's talk about the real issues. Remove the spotting of ships by CV based aircraft. Nostalgia4Infinity posted:I'd be on-board with skill-based matchmaking. I'm surprised it isn't a thing already. God no, i'd lose my mind in short order.
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Aug 8, 2018 17:01
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Blinks77 posted:Remove the spotting of ships by CV based aircraft. Remove the attacking of ships by CV-based aircraft.
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Aug 8, 2018 17:12
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Blinks77 posted:God no, i'd lose my mind in short order. Why? genuinely curious as Im wondering if there's some downside I haven't considered to more evenly distributed skill
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Aug 8, 2018 17:19
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What do you guys use to record your games?
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Aug 8, 2018 17:29
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Blinks77 posted:Remove the spotting of ships by CV based aircraft. We have to take this slowly. Torpedoes, then ships. In alpha, they used to have scout squadrons that you needed in order to spot ships and torpedoes, but it was removed under the guise of, "It's too complicated for our playerbase to understand". Which, while a poor mechanical decision, is.. well, very true.
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Aug 8, 2018 17:39
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I need some Missouri advice (or maybe this just applies to all BBs?) I feel like all I get is overpens. I'll get what I think is a great shot & dispersion (aiming generally just beneath & behind the front turrets) just to have tons of overpens, and it seems like I get tons more overpens then I should be getting. Is there something I'm missing? Keep in mind I don't really play Battleships much at all, I stick to my destroyers and cruisers.
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Aug 8, 2018 17:41
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Currently in a game with 2 CVs per team. Ours completely ignored the side I went, so we ended up getting shredded. Gentleman's agreement to not dogfight I guess.
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Aug 8, 2018 17:42
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ReapersTouch posted:What do you guys use to record your games? I just use the built in replays tool. https://na.wargaming.net/support/en/products/wows/article/19060/
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Aug 8, 2018 17:53
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toadee posted:Why? genuinely curious as Im wondering if there's some downside I haven't considered to more evenly distributed skill Because it'd mean those of us with a good rating would never get easy games. Every game would be "carry or lose" and while that's often broadly true. Knowing for a fact that the MM was screwing with me would have me gnawing on the walls even more. Heartcatch posted:We have to take this slowly. Torpedoes, then ships. I dunno, having torps spotted by CV-planes has never been my major worry when i'm dding about.
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Aug 8, 2018 18:02
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I envy your ability to never have a squadron hovering over you for fifteen minutes at a time.
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Aug 8, 2018 18:02
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Heartcatch posted:I envy your ability to never have a squadron hovering over you for fifteen minutes at a time. That's more an issue late game and would be fixed by them not being able to spot ships anyway. I mean, honestly, i'd rather they just got deleted from the game but as is...
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Aug 8, 2018 18:06
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Blinks77 posted:Because it'd mean those of us with a good rating would never get easy games. Every game would be "carry or lose" and while that's often broadly true. Knowing for a fact that the MM was screwing with me would have me gnawing on the walls even more. You'd also never have an impossible game where no matter what you did its a loss because your team is 90% morons. And you wouldn't have to carry many games at all, because for the most part, you'd have an equal number of players with the ability to pull their weight.
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Aug 8, 2018 18:07
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Blinks77 posted:Because it'd mean those of us with a good rating would never get easy games. Every game would be "carry or lose" It's pretty close to carry or lose at this point isn't it? Wouldn't playing with people of your skill mean you'd be with more of the people that are typically the carrying sort?
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Aug 8, 2018 18:10
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All of this predicates on winning being the objective. Winning is good, for sure. But I'd rather have a game where I shot up the enemy botes a shitton and had the satisfaction of a good fight that we barely lost at the end, than have a game where I got deleted by an enemy CV at the two minute mark but the rest of my teamies roflstomped them. This game doesn't work because winning is fun. This game works because PLAYING is (and should be) fun. That's why sky cancer is bad, because it reduces fun for everyone. That's why cowardly BBs are bad, because they reduce fun for everyone. Matchmaking that balances players of equal skill on opposing teams (or has separate matchmaking based on skill) would, in theory, establish a balance. And good balance equals opportunity for fun.
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Aug 8, 2018 19:21
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Cobbsprite posted:...implies that skill based MM would work and maybe be good... WG has stated that based on their stats, the vast majority of players are terrible and too terrible to put into a retard ring together. They would stop playing. They'd rather make it miserable for the decent/ok/p good dudes edited for clarity: they didn't outright say the playerbase were morons...they implied it. Listen to the Q&A a month or two ago with the community/streamers
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Aug 8, 2018 19:25
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Cobbsprite posted:All of this predicates on winning being the objective. Winning is good, for sure. But I'd rather have a game where I shot up the enemy botes a shitton and had the satisfaction of a good fight that we barely lost at the end, than have a game where I got deleted by an enemy CV at the two minute mark but the rest of my teamies roflstomped them. There is a problem here. There a people like me with pretty potato stats because we have no compunction about making GBS threads things up on purpose when someone on our team does something that pisses us off. Or we never ever division. Not to say I am a unicom player in disguise (I am not), but I am better than my stats... because the internet makes me behave in childish ways sometimes. So with a And for the record I realize I am an outlier, so really people like me are unimportant; however, I am sort of forced to be opposed to such a stats based system because I don’t want to fight all lovely players forever.
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Aug 8, 2018 19:58
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Skill based MM wouldn't make all potato matches, it would just mean in a pool of 10 good players, 10 average players, and 4 poo poo players, they would be distrubted evenly across the two teams instead of all good players on one and all average on the other
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Aug 8, 2018 20:09
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pokchu posted:I need some Missouri advice (or maybe this just applies to all BBs?) At knife-fighting range against CL's with paper armor your rounds are likely going through the entire boat, which would be an overpen. I've had this problem on my New Orleans a few times when doing operations and getting in close to dallas's: 'wtf all of my shots are overpenning but i know i'm shooting the citadel' You might also be aiming a bit high, I'm not sure if 'just beneath the front turrets' means the waterline, but you want to be aiming at the waterline. toadee posted:Skill based MM wouldn't make all potato matches, it would just mean in a pool of 10 poo poo players, 10 not-so-poo poo players, and 4 decent or better players, they would be distrubted evenly across the two teams instead of all good players on one and all average on the other Fixed. 
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Aug 8, 2018 20:22
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I'd be quite interested in spectating a tournament of sub-50% players for entertainment purposes, but beyond that I think skill-based matchmaking would be a very tiring experience as you would have to be focused every game instead of having a nice cruise. At least for me.
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Aug 8, 2018 20:47
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