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About 1.5 years ago or so, my company transitioned to "unlimited vacation", the idea being you can take as much time off as you want, as long as no critical business functions are interrupted by your absence. I found out the other day that the manager of another department put his team on a vacation prohibition, presumably because he/she felt any vacation would interrupt business function. That lockdown is still in place today, so there's an entire team that hasn't had a day off in 1.5 years. I typically have some trouble getting time off, but once I make my case, the request is granted. I still find it really annoying because vacation used to be something I had earned and no manager could give me any grief over taking time off. Now it's like I have to horse trade with my boss and convince them that the world will still keep spinning if I'm not here.
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Aug 9, 2018 22:15
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LLSix posted:I feel the opposite way about people who do use keyboard shortcuts when pair programming. I can't tell what they're trying to do when they use shortcuts which is really annoying. There are utilities which will overlay keyboard shortcuts pressed onto the screen.
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Aug 9, 2018 22:32
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My Rhythmic Crotch posted:About 1.5 years ago or so, my company transitioned to "unlimited vacation", the idea being you can take as much time off as you want, as long as no critical business functions are interrupted by your absence. 
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Aug 9, 2018 23:14
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This. Any reasonable management should be able to work around an employee being out for a week or two with some notice. Cynics in our industry hear "unlimited vacation policy" and think "never vacation policy" and here they're right. Sever and shame them on glassdoor.
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Aug 9, 2018 23:55
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"Oh, you're worried about your 'critical business functions'?" *all good devs leave, permanently disrupting critical business functions*
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Aug 10, 2018 00:01
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I've been at this place like 5 years and leaving is starting to sound better and better. The two huge advantages are a 5 minute commute and a very relaxed environment probably 50% of the time. When I first started here, it was relaxed probably 90% of the time and I had a boss that I liked a lot more. Also the dumb vacation stuff was a lot better in the beginning.
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Aug 10, 2018 00:28
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Shirec posted:What’s pair programming called when it’s three people? Crowdsourcing your job Alternately, crowd computing.
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Aug 10, 2018 00:36
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I'm creating a Selenium framework to test a product that makes heavy use of Dojo. I've had to write so many classes to handle dojo widgets that I'm worried I'm making a monster to fight a monster.
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Aug 10, 2018 01:12
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SardonicTyrant posted:I'm creating a Selenium framework to test a product that makes heavy use of Dojo. I've had to write so many classes to handle dojo widgets that I'm worried I'm making a monster to fight a monster. Can't you unit test your JS instead of relying on UI tests? In my experience, trying to do any UI testing more extensive than smoke testing is a recipe for disaster.
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Aug 10, 2018 03:16
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New Yorp New Yorp posted:Can't you unit test your JS instead of relying on UI tests? In my experience, trying to do any UI testing more extensive than smoke testing is a recipe for disaster. I also don't think that's our team's responsibility? I'm fairly certain the development team is supposed to be doing that.
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Aug 10, 2018 04:15
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Clanpot Shake posted:This. Any reasonable management should be able to work around an employee being out for a week or two with some notice. Cynics in our industry hear "unlimited vacation policy" and think "never vacation policy" and here they're right. Sever and shame them on glassdoor.
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Aug 10, 2018 05:12
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Cross posting from BFC but since this is relevant - had a phone interview with a company recently, and their vacation policy is "Unlimited but try to keep it to around 3 weeks." So, three weeks then? Likely scenario is if I take over three weeks I'd start getting not-reprimanded, side-eyed from other employees who toe that line, and dinged on my performance reviews. Sucks because the work sounds good and I feel like I'm spinning my wheels where I am, but I'm not sure I'd be willing to give up the perks (all the same or worse than my current place) or the vacation (essentially two weeks more than this new place). I feel like I'd need boat money. It's not going to be a simple math problem this time =/
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Aug 10, 2018 06:41
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Unlimited vacation has always seemed to be about cooking the books and removing the push to take vacations that a stack of accumulated PTO provides. Especially if there were policies about capping/not allowing rollover. Any halfway decent org or manager will still push you to take vacations, but most orgs aren't decent. But there are is also a significantly uncynical portion of the industry that seems to loving love the idea. When my company switched from 3 declared weeks (+5 sick days) to unlimited people loving clapped. I just gave myself 5 extra float days (on top of the 3 weeks to be reserved for actual vacations plus the sick/mental health days) and track it on a spreadsheet. When I get promoted at end of year I might just decide to give myself an extra week, since I'm worth it. Or start looking for another job if I get passed over.
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Aug 10, 2018 07:05
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SardonicTyrant posted:This framework is a replacement for an older, really bad Selenium framework. Knowing nothing about the application, here is my wisdom: Test things where they need to be tested. If the logic is in the backend, use restassured or something similar to talk to the backend only. If there is a lot of business logic in the frontend, use unit tests there to test the logic first and only write Selenium tests for some integration stuff where you use only the minimum viable input. Thing is, people have a tendency to write huge testsets that test everything, thus ending up with the Testing Icecream Cone, instead of a nice Test Automation Pyramid. Ham Vocke wrote some really good things about this, using Spring Boot as an example: https://martinfowler.com/articles/practical-test-pyramid.html The ebook is a bit dated but contains more code examples: https://www.hamvocke.com/blog/ebook-testing-microservices/ So if you think you are creating a monster, you probably are and if you stop and take a step back, that is probably a good thing.
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Aug 10, 2018 07:33
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Unlimited vacation means that the employer does not have to pay an employee for unused time off if they are laid off or fired, especially in jurisdictions requiring them to pay for unused time off. It's a cost-cutting measure to gently caress over the employees dressed up in Orwellian language. As a bonus you encourage more brown-nosing and groveling toward managers! https://hiring.monster.com/hr/hr-best-practices/workforce-management/employee-benefits-management/unlimited-vacation-policies.aspx quote:Can flexible vacation policies reduce costs? I suspect unlimited vacation is a Uniquely American  phenomenon since the US federally requires a minimum of 0 days of paid holiday or vacation while civilized societies like austria require a minimum of 35 days.
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Aug 10, 2018 08:39
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35? drat, I thought it was great here with 20.
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Aug 10, 2018 08:49
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actually it looks like it's 38 days in austria now lol just for an idea of how insanely hosed the US is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_minimum_annual_leave_by_country
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Aug 10, 2018 08:54
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Keetron posted:35? drat, I thought it was great here with 20. Austria's 38 is including public holidays, note. The EU legal minimum is 20 vacation days, not including public holidays. Most countries have some of those, Austria apparently has 13 paid public holidays and 25 vacation days. There are assorted local practices. Sweden similarly has 25 vacations days, plus 9 public holidays which may in principle be unpaid but are in practice always paid for permanent employees. Hourly contract work is a different thing as usual. It's also common for a lot of places to have "squeeze days" where if a public holiday falls on a Tuesday or Thursday then you get Monday or Friday off, respectively. The US is a huge, weird outlier for this stuff. Afghanistan has stronger labor laws. It can't enforce them worth a drat, but in principle Afghan employees have 20 days of vacation and 15 paid holidays.
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Aug 10, 2018 08:59
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America's strong "the government shouldn't mandate ANYTHING! SMALL GOVERNMENT!" mentality isn't really good for employees, who knew? Thankfully you have well-organized health care and subsidized college education, am I right?
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Aug 10, 2018 09:13
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comedyblissoption posted:actually it looks like it's 38 days in austria now lol Wait...you have none?! Is it not at least one of those, in practise all the states have their own and it works out ok?
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Aug 10, 2018 09:14
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Mega Comrade posted:Wait...you have none?! Is it not at least one of those, in practise all the states have their own and it works out ok? No. In practice you are 100% at the mercy of your employer/~the whims of the free market~. Some states might have laws with minimum vacation time but I don't know of any off-hand.
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Aug 10, 2018 10:35
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Geez: Wikipedia posted:The Netherlands has the second lowest number of public holidays in the world. Ah well, I'll take my nearly free healthcare.
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Aug 10, 2018 11:13
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comedyblissoption posted:I suspect unlimited vacation is a Uniquely American
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Aug 10, 2018 11:48
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I'm pretty sure canada has a minimum of 2 weeks paid vacation, plus about 13 holidays in a year, plus a minimum of 5 sick/personal days Unlimited vacation doesn't gently caress with that either - if I don't take any vacation for the year, I'm getting a 2 week lump sum at the end. Luckily my company is less the "complain if you take more than 2 weeks" and more the "hmm where should I go for my second three-week vacation this year?"
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Aug 10, 2018 12:10
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I was trying to google anything that revealed what the median worker gets in vacation days at an "Unlimited Vacation" workplace. This is the only thing I could find: https://blog.namely.com/blog/what-data-reveals-about-unlimited-vacation quote:We took a look at all of the personal time off request data for 2016, and then segmented those requests by unlimited versus traditional plans. The results reinforced the concerns of unlimited vacation skeptics: employees with unlimited vacation plans take an average of only 13 days off per year, whereas traditional plan employees average 15 days annually. Does any "Unlimited Vacation" workplace even advertise the median amount of vacation time their workers receive?
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Aug 10, 2018 12:16
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Mega Comrade posted:Wait...you have none?! Is it not at least one of those, in practise all the states have their own and it works out ok? http://www.bbc.com/capital/story/20141106-the-no-vacation-nation quote:Though many American companies gift their workers between five and 15 salaried days off per year, a recent study from the US-based Center for Economic and Policy Research found that nearly one in four private-sector workers doesn’t receive any paid vacation time. https://www.cnbc.com/2018/07/05/heres-how-many-paid-vacation-days-the-typical-american-worker-gets-.html quote:Americans used to understand the importance of getting away from the office. From 1976 to 2000, the average working American took off more than 20 days a year. Starting in 2000, workers have been taking fewer days off. In 2015, American worked took an average of just 16 days off.
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Aug 10, 2018 12:23
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If you advertise unlimited vacation I’m taking a minimum of 20 workdays off. In practice, this would probably get me fired, but at least I’d make a stand against the grim specter of capitalism.
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Aug 10, 2018 12:35
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Sagacity posted:America's strong "the government shouldn't mandate ANYTHING! SMALL GOVERNMENT!" mentality isn't really good for employees, who knew? It's not really good for anyone OP
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Aug 10, 2018 13:59
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New Yorp New Yorp posted:Can't you unit test your JS instead of relying on UI tests? In my experience, trying to do any UI testing more extensive than smoke testing is a recipe for disaster. at least one thing i'm liking about the angular cli tooling for .net core is that a) template comes with both the unit testing with karma and the e2e with protractor working right out of the box, and it's pretty easy to swap in 'real' controllers for the production environment. b) conforming with angular means that your developers actually have to make components for the UI anyway, so in principle, you should be able to write the UI tests at the angular component level, and you should be able to just write a test controller for hosting the individual components and write component based tests using protractor. i don't really believe in the external qa-style selenium tests because it feels gross to write tests that have to find your log-in page, click log in, and then manually click a link to test whatever you're writing automated tests - what I like about angular + protractor is that protractor is a wrapper for selenium that understands angular. a) I can use TestHost (https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/aspnet/core/test/integration-tests?view=aspnetcore-2.1) and the integration test framework of .net core to make my own authorization middleware that I use for the purpose of the tests - I can make it so it will just bypass the login page and log in as an arbitrary user if i don't care about testing specific users, or log in as a specific user by, say, providing the username/password in the header and having the authorization middleware create an identity. I like this framework because I might want to test with a real database and real data, but don't necessarily want to log in every single time. b) For pure unit tests, I can unit test angular UI side using karma - with angular cli, it's easy to stub out the api calls because the way it works is if you make an api call, it will be routed to the .net controller if available, if not, the request will be routed to angular, so it's pretty easy to set up fake controllers for the purpose of unit tests. I'm not a super huge fan of the pure unit tests for UI, I'll generally only provide these for documentation. c) Protractor is pretty good - it's built on top of selenium, but it understands angular directives/models so it's usually less code than pure selenium. i'll generally stub out the authentication layer using the testhost, and run the protractor tests against the version of the project hosted by testhost. Navigation is a lot better because angular guides the devs into making everything components, so generally every individual component will either have a url (or it would be easy to make one). The cool thing about angular cli for .net core is that it'll just make a working project with all this protractor stuff - you'll have to add like a testhost project, and the authorization middleware is a one line thing. (I don't actually have a boss or assignments at my job so I've been 'updating my skillset' for like three months now).
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Aug 10, 2018 14:12
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comedyblissoption posted:Unlimited vacation means that the employer does not have to pay an employee for unused time off if they are laid off or fired, especially in jurisdictions requiring them to pay for unused time off. It's a cost-cutting measure to gently caress over the employees dressed up in Orwellian language. As a bonus you encourage more brown-nosing and groveling toward managers! Except when they pair it with a policy of a minimum amount of time off per year and other sanity checks to make sure the policy is actually humane. Uncommon, but not exceptionally so.
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Aug 10, 2018 14:43
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comedyblissoption posted:Unlimited vacation means that the employer does not have to pay an employee for unused time off if they are laid off or fired, especially in jurisdictions requiring them to pay for unused time off. It's a cost-cutting measure to gently caress over the employees dressed up in Orwellian language. As a bonus you encourage more brown-nosing and groveling toward managers! Previously they had allowed stockpiling unused vacation days. So people were just carrying like, 120+ vacation days and never using them, and the company had to keep cash on hand to pay that out. We should have seen the "unlimited" vacation coming, because they kept dropping the limit on how many days you could stockpile, until it became low enough they could afford to pay everyone out and make the transition to "unlimited".
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Aug 10, 2018 16:12
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My company gave me two weeks of vacation to start. I normally would have said no to that offer, but I know my manager and so far have taken over a week worth of “mental days” and nobody seems to care. It also helps that I work from home, so those mental days are “respond if you can on slack if you can.”
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Aug 10, 2018 16:55
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It's been hot lately, so I've been wearing shorts for my bike ride in the morning and changing to pants once I cool off. Today is somebody's last day, so there was a gathering in the conference room. My boss asked if I was coming up and I said sure, but I needed to change into my pants first. Boss got all weird about the shorts, even laughingly asking a coworker what they thought about wearing shorts in the office. My boss then said, "Well, there is a dress code." and I reiterated that I had pants, but I just hadn't changed into them yet. Then I looked in the "Dress Code" section of the employee handbook, which starts, "While the Company does not have a standard dress code…" I so love unwritten rules, especially the ones that conflict with the written rules! I heard again this week that company policy is not to allow employees to take partial days off for either vacation or sick leave. This rule is also not in the handbook and the part about sick leave, I'm pretty sure, actually conflicts with California law. Even better! I don't look forward to the day I try to take two hours of sick time to go to a doctor appointment, which should absolutely be allowed by California law, but will cause a discussion with my boss and probably HR.
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Aug 10, 2018 17:11
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Bongo Bill posted:There are utilities which will overlay keyboard shortcuts pressed onto the screen. Problem solved. Thank you.
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Aug 10, 2018 17:19
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Unlimited vacation can go the opposite direction. I've taken around 15 days already this year and am taking the week after next and 1 (but maybe 2) weeks for the holidays. There's a level of assertiveness that's unfortunately required. No one is going to help you schedule your vacation. You just kinda have to say "I'll be out from X to Y. Talk to Z if you need something while I'm gone."
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Aug 10, 2018 17:33
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How do you get used to office hours being flexible? I got super anxious today because I’ve been getting in at 9 (I’m generally first) and it feels so alien. Hours policy is “whatever as long as your work is getting done”. I stayed until 5:30 last night cause of the worrry
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Aug 10, 2018 18:20
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Blinkz0rz posted:Unlimited vacation can go the opposite direction. I've taken around 15 days already this year and am taking the week after next and 1 (but maybe 2) weeks for the holidays. I wish it worked that way here. Each manager is free to make whatever process they want, and mine requires her approval to be gone.
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Aug 10, 2018 18:27
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I think just growing accustom to what your coworkers are doing helps. My team gets in between 8 and 10:30 and leaves between 4 and who knows I'm not sticking around that late to find out. I come in between 8:30 and 9:30 depending on how hard it is to get out of bed and work until 5ish (as early as 4ish if I'm just not being productive and need to decompress, 6:30 if I'm in the zone and want to get something done). If I'm going to be later than 10 or so I might send an email letting the team know.
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Aug 10, 2018 18:29
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Shirec posted:How do you get used to office hours being flexible? I got super anxious today because I’ve been getting in at 9 (I’m generally first) and it feels so alien. Hours policy is “whatever as long as your work is getting done”. I stayed until 5:30 last night cause of the worrry I saw another developer come in at 0930 and leave at 1500 and tried my hardest to emulate his example.
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Aug 10, 2018 18:30
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Shirec posted:How do you get used to office hours being flexible? I got super anxious today because I’ve been getting in at 9 (I’m generally first) and it feels so alien. Hours policy is “whatever as long as your work is getting done”. I stayed until 5:30 last night cause of the worrry
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Aug 10, 2018 18:31
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