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Alright we are whole again! Now it's time to build a massive line of forts along the entirety of the Pyrenees Mountains to ensure that no one will ever threaten us again.
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Aug 18, 2018 18:17
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Rodyle posted:I want those loving mountains turned into a god drat doom wall that nobody can ever cross again
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Aug 18, 2018 18:19
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Those GP figures might not be terribly accurate since DM, Celtic Union, Morocco and SGU will have all had tons of pops temporarily unemployed due to occupations. Currently the standings for industrial score go Japan - Al-Andalus - Hannover which seems kind of insane? Permanent alliances with Ibriz, Berber Union and Japan sound good. Enough loving around with Europe, everyone there hates us anyway (though I'd be happy for us to eventually feed England to the Celtic Union) The Narbuna Problem needs to be resolved asap. Real shame about Sardinia and Crete still being Moroccan, too. I guess we can deal with that if we ever get into a great war with them. E: Would be nice to know if the other beligerents vs. Morocco managed to make any gains RabidWeasel fucked around with this message at 18:23 on Aug 18, 2018 |
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Aug 18, 2018 18:20
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Yea, if those industry scores are correct, Japan is the USA of this timeline - massive industrial powerbase across the sea from europe.
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Aug 18, 2018 18:23
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oystertoadfish posted:russia is terrifying, they just destroyed germany and reconquered france and britain. that'll be fun in the future I don't think the Berber Union has slavery, but I'm not completely sure. The Celts aren't our allies, we were just briefly united for that crisis. I could probably get a formal alliance without too much of a hassle, though they're about to collapse to reactionaries. The South Germans aren't our friends at all. Ibriz has been conquering land in the new world, even forcing the Dual Monarchy to send a couple big armies over there, but I didn't include it because the update was already massive. Yvonmukluk posted:Did we seriously get that random 'no alliance for you!' event fire for a third time, or was it something else? Nope it wasn't that event. The SGU suffered a liberal revolution because of the war occupation (they're still a monarchy though), and that reset all their relations. I can look into getting an alliance with Japan though.
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Aug 18, 2018 18:23
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does the berber union still do slavery?
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Man, Russia is POWERFUL and Al Andalus is very isolated. I hope the SGU can recover. The Celtic Union has always been a bit of a pushover, Maybe you can pull off real-world Spain's trick and just sit out the World Wars. Check out that breakaway state off of Vakhtani, and also Japan has Shanghaied Shanghai.
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Aug 18, 2018 18:23
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RabidWeasel posted:Those GP figures might not be terribly accurate since DM, Celtic Union, Morocco and SGU will have all had tons of pops temporarily unemployed due to occupations. Currently the standings for industrial score go Japan - Al-Andalus - Hannover which seems kind of insane? Yep, the DM, SGU and CU were all fully occupied for long parts of the war, so it'll take a little while before the GP rankings recover and stabilise. And I'll post what happened in the other wars in the next update, hopefully. hashashash fucked around with this message at 18:29 on Aug 18, 2018 |
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Aug 18, 2018 18:25
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Yeah Ibriz and Japan seem our key ally targets now that we've gotten to our Turtle Up stage. Japan's ability to force Russia to actually march all those troops around in particular seems key. Anyway, now for the game-long move to the left.
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Aug 18, 2018 18:46
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A time for war A time for peace
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Aug 18, 2018 18:50
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Hashim posted:
 This is the best outcome. We have had the worst luck with allies, and I am actually glad to see the Celts get screwed over. I still haven't forgiven them for not honoring our alliance way back in EU4. And as loyal as the Germans have been in this conflict, a unified Germany could be even more dangerous than the Duel Monarchy. We're diplomatically isolated, but we also have relatively weak neighbors. The only real threat is a continent away. Thordain posted:Japan looks like the best power to buddy up with now, given that they border Russia and Morocco and seem to have a higher military and industry score than anyone. Except according to the world map, they lost territory to Guang somehow? I'm really confused how that happened. I'm still in favor of allying with Japan, but seriously, what the hell? Snipee fucked around with this message at 18:58 on Aug 18, 2018 |
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Aug 18, 2018 18:56
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Trying to peel off Russia might be a good idea too, since they were only in the war to stomp on the SGU, and if you don't choose to rebuild the relations with the SGU from scratch, might as well go with the next choice. It seems foolish to try to go into the future without a big European ally, and the Celtic Union is a chump. Of course, frantically trying to build international alliances was part of the moderate platform. Turtling, avoiding overextension, so you can spend all your time trying to improve living standards was the socialist platform. The thread chose the Imperialists, who are all about extending ever onward and clashing with other colonial powers. If Al Andalus doesn't scramble to secure its global position, it may have just set itself up for another big fall.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:09
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Snipee posted:Except according to the world map, they lost territory to Guang somehow? I'm really confused how that happened. I'm still in favor of allying with Japan, but seriously, what the hell? Not gonna lie, I'm also confused as to what happened. I might've missed something, but iirc Guang fought two big wars in the past couple updates: they fought Japan to a status quo, and they defeated Wu in a war. I've got no clue what happened with Beijing though, unless rebels went nuts or there's some event that I forgot to strip out.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:13
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As long as the Socialists recognize that the borders they have to defend are about 90% coastline and a navy that can prevent invasions counts as critical "defensive military technology", then also builds the Maginot in the Pyrenees we could 100% turtle up and march ever leftward for the rest of the game, regardless of what international politics shakes out as.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:14
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We should make friends with the Russians  who nearly won the war of its useless allies. They also were the only ones to try to give us Iberia decades ago.
Jack2142 fucked around with this message at 19:19 on Aug 18, 2018 |
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Aug 18, 2018 19:16
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Honestly, without the Germans in our bloc, do we really need to worry about the Russians? e: what Jack said
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Aug 18, 2018 19:16
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poo poo befriending Russia just might work, actually, we don't really have competing interests now that Germany's out of the picture.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:20
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Hashim posted:Not gonna lie, I'm also confused as to what happened. I might've missed something, but iirc Guang fought two big wars in the past couple updates: they fought Japan to a status quo, and they defeated Wu in a war. I've got no clue what happened with Beijing though, unless rebels went nuts or there's some event that I forgot to strip out. That's extremely impressive. I was under the impression that uncivilized nations didn't stand a chance against civilized nations this late into the game. e: Read too fast and missed the comment about including the other wars in the next update. Snipee fucked around with this message at 19:34 on Aug 18, 2018 |
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Aug 18, 2018 19:21
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oh also, not nitpicking, just curious about the in-game peace treaty:Hashim posted:The Almoravid Sultan would not suffer another sacking, however, and immediately surrendered in return for amnesty. He dispatched diplomats to a meeting with the Andalusi at the neutral city of Narbuna, where he finally agreed to relinquish Qartayannat, the initial wargoal. Five years of war had seen Andalusi demands skyrocket, however, and the Sultan was further forced to pay reparations, surrender Malta to Palermo, and cede a small stretch of land in east Africa to the Andalusi. does kilwa+malta cost less war score or whatever to get than tangier/ceuta, or did you consciously not to take land on the other side of the strait? how did the treaty negotiations go in terms of in-game mechanics as the war progressed? and then you glued the slavery policy change on via event? (also is 'moroccan sicily' one of those weird Victoria-isms where malta is part of the same state as sicily or something?)
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Aug 18, 2018 19:25
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The Imperialists were very explicitly not interested in trying to take Moroccan core land across the straits but WERE into taking colonies, so that's what they did. Also, yeah, colonies are usually an order of magnitude cheaper to take than full core states.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:27
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Also much cheaper in terms of infamy. A full state is what, 12 or so? While colonies are cheaper and cores are free.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:29
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Snipee posted:That's extremely impressive. I was under the impression that uncivilized nations didn't stand a chance against civilized nations this late into the game. Uncivilised nations never really beat civilised nations, but I just checked, and looks like Guang fully modernised sometime in the past decade. And yeah, I think they both were. oystertoadfish posted:oh also, not nitpicking, just curious about the in-game peace treaty: I posted the war goals that each party would shoot for in the previous summary/mini-sotw, and the Imperialists would expressly go for colonies over the straits. Only the royalists would demand Tangier/ceuta, since it's mostly a pride thing for them. But seizing colonies also costs less infamy than core states, so it was cheaper too, and I was brushing pretty close to the infamy limit anyways. Basically the way things went down was: -seizing Qartayannat was the primary wargoal -I immediately added Marriya, because we have a core there and it's infamy free -A few months later, I added Moroccan Sicily (which is just Malta, yeah) because it was also free, since we got that CB via random event in the last update. -I added the Kilwan colony when the war in Africa finally turned around in favour of us. -I wrote an event where us capturing Marrakesh (again) would allow us to force the Berbers to abolish slavery.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:33
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Hashim posted:Uncivilised nations never really beat civilised nations, but I just checked, and looks like Guang fully modernised sometime in the past decade.  I take back what I previously said about allying Japan. I vote for buddying up with Guang and Russia.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:40
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so warscore, infamy and the explicit goals that were laid out in the last choice which i should've remembered. thanks for the answers we might have a tough time looking for allies but i guess germany and italy are still non-unified so maybe europe will bother each other over that and we can be friends with whoever isn't friends with frangland if we could take more of bengal without annoying anyone important who isn't on a truce timer, that might be a good use of time in the near term
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Aug 18, 2018 19:43
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I'm thinking voting Socialists is incredibly important, if for no other reason than they will never ATTACK into mountains, just dig into them while researching all the fort/dig in bonus techs we've overlooked. We've got a drat fine state, a drat fine navy, and drat fine borders now. Let's grab all the high-end manufacturing techs and become a shining city on a hill. gently caress whatever all the other Euro powers want, we're no longer interested in their petty self destructive squabbles. Also knocking Morroco out of GPhood is incredibly satisfying.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:48
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Socialists might also be able to get some public education or healthcare going, which would be very nice. That being said, I'm very glad we went with the Imperialists this time around. Control of the Peninsula! Multiple naval victories! Truly, we have said gently caress Morocco on this day.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:50
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ThatBasqueGuy posted:I'm thinking voting Socialists is incredibly important, if for no other reason than they will never ATTACK into mountains, just dig into them while researching all the fort/dig in bonus techs we've overlooked. We've got a drat fine state, a drat fine navy, and drat fine borders now. Let's grab all the high-end manufacturing techs and become a shining city on a hill. gently caress whatever all the other Euro powers want, we're no longer interested in their petty self destructive squabbles. Seconded. My only real concern with going full Socialist at this point is making sure we that we get some political reforms going too.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:51
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tbh our greatest threat right now is the DM/Moroccan alliance. Ibriz and Japan will not do much good when war breaks out in Europe.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:52
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Watch Morocco fall to communists because we obliterated their military and jacked up their militancy.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:52
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Crazycryodude posted:As long as the Socialists recognize that the borders they have to defend are about 90% coastline and a navy that can prevent invasions counts as critical "defensive military technology", then also builds the Maginot in the Pyrenees we could 100% turtle up and march ever leftward for the rest of the game, regardless of what international politics shakes out as. Socialists will defend their borders, but they're not gonna spend vast sums of money expanding and modernising the navy, not when there are factories that need opening and railways that need constructing. They'll probably build a few fortresses too, though not as much as the Moderates would. The international scene is where the Socialists and Moderates are a bit more distinguishable, apart from their attitudes towards social/political reform. Moderates would be focused on building a powerful alliance network that stretches across Europe as a way of preventing continent-wide wars, whilst the Socialists would try and achieve the same by avoiding permanent allies altogether and opting for a more isolationist stance.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:52
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Dance Officer posted:tbh our greatest threat right now is the DM/Moroccan alliance. Ibriz and Japan will not do much good when war breaks out in Europe. Not even. Doesn't matter how many troops the DM has, a late game army dug into the mountains will basically never be pushed back when player lead. Same for the straits if we keep up with the naval race at all.
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Aug 18, 2018 19:53
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Yeah, gently caress the continental great powers. We can hide from them behind our mountains and navy. Dragging SGU, DM, CU etc into a war with us would just end up getting them overrun anyways. We would be expected to do all the work and be blamed by them if we couldn't win the war all on our own. We should get allies in Japan, Benin and Gharbia. Far enough away to not worry about invasion but strong enough to matter
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Aug 18, 2018 19:54
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Obviously the best way to ensure peace in Europe is to have two powers on each end of the continent at each other's side to prevent the small states like Hannover, the DM, etc. from getting up to trouble. Al-Andalus and Russia, a match made in heaven. Add in alliances with Japan, Benin, and Ibriz, and we'll have global reach! I'm for whatever gets us the most rapid political liberalization at this point. IIRC our population would be supportive of it, liberals and socialists have like 45-50% of the UPPER House much less the overall population. It's time to create multiple gleaming cities on the hill. And lastly, Morocco is not only no longer an evil slave state but not even a Great Power. gently caress Morocco today, gently caress Morocco tomorrow, and gently caress Morocco forevermore. Can we sphere them to ensure that they never trouble anyone ever again?
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Aug 18, 2018 19:56
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Oh hey, I just realized that Provence became a republic. When did that happen?
Ikasuhito fucked around with this message at 20:01 on Aug 18, 2018 |
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Aug 18, 2018 19:57
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Morocco's no longer a gp you say? *extremely mortal Kombat voice* SPHERE THEM
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Aug 18, 2018 20:02
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Oh my god I completely missed that Morocco's not a GP anymore, if that actually sticks holy poo poo it is gonna be SO delicious to sphere the gently caress out of them forever.
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Aug 18, 2018 20:03
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Agean90 posted:Morocco's no longer a gp you say? *extremely mortal Kombat voice* SPHERE THEM Also yea'ing any strategy that lets us turtle without being diplomatic shut-ins. We finally have our rightful land and people, who gives a poo poo about the rest of tired old Europe, but let's look overseas for allies and friends. Anything to keep our clay from suffering the footfall of foreign boots again!
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Aug 18, 2018 20:17
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See the problem is, you can't turtle up when you're sprawled over half a continent with more crazy exclaves butting up against potentially hostile territory. If you're going to sink your resources into these far-flung territories, you need to be able to fight for them, or else risk losing them altogether and losing all that investment. Some very mutually exclusive schools of thought cropping up in this thread.
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Aug 18, 2018 20:17
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One step closer to Morocco's true destiny As our client 
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Aug 18, 2018 20:17
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Hashim posted:Socialists will defend their borders, but they're not gonna spend vast sums of money expanding and modernising the navy, not when there are factories that need opening and railways that need constructing. They'll probably build a few fortresses too, though not as much as the Moderates would. thank you for this delicious poison pill so voting socialist isn't a complete no brainer
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Aug 18, 2018 20:22
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They don't need to expand the navy but could they at least rebuild the ships we lost? That would be enough to tide us over until Dreadnoughts become available.
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Aug 18, 2018 20:25
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