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Broken Cog posted:Kinda related, but is there any explanation of how the knight ended up on the surface for the beginning of the game? I think this is the most important lore question in the game! Where has the Knight been? For how long? I think I asked this earlier in the thread and we might have even had a conversation about it, but is the Void Heart scene where you climb up out of the Abyss and then fall back down supposed to be a vision? Or a flashback? As in something that actually happened? It opens up a whole lot of questions: did the King keep making vessels after the Hollow Knight? When did he and the whole White Palace disappear? What is the timeline!?
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Aug 22, 2018 20:44
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SirSamVimes posted:I have never understood people who are against contact damage, to be honest. The game would be way way too easy without it. I can accept contact damage with suspension of disbelief but sometimes when I think about game logic too much I start to wonder why is the enemy so toxic you take damage just by touching them but they do not by touching you. Maybe there could be a game where you can double KO by ramming into opponents.
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Aug 22, 2018 20:48
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The only time I lost Geo across two playthroughs was trying to do that nasty thorn challenge area in Greenpath. Only happened the once. I already had the lantern so it wasn't that big a deal. In general I walk on eggshells if I die until I get my shade back and I think some people just blast back on through like they haven't got a care in the world.So It Goes posted:This is what confuses me. Castlevania and Metroid have contact damage. Mario has contact damage. Mega Man has contact damage. Do the people who talk about contact damage also not want it in basically every 2d game that exists? Or is it only hollow knight where they feel it shouldn’t exist, and if so why? This is going to sound very cold and mean but I think some of it is literally just there are a lot of people who are absolute dogshit at video games but want it to be someone else's fault when they die. I talked to one guy who spent half an hour getting the item on the right side of Queen's Station. It's like 3 jumps and there's a bench in the room next to it. I cannot fathom a world in which it takes half an hour to complete that sequence. The same guy complained about contact damage, but also professed a love of Castlevania, a game with contact damage. One thing the dev I mentioned earlier pointed out is that people are very bad at expressing themselves and that may be how he's interpreting the different problem that he's actually having, like getting hit in a way that he gets knocked back into environmental hazards. I can only really think of one place where that might be a consistent issue for a player with functioning gross motor control and that's the area with the flipping platforms and the flying bugs whose stingers sprout crystal when they shoot, that one definitely frustrated me a bit.
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Aug 22, 2018 20:54
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TeaJay posted:I can accept contact damage with suspension of disbelief but sometimes when I think about game logic too much I start to wonder why is the enemy so toxic you take damage just by touching them but they do not by touching you. Referring back to an earlier post I made, do you feel this way about all 2d games like castlevania, Metroid, Mario, donkey Kong, rayman, mega man etc? Or is it just hollow knight? For some reason I’ve only ever heard this point for hollow knight and I don’t really get what the difference is.
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Aug 22, 2018 21:00
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I don't even think that enemies hurting you on contact is necessarily a bad idea from a design standpoint, it's more that it kind of breaks immersion I guess, just an instant reminder I'm playing a videogame.
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Aug 22, 2018 21:01
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Do you constantly forget you are playing a video game?
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Aug 22, 2018 21:04
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I'm sure you can make a perfectly fine game without contact damage, but then the enemies would need to be much more dangerous in other ways. Getting upset over it in a game like hollow knight is like getting upset that the enemies have guns in an FPS.
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Aug 22, 2018 21:14
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RCarr posted:Do you constantly forget you are playing a video game? If it's a good one, yes. That's kind of what immersion means.
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Aug 22, 2018 21:17
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RCarr posted:Do you constantly forget you are playing a video game? I constantly dissociate and see myself above the shoulder from about ten feet back and pick up orbs
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Aug 22, 2018 21:22
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OzFactor posted:I think this is the most important lore question in the game! Where has the Knight been? For how long? I think I asked this earlier in the thread and we might have even had a conversation about it, but is the Void Heart scene where you climb up out of the Abyss and then fall back down supposed to be a vision? Or a flashback? As in something that actually happened? If I recall Hornet has a line about The Knight coming from two voids or something like that, so the Knight was clearly outside of The Kingdom before the game starts. Spoilers I guess Timeline: Radiance rules the Kingdom ---> A Wyrm becomes the White King and gives the bugs "consciousness." ---> The Radiance who has been forgotten seeps into different memories, corrupting various bugs / creatures and kick starts "the infection." ----> White Wyrm King becomes desperate to control / contain The Radiance, begins mass producing Hollow Knights until his "favorite" turns out to be the appropriate one, at some point Hollow Son / Daughter takes on the infection, the Dreamers seal him in and the King in despair over Hollow Son / Daughter returns to The White Palace to die / disappear. Years and years later, the Kingdom is in ruin and Hollow Son / Daughter is too attached to the White King, forming some kind of cracks which allows The Radiance to leak out. Out of necessity / cosmic balance / whatever, The Void either creates or reactivates our Knight to come to the Kingdom and the game happens.
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Aug 22, 2018 21:25
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It’s basically accepted by the community at this point the question of why the knight is outside at the start is the biggest mystery in the game that doesn’t have anything even hinting at an explanation in game (along with weavers den in general). I know it got asked in an ama and IIRC the response was something akin to a hmm which made it sound like it might get explored in the hornet dlc. IMO the knight probably just randomly wandered out somehow and then got lured back when the egg cracked and the hollow knight made a call to its siblings or something for help. Or the king made a call with his dying breath maybe. Thinking about it, it’s not entirely clear why the king is dead exactly.
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Aug 22, 2018 21:36
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So It Goes posted:It’s basically accepted by the community at this point the question of why the knight is outside at the start is the biggest mystery in the game that doesn’t have anything even hinting at an explanation in game (along with weavers den in general). I know it got asked in an ama and IIRC the response was something akin to a hmm which made it sound like it might get explored in the hornet dlc.
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Aug 22, 2018 21:44
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Well that just leads to a follow up question of where the king went then, and why. It almost leads to speculation that the main character is the king himself who somehow reincarnated into a vessel. It’s kinda a neat idea but has literally no support for it, which I’m not a big fan of when theorizing lore.
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Aug 22, 2018 21:48
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The simplest explanation might be the knight knows it was rejected - it wasn't chosen by the King to be a Hollow Knight, so it has no purpose, and may as well wander the world. And then was somehow called back by the infection beginning to leak as people have said.
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Aug 22, 2018 21:48
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On this topic, can the King technically die? It's a Wyrm, so it may have just reincarnated just as its previous "corpse" is outside the kingdom
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Aug 22, 2018 22:10
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^burtle posted:If I recall Hornet has a line about The Knight coming from two voids or something like that, so the Knight was clearly outside of The Kingdom before the game starts. quote:Again we meet little ghost. She seems to imply that there's some benefit or power in the Knight's absence from the Kingdom. Maybe the Knight avoids any sort of corruption resulting from the Hollow Knight's weakening state because the Knight is out of the country. So in that case, the Void Heart scene is an actual flashback and our Knight was created either before or at the same time as the Hollow Knight and left Hallownest before the Hollow Knight was sealed. The other timeline question: I had always assumed the Hollow Knight tried to contain the infection, then started to fail, and then the King reached out to the Dreamers for their help in sealing it away. But I suppose he could have had it sealed away before it started to fail. I guess I'm not sure that really matters though.
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Aug 22, 2018 22:14
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Anybody else see what looks like the king in the background of a bench screen in queen's garden? It's sorta by the love key. Will try to screen shot it when i get home.
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Aug 22, 2018 22:36
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Noticed that just last night
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Aug 22, 2018 22:46
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Cicadalek posted:If it's a good one, yes. That's kind of what immersion means. 2D platformers aren't particularly conducive to immersion, imo.
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Aug 22, 2018 23:15
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So It Goes posted:This is what confuses me. Castlevania and Metroid have contact damage. Mario has contact damage. Mega Man has contact damage. Do the people who talk about contact damage also not want it in basically every 2d game that exists? Or is it only hollow knight where they feel it shouldn’t exist, and if so why? I mean, I don't have a problem with contact damage but in Metroid you can take a lot more hits than in Hollow Knight.
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Aug 22, 2018 23:21
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Cicadalek posted:One other tiny thing that bothered me: not really sure why the geo magnet charm and the charm that shows your position on the map were charms at all, rather than just passive traits. They felt kind of mandatory for exploring so it was basically like a notch tax unless you wanted to get lost and lose geo. Think of the compass charm as more like a reward for players who get a handle on the maps, rather than a penalty for relying on it. I feel like the compass would bother people less if it started as a built-in feature, with an NPC that offered to turn it off for an extra charm slot, or maybe to turn it into the charm we have now. Functionally identical, but it would read more clearly as a reward.
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Aug 22, 2018 23:45
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Archenteron posted:Counterpoint: the Void Heart also lets you function as the perfect vessel That's not a confirmed fact at all.
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Aug 22, 2018 23:51
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anachron posted:Anybody else see what looks like the king in the background of a bench screen in queen's garden? It's sorta by the love key. Will try to screen shot it when i get home. That's a statue, they're all over the place in Queen's Garden.
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Aug 23, 2018 00:59
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Brandfarlig posted:I mean, I don't have a problem with contact damage but in Metroid you can take a lot more hits than in Hollow Knight. So the reason people bring it up for hollow knight but not other games is because of health pools? That doesn't really explain why I literally never see it brought up for, say, Mario or Donkey Kong or Rayman games but everyone who talks about it appears to be avoiding my question at this point (i.e. not why they have a problem with contact damage but why it's a problem in Hollow Knight and not the other games I listed, unless they believe it is also a problem for those games I guess).
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Aug 23, 2018 01:22
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fractalairduct posted:That's a statue, they're all over the place in Queen's Garden. Nah, there's only one of these https://imgur.com/a/J331FqO
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Aug 23, 2018 01:22
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anachron posted:Nah, there's only one of these We see the king though, he's not nearly that big.
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Aug 23, 2018 01:30
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ItBreathes posted:We see the king though, he's not nearly that big. Or, in a different sense, he's much bigger than that. Could it be the Queen, instead?
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Aug 23, 2018 03:09
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shirts and skins posted:Or, in a different sense, he's much bigger than that. Could it be the Queen, instead? it's literally a giant version of the king's idols, isn't it?
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Aug 23, 2018 03:38
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That Greenpath chunk all the way to the left where you have to super dash and hit the armored flying things while dodging spikes is a loving crime against humanity, especially when they leave your stupid corpse all the way at the end of it in case you wanted to get your money back.... There better be a check for a million bucks at the end of that level, handed to me in person by an employee of Team Cherry DreadCthulhu fucked around with this message at 06:14 on Aug 23, 2018 |
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Aug 23, 2018 04:43
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shirts and skins posted:Or, in a different sense, he's much bigger than that. Could it be the Queen, instead? You meet the queen, she's the glowing tree thing.
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Aug 23, 2018 04:52
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So what's in the new DLC?
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Aug 23, 2018 12:55
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ItBreathes posted:You meet the queen, she's the glowing tree thing. Ohhh. Yeah that makes sense. RCarr posted:So what's in the new DLC? Doesn't it come out today? When is it supposed to drop?
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Aug 23, 2018 13:40
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PC version in maybe a few hours? No idea when Switch patches usually come out
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Aug 23, 2018 13:58
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standard steam title drop time is 1pm EST, though it could be different since the devs are australia based.
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Aug 23, 2018 14:04
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The Hollow Knight Discord is usually really on the ball with these announcements. Rest assured I'm gonna have an eye on this (well, I'll see the "1" notification in Discord anyway), and I'll try to post if no one hasn't when it drops. So you can all play it in my stead - I've got work, sadly, then going right from there to a movie.
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Aug 23, 2018 14:19
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10am PST
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Aug 23, 2018 14:20
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Here is a countdown for people who find time zones confusing, like me.
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Aug 23, 2018 14:38
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if it makes you feel better i literally just said 1pm est and still had to double check with google to make sure that lined up with 10am pst
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Aug 23, 2018 14:51
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Cowcaster posted:if it makes you feel better i literally just said 1pm est and still had to double check with google to make sure that lined up with 10am pst Same, my brain got extra confused because I'm usually CST but today I'm in EST. I know there's no functional difference but it's still made me go "an additional hour? ughhh"
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Aug 23, 2018 14:54
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For those who really wanna know spoilers, a link was in discord of a txt file with them. https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/283680756159741953/481938469514641409/Godhome.txt It’s probably not complete since its just one persons notes.
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Aug 23, 2018 15:07
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