THAT... is the Hitman Megathread

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Kernel Monsoon: Jul 18, 2006

Lobok posted:

That rules.

It does, I tried it and it works great. You can even complete the mission a good 10+ seconds quicker than in the video by taking out De Santis before Silvio Caruso.

# ? Aug 28, 2018 14:13

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# ? May 24, 2024 20:36

double nine: Aug 8, 2013

that video does demonstrate my two problems with hitman:

- lawnmowers are far too finnicky in where to shoot in order to have them leak oil
- if a target/npcs are aware they're being fired on, the accident they get into 5 seconds later shouldn't count as an accident?

# ? Aug 28, 2018 14:19

Jerusalem: May 20, 2004; Would you be my new best friends?

StashAugustine posted:

Accident and poison kills are (outside of some bugs and edge cases) ok to be found. Also Hokkaido is weid in that Soders doesn't count as a body so you can c4 him and no one cares

Doctor: Don't be upset nurse, these things sometimes happen on the operating table :shrug:

# ? Aug 28, 2018 14:21

elf help book: Aug 5, 2004; Though the battle might be endless, I will never give up

Police in Hitman's world have the ability to scan victim's brains to know the last thing's they saw before dying, but they also are too dumb to look in hampers.

# ? Aug 28, 2018 14:22

The Kins: Oct 2, 2004

elf help book posted:

Police in Hitman's world have the ability to scan victim's brains to know the last thing's they saw before dying, but they also are too dumb to look in hampers.

Well, I mean, clearly they're dealing with a professional serial killer with a genius-level IQ. Only a complete and total idiot would hide in a cupboard, so clearly he can't be there. :v:

# ? Aug 28, 2018 14:29

double nine: Aug 8, 2013

it's a godsend that there is no decay or sense of smell in the hitman world.

# ? Aug 28, 2018 14:35

StashAugustine: Mar 24, 2013; Do not trust in hope- it will betray you! Only faith and hatred sustain.

One day hitman will accurately model bathroom etiquette and then were all hosed

# ? Aug 28, 2018 14:44

double nine: Aug 8, 2013

we'll always have the coin though.

# ? Aug 28, 2018 14:52

DLC Inc: Jun 1, 2011

StashAugustine posted:

One day hitman will accurately model bathroom etiquette and then were all hosed

I feel like "barging in to occupied bathrooms" is a staple of the series akin to how Deus Ex made air ducts/vents the most convenient and obvious point of entry virtually anywhere.

double nine posted:

we'll always have the coin though.

I've gotten shot to death just by dropping a coin in this game so I agree, the rear end in a top hat nature of dropping a simple coin cannot be overstated or removed from the Hitman experience

# ? Aug 28, 2018 15:15

Funky Valentine: Feb 26, 2014; Dojyaa~an

"I need to use the bathroom."

"Well can you wait?"

*47's entire world collapses*

# ? Aug 28, 2018 15:23

Nakar: Sep 2, 2002; Ultima Ratio Regum

Unlucky7 posted:

Can�t believed I am questioning this now that I am just about to start Hokkaido, but what defines �No bodies�? Non target bodies are definitely not allowed to be found, but targets seem a bit wobbly. Do they not count if they are accident or unnoticed kills?

A body is found when an NPC observes any of the following:

An unhidden corpse, unless that corpse died from poison or an accident. How they know this is unclear, but the score system knows. They don't have to witness the death, they just have to stumble upon the body.
An unconscious person, unless that person was knocked out by a sedative, but the instant they reach the body to wake it up it suddenly counts as a body found again.

People are not corpses/unconscious while they are awake and alive. This sounds like a stupid and obvious point but it actually matters for determining whether a body is found. Dumping an unconscious person over a railing might cause either you to be spotted dumping them or the body itself to be seen by someone before it dies from the fall accident, destroying your score. Pushing a conscious person over a railing will never cause a body found, because the NPC is alive right up until they die, and the instant they die they're an accident kill corpse and can't count for bodies found. Always push living people if you can get away with it, it's easier to lure them and harder to get caught.

The sedative thing is borderline useless but you can kind of use a sedated body as a lure as long as nobody physically reaches the body before you kill them or knock them out as well. Why this only applies to sedatives I do not know. If the sedative syringe returns in HITMAN 2 and is an actual unlock (and this score quirk remains in place) this might be more valuable as you could knock a person out such that they'll be seen by a person who has to path a very long way to get to them, giving you a chance to lay a trap for them before they reach the corpse. Imagine for instance sedating a body on the patio area outside the Sapienza apartment and letting somebody see it, causing them to path around and up into the apartment where you then explode them with a proximity duck inside 47's apartment. Unlikely to ever be useful, but marginally moreso than the food-and-drink-only sedative vial that the first game has to work with.

"Unhidden corpse" also matters, as once a corpse has been dumped or stashed unseen NPCs will no longer react to it, provided you don't attempt to drag the body again. Normally you'd never have the opportunity to do this as the body disappears, but some spots on some maps offer the opportunity to dump a body and then physics it elsewhere with the Striker or Ghost, whereupon NPCs will utterly ignore it provided you don't touch it directly.

# ? Aug 28, 2018 23:31

Matinee: Sep 15, 2007

Nakar posted:

Nakar's always awesome insights

I'd love to see IOI publish an official flowchart of all the AI logic workflows, but your posts are a fantastic substitute.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 00:04

Dabir: Nov 10, 2012

So you can knock someone out with a sedative and dump them over a railing and that's still silent assassin even if they were seen on the way down?

# ? Aug 29, 2018 00:56

Unlucky7: Jul 11, 2006; Fallen Rib

And that is Hokaido down and Season 1 done. Now to polish it off and do all the bonus campaigns/missions, or at least as much as I can do before I get my hands of Dragon Quest XI.

There isn't any post credit stinger, is there? The game bugged out loading the final campaign cutscene and I skipped the credits so I can reload it.

Final Cutscene Spoilers:

Writer 1: Wait, why is little 47 bald? Not like childhood baldness is a thing.
Writer 2: Uh then how else would we know it is 47 as a kid?
Writer 1: �but
Writer 2: STUPID :smug:

Got to say I was hoping the ending would have 47 and the Shadow Client finally meeting and becoming assassin bros.

I do love that most confrontations can be defused by briskly walking away from the guy getting in your face.

Unlucky7 fucked around with this message at 08:00 on Aug 29, 2018

# ? Aug 29, 2018 07:54

Gaius Marius: Oct 9, 2012

Have you played the other games? 47 has always been a clone.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 11:41

Lollerich: Mar 25, 2004; The little doctors are back,
they want to play with you!

Dabir posted:

So you can knock someone out with a sedative and dump them over a railing and that's still silent assassin even if they were seen on the way down?

There is only one sedative syringe in the game. Some random guy near the beach area in Sapienza carries one. But to answer your question, yes.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 11:47

Matinee: Sep 15, 2007

I wonder if they're going to iron out that quirk for 2 because of the (presumably sedative) dart gun.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 11:57

Drunken Baker: Feb 3, 2015; VODKA STYLE DRINK

Gaius Marius posted:

Have you played the other games? 47 has always been a clone.

Side-note, but what the hell was going on with that second Hitman film? 47, now a scallywag with a shaved, stubbled skinhead ends up on a roof when another clone, 48 appears... But 48 (played by the same actor) has a proper, (though probably prosthetic) bald head?

God knows I'm not going to get the DVD and check the interviews, but does anyone know what that was all about? Like why didn't 47 have a proper bald head throughout the entire film? Were they going for some thematic stinger at the end? I have no drat idea.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 13:28

StashAugustine: Mar 24, 2013; Do not trust in hope- it will betray you! Only faith and hatred sustain.

The hitman movies are bad op

# ? Aug 29, 2018 13:49

dogstile: May 1, 2012; fucking clocks
how do they work?

You don't watch videogame movies expecting them to be good

# ? Aug 29, 2018 14:13

Fuego Fish: Dec 5, 2004; By tooth and claw!

The best Hitman movie is John Wick 2.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 14:34

RBA Starblade: Apr 28, 2008; Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

My favorite kills are just pushing people into the water from Sapienza's pier on the way to the boat. I crack up every time.

StashAugustine posted:

The hitman movies are bad op

Shitman

# ? Aug 29, 2018 14:34

Dabir: Nov 10, 2012

Lollerich posted:

There is only one sedative syringe in the game. Some random guy near the beach area in Sapienza carries one. But to answer your question, yes.

There's situations where you wouldn't need a syringe. The headmaster in Marrakesh, say, you can dope his pipe and then chuck him over the edge of the roof. Or you could probably engineer a contract where one of the guards in the Paris attic who drinks from a water bottle has to be killed by a fall.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 16:53

Digital Jedi: May 28, 2007; Fallen Rib

StashAugustine posted:

The hitman movies are bad op

I think the first one wasn't all that bad. I liked Timothy Olyphant as 47. They tied it to the game as decently.

The 2nd one was atrocious garbage.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 17:13

Mantis42: Jul 26, 2010

The rule of thumb is "Does this Hitman property have Agent Smith in it? If so, it is good/canon/etc"

Absolution and the movies do not have Agent Smith. They are not real Hitmen.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 17:31

Lollerich: Mar 25, 2004; The little doctors are back,
they want to play with you!

Dabir posted:

There's situations where you wouldn't need a syringe. The headmaster in Marrakesh, say, you can dope his pipe and then chuck him over the edge of the roof. Or you could probably engineer a contract where one of the guards in the Paris attic who drinks from a water bottle has to be killed by a fall.

You know you can just knock someone out by using physical force though, right?

# ? Aug 29, 2018 20:49

Unlucky7: Jul 11, 2006; Fallen Rib

The ending of Hitman 2016:

https://twitter.com/dril/status/134787490526658561

# ? Aug 29, 2018 21:32

StashAugustine: Mar 24, 2013; Do not trust in hope- it will betray you! Only faith and hatred sustain.

Lollerich posted:

You know you can just knock someone out by using physical force though, right?

If the fall is witnessed it'll count as a body found

# ? Aug 29, 2018 21:49

Dabir: Nov 10, 2012

Lollerich posted:

You know you can just knock someone out by using physical force though, right?

yeah you can also just savescum through levels on normal doing suit only silent assassin and only killing people with the fiber wire, doesn't mean you should

# ? Aug 29, 2018 21:58

Lollerich: Mar 25, 2004; The little doctors are back,
they want to play with you!

Dabir posted:

yeah you can also just savescum through levels on normal doing suit only silent assassin and only killing people with the fiber wire, doesn't mean you should

What are you even talking about?

# ? Aug 29, 2018 22:57

Lollerich: Mar 25, 2004; The little doctors are back,
they want to play with you!

StashAugustine posted:

If the fall is witnessed it'll count as a body found

How is this different from constructing an elaborate way in which your target drinks the sleeping poison and then dropping them from a balcony like he's suggesting?

# ? Aug 29, 2018 22:59

Dabir: Nov 10, 2012

The whole point is that sedated bodies don't count as bodies.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 23:02

StashAugustine: Mar 24, 2013; Do not trust in hope- it will betray you! Only faith and hatred sustain.

Lollerich posted:

How is this different from constructing an elaborate way in which your target drinks the sleeping poison and then dropping them from a balcony like he's suggesting?

Nakar posted:

A body is found when an NPC observes any of the following:

An unhidden corpse, unless that corpse died from poison or an accident. How they know this is unclear, but the score system knows. They don't have to witness the death, they just have to stumble upon the body.

An unconscious person, unless that person was knocked out by a sedative, but the instant they reach the body to wake it up it suddenly counts as a body found again.
People are not corpses/unconscious while they are awake and alive. This sounds like a stupid and obvious point but it actually matters for determining whether a body is found. Dumping an unconscious person over a railing might cause either you to be spotted dumping them or the body itself to be seen by someone before it dies from the fall accident, destroying your score. Pushing a conscious person over a railing will never cause a body found, because the NPC is alive right up until they die, and the instant they die they're an accident kill corpse and can't count for bodies found. Always push living people if you can get away with it, it's easier to lure them and harder to get caught.

The sedative thing is borderline useless but you can kind of use a sedated body as a lure as long as nobody physically reaches the body before you kill them or knock them out as well. Why this only applies to sedatives I do not know.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 23:04

Lollerich: Mar 25, 2004; The little doctors are back,
they want to play with you!

quote:

. Dumping an unconscious person over a railing might cause either you to be spotted dumping them or the body itself to be seen by someone before it dies from the fall accident, destroying your score.

I don't think that this is even possible or likely to happen at all. Even so it can be easily avoided by dumping an unconscious body over a railing where nobody sees you doing it. Once the body is found it should count as an accident.

All of this is likely moot when Hitman 2 comes out anyway, because unless they are retarded they are going to fix most of these weird convoluted AI hacking scenarios.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 23:23

Tippis: Mar 21, 2008; It's yet another day in the wasteland.

Lollerich posted:

I don't think that this is even possible or likely to happen at all.

Not only is it possible � it's quite common and a significant problem if you're trying to do a kill-all/SA run of, say, Paris or Bangkok.

# ? Aug 29, 2018 23:38

Dabir: Nov 10, 2012

Again, think about the Paris attic. If you want to kill most of the guys up there with a fall accident, you'll need to knock them out first then throw them over the railing, and even if only a tiny fraction of the NPCs in the fashion show are real that's still a dozen sets of eyes to see the body before it hits the ground.

# ? Aug 30, 2018 00:56

Nakar: Sep 2, 2002; Ultima Ratio Regum

Lollerich posted:

I don't think that this is even possible or likely to happen at all. Even so it can be easily avoided by dumping an unconscious body over a railing where nobody sees you doing it. Once the body is found it should count as an accident.

I think it depends on when the NPC is killed by the dump prompt. There are a few where the NPC can be observed on the way down, mostly long drops like a few in Paris. So many weird aspects of the game are tied to prompt actions.

# ? Aug 30, 2018 03:55

Mondian: Apr 24, 2007

Colorado has some too, I botched SA on one of the ETs because of this quirk. Anyway yeah that guy is hugely wrong it is a big thing to be aware of

# ? Aug 30, 2018 07:02

Nakar: Sep 2, 2002; Ultima Ratio Regum

Note that one thing I observed in the Miami demo footage was a massive reduction in the number of containers. There was one in the downstairs bathrooms near the parking garage, and one in the kitchen area. A number of the bathroom areas were also occupied by NPCs or had NPCs near them (guy mopping near the bathrooms, two women vaping in a stall in the upstairs bathroom). Containers only hold two people and I doubt there's anywhere you can dump infinite bodies other than maybe the ocean (from the boardwalk area that wasn't implemented in the demo), so it'll probably be important to actually hide bodies in places that NPCs won't go and can't see. A good example is the race marshal one guy knocked out in one video; there's no container to stuff him and two NPCs nearby, but by dragging him behind some crates the NPCs won't see the body even if they turn around.

If I had to guess, this is both a general balancing feature (you actually see fewer containers as 2016's design goes on; Hokkaido has far fewer than Paris and sometimes none at all in crucial areas) and the result of the Picture-in-Picture feature coming back from Blood Money. Now that we can see when and which bodies are found, we have better feedback about how they get found and so IOI is content to make us work harder for it.

# ? Aug 30, 2018 16:12

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# ? May 24, 2024 20:36

freebooter: Jul 7, 2009

Am I correct in thinking that Hitman 2 is basically going to include all of Hitman 1? My friend somehow managed to download the whole game (Hitman 1) for "free", but only has access to the training levels, and was waiting for it to go on sale before buying it to unlock the rest of the game which I guess already downloaded onto his PS4 harddrive... anyway, is he better off just waiting for Hitman 2 and buying that?

# ? Aug 31, 2018 07:32

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