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these things happen because 5e does gently caress all to actually teach or facilitate good DMing
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Sep 4, 2018 18:50
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Really looking forward to the next adventure book. My group (2DMs) has a shared timeline in the realms and a lot of our adventuring party’s have either started or visited waterdeep during official and home brew adventures, so everyone is down for a social focused adventure there.
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Sep 4, 2018 19:00
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Can't wait to put the wizard in an antimagic room and make him fight a dragon because he shouldn't always get to use his superpower
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Sep 4, 2018 19:01
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Piell posted:Can't wait to put the wizard in an antimagic room and make him fight a dragon because he shouldn't always get to use his superpower Finally a way to balance magic users with martial characters.
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Sep 4, 2018 19:07
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If everyone insists on rolling social skills ( a bad idea) the DC can just be cut to 1/10th for speaking the language. So The Bard can roll at DC 40 with his skills and the fighter who speaks wizzlewoggle can roll against DC 4
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Sep 4, 2018 19:27
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When I was running a heroquest game one of my players managed to roll a critical failure (with me rolling a critical success) twice on seducing a minor NPC. Due to how confident I was in the system I was able to set up an entire storyline out of that as she fell desperately in love with the priestess and got involved in a troll ceremony and tying her own clan into a trade deal over it. People really enjoyed it, so I think one of the solutions is to have the problem be solvable or to make failure interesting. Even if that interest is via death.
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Sep 4, 2018 19:36
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KittyEmpress posted:I've never been in a situation where I want my 1 athletics bard to try breaking down a door. It's a stupid, stupid artefact of lovely game design that results in the default social encounter being "The character with the best stat talks for a while and then everyone else gets to play again".
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Sep 4, 2018 20:32
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Having high charisma only affects your ability to change the NPC's mind. If you insist on statting it out: If the half orc fighter with 8 cha asks the half orc barbarian npc to help a brother out and offering him a drink, the NPC may be a DC10 and the fighter gets +2 for beer vs having a fancy elf bard ask which may be a DC20 because he prefers punching elves to taking to them. Every bard should be occasionally faced with situations they can't sweet talk themselves out of easily. Just like fighters should have to solve problems via not punching. The moral of this story is play PbtA games because you gain xp by failing which encourages people to leave their comfort zones in a more organic way.
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Sep 4, 2018 21:13
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Piell posted:Can't wait to put the wizard in an antimagic room and make him fight a dragon because he shouldn't always get to use his superpower Enemies with magic and legendary resistances exist, and are a good way to force a save-or-suck caster to diversify their approach.
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Sep 4, 2018 21:19
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Splicer posted:It's really not the same thing. Breaking down a door is one component of the overall exploration pillar of the game. Yeah you don't kick down doors, but presumably you have decent dex or wisdom or intelligence, all of which are used frequently both individually or in group checks when puttering around a dungeon, and that's ignoring your spells. But the Fighter having 8 charisma means they're locked out of the entire social side of the game. Social interaction is gated behind a single stat. Imagine if entering a dungeon meant the Bard, Wizard, and Rogue just put their sheets away for the session because "Kicking down doors is the Fighter's job". At a bare minimum intimidate should really be flex-statted. Someone strong not being able to intimidate someone by crushing a beer glass or whatever just doesn't make sense. But, you know, D&D.
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Sep 4, 2018 21:40
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thespaceinvader posted:At a bare minimum intimidate should really be flex-statted. Someone strong not being able to intimidate someone by crushing a beer glass or whatever just doesn't make sense. Often overlooked probably, but the rules do say the GM may choose to combine a proficiency with another stat at times and "Strength (Intimidation)" is the exact example it gives.
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Sep 4, 2018 21:43
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Eggnogium posted:Often overlooked probably, but the rules do say the GM may choose to combine a proficiency with another stat at times and "Strength (Intimidation)" is the exact example it gives. Hush, you, we're almost done hatefucking 5E.
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Sep 4, 2018 21:47
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My super power is mind control and gently caress you if you think I’m going to waste a spell slot on making sure I can use it in 100% of all encounters instead of 90%.
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Sep 4, 2018 21:49
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Eggnogium posted:Often overlooked probably, but the rules do say the GM may choose to combine a proficiency with another stat at times and "Strength (Intimidation)" is the exact example it gives. I wasn;t sure if that was just a common house rule or not. That at least is good.
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Sep 4, 2018 21:51
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KittyEmpress posted:I've never been in a situation where I want my 1 athletics bard to try breaking down a door. Breaking down a door doesn't usually consume 20+ minutes of game time in which the rest of the party does nothing. Faces are bad for the same reason deckers are: they encourage significant stretches of playtime where one player does everything and the rest of the table fucks around on their phones because they have zero involvement.
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Sep 4, 2018 22:15
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thespaceinvader posted:I wasn;t sure if that was just a common house rule or not. That at least is good. It's a "variant", but it is RAW in the PHB. 
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Sep 4, 2018 23:13
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I don't think I've seen anything in 5e that'd contradict the old ruling here: If you have a bow and arrow, point it at the spellcaster and hold your action for when they're casting a spell. That way you not only make the usual ranged attack, but you also force them to roll concentration to make the spell not fizzle should the attack hit. If you want to mess with spellcasters as a physical attacker, do this.
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Sep 4, 2018 23:26
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Azza Bamboo posted:I don't think I've seen anything in 5e that'd contradict the old ruling here: Yes, I'm going to give up one of my attacks (and possibly also a bonus action attack) for the chance to force a spellcaster to miscast instead of just applying the best CC on them.
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Sep 4, 2018 23:30
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Azza Bamboo posted:I don't think I've seen anything in 5e that'd contradict the old ruling here: That rule doesn't exist. There's no rule about making a concentration check for non-concentration spells.
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Sep 4, 2018 23:30
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Toshimo posted:That rule doesn't exist. There's no rule about making a concentration check for non-concentration spells. There is for spells held for a readied action, even non concentration spells are subject to a concentration check to make sure they don't fizzle their readied spell prior to the trigger occurring.
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Sep 4, 2018 23:32
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Raar_Im_A_Dinosaur posted:There is for spells held for a readied action, even non concentration spells are subject to a concentration check to make sure they don't fizzle their readied spell prior to the trigger occurring. (A) That's not the scenario being discussed and (B) that's written as deliberately turning a non-concentration spell into a concentration spell until it is cast, which differs greatly from normal spellcasting.
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Sep 4, 2018 23:41
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eh, I won't be informing the group I GM of this lack of ruling. We've figured for a while that if something thwacks you while you're trying to say your magic words or whatever, you've gotta hold it together. It's something we've had since we were playing Pathfinder. To me it definitely feels right.
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Sep 4, 2018 23:58
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Typically when a GM does a "surprise language barrier" thing, it's less of a planned "now that you've all become comfortable with your capabilities, here's a curveball" thing and more of a "I did not actually take into account the language thing, woops" or a "challenge equals really hard checks, and I run a CHALLENGING GAME" thing.
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Sep 5, 2018 00:03
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I try to have a grasp of which languages my players know so I can tailor specific stuff so that they get to interact with it first.
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Sep 5, 2018 00:09
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Azza Bamboo posted:eh, I won't be informing the group I GM of this lack of ruling. We've figured for a while that if something thwacks you while you're trying to say your magic words or whatever, you've gotta hold it together. It's something we've had since we were playing Pathfinder. 5e, everyone
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Sep 5, 2018 00:19
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Section Z posted:On that subject, the literal best thing about Edge of the Empire is it being basically the only Star Wars system to say "Holy gently caress you guys, when has language barriers EVER mattered in Star Wars? No, not even for the Ewoks. Get over yourselves, the party understands eachother, and probably the next dozen species they meet" The only time language comes up is the Speaks Binary talent that gives you bonuses when dealing with droids. Having a nice carrot for a player who decide they want to play a linguist is the only reasonable way to go about it, hard shut off for interaction are the problem. This is a setting where one of the main characters skillset is 'speaks a shitload of different languages' too.
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Sep 5, 2018 00:37
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Azza Bamboo posted:eh, I won't be informing the group I GM of this lack of ruling. We've figured for a while that if something thwacks you while you're trying to say your magic words or whatever, you've gotta hold it together. It's something we've had since we were playing Pathfinder. That's a design philosophy from the TSR days It gets extra fun when the caster fakes casting to avoid being interrupted
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Sep 5, 2018 00:47
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Azza Bamboo posted:I don't think I've seen anything in 5e that'd contradict the old ruling here: In 5e, readied actions are taken after the trigger finishes. So if you ready for an enemy casting a spell, you can loosen an arrow at him after the spell's already cast. So barring some other way that doesn't involve the Ready action, it's not actually possible to whack a spellcaster in the middle of casting. Also, whatever Pathfinder has to say on this issue is irrelevant. Different games have different rules, different assumptions about how magic works, and different design goals. I mean, might as well say that the monsters never get to make any rolls because that's how Blades in the Dark works. You're of course free to play it differently, just be aware that you're playing with a houserule.
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Sep 5, 2018 00:58
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imo my grapple check should automatically restrain my opponent. Whatever version has that by default is the one I'm folding into my homebrew rules. e: I've actually been reading Blades In The Dark recently. Seems rad.
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Sep 5, 2018 01:04
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On the other hand this is 5e which has large sections of the rules spackled over with “COPY 3.5 HERE” because they were too lazy to do the work themselves. The ruling Azza Bamboo cites is from 3.5 and the 5e rulebooks openly invite you to rewrite them and replace parts with rules you like from previous editions of D&D. The game invites that. Using the old rules because they like them better is pretty much 5e’s entire ethos. If you’re not cool with that you might want to try a different game written by an actually capable designer (like the aforementioned Blades in the Dark.)
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Sep 5, 2018 01:05
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Sage Genesis posted:In 5e, readied actions are taken after the trigger finishes. So if you ready for an enemy casting a spell, you can loosen an arrow at him after the spell's already cast. So barring some other way that doesn't involve the Ready action, it's not actually possible to whack a spellcaster in the middle of casting. (disclaimer: obviously I know interrupting spells like this isn't how 5e rules work but I do want to know how readied actions work)
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Sep 5, 2018 01:06
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Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:I do want to know how readied actions work Don't forget that in 5th ed, you have to be regarded as having taken an action before you start to take the action that you are going to have taken even if something prevents you from actually taking the action, or else it would be silly rules-lawyering.
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Sep 5, 2018 01:23
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I've heard the rules for monster creation in the DMG are apparently nothing like actual monsters. And I know from looking at guides such as TheangryDM's that do it by-the-book, the HP totals look hilariously overinflated. How would one actually create a monster more in line with the book's? I've seen the 5E Monster on a Business Card method, but it looks kind of overly standardized.
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Sep 5, 2018 01:29
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As far as I can tell just mash together the statblocks of the closest approximation of what you were gonna create and go hog wild.
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Sep 5, 2018 01:35
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I'm guessing that has to be the case, considering that unless I'm doing something horrifically wrong a freaking goblin of all things is flat-out CR 1 by the Monster Manual's rules. To retrace the steps it took me to get there: CR 1/4 creature (by book standards at least), so its proficiency bonus is +2. It gets a +4 to attack, which is perfectly in line with the book standard of +3. Maybe a bit higher. It deals an average of 5 damage from 1d6+2, which squares out to the book range of 4-5. Its HP is 7, putting it at the bottom-most range of the 1/8 CR defense table. However, its armor is 15, so we go up a level and bring it to a CR of 1/4. This makes offensive and defensive CRs both equal 1/4, which is right where the goblin should be. Then it all goes to poo poo when we add Nimble Escape, because apparently the formula thinks goblins are elite crack teams of commandos who can hide on every single turn. According to the DMG this makes their "effective" attack bonus +8 and "effective" AC 19, inflating the CR drastically. I know the rules aren't perfect, but did they seriously botch at checking their own rules on a freaking goblin of all things? The Bee fucked around with this message at 02:10 on Sep 5, 2018 |
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Sep 5, 2018 02:04
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The Bee posted:I'm guessing that has to be the case, considering that unless I'm doing something horrifically wrong a freaking goblin of all things is flat-out CR 1 by the Monster Manual's rules. Checking things is hard. And requires actual competence. Mearls didn't give a poo poo about the game, and neither should you.
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Sep 5, 2018 02:11
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The Bee posted:I know the rules aren't perfect, but did they seriously botch at checking their own rules on a freaking goblin of all things? You shouldn't bring this up, all that negativity just doesn't help anyone and it will obviously be fixed before the book is published even though it's already fine.
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Sep 5, 2018 02:24
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Lol goblins are OP
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Sep 5, 2018 02:26
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Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:What if the trigger is instead the start of a somatic spell invocation? I don't think a trigger has to be after any particular Action if you can describe it more precisely than that. Surely you could have a readied action to fire after the second attack of a 3-part multiattack, is subdividing a casted spell into phases really that different? That gets a bit tricky because some Actions have obvious sub-components. With Extra Attack for example you might make an attack, move, and then perform another attack. And as AlphaDog hinted at, with Shield Master's shove option this gets a lot more complicated. But spellcasting doesn't work like that. There is nothing in the rules to the best of my knowledge which makes it game mechanically anything other than an instant event. Obviously that cannot literally happen in character and it would take a distinct amount of time, but then we must also consider that recognizing the action, making the attack, and the arrow's travel would also take additional time. And that leads to madness. Could you subdivide casting into distinct phases? Sure. As I said, you can houserule the game. I just shudder to think of what the game might devolve into. "Ok, the caster grabs his components..." "I shoot him!" "Somehow his action is in slow-mo and your arrow attack is instantaneous, so now he's shot. But this was his free object interaction for the round, I never said he was casting a spell. So now he'll begin using the component and-" "Ok, so now I'm preparing for when I see him actually wiggling his fingers to cast a spell. And then my arrow will be loosened and strike him before he finishes the spell. Somehow." "He casts Blindness on you." "Aha!" "Which doesn't have a Somatic component, so your Ready doesn't work." "Oh come on!" "I ready for when he... uh... says anything, makes any sort of movement, and in the case of a Sorcerer with the right metamagic, does a very specific kind of unknowable silent act of will?" "Lol no." "Then I... I ready for if he... casts a spell?" "You successfully shoot him. After the trigger finishes. So you don't disturb the casting." Boy, this sounds like a great game and I'd be glad to be in it. Edit: All of this gets even more difficult if we consider Clerics, because their somatic and material components can both be replaced by "has a shield equipped", provided that shield has a depiction of their god's holy symbol on it. So what are you going to ready for? Them having a piece of equipment? Them speaking? By the time your bow-wielding rear end has figured out which mumblings are just generic zealotry and which ones call down the thunder, it's too late. Sage Genesis fucked around with this message at 02:51 on Sep 5, 2018 |
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Sep 5, 2018 02:37
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I agree that it can be fun for the Barbarian to have the magic background key to communicate with a bunch of Pigmen or whatever and the whole episode can revolve around his attempts to communicate with them while the Bard feeds him lines about what to say. That can be fun. You can even make a plot out of it. The issue is that D&D treats languages like magic decoder rings and not like languages. Not to mention anybody who actually gets languages at char gen takes Common, Elvish, and then goes uhhhhh what else should I take. It's not an interesting background mechanic, it's one of those 'emergent' bullshit things that may or may not come up and has almost no connection to anybody's character. It would be far, far more interesting if the Barbarian was the point-person for a social interaction not because he for some reason took Orc when he wasn't sure what else to take but because he's the character most likely to understand Orcs and their traditions.
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Sep 5, 2018 02:38
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