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I admit I am curious - would you need to find some way to penalise Karen Berger and Paul Levitz too? They've left, but they were effectively in charge of the company when Berganza was brought on as an editor and accrued most of his power. I don't really know how this sort of thing works. 
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Sep 13, 2018 20:53
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Where do you stop? You guys know his wife still works there right? And his son. Edit: might still be his fiance. I'm a bit out of touch on that. Rhyno fucked around with this message at 21:01 on Sep 13, 2018 |
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Sep 13, 2018 20:57
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site posted:you make it sound like punishing people who cover up one of their employees continued sexual harassment of other employees is a bad thing. if multiple people are complicit you bring the hammer down on all of them, this isn't a difficult concept I don't know what the dates of everything were, but if Berganza was pulling his bullshit before Didio was at DC it means other people were covering for him before Didio could have done anything. It doesn't absolve him, but it means he's not the only one culpable and probably not the worst.
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Sep 13, 2018 20:58
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Rhyno posted:We need proof they were complicit in covering for him before we get the torches out. I'm all for scumbags getting what they deserve but I never saw any credible proof that Didio was covering for Berganza and the story that Berg had upper corporate friends goes back a decade or more. corporate as in somewhere outside of dc proper? or like geoff or diane nelson or someone? Skwirl posted:I don't know what the dates of everything were, but if Berganza was pulling his bullshit before Didio was at DC it means other people were covering for him before Didio could have done anything. It doesn't absolve him, but it means he's not the only one culpable and probably not the worst. like i said , at the time women were talking about didio in particular and were saying they were trying to communicate with him to no avail, so i assume they would know more about it than i. if dans not the only one culpable get em all. and if some of the people who were covering for him dont work at dc anymore well then its not like they can fire them too but that doesnt mean dont punish anybody if you cant punish everybody according to the buzzfeed article that got eddie canned there were multiple complaints that took place after didio, lee, and harass took the top jobs in 2010, which makes them pretty directly complicit in at least a few cases site fucked around with this message at 21:21 on Sep 13, 2018 |
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Sep 13, 2018 21:06
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Witch hunts are a bad idea. If there is actual proof then burn him to the ground but until then he shouldn't lose his job because of people's tweets.
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Sep 13, 2018 21:16
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Luckily this isn’t a witch hunt.
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Sep 13, 2018 21:21
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For the record, I don't have a problem with burning Dan Didio's reputation to the ground, I was just encouraging a wider net and worried it would stop at Dan Didio.
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Sep 13, 2018 21:36
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Skwirl posted:I was just encouraging a wider net and worried it would stop at Dan Didio. gotta catch em all
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Sep 13, 2018 21:48
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Okay, back to this. Riley Rossmo! 
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Sep 13, 2018 21:53
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site posted:gotta catch em all Didio almost certainly participated and abetted a system where a serial abuser was allowed to thrive, but he definitely wasn't the one who set it up and I'm more interested in seeing them held to account.
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Sep 13, 2018 21:54
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i dont know how many ways i can say yes to this lol, if there are people still somewhere at dc comics, or dc ent, or warner bros higher up in the food chain that she can bring down for being complicit please do. but if she can take out people that high up im not sure why she would need to stop before axing didio and the rest get as many as you can
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Sep 13, 2018 22:12
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Didio is almost certainly the one who got Hippyname Wagner fired as colorist a few weeks back.
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Sep 13, 2018 22:17
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Rhyno posted:What has he done recently that's so offensive? Why does it have to be recently? He's been awful since the mid 00s. Even beyond everything everyone else is saying the dude's creative vision being the New 52 and Countdown says more than enough that he shouldn't be dictating the line. His only saving grace is he's got some favorite small time franchises but even that's more penchant than purpose.
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Sep 13, 2018 22:33
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site posted:i dont know how many ways i can say yes to this lol, if there are people still somewhere at dc comics, or dc ent, or warner bros higher up in the food chain that she can bring down for being complicit please do. but if she can take out people that high up im not sure why she would need to stop before axing didio and the rest That would be everyone working there. The idea was to send Eddie to sensitivity training and work in a Superman office that on the whole didn't have any women in it. Due diligence for corporate culture >2 years ago. Then they fired him when the optics got bad, which is how a 2017-18 company works. Everyone did their best and since the internet let everyone know how sex pests and victims should actually be treated now they know better! Who's to fire?  edit: New Freedom Fighters 12 issue series from Venditti and Barrows https://www.cbr.com/dc-freedom-fighters-nazi-punching-new-series/ 
Teenage Fansub fucked around with this message at 23:33 on Sep 13, 2018 |
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Sep 13, 2018 22:33
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DC Universe is up. It seems bad! Like maybe they should have waited a few more months to launch it anyway.
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Sep 13, 2018 23:42
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I've probably asked this before, but did we ever find out what Kevin Smith's "biggest writing gig I've ever worked on and biggest IP I've ever worked with" he was teasing a while ago was?
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Sep 13, 2018 23:47
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Wheat Loaf posted:I've probably asked this before, but did we ever find out what Kevin Smith's "biggest writing gig I've ever worked on and biggest IP I've ever worked with" he was teasing a while ago was? Dude has published comics starring Batman and Spider-Man and wrote an outline for a Superman film, so whatever the gently caress he was talking about he was exaggerating.
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Sep 13, 2018 23:51
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Jason Todd's new shirt and haircut makes me think of Superboy from Young Justice (the cartoon).
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Sep 14, 2018 00:44
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Vince MechMahon posted:DC Universe is up. It seems bad! Like maybe they should have waited a few more months to launch it anyway. "World-class comics reader" but umm the video player crashes constantly? Is competent-class too much to ask?
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Sep 14, 2018 00:57
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Wheat Loaf posted:I've probably asked this before, but did we ever find out what Kevin Smith's "biggest writing gig I've ever worked on and biggest IP I've ever worked with" he was teasing a while ago was? He is doing a show or podcast for the dc universe thing They are also doing a daily show lol
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Sep 14, 2018 02:45
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Two Tone Shoes posted:Why does it have to be recently? He's been awful since the mid 00s. Even beyond everything everyone else is saying the dude's creative vision being the New 52 and Countdown says more than enough that he shouldn't be dictating the line. His only saving grace is he's got some favorite small time franchises but even that's more penchant than purpose. Look, I don't like the man either and I have actually had in person interactions with him but I don't think my personal feelings about what kind of person he is should dictate how much longer he keeps his job. I just need something more than "I'm angry at this person because a horrible thing happened under his watch." He did was he was required to do, Berganza went to rehabd etc. It sucks but we can't prove that Didio was complicit. He certainly wasn't holding doors shut while Berganza slapped asses inside.
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Sep 14, 2018 03:44
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I would just like him to be replaced cause I don't like most of his decisions related to the comics.
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Sep 14, 2018 04:12
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Rhyno posted:Look, I don't like the man either and I have actually had in person interactions with him but I don't think my personal feelings about what kind of person he is should dictate how much longer he keeps his job. I completely disregarded the Berganza stuff and pointed out why it would be a good idea for him no longer to be the making all the big calls on creative decisions at DC. Like, if doing a lovely job at your job for years isn't a good enough reason to give someone else a shot then what else? Nothing I said was about what kind of person he is. It had everything to do with his capability. I even went out of my way to ignore how he ran some writers out of DC in the late 00s/early 10s just so I wouldn't have to broach his character. Two Tone Shoes fucked around with this message at 04:31 on Sep 14, 2018 |
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Sep 14, 2018 04:29
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Mr Hootington posted:He is doing a show or podcast for the dc universe thing Wait a daily show like a dude trying to riff on politics/news or a dude trying to riff on comics? Because neither sound good but one sounds cringier than the other
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Sep 14, 2018 04:32
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Rhyno posted:a horrible thing happened under his watch." . . .  Required to do by who
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Sep 14, 2018 04:36
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His bosses. As I've said before, Berganza was known to have friends up the ladder which is probably why he got away with it for so long. Had he not been on the front page of the NYT he would probably still have his job. Also that previous post was not a response to you, it was towards the post directly above mine.
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Sep 14, 2018 04:47
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Look Site, here's the short story, you can call for the head of literally everyone who currently works at DC and you wont actually get the people who actually permitted it, all you'll get to do is pat yourself on the back for getting a lot of innocent people fired because they 'abetted' it when it was never anything they could do in the first place. Maybe instead of going after Didio, you should be going after the DC upper management who predated him who would have been the ones to protect Berganza.
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Sep 14, 2018 09:48
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Onmi posted:Look Site, here's the short story, you can call for the head of literally everyone who currently works at DC and you wont actually get the people who actually permitted it, all you'll get to do is pat yourself on the back for getting a lot of innocent people fired because they 'abetted' it when it was never anything they could do in the first place. Maybe instead of going after Didio, you should be going after the DC upper management who predated him who would have been the ones to protect Berganza. This sums it up pretty well. Didio may be douche but he inherited the situation and his hands were pretty much tied. Hell, Berganza was very close to getting Dan's job at one point before he was brought over.
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Sep 14, 2018 10:00
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nofather posted:Oh I see. I stopped listening to the solicits when they started getting spoilery for other things. People were freaking out about him not going by Dick anymore, that DC was going to force people to call him by a different name entirely. It looks like that name is Grayson. Who'd remember that. Though I guess amnesia would be one way to get over losing your Dick. This is so painfully obvious I want to skip it entirely. I mean they literally JUST DID THIS STORYLINE like four years ago with Bruce. However will Dick (Rick? They've tried calling him Rick in the latest Titans as they had him and Miss Martian traveling through tv channels an old lady is clicking through and one of them was Casablanca) get his memory back? (SERIOUSLY DO NOT CLICK BELOW IMAGES IF YOU ARE WORRIED ABOUT BEING SPOILED) Nightwing #46  Nightwing Annual #1   Assuming Barbara remembers she has the thing after her seizure (courtesy of the chip that allows her to walk being on the fritz after getting electrocuted by Grotesque in her latest book) this is just going to be wheel-spinning. The idea Bruce would just let Dick wander off alone to Bludhaven and live an oblivious life with a TBI is just... levels of stupid beyond current comprehension, nevermind Damian/Tim/Alfred being ok with the idea.
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Sep 14, 2018 15:50
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Onmi posted:Look Site, here's the short story, you can call for the head of literally everyone who currently works at DC and you wont actually get the people who actually permitted it, all you'll get to do is pat yourself on the back for getting a lot of innocent people fired because they 'abetted' it when it was never anything they could do in the first place. Maybe instead of going after Didio, you should be going after the DC upper management who predated him who would have been the ones to protect Berganza. Thats dumb as hell. again if the people who started protecting berganza still work at dc then by all means they should get fired. If they arent and this upper ladder that rhyno keeps making nebulous statements about is now harras, lee, didio, then they inherited a policy of protecting berganza they were in a place to rescind and actively chose not to I still want to know what this upper ladder is and where we are saying it is? Is it the shareholders or the dc ent president, or someone at warner bros? Geoff johns? Im being told that complicity doesnt actually means what it means and we need more to go on other than "these guys were literally in charge of dc comics at the time when multiple women were being sexually harassed by an employee" and didnt do anything about it, but also im supposed to just accept that these people in charge actually have no ability to do anything about it because of orders from someone who may or may not exist at one of three companies involved that no one seems to be able to pin down, and that also absolves them of any wrongdoing. Im done, clearly y'all are just gonna keep twisting into knots about it site fucked around with this message at 16:12 on Sep 14, 2018 |
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Sep 14, 2018 15:50
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I assume some anonymous HR people you'll never know at WB decided on the ultimatum of sensitivity training and a 'don't do that again or else'. Ultimately, he was fired. I'm guessing the new lady's gonna leave it at that and worry about the next lot of harassment. Scott Snyder, Peter Tomasi, Charles Soule, Greg Pak, Gene Yang and Geoff Johns all wrote Superman comics in the years directly before Berganza's firing. You can ask them why they accepted him. edit: Or why, knowing the situation, I went 'Oh well' and bought those comics. I don't have a good answer. Teenage Fansub fucked around with this message at 16:16 on Sep 14, 2018 |
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Sep 14, 2018 16:05
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Were any of them in a position to terminate berganzas employmentTeenage Fansub posted:I'm guessing the new lady's gonna leave it at that and worry about the next lot of harassment. Most likely yes
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Sep 14, 2018 16:14
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No, nobody was. That's why he kept his job. Nobody was complicit in this. As stated above, are, are you going to call for the end of the careers of all creators that worked with him?
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Sep 14, 2018 16:23
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Im not buying your premise but you wouldve known that if you actually read any of my posts instead of just seeing i made a new one and quadrupling down
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Sep 14, 2018 16:28
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You asked about my nebulosu statements, that's exactly what the thing was. When this came out several years ago the discussion ended with "Well you know Eddie's connected so his job is safe." Nobody knows who his connection was but he had protection from someone above Didio's pay grade. You're mad that Didio didn't do something when it's basically known that his hands were tied and that is why Berganza was demoted and sent to rehab/therapy instead of being terminated on the spot.
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Sep 14, 2018 16:34
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So your facts are that someone somewhere at some point was protecting berganza that was above didio at the beginning but also even though you dont know who it was this person definitely still worked at dc after the changeover in 2010 and was still in a position above harras, lee, and didio, even though they were the top of the ladder, forcing that policy on them And also that even though they were by your own admission enforcing that policy they were not complicit in enforcing that policy site fucked around with this message at 16:44 on Sep 14, 2018 |
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Sep 14, 2018 16:41
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As a poet once said: "Everything is hosed and everybody sucks."
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Sep 14, 2018 16:46
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site posted:So your facts are that someone somewhere at some point was protecting berganza that was above didio at the beginning but also even though you dont know who it was this person definitely still worked at dc after the changeover in 2010 and was still in a position above harras, lee, and didio, even though they were the top of the ladder, forcing that policy on them Nobody knew. Or if they did nobody was talking. Also there are people above the DC offices. Everyone answers to someone in a higher chair. Berganzas friend was assumed to be someone in WB corporate. I thought I made that clear. Edit: at the summit the year he got suspended this was all anyone was talking about and the chatter was everywhere that he had a friend far up the chain and it's the sole reason he got to keep his job.
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Sep 14, 2018 16:57
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Hey guys...I like to read Superman comics. Also Justice League.
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Sep 14, 2018 16:58
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Here's a thing to actually be angry at Didio for
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Sep 14, 2018 17:07
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