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I've only ever healed in an MMO and because of that I think I had an even extra layer of anxiety to add to tanking, but I have been playing a boosted-to-60 WAR and my only anxiety after getting a few dungeons under my belt is dungeon pathing I'm really glad that the community seems to be so chill because I have definitely pulled unnecessary rooms and no one bitches. In WoW it would be an endless shitstorm
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Sep 17, 2018 15:05
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Orthodox Rabbit posted:The most important rule of Tanking is tank Bone Dragon in the middle
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Sep 17, 2018 15:10
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Phone posted:The most important part of tanking is yelling at the ranged dps to use LB. I love my "LB or I will!" macro, it always gets a laugh out of people.
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Sep 17, 2018 15:11
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Waffles Inc. posted:I'm really glad that the community seems to be so chill because I have definitely pulled unnecessary rooms and no one bitches. In WoW it would be an endless shitstorm I grumble quietly unless it becomes a pattern, then I ask if they're after something and point the way
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Sep 17, 2018 15:12
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Waffles Inc. posted:I've only ever healed in an MMO and because of that I think I had an even extra layer of anxiety to add to tanking, but I have been playing a boosted-to-60 WAR and my only anxiety after getting a few dungeons under my belt is dungeon pathing Healing is way more of a challenge in this game than tanking, IMO.
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Sep 17, 2018 15:23
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Cat Army
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Ouhei posted:Healing is way more of a challenge in this game than tanking, IMO. Yeah, without question. Tanking's more anxiety-provoking for a lot of people because it places you as the de facto "leader" in your average 4-man group and has a highly visible element (your own survivability) that's largely out of your control. The actual mechanical execution is easy.
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Sep 17, 2018 15:26
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Waffles Inc. posted:I'm really glad that the community seems to be so chill because I have definitely pulled unnecessary rooms and no one bitches. In WoW it would be an endless shitstorm The worst I've seen in FFXIV so far was a tank and DPS arguing with each other during an Ala Mhigo run a while back because the DPS didn't focus on the target the tank marked and the tank lost aggro on the target the DPS was attacking. And by "arguing," I mean taking the time to stop and type during fights. Eventually I told them to shut up until we finished the boss fight and for some reason they listened to me. I left at the end before I could see if they resumed arguing after throwing a commend at the healer for putting up with that poo poo.
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Sep 17, 2018 15:32
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Harrow posted:The worst I've seen in FFXIV so far was a tank and DPS arguing with each other during an Ala Mhigo run a while back because the DPS didn't focus on the target the tank marked and the tank lost aggro on the target the DPS was attacking. And by "arguing," I mean taking the time to stop and type during fights. Eventually I told them to shut up until we finished the boss fight and for some reason they listened to me. I left at the end before I could see if they resumed arguing after throwing a commend at the healer for putting up with that poo poo. Who the gently caress loses aggro in Ala Mhigo? 2-3x Flash/Unleash/Overpower should keep everything locked onto you for the rest of the fight unless everyone's DPS is sub-1.8k.
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Sep 17, 2018 15:35
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I think the only arguments I've had with tanks as a DPS is the rare occasion one will demand you not aoe or dps less so you don't pull aggro and, uh, no.
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Sep 17, 2018 15:39
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Once you get into the groove tanking is best. You dictate the pace, which means everyone goes at your speed. If you over pull just throw out a quick 'sorry I'll ease up' and everything works out. You get to enjoy your quick queues, commendations, and
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Sep 17, 2018 15:43
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Did they remove the secondary class requirement for jobs? Like you just need 30 gladiator for paladin now?
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Sep 17, 2018 16:05
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I'm trying to tank more in high-end content just to try and get over that dumb anxiety I really shouldn't be having over a fun video game. I honestly enjoy WAR and I hate having a mental block on something I like. (also I want those achievements) Honestly just knowing how to quickly build your aggro and mitigate damage efficiently is 90% of the work. The rest is knowing which way the boss should be facing at certain times. bagrada posted:Did they remove the secondary class requirement for jobs? Like you just need 30 gladiator for paladin now? Yep, they have been gone for a while now.
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Sep 17, 2018 16:07
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It is nearly impossible for a tank that is doing things correctly to lose threat in any situation. Even if your dps are good enough to do real damage while also being bad enough to not use enmity reduction skills, you can typically adjust by just doing a few more Flashes or enmity combos. A hot poo poo dps burst opener done without Diversion or Lucid Dreaming can potentially rip hate before the tank can solidify agro after pulling, but that's the one case where it actually is more on the dps than it is on the tank.
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Sep 17, 2018 16:10
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If DPS are unloading immediately that's on them. We're not in "wait for 5 sunders before dpsing" territory any more.
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Sep 17, 2018 16:17
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The tank stance threat multiplier is significant. One or two high threat combos will rocket you to the top of the list. The dps can survive a hit or two in the mean time.
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Sep 17, 2018 16:22
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I'm a jerk SMN lifer and RDM part-timer who greatly enjoys ripping hate off of subpar/undergeared tanks during boss fights, especially when they sit in tank stance the whole fight. It's exciting. Though I usually pop Lucid Dreaming before I die.
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Sep 17, 2018 16:34
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i'm not asking anyone to dps less, just please, for the love of god, use diversion and lucid dreaming so i can dps. fell cleave gives me life.
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Sep 17, 2018 16:37
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There's been a couple times where I've opened big pulls with quad flares + double foul and I don't think there's anything that helps in that situation 
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Sep 17, 2018 16:39
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Truga posted:There's been a couple times where I've opened big pulls with quad flares + double foul and I don't think there's anything that helps in that situation It's very important and good to do this whenever possible the floor isn't gonna tank itself
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Sep 17, 2018 16:43
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I mean, if the other dps was also a black mage doing the same, the pack would be dead before it had time to hit anything, but some people still insist on playing lesser dps  e: I think I posted about this already but, shortly after SB released I was doing kugane castle as blm and the other dps was smn, and where the mechaninja adds spawn he tried to LB them but I just timed a flare+swiftcast foul for it and they all died before LB finished casting and I laughed all the way to the end of the dungeon it was so good Truga fucked around with this message at 16:47 on Sep 17, 2018 |
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Sep 17, 2018 16:44
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Truga posted:There's been a couple times where I've opened big pulls with quad flares + double foul and I don't think there's anything that helps in that situation can't pull hate if everything's dead
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Sep 17, 2018 16:48
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Truga posted:I mean, if the other dps was also a black mage doing the same, the pack would be dead before it had time to hit anything, but some people still insist on playing lesser dps efb
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Sep 17, 2018 16:48
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hey, quick question about stuff i'm reading online but wanna verify with people who might know better: you can create cross-world parties so long as all the players are on the same data center, right? so for example if i made a character on, say, diabolos, i could still party with and do dungeons with my friends on excalibur? is the downside that i just wouldn't be able to run out of dungeon content with them? just trying to understand the rules/limitations of this, thanks! 
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Sep 17, 2018 16:52
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Only time I had issues with tanking (other than having someone rip aggro off me at low level because I didn't have tank stance yet) was a couple of days ago during Keeper of the Lake, when an AST opened up on the Gobbue while I was getting the train going right at the start of the dungeon. By the time I noticed and got back to Tomahawk range the gobbue had already punched her to death. I feel that one was on me, but said AST then proceeded to start 3 pulls on her own while the DPS and I were opening coffers, so I have no sympathy. 
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Sep 17, 2018 16:53
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Truga posted:There's been a couple times where I've opened big pulls with quad flares + double foul and I don't think there's anything that helps in that situation last night I pulled aggro and died three flares into a quad flare and I was laughing too hard to be mad about it
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Sep 17, 2018 16:58
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Edmond Dantes posted:I feel that one was on me, but said AST then proceeded to start 3 pulls on her own while the DPS and I were opening coffers, so I have no sympathy. See now this is just rude. If non tanks want to pull they better be prepared to deal with the consequences. Or at least pull them to the tank so he can collect the aggro.
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Sep 17, 2018 17:04
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Kaubocks posted:hey, quick question about stuff i'm reading online but wanna verify with people who might know better: Correct. You wouldn't be able to do things like share a house with your friends, join the same free company, or actually see them in the game world. But you're free to form up parties, chat with them in cross-world linkshells, and join the same instanced content (dungeons, trials, raids, etc.)!
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Sep 17, 2018 17:11
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Kaubocks posted:hey, quick question about stuff i'm reading online but wanna verify with people who might know better: Yup, you got it exactly right. Anything you have to queue for is a go, anything that takes place entirely in the open world is a no-go.
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Sep 17, 2018 17:12
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Dwesa posted:I remember holding that sword with my... book. I took the sword as a MNK once. You just block it with your fists. 
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Sep 17, 2018 17:13
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awesome, thanks for the confirmation!
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Sep 17, 2018 17:13
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My biggest problem with tanking is deciding on one. I like the paladins flashy moves, the warrior is great off tank and the dark knight is good all around and has great quests.
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Sep 17, 2018 17:18
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Spuzzz posted:My biggest problem with tanking is deciding on one. I like the paladins flashy moves, the warrior is great off tank and the dark knight is good all around and has great quests. Why not all three? Jokes aside, as someone whose first job was Paladin, I'd recommend either of the other tanks, since tanking dungeons as paladin feels really boring and weak compared to the other two. Warrior has AOE gauge moves to play with and access to Overpower from very early, while Dark Knight gets to do the dance of Dark Artsing the Darks of Darkness, but Paladin pretty much just has flash, CoS, and a spin attack they obtain way too late. But maybe that's a plus if you want something easy and straightforward? In terms of difficulty to play, I'd rank them from highest to lowest as DRK - WAR - PLD. If I had to recommend one, I guess it would be WAR?
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Sep 17, 2018 17:40
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Main tank/ off tank just refers to who is currently tanking the boss in this game and isn't indicative of what jobs are expected to pull and keep the bosses attention. The only reason to be concerned about what tank you are playing is if you are doubling up in an 8 man or trying to get a speed kill for fflogs.
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Sep 17, 2018 17:42
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Harrow posted:Also, is it hard to tank trials and/or raids? I had to do a Tank Swap for the first time yesterday when we were fighting Ratfinx in A5. I haven't Tanked any trials aside from Greg V2, where I was MT as I recall. Typically I've been OT, though, so I'm probably not the best person to ask!
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Sep 17, 2018 17:45
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I can't really get into WAR's whole aesthetic, I think. I've never really been into the berserker archetype, I guess. I think I like PLD's overall flashiness, the whole sword-and-shield aesthetic, and some of the cool stuff they can do later (Passage of Arms looks sick as hell), though DRK does appeal to me, too, even if only for the apparently very high quality of the job quests. I wasn't aware of how easy tanking would be for the kinds of things I'm likely to do so I was somewhat scared off by hearing that DRK is harder to play than the other two and also maybe not as effective at endgame, but really I'm probably not going to be running savage anything any time soon so that's probably not really relevant. What makes DRK hard to play and/or fun to play? I guess I might as well try it out, too.
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Sep 17, 2018 18:09
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DRK is hard to play in that you have to mash Dark Arts all the time to enhance all your big attacks.
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Sep 17, 2018 18:14
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Paladin is easy and until DRK 45 (when you get Dark Arts) the only important difference between them is whether you want a holy or dark flavour to your animations. Later paladin gets more support abilities and a magic damage phase, and dark knight gets big damage (for tank, at least) abilities to go with the big sword. Dark knight also definitely has the better quests. Basically, go with whichever is cooler to you. Warrior is different even in the beginning because Overpower is trickier to use than Flash/Unleash, but you will get used to that before you get to anything difficult.
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Sep 17, 2018 18:27
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SettingSun posted:DRK is hard to play in that you have to mash Dark Arts all the time to enhance all your big attacks. “DRK is hard because you have to pay attention”
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Sep 17, 2018 18:28
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DRK's Pros: Has a bigger sword than pld, has arguably the best job quests in the game, is probably the flashiest of the tanks in terms of sheer particle effects, can feel the warp over taking you, but it's a good pain. DRK's Cons: Complexity, is that something you eat?    Is also probably SAM in disguise.
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Sep 17, 2018 18:35
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Harrow posted:What makes DRK hard to play and/or fun to play? I guess I might as well try it out, too. DRK is hard to play because if you roleplay properly, you will wonder why you are bothering to serve those pathetic party members of yours: why save them from their inevitable fate? You are not their slave: leave them to die like the badass you are and move on to slay the true threat. In actuality though, DRK is interesting and fun to play because they are the 'spellsword' archetype: a blend of magic and swordplay. I was originally a PLD in the hopes that they were the spellsword, but their real magic is only in a burst phase that you get way later in Stormblood. Meanwhile, DRK has a bevy of interesting spells that are further enhanced by the constant use of Dark Arts for unique effects and power. The complexity is nice and refreshing and you have plenty of interesting buttons to hit besides your normal combo. Like PLD, you have a lot of extra abilities, but while the PLD is all about defense and healing abilities (which are probably just unnecessary with good healers), you are more about doing damage (which is always welcome). The difficult part is managing your MP and blood gauge: you can sometimes be caught out blasting all your MP/blood on single-target power moves for a boss, only to be left high and dry when a bunch of adds are summoned and you have no MP to use on your aggro AoE abilities. Also, your "oh poo poo" button is the worst of all of the tanks: Living Dead is terrible and eclipsed by the superior Holmgang (WAR) and Hallowed Ground (PLD).
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