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Reclines Obesily posted:the polling ive seen of the euro parliament shows national rally picking up the same amount of seats Gotta make those glamour articles about the far right tho
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Sep 26, 2018 01:54
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Electronico6 posted:the nationalist, eurosceptic, and anti-globalist party, the Portuguese Communist Party
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Sep 26, 2018 02:38
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Kurtofan posted:Gotta make those glamour articles about the far right tho there's been several german polls over the past few months with the greens either getting within 1 point of AFD or even passing them but you don't hear poo poo oh well
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Sep 26, 2018 03:41
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get that OUT of my face posted:say what now GElectrico is being kinda flippant, the PCP is old school marxist leninist meaning they have a populist, international bend, not nationalist. Portugal is a odd duck because its really averse to extremism,even when we went fascist it was a half-assed integral fascist dictatorship. Half assing things is kinda of our national moto. Although we let all the fascist enablers back in in the 80's because they had all the money.we're still better off than spain in that regard. Also,that dictatorship was whit in living memory, all the insane populist go into football,and our antifa is good at cracking skulls. It turns out a active hard left is really good at squelching the nazis, who knew.
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Sep 26, 2018 10:24
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get that OUT of my face posted:say what now "A Left Wing and Patriotic Politic" has been it's slogan for a very long while. It's soviet rhetoric, that the correct dose of nationalism will lead to communism, socialism in one country, etc. PCP has always positioned itself the party that looks for national interest and sovereignty above everything else, more so since the collapse of the USSR. The alt-right positions itself as a new radical voice in politics, that was being forcefully kept down and ignored by the "Global Elites". "Take back control" is the pillar of all these alt-right parties, UKIP, FN, Lega, however euroscepticism and anti-globalisation has been a mainstay of Portuguese politics since it joined the EEC via PCP. Taking back control is all PCP cries about, so historical all the protest votes ended up going PCP way.
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Sep 26, 2018 10:30
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The EU being so undemocratic is probably going to be the end of it sooner or later. Though picturing an EU-wide election campaign is hilarious.
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Sep 26, 2018 10:34
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Antifa Poltergeist posted:GElectrico is being kinda flippant, the PCP is old school marxist leninist meaning they have a populist, international bend, not nationalist. Just because PCP say their patriotic policies are totally in line with the internationalist values of the October revolution, doesn't actually make it so. This is the same party that is still very much into Brezhnev limited sovereignty when it suits their needs.
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Sep 26, 2018 10:54
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I don't think the French public was wooed by obama tbh
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Sep 26, 2018 10:58
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Antifa Poltergeist posted:It turns out a active hard left is really good at squelching the nazis, who knew. My conspiratorial side sorta sees Observador and Publico suddenly doing Peterson fluff pieces on the oped re: the latter and promotiong the translation of the book (despite nearly everyone neing aware of the man being fluent in english) as a non subtle way to attempt to sell more people on the other side, now that even pundits here are going "oh jeez, i guess liberalism is dead?" But then again Bolton's magazine literally had a piece during the recent world cup trying to get a rw coup here and that wasn't as noted here as Serena Williams's confrontation witht the referee, who is portuguese and was a chance for everyone to post about him "civilizing the savage". Or the whole Maite Proenco poo poo.
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Sep 26, 2018 11:14
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jBrereton posted:I don't think the French public was wooed by obama tbh i just wanted to point out the mod being dumb
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Sep 26, 2018 11:32
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Kunster posted:My conspiratorial side sorta sees Observador and Publico suddenly doing Peterson fluff pieces on the oped re: the latter and promotiong the translation of the book (despite nearly everyone neing aware of the man being fluent in english) as a non subtle way to attempt to sell more people on the other side, now that even pundits here are going "oh jeez, i guess liberalism is dead?" They doing that so PSD will take in some of that noise. But Rui Rio isn't biting, because he is a whole different type of conservative, and CDS can't decide if it's going to jump the PSD ship to go with PS or wanting to become the new PSD. They are also splintering right now, and there's a bunch of in-fighting. There's nothing cohesive coming out of the PT Right these days, which is why this government can get away with 100 people dying in forest fires and it's barely a thing.
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Sep 26, 2018 11:40
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jBrereton posted:I don't think the French public was wooed by obama tbh much like his presidency obama didn't do poo poo here
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Sep 26, 2018 11:52
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Electronico6 posted:Just because PCP say their patriotic policies are totally in line with the internationalist values of the October revolution, doesn't actually make it so. This is the same party that is still very much into Brezhnev limited sovereignty when it suits their needs. Wait what?what nationalist policies do they have? Having our own currency? Second point im not sure, i mean the pcp is not advocating the use of force by other socialist countries to keep maduro in power or anything.fighting capitalism worldwide is kinda the marxist leninist thing. Kunster posted:My conspiratorial side sorta sees Observador and Publico suddenly doing Peterson fluff pieces on the oped re: the latter and promotiong the translation of the book (despite nearly everyone neing aware of the man being fluent in english) as a non subtle way to attempt to sell more people on the other side, now that even pundits here are going "oh jeez, i guess liberalism is dead?" Yeah, observador will go totally TrumpTrumpTrump if they can, the other media just doesn't wanna rock the boat. I think its more a reflection of the infighting in PSD and CDS triangulation than establishing a hard right wing beachhead.
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Sep 26, 2018 12:02
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Electronico6 posted:There's nothing cohesive coming out of the PT Right these days, which is why this government can get away with 100 people dying in forest fires and it's barely a thing. And the next year you could hear the loud sigh on the boardroom from the quicker response. No wonder Costa can boast himself easily when you straight up had the media just eager to get some old lady burst into flames on camera to point at. Pundits on camera straight up livid at him congratulating at the lack of a death count this year and accusing him of """politicizing""".
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Sep 26, 2018 12:05
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I remember obama backing sarkozy in 2012
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Sep 26, 2018 12:42
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Antifa Poltergeist posted:Wait what?what nationalist policies do they have? Having our own currency? Renationalization of economic sectors, pulling out of the EU, more power to national/local institutions. A lot of this isn't very far from your UKIP and FN "moderate" positions. The language and framing is of course completly different. But my statement here is that a Portuguese Nigel Farage is going to have a hard time appealing to patriotism and nationalism when that is already the domain of the Communist Party. PCP doesn't advocate intervention in Venezuela because there's no Communist superpower to come to the help of it like there was with Czechoslovakia in the 60's. PCP reapproachment with China during the turn of the century was a mistake that they never revisited. Soviets equated nationalism to internationalism to justify their brutal interference in the warsaw pact countries and military adventures, and in the end Soviets did gently caress all for internationalism or fighting capitalism worldwide. Soviet doctrine is still the core of PCP. and to this day PCP will still defend the crackdown of Czechoslovakia, Hungary, and the invasion of Afghanistan by Soviet forces, by usually citing Brezhnev limited sovereignty(Cunhal was a big of this), that these countries need to be invaded and occupied to defend the sanctity of socialism worldwide. And this is the important context to when you hear Jeronimo going on about the EU, NATO, IMF, and anti-imperialism, the actions against these organisations are framed in internationalist language, but he only advocates fighting them in Portugal. It's socialism in one country. Internationalism with PCP is all in values of revolutions past and in spirit. If you want marxist internationalism you better off with Left Bloc.
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Sep 26, 2018 12:50
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Kunster posted:And the next year you could hear the loud sigh on the boardroom from the quicker response. No wonder Costa can boast himself easily when you straight up had the media just eager to get some old lady burst into flames on camera to point at. Pundits on camera straight up livid at him congratulating at the lack of a death count this year and accusing him of """politicizing""". Taking away the pile of burnt bodies from the news is going to be Costa biggest political blunder in 4 years of government.
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Sep 26, 2018 13:04
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Electronico6 posted:Renationalization of economic sectors, pulling out of the EU, more power to national/local institutions. A lot of this isn't very far from your UKIP and FN "moderate" positions. The language and framing is of course completly different. But my statement here is that a Portuguese Nigel Farage is going to have a hard time appealing to patriotism and nationalism when that is already the domain of the Communist Party. My dude, a communist party calling for state and worker ownership of the means of production is not some novel thing. Dialetic analysis of the particular circumstances a communist party finds themselves in is not beyond the pale. Sure, Pcp under cunhal went hard on soviet style, but the dude is dead for 20 years and the party as moved on,slowly for sure.pcp position is that nato should be abolished how is that a isolationist position?A democratic party fighting for democratic changes in line with their policy is kinda the platonic ideal of a party? I mean i like left bloc and all , but their recent missteps over the robles debacle and euthanasia show that they are not immune to bourgeois excesses.
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Sep 26, 2018 13:20
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Antifa Poltergeist posted:My dude, a communist party calling for state and worker ownership of the means of production is not some novel thing. Dialetic analysis of the particular circumstances a communist party finds themselves in is not beyond the pale. This isn't about the means of production dude. “Hoje, a questão da soberania e da independência nacional está de novo colocada. Não temos ilusões, PS e PSD desistiram de Portugal. Nós, tal como ao longo da nossa história, desde a revolução de 1383, com as invasões de Castela, perante o ultimato inglês, quando do Rei fugiu para o Brasil e deixou o povo no cais, foi o povo que, mais tarde ou mais cedo, recuperou essa soberania, essa independência nacional.” (This is Jeronimo de Sousa in a rally from 2010) http://www.tvi24.iol.pt/politica/pcp/soberania-e-independencia-estao-de-novo-em-causa (my translation) "Today, the question of sovereignty and national independence is once again made. We have no illusions, PS and PSD have given up on Portugal. We, just like in our long history, since the revolution of 1383, the invasions from Castille, against the british ultimatum, when the king escaped to brazil and left the people behind, it was the people, which sooner or later, recuperated that sovereignty, that national independence." This is Nigel Farage and his independence day speech after Brexit won: “This, if the predictions now are right, this will be a victory for real people, a victory for ordinary people, a victory for decent people. We have fought against the multinationals, we have fought against the big merchant banks, we have fought against big politics, we have fought against lies, corruption and deceit. And today honesty, decency and belief in nation, I think now is going to win.” Marine Le Pen on her last election campaign launch "The French have been dispossessed of their patriotism. They are suffering in silence from not being allowed to love their country … The divide is no longer between the left and the right, but between the patriots and the globalists. ... The people are waking – the tide of history has turned" https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/feb/05/marine-le-pen-promises-liberation-from-the-eu-with-france-first-policies This is what I mean by PCP being a nationalist party. Appeals of patriotism, to national identity and history, a struggle of the people against the elites. A Portuguese UKIP or FN is going to have to contend with the fact that their primary means of gaining votes, appealing to nationalism, already is owned by the communist party. PCP is still the same party as it was when Cunhal died. Jeronimo will die like Cunhal praising the Soviet Union, and his heir apparent João Oliveira looks to be doing the same these days. PCP still supports MPLA of Santos in Angola despite being beyond corrupt. They never change in this respect. I also want NATO, the Euro, IMF and the EU gone, nor do I see them as inherent isolationist policies, but I do see them when it's PCP talking about, because they still are a Soviet Communist party to the very core, and the USSR was not a force for good or socialism and internationalism. Electronico6 has issued a correction as of 14:20 on Sep 26, 2018 |
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Sep 26, 2018 14:17
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Antifa Poltergeist posted:Yeah, observador will go totally TrumpTrumpTrump if they can, the other media just doesn't wanna rock the boat. I think its more a reflection of the infighting in PSD and CDS triangulation than establishing a hard right wing beachhead. Sol had a thing utterly surprised of the rw establishment not backing Trump and Publico just today had a "Why are we frowming at Trump when he's right about Iran?!" Piece. Hell, the piece on sapo 24 where they had an editor comment on how they'd handle the nyt anon piece is amusing bc only Observador actually quotes the piece. Every other paper's is an exercise in psychology. " we don't quote anonymous sources!" PSD activelly called Publico out on a piece featuring anon psd people seeking to leave over Rio. Kunster has issued a correction as of 14:21 on Sep 26, 2018 |
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Sep 26, 2018 14:18
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the portuguese communist party sounds cool as hell.
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Sep 26, 2018 14:31
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mila kunis posted:the portuguese communist party sounds cool as hell. They do throw some real good parties.
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Sep 26, 2018 14:32
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It’s pretty cool that they share the name of a drug that makes a person so unstoppable that a dozen police officers are needed to restrain them
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Sep 26, 2018 14:46
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Electronico6 posted:This isn't about the means of production dude. I do see differences in both speeches,as one states that true independence and revolution comes from the people and gives concrete examples of it, and the others throws about populist buzzwords of us vs them and for people to be proud of [insert nationality here]. I mean,stating that PS and PSD have sold themselves to capital, which has no country,is not some far out thing. From their 2015 programme "A Programme for a patriotic and left-wing policy that springs from the real situation of the Country and pointing the real causes which are at the root of the serious economic and social crisis that has struck it. A Programme that, given the dramatic social situation into which the Country was thrown, responds to the massive emigration of half a million Portuguese, which compromises our future, an unsustainable unemployment of more than one million two hundred thousand unemployed, with the colossal economic and social costs of almost three million Portuguese thrown into poverty by the current policy. A Programme determined to tackle a crisis that, although prior, appears with special acuteness with the entry into circulation of the single currency, expanded with the worsening of the crisis of the capitalist system and which has become even more devastating in the last five years with the implementation of the Stability and Growth Pact (SGP) and the Pact of Aggression. A Programme to overcome the Country's vulnerabilities resulting from the process of monopolist restoration and its inseparable programme of privatizations, of destruction of strategic sectors and liquidation of the productive sectors, of increasing finantialization of the economy, of a drastic cut in labour incomes and the rights of the workers. A Programme of affirmation of dignity and national sovereignty in view of the constraints of the capitalist integration process of the European Union and its instruments of domination that, from the euro to the Budgetary Treaty have bound Portugal to dependency. A Programme that follows the path of the resistance and struggle that is needed to confront the dictates and impositions of the European Union and the IMF, because it is on the path of resistance and affirmation of sovereignty, and not in vassalage to the centres of transnational capital, that one defends the interests and rights of the Portuguese people and of the Country." Independence and sovereignty from capital is like Marxism Leninism 101. I mean, if all the dipshit nationalist wanna vote for pcp because they somehow think its the party defending pure lusitanian bloodlines,that seems to be their problem,although i've yet to meet a single pcp voter saying "yeah im voting for pcp because they will make Portugal great again." From the programme also, for european cooperation: l A intervenção do Estado português visando uma reconsideração do enquadramento institucional da União Europeia, nomeadamente por via dos esforços concertados com outros Estados para a convocação de uma cimeira intergovernamental para revisão dos Tratados, que tenha como objectivos, entre outros, a imediata revogação do Tratado Orçamental e a revogação do Tratado de Lisboa. l A defesa dos direitos sociais e laborais como factores centrais da cooperação na Europa. A rejeição da Estratégia UE 2020 e sua substituição por um Pacto de Progresso Social e pelo Emprego. l A adopção no plano europeu de medidas de combate à pobreza e à exclusão social, incluindo a instituição de um rendimento mínimo. l A convocação de uma conferência internacional para a renegociação das dívidas dos países vítimas de processos de extorsão e chantagem dos ditos «mercados» e que foram comprovadamente prejudicados com a sua associação à União Económica e Monetária. l A defesa de planos de emergência para apoio dos países intervencionados pela troika, que preveja recursos financeiros e as necessárias derrogações ao funcionamento do mercado único e às políticas comuns. l O reforço substancial do orçamento comunitário, através da reabertura da discussão do actual Quadro Financeiro Plurianual. l A recuperação de instrumentos de soberania monetária, cambial, orçamental e fiscal, essenciais para garantir o desenvolvimento do País. Estudo e Preparação do País para o libertar da submissão ao Euro, de preferência em coordenação com outros Estados em situação semelhante. l A criação de um programa de apoio aos países cuja permanência no Euro se tenha revelado insustentável, que preveja a devida compensação pelos prejuízos causados e enquadre uma saída negociada destes Estados da moeda única. Uma iniciativa articulada com a Dissolução controlada da União Económica e Monetária, com a revogação dos diplomas da Governação Económica e do Semestre Europeu e o fim do Pacto de Estabilidade e Crescimento. l A reconsideração do enquadramento comunitário da economia portuguesa, com uma profunda revisão das políticas comuns, Política Agrícola Comum, Política Comum de Pescas, Política Industrial." Tl,dr: among others: -a complete revision of eu treaties -call for the expansion of eu budget -demand for a social services and job pact for all members. -call for a eu wide ubi -mechanisms for debt forgiveness and renegotiation. -a clear and controlled exit strategy available to member states from the euro. -end the growth and stability pact. This poo poo ain't soviet.txt. (They still suck when they support maduro and mpla) Electronico6 posted:They do throw some real good parties. This i agree. Antifa Poltergeist has issued a correction as of 00:02 on Sep 27, 2018 |
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Sep 27, 2018 00:00
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mila kunis posted:policies I don't think you "get" Italy's new government. It's pure, unfiltered volk and, just like a hundred years ago, we might be breaking new and exciting ground in authoritarianism
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Oct 1, 2018 23:15
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hackbunny posted:I don't think you "get" Italy's new government. It's pure, unfiltered volk and, just like a hundred years ago, we might be breaking new and exciting ground in authoritarianism
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Oct 2, 2018 02:56
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https://twitter.com/Ned_Donovan/status/1046771039814987778?s=19
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Oct 2, 2018 09:38
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Is Italy inhabited by cartoon characters?
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Oct 2, 2018 10:52
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Ya know, reading a piece on Publico that suggests trying to get Luso-Venezuelans and migrants fleeing from there in order to court PSD and CDS for some equivalent of the Cuban community in Miami and fearing that same block might go to protests against oil industries sort of tells me that RWers do have someone that sort of pays attention to the other side of the Atlantic a bit closer than I expected.
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Oct 2, 2018 12:29
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Is Italy inhabited by cartoon characters? youre not european are you
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Oct 2, 2018 16:21
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a pro-refugee italian mayor has been placed under house arrest for setting up "marriages of convenience" for immigrant women, fraudulent waste disposal contracts, and helping illegal migration. the more serious charges against him, which were fiscal-related, have been dropped
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Oct 2, 2018 22:58
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Kunster posted:Ya know, reading a piece on Publico that suggests trying to get Luso-Venezuelans and migrants fleeing from there in order to court PSD and CDS for some equivalent of the Cuban community in Miami and fearing that same block might go to protests against oil industries sort of tells me that RWers do have someone that sort of pays attention to the other side of the Atlantic a bit closer than I expected. Yes,its paulo portas, they are trying to replicate the "retornados" block.its really dumb in a really evil way that will probably work.
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Oct 3, 2018 19:12
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get that OUT of my face posted:that guy who's now in charge of italy's state broadcaster seems extra loving bad He's pretty bad yeah. I did a double take when I heard the name because I remembered him well, but of loving course they were serious
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Oct 3, 2018 23:04
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Antifa Poltergeist posted:Yes,its paulo portas, they are trying to replicate the "retornados" block.its really dumb in a really evil way that will probably work. I mean we already had Sic trying to do that with an horribly ill patient that went from Venezuela to Madeira whose wife ended up tearfully thanking the Portuguese Healthcare system during the entire interview so at the last minute they had to pin him as this burden parasite rather than this victim of communism. At least Fox News goes "Oh thank you for your time" when that happens. Hey at least pundits are now going "Oh poo poo maybe we shouldn't have equated Bolsenaro to Haddad as two sides of the same coin over and over again". Positive???!
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Oct 6, 2018 14:19
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Is Italy inhabited by cartoon characters? bunga bunga
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Oct 6, 2018 15:11
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Kurnugia posted:youre not european are you Australia does act like it's two miles off the coast of England but
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Oct 6, 2018 16:18
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salvini isn't even trying to hide his horrific racism
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Oct 16, 2018 00:48
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https://twitter.com/ronanburtenshaw/status/1052160667803967488 https://twitter.com/ronanburtenshaw/status/1052165338509512710 https://twitter.com/ronanburtenshaw/status/1052174463637352451
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Oct 16, 2018 14:49
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oh what a surprise the centrist was secretly one bad day* away from going fascist *it vaguely looks like politics might shift half an inch to the left
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Oct 16, 2018 15:06
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The saviour of Liberal Europe lmao
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Oct 16, 2018 15:16
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