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Nothingtoseehere
Nov 11, 2010


If the wheelock is more complex than the flintlock, why did the wheellock come 100s of years earlier? Is it some kind of innovation you need to produce flintlocks to begin with?

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Fangz
Jul 5, 2007

Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!

Nothingtoseehere posted:

If the wheelock is more complex than the flintlock, why did the wheellock come 100s of years earlier? Is it some kind of innovation you need to produce flintlocks to begin with?

Technology doesn't proceed as a straight line of increasing complexity. Sometimes the overcomplicated version comes first.

The particular spur to invent the wheel lock probably came from advances in spring-driven clocks in that period. For the inventor, if he had been working on clockwork mechanisms, the idea to use the wheel might seem more obvious, and he would not have been thinking in terms of ease of mass manufacture. That's my speculation anyway, you may also like the 'Leonardo da Vinci did it' theory.

Fangz fucked around with this message at 10:07 on Oct 2, 2018

Polikarpov
Jun 1, 2013

Keep it between the buoys
The sort of mad artisan who would create a piece of weaponized clockwork like the wheelock probably considered a simpler design and rejected it as being inadequately baroque.

Valtonen
May 13, 2014

Tanks still suck but you don't gotta hand it to the Axis either.

Nothingtoseehere posted:

If the wheelock is more complex than the flintlock, why did the wheellock come 100s of years earlier? Is it some kind of innovation you need to produce flintlocks to begin with?

I mean look at the early semi-automatic handguns with their weird toggle-locks like borchardt or Luger. ”New idea to get X done” is usually not the most refined solution.

HEY GUNS
Oct 11, 2012

FOPTIMUS PRIME
the wheellock is the pinnacle of engineering and it's been all downhill from there

Kemper Boyd
Aug 6, 2007

no kings, no gods, no masters but a comfy chair and no socks
I remember reading an old magazine article from 1977 or so, where there was presented a plan to create self-driving cars in West Germany, and it was technologically entirely feasible. The only real problem was cost, since you'd need a bunch of new infrastructure along every street and road and highway, so the tech at available at the time would have worked. Kinda similar with some forms of military tech.

MikeCrotch
Nov 5, 2011

I AM UNJUSTIFIABLY PROUD OF MY SPAGHETTI BOLOGNESE RECIPE

YES, IT IS AN INCREDIBLY SIMPLE DISH

NO, IT IS NOT NORMAL TO USE A PEPPERAMI INSTEAD OF MINCED MEAT

YES, THERE IS TOO MUCH SALT IN MY RECIPE

NO, I WON'T STOP SHARING IT

more like BOLLOCKnese

HEY GUNS posted:

how much chicken can one dude eat at one time? unless he can smoke the meat, salt it, dry it, or can it, it will all go bad within a day

Google Blaine Sumner raw chicken shake

KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010



Runner-up, TRP Sack Race 2021/22

Phanatic posted:

That said.

Flintlock:


Wheelock:


Ok this is good and correct

aphid_licker
Jan 7, 2009


Cyrano4747 posted:

Saskatoon has always sounded to me like a made up name for a joke. I had to go look at an atlas as a kid to prove that yeah, my dad wasn't loving with me.

See also: Blagoveshchensk

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry

Fornax Disaster posted:

Anyone have an idea what this might be? One of the old farmers in my family was using it for a tool box. It's about the size of a small microwave.





It is olive drab with what looks to be 7.32 stenciled on it in a very old looking style. Is that an ammunition size anyone used?



This other tool box came from the same farm, I know what it is though, it has MINE A/T MK V 1943 stamped on it!





These are from southern Ontario.

Don't have my book of various ammo calibers, but I can only hazard a guess that the 7.32 is the caliber, which is close to .280 Ross. That being said, its not 100% accurate, so :shrug:. Only mention I can find of a 7.32mm bullet was a random book/novel that mentioned the Uzi.

Mine box looks like it has a divide between the mines and detonators.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

How do canadians write their units? In the US you'll generally see something like 1st Battalion 8th Marines written like 1/8 but I've seen old German unit markings (think around WW1) that used a period instead of a slash.

Nenonen
Oct 22, 2009

Mulla on aina kolkyt donaa taskussa

Fornax Disaster posted:

Anyone have an idea what this might be? One of the old farmers in my family was using it for a tool box. It's about the size of a small microwave.





Doing some googling, I think it might be a kiddy safety seat box... oh

Jobbo_Fett posted:

Don't have my book of various ammo calibers, but I can only hazard a guess that the 7.32 is the caliber, which is close to .280 Ross. That being said, its not 100% accurate, so :shrug:. Only mention I can find of a 7.32mm bullet was a random book/novel that mentioned the Uzi.

Sometimes ammo boxes have caliber marked slightly differently from the official nomenclature to avoid being mistaken for something else in the same caliber resulting in logistical chaos, dunno if that explains.

bewbies
Sep 23, 2003

Fun Shoe

Cyrano4747 posted:

How do canadians write their units? In the US you'll generally see something like 1st Battalion 8th Marines written like 1/8 but I've seen old German unit markings (think around WW1) that used a period instead of a slash.

As an appropriate representation of Canada it is a mix of new and very, very succinct (brigade groups just have a number and nothing else, ie, "37 Brigade Group") and most profoundly British. For example in Afghanistan I worked with "Princess Louises' Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders of Canada Regiment"

Also a bunch of them are in French, not sure why

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry

Cyrano4747 posted:

How do canadians write their units? In the US you'll generally see something like 1st Battalion 8th Marines written like 1/8 but I've seen old German unit markings (think around WW1) that used a period instead of a slash.

Could also be a date. July 1932.



Fake edit: I might have it?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/32_Canadian_Brigade_Group

32nd Canadian Brigade Group - Located in Toronto (IE: Southern Ontario) and active from 1942 to 1946 (which fits with the A/T Mine box timeframe)


Double edit:

Royal Canadian Ordnance Corps / Royal Canadian Electrical and Mechanical Engineers
No.2 Group, No.1 (Reserve) Divisional Workshop, (RCOC) RCEME
No.5 (Reserve) Light Aid Detachment, (RCOC) RCEME
No.6 (Reserve) Light Aid Detachment, (RCOC) RCEME
No.7 (Reserve) Light Aid Detachment, (RCOC) RCEME
No.8 (Reserve) Light Aid Detachment, (RCOC) RCEME


Note unit number - Engineers/Ordnance



Triple edit:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corps_of_Royal_Canadian_Electrical_and_Mechanical_Engineers

"The majority of RCEME (/ˈriːmiː/ REE-mee, even though there is a "C" in it, just as "REME" is pronounced) technicians were, and still are, vehicle mechanics, but the original RCEME structure incorporated 25 different trades and sub-trades, employing specialists for each particular job in order to train and deploy them in time to meet the war's demand. While it was somewhat bulky, it was nonetheless a centralized structure for maintaining the Army's everyday equipment which was more efficient than the previous system of having each corps perform its own equipment maintenance, and also allowed for a greater degree of specialization within trades."

Jobbo_Fett fucked around with this message at 14:24 on Oct 2, 2018

JcDent
May 13, 2013

Give me a rifle, one round, and point me at Berlin!

Nebakenezzer posted:

Chapter 1 had a dude who joined up and had been a postman, so he was a military postman for his entire time in the service

I am learning a few things, though. This 1944 conscription crisis is dumb as gently caress. Basically the invasion of Europe ground down Canadian infantry so much that cooks and medics were being reassigned gulf war style, and without the proper training naturally they were getting killed really quickly. In order to get out of it, PM King (hm, now I get why we refer to him always as Mackenzie King) sent a letter to Churchill to ask if he wouldn't mind saying publically "It's alright brah, we don't need those divisions you have in Canada, we're good"

Churchill said no

So out of 700,000 men in the army mentioned in the book, 70,000 became casualties. That doesn't sound too much in a World War and for a country of 11 million... So how come there was a shortage?

E: Well, I understand the whole teeth: tail thing, and that they also had a Navy and an Air Force to take care of, but it seems like everyone started running out of people fast in WWII.

JcDent fucked around with this message at 14:40 on Oct 2, 2018

HEY GUNS
Oct 11, 2012

FOPTIMUS PRIME

MikeCrotch posted:

Google Blaine Sumner raw chicken shake
i refuse

Mr Enderby
Mar 28, 2015

Nothingtoseehere posted:

If the wheelock is more complex than the flintlock, why did the wheellock come 100s of years earlier? Is it some kind of innovation you need to produce flintlocks to begin with?

Sometimes stuff is over-designed, and the innovation is to refine it. Like with harpoons. For centuries europeans used these big arrow-shaped two flue harpoons. Then in the 19th century they discovered if you just leave one of the flues off it becomes hugely more effective, and that's why we don't have very many whales any more (also later on European and American whalers start using the toggling harpoon, which was invented by arctic people from pre-historic times, because technology doesn't move in straight lines).

SeanBeansShako
Nov 20, 2009

Now the Drums beat up again,
For all true Soldier Gentlemen.
It works with uniforms too, practical designs and styles are taken and just absorbed in or adapted from the environment.

Nebakenezzer
Sep 13, 2005

The Mote in God's Eye

ChubbyChecker posted:

I have few questions for Canadians:



I take it means some sort of hillbilly, but the other interpretation is funny too:






Drunk?


]

God damned? And is the 'lets the chickens go wild and rides a horse to a town' literal or figurative?


Beaten pretty much on every point, but I wanted to say:

The 'hunky' thing caught me by surprise, too. I lived in Saskatoon for a few years, and never heard the term. In Saskatchewan, anyway, it'd be a bit dumb, as it is the single largest ethnic group people are descended from. I also have to repeat that Canada was coming off of the Great Depression, and was considerably more rural. That sometimes translates to poor AF. As for booze, well, drinking and loving are, ahem, in proportion to other personal histories, its just collected under topic headings, so 1. almost certainly yes, and 2. we will get there.

Epicurius
Apr 10, 2010
College Slice

Nebakenezzer posted:

The 'hunky' thing caught me by surprise, too. I lived in Saskatoon for a few years, and never heard the term. In Saskatchewan, anyway, it'd be a bit dumb, as it is the single largest ethnic group people are descended from.

People tended to be more casual about throwing around ethnic slurs in the '30s than today, too.

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry
So I've been reading a book on booby traps and holy poo poo, there's nothing that has given me a better appreciation for the work combat engineers do. :stonk:

feedmegin
Jul 30, 2008

bewbies posted:

Also a bunch of them are in French, not sure why

You...have heard of Quebec, right? :shobon:

ilmucche
Mar 16, 2016

What did you say the strategy was?

feedmegin posted:

You...have heard of Quebec, right? :shobon:

Yeah but we're talking about canada, not quebec.

Vive la Quebec libre

GotLag
Jul 17, 2005

食べちゃダメだよ

feedmegin posted:

You...have heard of Quebec, right? :shobon:

Yeah it comes after Papa and before Romeo

Fornax Disaster
Apr 11, 2005

If you need me I'll be in Holodeck Four.

Jobbo_Fett posted:

Could also be a date. July 1932.



Fake edit: I might have it?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/32_Canadian_Brigade_Group

32nd Canadian Brigade Group - Located in Toronto (IE: Southern Ontario) and active from 1942 to 1946 (which fits with the A/T Mine box timeframe)


Double edit:

Royal Canadian Ordnance Corps / Royal Canadian Electrical and Mechanical Engineers
No.2 Group, No.1 (Reserve) Divisional Workshop, (RCOC) RCEME
No.5 (Reserve) Light Aid Detachment, (RCOC) RCEME
No.6 (Reserve) Light Aid Detachment, (RCOC) RCEME
No.7 (Reserve) Light Aid Detachment, (RCOC) RCEME
No.8 (Reserve) Light Aid Detachment, (RCOC) RCEME


Note unit number - Engineers/Ordnance



Triple edit:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corps_of_Royal_Canadian_Electrical_and_Mechanical_Engineers

"The majority of RCEME (/ˈriːmiː/ REE-mee, even though there is a "C" in it, just as "REME" is pronounced) technicians were, and still are, vehicle mechanics, but the original RCEME structure incorporated 25 different trades and sub-trades, employing specialists for each particular job in order to train and deploy them in time to meet the war's demand. While it was somewhat bulky, it was nonetheless a centralized structure for maintaining the Army's everyday equipment which was more efficient than the previous system of having each corps perform its own equipment maintenance, and also allowed for a greater degree of specialization within trades."

This could well be it, these were found only a few kms from the former site of the old BCATP airfield at Hagerville, which according to this was a RCEME depot post war:

http://militarybruce.com/abandoned-canadian-military-bases/abandoned-bases/ontario/

quote:

Opened on 8 August 1941 under the British Commonwealth Air Training Plan near Hagersville, with Relief Landing Fields at Kohler and Dufferin. No. 16 SFTS closed on 30 March 1945.

The station was taken over by the Army on 21 September 1945.

Camp Hagersville, as it was re-named, was used by the Royal Canadian Electrical Mechanical Engineer Corps as a maintenance facility, but the Royal Canadian Ordnance Corps as a depot facility and by the Royal Canadian Army Service Corps as a driver training centre. Permanent Married Quarters were constructed for the families of soldiers posted to the camp.

Tias
May 25, 2008

Pictured: the patron saint of internet political arguments (probably)

This avatar made possible by a gift from the Religionthread Posters Relief Fund

Jobbo_Fett posted:

So I've been reading a book on booby traps and holy poo poo, there's nothing that has given me a better appreciation for the work combat engineers do. :stonk:

Tell us about hard to remove traps

or better, rear end in a top hat surprise traps!

ChubbyChecker
Mar 25, 2018

Fornax Disaster posted:

Anyone have an idea what this might be? One of the old farmers in my family was using it for a tool box. It's about the size of a small microwave.





It is olive drab with what looks to be 7.32 stenciled on it in a very old looking style. Is that an ammunition size anyone used?



This other tool box came from the same farm, I know what it is though, it has MINE A/T MK V 1943 stamped on it!





These are from southern Ontario.

it's a microwave oven with 7:32 time left

ChubbyChecker
Mar 25, 2018

Don Gato posted:

So we've been bringing up Japanese guns a lot over the past two pages, and I've got a few related question. I've seen some drawings of Japanese musketeers with some kind of box over the back end of the gun, is that to keep the powder and match dry? And was there any particular reason I haven't seen the same kind of box on European arquebuses of the same era?


Related but I was digging through my photos the other day and I came across some absolutely gorgeous Turkish muskets that were on display at the Metropolitan Museum of Art in NYC. Everyone should have decorated their guns like that, what's the point of going to war if your weapons aren't as fabulous as you are.

post pics

zoux
Apr 28, 2006

I'm reading Bernard Cornwell's Warlord Trilogy (which is his take on Arthurian Legends if you don't know) and I'm curious what the architecture looked like in sub-Roman Britain? Was it all repurposed villas or did the Britons build their own poo poo?

Secondary question: do you guys find Cornwell to be a good author of historical fiction?

ChubbyChecker
Mar 25, 2018

zoux posted:

I'm reading Bernard Cornwell's Warlord Trilogy (which is his take on Arthurian Legends if you don't know) and I'm curious what the architecture looked like in sub-Roman Britain? Was it all repurposed villas or did the Britons build their own poo poo?

Secondary question: do you guys find Cornwell to be a good author of historical fiction?

yes

Hunt11
Jul 24, 2013

Grimey Drawer

zoux posted:

Secondary question: do you guys find Cornwell to be a good author of historical fiction?

I read a bit of one of his Agincourt books which seemed decent enough and thought it is a history book I did like his account of Waterloo.

bewbies
Sep 23, 2003

Fun Shoe
i really loved the saxon stories and like 3 of his standalone books but my tastes are pretty plebeian by the standards of this thread

KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010



Runner-up, TRP Sack Race 2021/22
I like him, he is no Patrick O’Brien but that’s a pretty high bar.

OctaviusBeaver
Apr 30, 2009

Say what now?
He's not bad but all of his books feel very samey. Reminds me of G.A. Henty but with a dash of anticlericalism.

P-Mack
Nov 10, 2007

He's very workmanlike but perfectly acceptable reads. He usually has notes at the end of each book about what was accurate, what was changed, and what was made up entirely.

zoux
Apr 28, 2006

bewbies posted:

i really loved the saxon stories and like 3 of his standalone books but my tastes are pretty plebeian by the standards of this thread

Did you watch The Last Kingdom? It's all on Netflix.

SeanBeansShako
Nov 20, 2009

Now the Drums beat up again,
For all true Soldier Gentlemen.
He's alright.

I might be biased though.

OpenlyEvilJello
Dec 28, 2009

Tias posted:

Tell us about hard to remove traps

or better, rear end in a top hat surprise traps!

Have you heard of Tomb of Horrors?

KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

I like him, he is no Patrick O’Brien but that’s a pretty high bar.

:agreed:

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

zoux posted:

Did you watch The Last Kingdom? It's all on Netflix.

I tried to watch that, and the main character seems just seems so lost and inexplicably foolish that I couldn't keep going.

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KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010



Runner-up, TRP Sack Race 2021/22
is it young Uhtred because he is a loving idiot knob in the books

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