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Helsing posted:Pelosi sat on the knowledge of the allegations against Kavanaugh for weeks or months before someone leaked it and forced her hand. The Democrats questioning Kavanaugh didn't coordinate efforts before hand. The party relied on an obviously biased FBI investigation instead of digging up dirt themselves and using it against Kavanaugh during the hearing when it would have mattered. Not to detract from your overall point, but I think you meant to say Feinstein.
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Oct 5, 2018 23:20
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Lol my dyslexia strikes again. The word in my brain turned into a totally unrelated set of letters by the time it reached my fingers.
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Oct 5, 2018 23:23
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Oh no, my dyslexia, making me write a totally grammatically accurate name of a political figure unrelated to my argument! Almost as if you could switch dyslexia for ignorance and reach the same result! Anyway, Ford has said that sitting on the testimony was her own decision, and thanked Feinstein for not releasing it, so shut up. There's ten million other reasons to hang Feinstei from a lamppost, no reason to invent ones.
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Oct 5, 2018 23:31
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I'm seeing a lot of rightful anger on social media and I think the Democrats underestimate just how much of this is going to get redirected to them if they treat this like just another vote and get back to palling around with their friends the Republicans. People hate villains but they hate traitors more.
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Oct 5, 2018 23:58
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Ytlaya posted:Even if you disagreed with other peoples' decisions to not vote for the "lesser evil" in cases like that, the pragmatic thing to do would be to still encourage politicians to move to the left (unless, of course, they were actually opposed to that ideologically).
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Oct 6, 2018 00:16
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steinrokkan posted:Oh no, my dyslexia, making me write a totally grammatically accurate name of a political figure unrelated to my argument! Uhm, yes? Like, quite literally that is what happens.
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Oct 6, 2018 00:44
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Matt Zerella posted:I hate it but it's also a very good containment zone which should be allowed to be invaded when 2 Rs vote No and 2 Dems vote yes to get Kavanaugh on the court. But I'm just spitballing here. But have you considered that in an alternative timeline where 0 Dems voted for Kavanaugh, the two R No's might have voted Yes? Since you can't literally explore alternate timelines, you must conclude that every action the Democrats take is the best possible action. J.B. CURES KANSAS posted:Like if you think a caucus that tolerates someone like Joe Manchin in their midst is ever going to impeach Kavanaugh or pack the courts then you have literal loving brain damage. Look, unless you can travel to the future and prove that the Democrats won't do (insert extremely unlikely good thing), it is very cynical and, uh, "nothing matters" (I think that's how this term is used?) to assume as such. Ytlaya fucked around with this message at 01:21 on Oct 6, 2018 |
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Oct 6, 2018 01:12
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Ytlaya posted:But have you considered that in an alternative timeline where 0 Dems voted for Kavanaugh, the two R No's might have voted Yes? Since you can't literally explore alternate timelines, you must conclude that every action the Democrats take is the best possible action. I had not friend,
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Oct 6, 2018 01:13
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By the way, I'm ashamed to admit that I actually thought there was a decent chance Kavanaugh's nomination would be blocked, largely because it's not exactly hard to choose some other non-rapist conservative shitheel. But apparently I expected too much.
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Oct 6, 2018 02:02
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Helsing posted:Pelosi sat on the knowledge of the allegations against Kavanaugh for weeks or months before someone leaked it and forced her hand. The Democrats questioning Kavanaugh didn't coordinate efforts before hand. The party relied on an obviously biased FBI investigation instead of digging up dirt themselves and using it against Kavanaugh during the hearing when it would have mattered. Really hope it blows up in their faces. Only way forward is to purify the party of them.
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Oct 6, 2018 02:10
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Ytlaya posted:By the way, I'm ashamed to admit that I actually thought there was a decent chance Kavanaugh's nomination would be blocked, largely because it's not exactly hard to choose some other non-rapist conservative shitheel. But apparently I expected too much. I figured there may he some incredibly small chance but the reality is that Trump is the truth of the Republican part not some aberration. There was no way they would not do anything he wants and we need to be prepared when they straight up support him doing openly illegal things using his position. Remember Kavanaugh is one of Bush's boys. Like does anyone who isn't a braindead political reporter think they would do anything when Trump starts REALLY abusing his authority? The political "experts" have literally no credibility. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 02:37 on Oct 6, 2018 |
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Oct 6, 2018 02:34
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There's a reason republicans can do things with 51 senators that the democrats can't with 60. Republicans would rather punish disloyalty on policy even if it means losing control of a chamber, while democrats prefer to reward membership in the name of getting control of a chamber, even if it means losing policy due to disloyalty. The point of winning power is using it. Republicans want to pass their preferred policy, democrats want to stay in power regardless of policy.
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Oct 6, 2018 02:39
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Yeah, an alternative candidate was never happening because abandoning Kavanaugh would be considered a Loss, and Trump isn't going to lose. It would make him look weak and that ain't happening in his addled brain.
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Oct 6, 2018 02:40
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joepinetree posted:The point of winning power is using it. You goddamn leftist. Stop attacking manchin! 
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Oct 6, 2018 02:41
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I saw idiots today saying that by opposing Manchin you were damaging the ability of Democrats to fix DACA. Like you dumb fuckers, the man has literally come out saying he opposes DACA. He isn't doing poo poo for that and he's proud about it. The guy uses white supremacist arguments for Trump's wall. That's who the Democrats have as a leader in their party. If there was any justice this week would discredit the entire DC press core and pundit class that has been selling us the lie that there are moderate Republicans that care about anything other than making sure Daddy Trump doesn't yell at them. Bill Kristol had the audacity to say people who called EXACTLY how this would go down after Flake called for the FBI report cynical and mean to Flake. None of these overpaid morons has any business discussing politics since they have a fundamental disconnect and live in a fantasy land. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 02:54 on Oct 6, 2018 |
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Oct 6, 2018 02:51
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The Trump thread is very frustrating to read, because people are so smug in their condescending dismissal of the left (which is frequently referred to as "the nothing matters crew" for some reason). It seems like one of the more common talking points involves characterizing "acknowledging that mainstream Democrats - and the support thereof - are not going to solve our problems" as some sort of "nothing matters" ambivalence and blind pessimism. edit: The interesting thing is that you can generally tell pretty easily which liberals might come over to the actual left as the political landscape changes and which ones are destined to ultimately be fundamentally ideologically opposed. This whole Manchin thing is a good example; the folks who insist on not only defending him in these discussions, but condemning those who get angry at him are people who are fundamentally political adversaries in the exact same way conservatives are. Some liberals currently don't identify with (or disagree with) the radical left simply due to the state of current mainstream politics and the inertia against leaving the ideological mainstream, and those are people who might be swayed in the future, but others are very clearly fundamentally opposed in a way where they wouldn't ever agree with the radical left, even if the radical left became more mainstream. Ytlaya fucked around with this message at 03:24 on Oct 6, 2018 |
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Oct 6, 2018 03:19
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It's honestly incredibly vile and I don't know how so many people can bring themselves to be so smug about saying that a vote for the rapist who will happily dismantle pretty much everything good done in the past few decades actually doesn't matter much.
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Oct 6, 2018 03:27
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Radish posted:IIf there was any justice this week would discredit the entire DC press core and pundit class that has been selling us the lie If the transparent lies leading to the Iraq war didn't cause anyone but Phil Donahue lose their jobs, why would this do anything? There are dozens of op-ed hacks constantly proving that if you go to the right school and kiss the right rings you can be wrong every week about everything and make bank for the rest of your life.
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Oct 6, 2018 03:34
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You forgot Dan Rather, the man who was only against Iraq after Bush's no-show gig at the National Guard was proven to be common knowledge.
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Oct 6, 2018 03:46
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https://twitter.com/peterdaou/status/1048307218716790784 What's infected Peter Daou and how can we spread it around a bit more?
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Oct 6, 2018 03:53
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Saagonsa posted:It's honestly incredibly vile and I don't know how so many people can bring themselves to be so smug about saying that a vote for the rapist who will happily dismantle pretty much everything good done in the past few decades actually doesn't matter much. Yeah; it seems like, even if you thought voting for Manchin was still optimal, you'd at least take a conciliatory sort of tone about it. Like "yeah it really sucks and I totally get why someone wouldn't want to vote for him, but it still seems like the better option, unfortunately." I'd disagree with that person, but at least they wouldn't be a smug prick. Instead, the tone used by these people implies that they clearly feel more disdain towards the "purist" left who rejects people like Manchin than they do Manchin himself (or others like him). Supporting a lesser evil like that isn't something you proudly do and condemn others for not doing; it's something you reluctantly do while focusing your efforts on avoiding having to make such a lovely choice again in the future (and you certainly don't get annoyed at other people being unwilling to make the same choice).
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Oct 6, 2018 03:54
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Going from Russian bots to GRU agents is something magical, I tell you hwat
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Oct 6, 2018 03:57
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Saagonsa posted:It's honestly incredibly vile and I don't know how so many people can bring themselves to be so smug about saying that a vote for the rapist who will happily dismantle pretty much everything good done in the past few decades actually doesn't matter much. They're all ex hillshills. None of this is surprising. They're still stuck in the Obama smug liberal era of thought and it's been pretty amazing seeing that poo poo survive in a post escalator world. Someone unironically used Malcom X to justify Manchin being in the party.
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Oct 6, 2018 04:03
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Office Pig posted:Going from Russian bots to GRU agents is something magical, I tell you hwat It's pretty hilarious seeing centrists become the insane conspiracy theorist they mocked only a few years ago. Edit: also, the reason why all the Trump thread posters suck poo poo is that politics is merely a team sport to them and every last one of them lack a moral/policy framework to their political beliefs. That's how you get people saying they'd vote for loving Hitler if he was (D-OH). BadOptics fucked around with this message at 04:18 on Oct 6, 2018 |
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Oct 6, 2018 04:15
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J.B. CURES KANSAS posted:https://twitter.com/peterdaou/status/1048307218716790784 He's foreign, so he actually cares about the fact that we have a heavily armed racial purity police that uses a decade+ old enabling act authored in part by Joe Biden to whisk children away to the camps.
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Oct 6, 2018 04:19
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Matt Zerella posted:Someone unironically used Malcom X to justify Manchin being in the party. Yeah that was just... poo poo. Libs, man.
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Oct 6, 2018 04:20
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Matt Zerella posted:Someone unironically used Malcom X to justify Manchin being in the party.
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Oct 6, 2018 05:00
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EdithUpwards posted:He's foreign, so he actually cares about the fact that we have a heavily armed racial purity police that uses a decade+ old enabling act authored in part by Joe Biden to whisk children away to the camps. To his credit, when ICE was at the forefront of everyone's minds a few months ago, he actually did admit that Democrats were complicit in the creation of the current immigration system and should be taken to task on it. Daou is honestly kind of weird.
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Oct 6, 2018 05:33
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Saagonsa posted:It's honestly incredibly vile and I don't know how so many people can bring themselves to be so smug about saying that a vote for the rapist who will happily dismantle pretty much everything good done in the past few decades actually doesn't matter much. It is called being a rich rear end in a top hat The cure involves a labor camp and seeing 90% of what you own taken by the revolution. Lightning Knight posted:To his credit, when ICE was at the forefront of everyone's minds a few months ago, he actually did admit that Democrats were complicit in the creation of the current immigration system and should be taken to task on it. Daou is honestly kind of weird. Chairman Daou is love, Chairman Daou is life.
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Oct 6, 2018 05:52
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J.B. CURES KANSAS posted:Like if you think a caucus that tolerates someone like Joe Manchin in their midst is ever going to impeach Kavanaugh or pack the courts then you have literal loving brain damage. The funniest thing about the Trump thread smoothbrains is that they simultaneously try to justify this poo poo with supporting Manchin being necessary because the Dems need as much power as possible and that if you point out all the lovely things he's done you'll somehow hurt voter enthusiasm, as if the natural reaction of any decent person to the argument that you only hang out with some vile shithead because it provides you with power isn't utter revulsion towards everybody involved. It's a really weird disconnect where posting dems bad on a dead internet comedy forums unacceptably damaging to turnout, but what the Dems in Congress do is completely unrelated to turnout. Then again, this isn't even the dumbest thing that the Trump thread cultists have psyched themselves into believing so I guess it isn't very surprising.
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Oct 6, 2018 06:23
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Cerebral Bore posted:The funniest thing about the Trump thread smoothbrains is that they simultaneously try to justify this poo poo with supporting Manchin being necessary because the Dems need as much power as possible and that if you point out all the lovely things he's done you'll somehow hurt voter enthusiasm, as if the natural reaction of any decent person to the argument that you only hang out with some vile shithead because it provides you with power isn't utter revulsion towards everybody involved. He's not the ~~~deciding~~~ vote which is a stupid concept. Voting records don't matter unless they have the deciding vote, I guess. https://twitter.com/michaelwhitney/status/1048303731207557120
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Oct 6, 2018 06:26
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theCalamity posted:He's not the ~~~deciding~~~ vote which is a stupid concept. Voting records don't matter unless they have the deciding vote, I guess. It's also funny that they say this, as if Manchin wouldn't pull a Jim Justice if it actually came down to the wire.
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Oct 6, 2018 06:30
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Cerebral Bore posted:It's also funny that they say this, as if Manchin wouldn't pull a Jim Justice if it actually came down to the wire. There's this idea that Manchin is only performing for votes. Every time I bring up how Manchin endorsed the GOP candidate for WV governor over the democratic candidate after Manchin lost the primary, I hear nothing but crickets.
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Oct 6, 2018 06:34
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theCalamity posted:There's this idea that Manchin is only performing for votes. Every time I bring up how Manchin endorsed the GOP candidate for WV governor over the democratic candidate after Manchin lost the primary, I hear nothing but crickets. Do they ever tell you how they square this idea with their oft-repeated assertion that WV is such a red state that only a GOP or GOP-lite candidate can win there? Because it would seem that these two assertions taken at face value would imply that you absolutely cannot trust Manchin to support the Dems when it matters.
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Oct 6, 2018 06:41
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Cerebral Bore posted:Do they ever tell you how they square this idea with their oft-repeated assertion that WV is such a red state that only a GOP or GOP-lite candidate can win there? Because it would seem that these two assertions taken at face value would imply that you absolutely cannot trust Manchin to support the Dems when it matters. All the time! But they don't ever make that connection even when I point it out. They justify it away with how he wasn't the deciding vote on anything except saving the ACA.
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Oct 6, 2018 06:43
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Welp, we killled it. It's finally dead.
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Oct 6, 2018 07:45
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neato
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Oct 6, 2018 07:45
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Axetrain fucked around with this message at 07:56 on Oct 6, 2018 |
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Oct 6, 2018 07:53
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Oct 6, 2018 08:03
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What's the matter? Nick Mullen got you pushing too many pencils?
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Oct 6, 2018 08:05
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