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Bogart posted:MIA: Routine. Remember when it was contemporary with Soma? Routine predated Alien: Isolation. It's an actual ghost haunting the horror genre.
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Oct 12, 2018 19:28
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FreudianSlippers posted:Giallo is usually non-supernatural* whodunit stuff though. Like one of the reasons Argento made Suspiria was to distance himself from giallo by making supernatural. Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 19:37 on Oct 12, 2018 |
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Oct 12, 2018 19:34
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Synth music in general is sadly missing from Horror. And if you want some kind of technicolor nightmare that's a Argento movie, I'd like something that better encapsulates the summer camp slasher like The Burning or Camp Sleepaway. I know Friday the 13th: The Game exists, I suck at it and that's fine. But I'm talking about a single player experience where you're the kid in a camp that slow burns itself into survival horror.
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Oct 12, 2018 19:51
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Crabtree posted:Synth music in general is sadly missing from Horror. And if you want some kind of technicolor nightmare that's a Argento movie, I'd like something that better encapsulates the summer camp slasher like The Burning or Camp Sleepaway. I know Friday the 13th: The Game exists, I suck at it and that's fine. But I'm talking about a single player experience where you're the kid in a camp that slow burns itself into survival horror. Zombies are last decade's horror, for sure, but Dying Light had some seriously good fake John Carpenter music going in it, and it did occasionally dip into decent horror. I had more fun running night missions in Dying Light than I had in any of Outlast or other running away based horror.
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Oct 12, 2018 20:04
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That's because Dying Light wanted their running to actually be a big part of the game, running around, climbing stuff, jumping off and between stuff, it was actually made to feel good and make you wanna parkour. Outlast gives you no options because they want to subject you to more of their edgy schlock.
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Oct 12, 2018 20:44
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Its just a shame that Outlast was a fluke in how well the original and whistle blower's theme was so far from what the creator actually intended to present. Is there any other game that tries to do Argento/Carpenter/80s Rick Wakeman synth as that was able to convey a kind of music that goes hand in hand with video games.
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Oct 12, 2018 21:05
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Crabtree posted:Is there any other game that tries to do Argento/Carpenter/80s Rick Wakeman synth as that was able to convey a kind of music that goes hand in hand with video games.
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Oct 12, 2018 21:12
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Crabtree posted:Its just a shame that Outlast was a fluke in how well the original and whistle blower's theme was so far from what the creator actually intended to present. Not horror unless you count pixelated warcrimes. But goon made game Brigador has a John Carpenter as gently caress soundtrack.
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Oct 12, 2018 21:27
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Yardbomb posted:Still despite all this, like every other time I ever check in on the couple DbD streamers I've followed who aren't dickweeds, they're pretty frequently like "God I hope Last Year swings in and does well" so there's still people really wanting it to succeed Yardbomb posted:That's because Dying Light wanted their running to actually be a big part of the game, running around, climbing stuff, jumping off and between stuff, it was actually made to feel good and make you wanna parkour. Cardiovorax fucked around with this message at 22:08 on Oct 12, 2018 |
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Oct 12, 2018 22:06
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Yardbomb posted:That's because Dying Light wanted their running to actually be a big part of the game, running around, climbing stuff, jumping off and between stuff, it was actually made to feel good and make you wanna parkour. I'm still mystified that the DLC went for driving. The flatter landscape stripped the usefulness out of all the parkour abilities but the car just wasn't as fun to use. That and the ending was shite.
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Oct 12, 2018 22:15
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Cardiovorax posted:Any particular reason why? Honest question. I'm not a multiplayer person and Dead By Daylight seems like it does its core gameplay very well, speaking as someone who has never actually played it. If the habitual crowd thinks that it has any glaring weaknesses, I'd be interested in knowing what they are. I don't know, I kept playing because it was fun. I liked the plot, it worked for me, though the game was as big as a skyrim.
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Oct 12, 2018 22:16
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Cardiovorax posted:Any particular reason why? Honest question. I'm not a multiplayer person and Dead By Daylight seems like it does its core gameplay very well, speaking as someone who has never actually played it. If the habitual crowd thinks that it has any glaring weaknesses, I'd be interested in knowing what they are. The game is heinously unbalanced in favor of the survivor's side is the short of it. A decent chunk of the game's high level (Killer-leaning mostly) personalities are pretty obviously fed up with the game, but that's where they've made their community and that's where they get those views and subs, so they're really kind of trapped there until another game can finally "compete" with DbD. Probably the best killer player in the game (Marth88) straight up dumped the game when Deathgarden came out, made a big deal of it and everything, then had to miserably come right back when Deathgarden sputtered out insanely fast. They've made no bones about what happened either, they own up to having come back to DbD pretty much defeated the way they were, so they stick with the drudgery of playing it until something better hopefully comes. For a bit of a deeper explanation, I'll quote the posts I made in our still new-ish thread for the game here on SA. Yardbomb posted:It's the very opposite, unless you're using "higher" to say "the big number (20-10) ranks" in that weird way. Yardbomb posted:It's the same reason as the Depth thought, they're not more "lethal" in this case but survivors are absolutely the stronger side and there's a bunch of ~personalities~ for this game that are great big douchebags, so a lot of people don't want to bother getting bullied by bullshit SWF groups. Which hey that brings me to another thought, outside voice chat hurt this game a lot. The devs explicitly kept it out in the original design, there's still a bunch of launch/early perks that make this really obvious, where they're balanced almost entirely on the survivors not being able to give their whole team the constant play-by-play, really the entire idea of people being on the hook and "Is it safe or is it dangerous to go for the save" as well, guess what happened when they caved to people haranguing them for a full team queue (SWF, Survive With Friends) option.
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Oct 12, 2018 22:25
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Thanks for spelling it out. The videos I watched didn't make it look that bad, but on retrospect, the survivors did win disproportionately often. In an asymmetric game like this, it's easy to put it down to player skill, but gameplay balance does matter a lot. Apparently, people have strong feelings about the developer screwing up there.Skyscraper posted:I don't know, I kept playing because it was fun. I liked the plot, it worked for me, though the game was as big as a skyrim.
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Oct 12, 2018 22:50
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Dead By Daylight is the Smash Brothers of asymmetrical games, but also only one side gets to pick Bayonetta and the genre lacks a Tekken or Fighterz.
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Oct 12, 2018 22:59
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Cardiovorax posted:It's a really fun game to actually play, but yeah, how much of a total douche you need to be for the main plot and how much of it is just deferred fetch quests really ruined my enjoyment of it. I never finished the game, as such, although I finished leveling my character. Do you have to be a douche? I thought it was a game about saving a population from a Heart of Darkness-esque dictator? That guy seemed like a dick to everyone? And then you keep the city safe from (GOVERNMENT)'s bombers?
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Oct 12, 2018 23:32
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Skyscraper posted:Do you have to be a douche? I thought it was a game about saving a population from a Heart of Darkness-esque dictator? That guy seemed like a dick to everyone? And then you keep the city safe from (GOVERNMENT)'s bombers?
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Oct 12, 2018 23:52
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Cardiovorax posted:There is that section where you burn vital anti-zombie vaccine because your government bigwig bosses tell you to in the name of "the Greater Good" that really made me feel super lovely, so yeah, I think you really have to be a douche and don't get to make any choices about it either. crane is a pretty weird character because his intro implies that he's an intelligence operative and you'd think anyone selected for the job wouldn't think twice about doing 'whatever's necessary' but he complains like hell about that act and he's pretty much in open rebellion against his handlers for the rest of the game. Honestly the meta plot about the origin of the virus is schlocky beyond belief but the story of crane's interactions with the refuges of the zombie attack isn't half bad. then of course you get the crazy dream level which is a bit....completely lol but i think it's a pretty serviceable plot. also dying light is not remotely horrific. even against the psycho night zombies you simply have way too many tools of mobility to make the player ever feel truly vulnerable.
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Oct 12, 2018 23:58
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A big flaming stink posted:crane is a pretty weird character because his intro implies that he's an intelligence operative and you'd think anyone selected for the job wouldn't think twice about doing 'whatever's necessary' but he complains like hell about that act and he's pretty much in open rebellion against his handlers for the rest of the game.
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Oct 13, 2018 00:06
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asymmetrical competitive gameplay is, afaict, bar none the most hellish structure to design for. Meta balance at the upper end for a game with as much player variance as DbD is basically impossible. The issue is compounded for streamer types because they ride right up to the meta as fast as anyone, and content creators tend to be socially incentivized into antagonism with the developer.
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Oct 13, 2018 00:18
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Discendo Vox posted:asymmetrical competitive gameplay is, afaict, bar none the most hellish structure to design for. Meta balance at the upper end for a game with as much player variance as DbD is basically impossible. The issue is compounded for streamer types because they ride right up to the meta as fast as anyone, and content creators tend to be socially incentivized into antagonism with the developer. would you consider L4D versus symmetrical or asymmetrical? e: hell, Dying Light's versus mode as well A big flaming stink fucked around with this message at 00:25 on Oct 13, 2018 |
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Oct 13, 2018 00:22
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A big flaming stink posted:would you consider L4D versus symmetrical or asymmetrical?
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Oct 13, 2018 00:27
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man, I remember when I was optimistic about Evolve for like, a brief period before it actually released
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Oct 13, 2018 00:33
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Cardiovorax posted:Asymmetrical, if you ask me. The Infected side has a distinctly different skillset from the Survivor side. It's not as harshly asymmetrical as games like Dead By Daylight, but the sides are basically playing different games with different approaches to success. It's easier to balance out because L4D gameplay hinges on the Infected playing in groups and repeatedly dying over the course of a level and getting to exploit their respawn mechanic much like they do in singleplayer mode. It's a game of attrition, not a game of straightforwardly winning or losing. You also get 4 brains vs 4 brains in L4D, instead of 1 v whatever in stuff like DBD or F13.
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Oct 13, 2018 00:39
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A big flaming stink posted:would you consider L4D versus symmetrical or asymmetrical? Symmetrical in the same way Attack/Defend game modes are. Unless there's modes I'm forgetting about, you play both sides of a given stretch of a campaign and then are rated based on your survivor performance compared to the other side. Each round itself is asymmetrical but the total package is symmetrical. I mean that's the easy way to make asymmetrical game modes balanced. I think Splinter Cell did that as well? And any Attack/Defend mode in any shooter does it. For obvious reasons it can't really apply when it's not two teams but 1 v >1. Best you could do is Hide or Die's system, or like any of Halo's Juggernaut modes. TGLT fucked around with this message at 00:46 on Oct 13, 2018 |
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Oct 13, 2018 00:42
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Evolve was fun when it went f2p. They really got creative with the new loadouts and made it feel pretty fair and skillbased. If only the bigwigs gave it more than like four months to become profitable  .
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Oct 13, 2018 00:49
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Lunatic Sledge posted:man, I remember when I was optimistic about Evolve Evolve was real cool, but it was bogged down in 2K bullshit from birth to death. Bogart posted:Evolve was fun when it went f2p. They really got creative with the new loadouts and made it feel pretty fair and skillbased. If only the bigwigs gave it more than like four months to become profitable This too, Evolve Stage 2 was a lot of fun and they had a ton of people playing, then they decided to axe Turtle Rock because the game wasn't magically making money.
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Oct 13, 2018 00:54
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How well does Eternal Darkness emulate? I don't know if I want to bother digging the Wii out for it Edit: I have a WiiU but I don't know if that thing can be modded to run GameCube titles
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Oct 13, 2018 01:12
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Runs perfectly on WiiU if you're willing to jump through some homebrewing hoops.
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Oct 13, 2018 01:22
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Len posted:How well does Eternal Darkness emulate? I don't know if I want to bother digging the Wii out for it
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Oct 13, 2018 01:24
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Cardiovorax posted:Dolphin Emulator wiki says it's playable from beginning to end with minor problems. Easier than modding a console for it, that's for certain. what else are you going to do with a wiiu
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Oct 13, 2018 01:29
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Bogart posted:what else are you going to do with a wiiu I know right? And people wonder why I'm wary of the Switch. I dunno, could be I got burned on the last two Nintendo consoles?
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Oct 13, 2018 01:32
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Bogart posted:what else are you going to do with a wiiu Might still have it lying around somewhere, come to think of it.
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Oct 13, 2018 01:34
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L4D rules. Easily the best zombie games ever.
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Oct 13, 2018 01:45
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Same. Shame they shat out another one in a year without much in the way of new stuff and then forgot about it for hats'n'whales.
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Oct 13, 2018 01:47
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Soft modding wiiu is safe and easy. Best emulation system until switch is hacked.
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Oct 13, 2018 05:21
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Len posted:I know right? at this point there's enough awesome games on it that it's worth it. Horror question: Did anyone figure out what the hell was going on in Ice-Pick Lodge's Knock-Knock?
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Oct 13, 2018 06:27
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It was kind of inside his head but it was also inside all of his ancestor’s head and also there was a kid taken away by the government. Unfortunately that’s all I remember.
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Oct 13, 2018 06:31
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al-azad posted:Soft modding wiiu is safe and easy. Best emulation system until switch is hacked. isn't every single switch already compromised
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Oct 13, 2018 07:36
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Discendo Vox posted:asymmetrical competitive gameplay is, afaict, bar none the most hellish structure to design for. Meta balance at the upper end for a game with as much player variance as DbD is basically impossible. The issue is compounded for streamer types because they ride right up to the meta as fast as anyone, and content creators tend to be socially incentivized into antagonism with the developer. DbD's balance is a pipe dream because the game creators released a game with fewer concepts than actual Tag. like, the game we all played on the playground at 5 years old is objectively more complex than DbD's core gameplay. you can only dress up a game so bare bones so many ways before it becomes obvious what you've done, and people start seeing the hopelessness in the exercise. because it eschewed things as simple as stamina or a timer, they have shown themselves entirely unable to model a chase that's satisfying for anyone involved. survivors either have some way to infinitely juke the killer or they don't. if they do, they do not fear the killer and the killer player knows it. if they don't, they have no reason to really resist the killer because it won't do them any good anyway. the basic tug of war between killer and survivors has never been in any other state at any point during the game's life cycle. F13, by comparison, had two extraordinarily simple concepts put in and it made the entire dynamic make sense. survivors have stamina and can out-sprint the killer, but the killer will absolutely wear them down if given sufficient time. that dynamic overlaying a hard 20 minute limit on the gameplay gave them a plenty robust tug of war that they could then balance. and it generally worked very well, actually, the primary problem F13 had was the fact that it never got over its own bugginess. DbD instead must attempt to solve all this using their skinner box fueled perk system and it's like trying to insulate a shack using mattresses. you can shift them around to cover you where the wind blows but it's not a solution for a whole slew of reasons. it's an incredibly shallow game that wasn't very well thought out at any point, but a combination of a big streamer splash, good aesthetics, and a very strong skinner box meant that it succeeded anyway. much like many MMOs. my overall point here is, asymmetrical competition isn't as hard as people have made it in recent years - it's just that, for whatever reason, the dominant player right now is incredibly bad at being a game. Coolguye fucked around with this message at 09:46 on Oct 13, 2018 |
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Oct 13, 2018 09:44
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"Skinner box" is probably the best description for the "press a button, get a thingie" gameplay of games like Diablo et al that I've yet seen. Can't imagine why I never put that together in my head before.
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Oct 13, 2018 10:56
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