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KakerMix posted:"I got the manual so I'd be more engaged in the sport of driving" - elitist The person I quoted said if you don't want a manual, you may as well buy a Lexus. Meaning that only manual cars should count as sports cars. And yes, if you can't see how driving an automatic can still be an engaging experience that requires your full concentration, you're elitist. Zorak of Michigan posted:Any of them who complain that the transmission jerks at low speed and whine for a torque converter will be up against the wall when I come to power. Torque converters are inarguably better from a standstill than a manual or DSG - even on a track. They have torque multiplication, making them significantly faster off the line. And a lot of DSGs can't handle a ton of torque before turning themselves into very shiny and expensive metal shavings. It probably depends on the exact conditions, but I could see a sufficiently tuned torque converter auto actually beating a DSG on the track. KillHour fucked around with this message at 20:35 on Oct 21, 2018 |
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Oct 21, 2018 20:29
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Hey cool we good we settled auto vs manual on the last page how bout them new cars huh?
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Oct 21, 2018 20:32
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opengl128 posted:Hey cool we good we settled auto vs manual on the last page how bout them new cars huh? You're right. Let's talk about something positive like the new Cadiloh God, kill it with fire!. 
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Oct 21, 2018 20:38
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I’m the windshield lol
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Oct 21, 2018 20:46
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KillHour posted:You're right. Let's talk about something positive like the new Cadiloh God, kill it with fire!. 
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Oct 21, 2018 21:03
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KillHour posted:The person I quoted said if you don't want a manual, you may as well buy a Lexus. Meaning that only manual cars should count as sports cars. Hey, to be clear, I'm talking specifically in the context of the GT500, and in the context of my other opinions about how much power a street car can have before becoming a giant pile of excess. If you need to juggle a tedious commute with your sports car needs, sure, I can see the argument for a torque converter on a car with a few hundred hp. Enjoy. At 700+hp, yeah, I get elitist.
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Oct 21, 2018 21:27
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All modern cars look like that Cadillac anyway so even if it isn't about transmissions we can all agree that modern automobile styling is poo poo garbage fit for an rear end.
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Oct 21, 2018 21:44
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KillHour posted:You're right. Let's talk about something positive like the new Cadiloh God, kill it with fire!. Holy gently caress that looks bad. It's like those chunky preschool kids toy cars you can buy
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Oct 21, 2018 21:51
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KakerMix posted:All modern cars look like that Cadillac anyway so even if it isn't about transmissions we can all agree that modern automobile styling is poo poo garbage fit for an rear end. All styling competition has been replaced by the rush to build the most annoying infotainment system.
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Oct 21, 2018 21:59
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Zorak of Michigan posted:I can't even imagine what 700+ hp would be like to control on public roads It would be fun, that's what it would be like
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Oct 21, 2018 22:06
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incels interlinked posted:It would be fun, that's what it would be like I got frustrated with the Golf R I used to have because you run out of ~fun space~ really quickly on public roads, and a Golf R is pittance compared to the monsters driving around these days. I have way more fun in slower stuff, driving a slow car fast etc.
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Oct 21, 2018 22:20
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KakerMix posted:I got frustrated with the Golf R I used to have because you run out of ~fun space~ really quickly on public roads, and a Golf R is pittance compared to the monsters driving around these days. I have way more fun in slower stuff, driving a slow car fast etc. Personally I think Golf GTI performance level is the perfect spot to be for how I use a car
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Oct 21, 2018 22:32
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KakerMix posted:All modern cars look like that Cadillac anyway so even if it isn't about transmissions we can all agree that modern automobile styling is poo poo garbage fit for an rear end. I blame all the stupid concept car marker drawings where it's 50% wheels with some tiny slits for windows. I can understand being forced to make design compromises for production but these designers want them to look the way they do. Cars look more like the concept sketches every year.
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Oct 21, 2018 23:19
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crossovers and suvs look like poo poo period
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Oct 21, 2018 23:25
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Powershift posted:https://www.iihs.org/iihs/ratings/vehicle/v/ford/mustang-2-door-coupe/2018 Stop, stop my penis can only get so erect.
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Oct 22, 2018 02:35
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MrYenko posted:A manual clutch makes a car slower than two clutches and a computer. If the goal of the car is to be fast with no compromises, then I see nothing at all wrong with dropping a manual clutch option. Rowing gears is an obsolete skill. ZF 8HP shifts as fast and can cope with more torque than almost every DCT.
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Oct 22, 2018 14:00
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MrYenko posted:Cars that do away with manuals in favor of a hydraulic planetary automatic can go die in a fire. I’m looking at you, BMW. Do you think the economic forces that are presently killing the manual will somehow overlook the DCT? The bean counters are unanamous - they want us all in slushboxes.
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Oct 22, 2018 14:36
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Many people think that driving a manual is more fun than driving an automatic. I'm one of them. But it certainly is not faster than an excellent automatic transmission. With the performance difference between a Mustang GT and higher-spec Mustangs being largely in the realm of poo poo you have no chance of probing anywhere except a track -- where that extra performance could make a difference -- I can see the motivation behind dropping the manual transmission option, and I say that as someone who thinks that more vehicles should have a manual transmission option.
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Oct 22, 2018 14:39
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drgitlin posted:ZF 8HP shifts as fast and can cope with more torque than almost every DCT. Somewhere there is a long-dead GM powertrain engineer that simply cannot stop smiling. My distrust of hydraulic autos is deep-seated and irrational, and I’ll be the first to admit it. I blame the 700R4. SlapActionJackson posted:Do you think the economic forces that are presently killing the manual will somehow overlook the DCT? The bean counters are unanamous - they want us all in slushboxes. No, I think the DCT will simply replace manuals in high-end performance cars where price is less of an issue. In econoboxes, yes, I think within ten years there will no longer be manual options from any major global OE.
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Oct 22, 2018 14:40
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Even a Mustang GT will be faster with the automatic, and fuckin lol at the idea that a manual in a 700hp car isn't stupid as poo poo. I daily a manual and I like that it allows me to game shifting for efficiency, but manuals actually suck compared to modern good automatics and the manual transmission fetishism among internet car nerds is both tiresome and pathetic.
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Oct 22, 2018 18:02
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Wheeee posted:Even a Mustang GT will be faster with the automatic, and fuckin lol at the idea that a manual in a 700hp car isn't stupid as poo poo. This fails to address ~enjoyment~ though and I'd argue people that go "SLOWER" as if that's the only metric car purchases are based on are far more tiresome and pathetic. Why buy a Mustang GT when there are faster cars out there? Because you might want a Mustang for an emotional reason? Dang that's almost like why people like a stick to waggle around!
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Oct 22, 2018 18:44
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KakerMix posted:This fails to address ~enjoyment~ though and I'd argue people that go "SLOWER" as if that's the only metric car purchases are based on are far more tiresome and pathetic. In this case, I think the issue is that there are very few people who would buy the GT500 over a Mustang GT if high-end performance were not a primary concern for them, so it makes sense to optimize the GT500 for performance/speed rather than the joy of shifting one's own transmission directly.
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Oct 22, 2018 19:14
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Wheeee posted:Even a Mustang GT will be faster with the automatic, and fuckin lol at the idea that a manual in a 700hp car isn't stupid as poo poo. If I'm buying a Ford GT I want whatever is fastest around the track.
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Oct 22, 2018 19:16
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Wheeee posted:Even a Mustang GT will be faster with the automatic, and fuckin lol at the idea that a manual in a 700hp car isn't stupid as poo poo. Indeed, who could possibly doubt the supremacy of the modern
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Oct 22, 2018 19:28
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ilkhan posted:If I'm buying a Mustang GT I want the manual for enjoyment reasons. I exactly agree with this, and it's what I was getting at when I made my earlier comments about the GT500.
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Oct 22, 2018 19:34
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ilkhan posted:If I'm buying a Mustang GT I want the manual for enjoyment reasons. The real reason I'm buying a Ford GT is to drive it downtown to the fancy restaurant with my wife/mistress lol if you think I'm taking it to a track. Remember the Hellcat? Yeah how many of those are just cruising around town vs. being used for heavy race use? Stuff like the GT 500s or whatever are just as much a badge as a performance vehicle. Heck if actually bet that they are more badges than are enjoyed for their engineering and performance, and those people don't give a poo poo about anything besides what makes them look more exclusive. Car X around the track faster than car Y? You know I'll be buying car X to bring that up as it had a hundred miles put on it under my ownership. KakerMix fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Oct 22, 2018 |
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Oct 22, 2018 19:43
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KakerMix posted:The real reason I'm buying a Ford GT is to drive it downtown to the fancy restaurant with my wife/mistress lol if you think I'm taking it to a track. That sort of thing does bring out my car elitist. I never look down on someone because of the amount of money they spent on a car, but I do look down on them for buying cars that are plainly wrong for their actual use case. Example: If my kid told me that they had just bought a Craigslist Miata, I would heap scorn on them, because my kid doesn't like to drive, and there's no logical reason to own a Miata if you don't think driving is fun. It would not matter that I would love to own a Miata. That car would be wrong for my kid, and they should have known better, and I would tell them so. I get that some people are Mustang or Camaro people, and if they want to buy a ZL1 or GT500 or whatever because it's next on their climb up that mountain, then more power to them. It's not about rationality in that case and there's no point making such judgements. However, when we get to people who just want an expensive car for the sake of image, and they choose a 700hp monster because it looks striking, my elitism comes out again, because using those cars just to go to the restaurant is insane. Compared to a luxury car of the same price, which would convey the appearance of wealth just as well, the ride is worse, the amenities are worse, hell, it's probably harder to get in and out of, and all they get in exchange is a louder engine and more power than they can use.
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Oct 22, 2018 20:13
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Zorak of Michigan posted:However, when we get to people who just want an expensive car for the sake of image, and they choose a 700hp monster because it looks striking, my elitism comes out again, because using those cars just to go to the restaurant is insane. Compared to a luxury car of the same price, which would convey the appearance of wealth just as well, the ride is worse, the amenities are worse, hell, it's probably harder to get in and out of, and all they get in exchange is a louder engine and more power than they can use.
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Oct 22, 2018 21:07
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I would like to add something to the manual vs auto conversation; Cars sound better to me as manuals, the revs rising and falling on a gear change vs the static rev of an auto or the bwarp *fart* of a dsg setup. I'm sure seems like a really stupid thing to a lot of people but it's a reason I personally like a manual gearbox even though they're 'not as good'
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Oct 22, 2018 21:30
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Olympic Mathlete posted:I would like to add something to the manual vs auto conversation; Even on my truck the shift points and readiness to downshift are different in sport mode, and I've had it to redline whenever I want to. Just a matter of using the smile pedal. I don't have the truck at redline as much as I did in the Mustang, but again that is a matter of choice. But I do get your point, sometimes you want to hold the gear just for the fun of it, and you don't get that in the auto.
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Oct 22, 2018 22:27
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MrYenko posted:No, I think the DCT will simply replace manuals in high-end performance cars where price is less of an issue. In econoboxes, yes, I think within ten years there will no longer be manual options from any major global OE. I think you've got that completely backwards - you'll see DSGs in low end stuff like the Golf and Polo as a cost cutting measure but more expensive cars will move to proper autos. Anyway within ten years I can't even see petrol being a mainstream option so it's all moot.
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Oct 22, 2018 22:49
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Zorak of Michigan posted:That sort of thing does bring out my car elitist. I never look down on someone because of the amount of money they spent on a car, but I do look down on them for buying cars that are plainly wrong for their actual use case. Example: If my kid told me that they had just bought a Craigslist Miata, I would heap scorn on them, because my kid doesn't like to drive, and there's no logical reason to own a Miata if you don't think driving is fun. It would not matter that I would love to own a Miata. That car would be wrong for my kid, and they should have known better, and I would tell them so. A lot of people actually do track their expensive 700hp cars as well as drive them to thr restaurant. You're making a lot of assumptions about people you know nothing about and also about cars you know nothing about
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Oct 22, 2018 22:57
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fridge corn posted:A lot of people actually do track their expensive 700hp cars as well as drive them to thr restaurant. You're making a lot of assumptions about people you know nothing about and also about cars you know nothing about Anecdotally "a lot" really use their car as a sort of trophy to show off at cars and coffee (me included). That's fine since as far as I'm concerned it's all emotional anyway and most people drive things that I loathe. I know of one dude with a tactilol bright red Poison-catalog Wrangler that's spotless and shiny that really does make it out offorading and beats the poo poo out of it. He had tastes that don't align with mine but by golly he's out there thrashing his machine and coming home, washing it and detailing it. You could assume he's just like all the other spotless mall crawlers and you'd be wrong, but so what? He doesn't give a poo poo, you shouldn't either. He's genuine, that's the real rare part.
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Oct 22, 2018 23:28
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I judge people who buy fancy appliances for reasons other than the features and then don't use all the features. gently caress you guy who doesn't order milk from amazon on his fridge computer. gently caress you guy who doesn't use the steam feature in his . Those are features i would use if i had them and therefore he is doing something wrong. The jerk.
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Oct 22, 2018 23:43
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 Pandem is starting to grow on me tbh
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Oct 23, 2018 00:00
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Holy gently caress that is spoopy.
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Oct 23, 2018 00:16
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KakerMix posted:Anecdotally "a lot" really use their car as a sort of trophy to show off at cars and coffee (me included). That's fine since as far as I'm concerned it's all emotional anyway and most people drive things that I loathe.
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Oct 23, 2018 02:04
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ilkhan posted:I roll my eyes at the pristine lineup on 6 figure cars I see at CnC events. No numbers, street tires, not prepped in any way, never seen a track. I don't care. Its just a dollar sign on wheels. Right, and if they didn’t buy all those cars just to show off then manufacturers wouldn’t be able to afford to build them for the few people who do buy them and take them to the track.
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Oct 23, 2018 04:19
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Modus Man posted:Right, and if they didn’t
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Oct 23, 2018 04:34
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Solus posted:
I'm just happy they've stopped putting those lovely cheap looking LEDs in the front bumper.
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Oct 23, 2018 06:29
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