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VelociBacon
Dec 8, 2009

Stoca Zola posted:

I was being a bit hypothetical, ha! not specifically targeting your specific sponge. You still don't have fish back in your tank, right? so you've got a lot more leeway than someone who has only a sponge as lifesupport for a tank full of fish. I'm a childless fish-mum, they are a substitute for my stunted maternal energies I think.

I meant it only in jest, you've been very helpful.

If you over - add fertilizer do you get dead plants or just tons of algae?

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Siochain
May 24, 2005

"can they get rid of any humans who are fans of shitheads like Kanye West, 50 Cent, or any other piece of crap "artist" who thinks they're all that?

And also get rid of anyone who has posted retarded shit on the internet."


Stoca Zola posted:

Finnex has a 6 month warranty and not great support when the power supplies fail if I recall others experience, I can add my own that my finnex clip on lasted maybe a year. The LEDs looks great but the power supply quality isn't there to justify the price. You might get lucky and get one that doesn't fail but that's a gamble IMO. Beamswork seem pretty good, I haven't heard any bad reviews. I think the white/blue lights don't look as natural though, it's something worth looking into because who cares if the plants like it if it makes them look like they're under a cheap fluoro; I think it's important that it looks nice to you as well as grows plants and it seems that plants care about brightness more than anything else. I think some of the multicolour LED lights are a bit gimmicky, Chihiros comes to mind, but maybe it's about getting it to look right visually more so than providing the exact light wavelength profile for a plant. You know what looks good to you better than anyone else, just don't forget to factor that in.

My big planted tank never looked better after I started dosing with a dosing pump, I thought I'd be able to remember to fertilise myself but the tank did a lot better with consistency from the pump. I water my liquid fertiliser down so that I can run the pump longer and get a more accurate dose but it turns out plant fertiliser can and does go mouldy so I haven't worked out how to deal with that yet. I wouldn't have thought dosing would make so much difference and I would never have bought the dosing pump but I saw one on special and now I have no regrets. Just a little quirky setting it up though, had to disassemble the pump heads to unkink the internal hose as it didn't work out of the box. No pressurised CO2 in my tank, just an upturned container that holds gas in contact with the water. A little dissolves over time so it's better than nothing but it's also fish safe. I'm using vinegar and sodium bicarbonate in a DIY coke bottle kit. Stinks a lot less than the yeast method. I think there's a difference in algae between no CO2 and some tiny amount of CO2 too, the plants just do a bit better and algae is almost gone.

Thanks for the info!
For the dosing pump - how is yours hooked up? Are you running the drip right into the tank, or does yours feed into a canister or something?
I'm trying to figure out how I can do it "cleanly" - if I can somehow get the doser feeding into the return line from the canister, I'd be happy.

Stoca Zola
Jun 28, 2008

I got one of these Jecod/Jebao ones:

It's a peristaltic pump, that is there are some spoke-like fingers in the pump head that push on the rubber pipe and rotate which forces the liquid along. When it has sat on the shelf for a while the same piece of pipe is pinched for too long, that's why you have to open it up and mess with it the first time you use it. It actually came with a spare pump head too which is cool! I had mine programmed for pump 1 to dose the equivalent of 3 fertilizer squirts every day (which is underdosing for the size of the tank), and pump 2 to come on for short periods throughout the day, the liquid reservoir I just used a rinsed out plastic jug (it actually looked a lot like a piss bottle :downs:) and had that in the cupboard in the tank stand, so one end of a piece of airline goes into the jug, connects to the short hose going into the pump, and the other goes all the way up the back of the tank and in through a one way valve through the top which is just dangling in near where I have an airstone and a wavemaker. Same kind of deal as an airline only I'm slowly pumping fertilizer through it. So pump 2 was just stirring the contents of the reservoir with both ends of the airline tube going straight in.

You can calibrate the pump by making it pump a known quantity of water and then it will use that for you to judge how much you want to pump each time. I don't know how precise it was really, for me I just wanted it to put a bit in each day when normally I would forget and it would be every 3, 4 or 5 days. Or I wouldn't want to do it because it was too close to water change day, or whatever dumb reason.

I don't think it would be hard to get a fitting that let you put the ferts inline some how, you'd probably want to avoid anything that has a venturi effect though or it would suck more ferts than you wanted to send. So maybe doing it near the canister inlet would work (although then the filter might strip the N out of the ferts! who knows!) as long as the liquid ferts end up somewhere where there is flow in the tank, they do disperse pretty well. Since all my tanks are hooded, having it up near the top hides it pretty well. You know what, I think the peristaltic part of the pump would prevent unauthorised venturi-like suction on your fertiliser line so maybe you could inline it with no risk. Easy enough to trial it with a bottle of water instead of a bottle of ferts!

edit to add:

Maybe a duckbill outlet isn't your style, but there are a few fittings with an air intake like that which might be usable. I'd just be worried it would collapse the tube and then stick like that. If you used a hard tube like you see for pressurised systems such as RO that would avoid that issue; not sure how you'd couple that with the soft rubber tube coming out of the pump though. There might be a suitable fitting out there though.

Stoca Zola fucked around with this message at 14:37 on Oct 18, 2018

VelociBacon
Dec 8, 2009

Interesting. I don't think I'm at that point yet, more likely just going to do twice weekly manual dosing (the dose is literally 1mL).

Stoca Zola
Jun 28, 2008

That's for Siochan, I forgot to say. For your tank VB I think manual dosing is absolutely the right method. Or like this :boonie:




(he's drinking a VB)

Siochain
May 24, 2005

"can they get rid of any humans who are fans of shitheads like Kanye West, 50 Cent, or any other piece of crap "artist" who thinks they're all that?

And also get rid of anyone who has posted retarded shit on the internet."


Stoca Zola posted:

I don't think it would be hard to get a fitting that let you put the ferts inline some how, you'd probably want to avoid anything that has a venturi effect though or it would suck more ferts than you wanted to send. So maybe doing it near the canister inlet would work (although then the filter might strip the N out of the ferts! who knows!) as long as the liquid ferts end up somewhere where there is flow in the tank, they do disperse pretty well. Since all my tanks are hooded, having it up near the top hides it pretty well. You know what, I think the peristaltic part of the pump would prevent unauthorised venturi-like suction on your fertiliser line so maybe you could inline it with no risk. Easy enough to trial it with a bottle of water instead of a bottle of ferts!

edit to add:

Maybe a duckbill outlet isn't your style, but there are a few fittings with an air intake like that which might be usable. I'd just be worried it would collapse the tube and then stick like that. If you used a hard tube like you see for pressurised systems such as RO that would avoid that issue; not sure how you'd couple that with the soft rubber tube coming out of the pump though. There might be a suitable fitting out there though.

Yeah, that's the doser I'm looking at. I'm trying to find something I can run inline on the canister run, just to keep things clean. Intake to the canister would likely be the best bet...maybe. I might have to do some playing around.

Luneshot
Mar 10, 2014

STAC Goat posted:

That little shell I found in my tetra tank yesterday is now crawling up my empty 5 G tank. I wonder where the hell he came from. I hadn't added anything to the tank in weeks (except a silly Halloween decoration). If I'm not noticing any serious problems (besides algae) should I worry too much that there might be more hiding?

See thread title...

In all seriousness, that snail probably came from snail eggs, which is why you didn’t see them until now. Most pest snails (Malaysian trumpet snails (MTS), bladder snails, pond snails, ramshorn snails) are self-fertilizing and/or hermaphroditic. Where you see one, there’s usually already dozens of eggs hiding in your tank.

If you post a picture we can give a definitive identification. That said, although snails are unsightly they’re usually good for the tank- they eat uneaten food, detritus, algae, and various other microorganisms. MTS burrow into the substrate, which helps aerate it. They’re ugly but helpful.

But if you want to stop an infestation, you need to get it out ASAP- the one snail I saw when I just established my tank is now hundreds, even with two assassin snails in the tank.

STAC Goat
Mar 12, 2008

Watching you sleep.

Butt first, let's
check the feeds.

As soon as I saw him I pulled him out and threw him in my empty 5G tank (that I for some reason still have water in) where he can't hurt any fish and tossed a little food in just for matter or whatever. I saw him climbing the walls yesterday but haven't spotted him since. Either he's blending in with the dirty and gravel or he snuck out and is somewhere. I dunno. But he's not in the original tank.

I have to do a number on that tank soon because everything is just covered in algae and no matter how often I clean it it grows back 2 days later. So I'm gonna repeat the same process I did on my other 10G tank. Do a big water change, scrub the hell out of stuff, do another water change. Maybe get my rear end to the Petco for some more plants and see if I can get a recommended algae eater. Or something to kill snails if necessary.

The irony is I was considering looking into snails to control the algae. So if a million of them show up I guess I'll just deal with my wish coming true.

edit: Quick google image search my snail looked a lot like a "bladder snail." Charming name.

STAC Goat fucked around with this message at 22:07 on Oct 18, 2018

STAC Goat
Mar 12, 2008

Watching you sleep.

Butt first, let's
check the feeds.

Oh, hey, look who I found.

Luneshot
Mar 10, 2014

Yup, looks like a bladder snail or pond snail to me. Check whether their shells are dextral or sinistral. As seen from the bottom (the side facing the glass) with the apex of the shell facing upwards, the opening is on the right- this is dextral, and if the opening is on the left it's sinistral. Bladder snails (Physidae) are sinistral, but very few other snails are, which helps make them easily identifiable.

I'm fond of my bladder snail infestation, honestly- I made a half-gallon jar just for snails to keep them in. Something about them is just fun to watch- the way they float up and down, and their violent twisting of the shell back and forth when something gets attached to it (like another snail).

VelociBacon
Dec 8, 2009

Did a 80% water change, refertilized, and strip dipped the tank. Took some photos since I did the water change and someone mentioned it was hard to tell the condition of the plants because the tannins in the water were darkening everything.



Quite a bit of this white mossy looking stuff on some areas of the hardwood. I was warned about it (I think) and told it was harmless and would go away at some point. Hope so!



GH/KH seem okay with the new water?

Stoca Zola
Jun 28, 2008

The "ok" for gH and kH depend on what you're keeping, but I'd say you could go higher for pretty much anything you want to keep apart from specialised soft water fish. It's about 18ppm per degree of hardness. Sometimes you see charts in degrees not ppm! Anyway you're looking at soft and acidic there (confirmed by low pH too). Anything under 75ppm gH is considered soft, then under 150 for medium, 300 for hard, and anything over 300 is very hard. As for kH I think I've seen 120ppm as a ballpark for stability but it will depend on other things in your tank, I don't add as much as that and mine are reasonably stable. The kH will affect the pH.

Personally I aim for mediumish gH apart from my guppies and crays which get harder water. If you were keeping neocaridina shrimp you'd want harder, but what you've got right there would probably suit many Cardinia shrimp (I don't know much about those!) and probably any Blackwater species too, although they like the water all brown and dimly lit to go with it.

Forgot to say anything about your plants, they're looking pretty okay really. I'd be tempted to trim and replant the trimmings on your stem plants to try and get them to be a bit bushier at the rear of the tank but no need to rush things there.

Stoca Zola fucked around with this message at 04:47 on Oct 20, 2018

SocketWrench
Jul 8, 2012

by Fritz the Horse

VelociBacon posted:

Quite a bit of this white mossy looking stuff on some areas of the hardwood. I was warned about it (I think) and told it was harmless and would go away at some point. Hope so!



Oh yes, that, don't worry, it's harmless and does clear up on its own. It's just bacteria feeding on whatever is left in the wood and they'll vanish once the food's gone. Took mine about two weeks or so.
BTW, shrimp love that gunk. Mine munched like mad on it

STAC Goat
Mar 12, 2008

Watching you sleep.

Butt first, let's
check the feeds.

I was freaking out last night because my aquarium was making a constant clicking sort of noise. I was scared shitless that there was a crack splitting somewhere but I couldn't find anything except a small chip on the outside that seems superficial (and certainly isn't splitting). Then I thought maybe like the thermometer wire was clicking onto the filter or something so I moved stuff all the equipment. Then I decided it must be the filter so I shut it off for awhile but it kept happening. I finally figured that the goldfish kept going to the top of the tank A LOT and were... hitting the hood? I did a water change and lowered the water level a bit so they wouldn't be able to reach the top so easily. It continued but much lesser so.

That being said I was on a LOT of allergy medicine so its possible the entire thing was much more in my head than it really was. Today I haven't really noticed the sound at all. And the goldfish don't seem to be acting out of the ordinary. I'll probably do another water change and raise the water level back up and see if it happens again (because the filter is loud as hell right now). But I'm hoping this was just an amusing anecdote about me hallucinating noises hopped up on Benadryl. I also woke up in the middle of night soaked in a cold sweat, so you know...


edit: Not in my head, I guess. I just did a test and the ammonia readings are off the charts. That's weird since I didn't notice a problem in regular testing but I guess it explains why they're so agitated and jumping to the top of the tank so much (I think the sound I was hearing might have been them "splashing" at the surface). Did 2 1/3rd water changes and will test and do another tonight and then again tomorrow. I haven't had this kind of problem for awhile in this tank, but I did add fish so I guess it makes sense and I was being careless. No one seems hurt so hopefully no harm done. Molly has been acting odd and I had chalked it up to him being cold and me needing to get a heater. So hopefully I didn't hurt him.

STAC Goat fucked around with this message at 22:45 on Oct 21, 2018

Stoca Zola
Jun 28, 2008

Good job with the huge water change, ammonia is pretty bad news. But you caught it before anyone died so I think that still counts as a fishkeeping success. Might have been better to do both 1/3 changes at once, you're looking at going from 100% ammonia to 33% with one big 2/3 change, but with two 1/3 you go from 100% to 66% to 44% of whatever your original ammonia level was. Not quite as good but still, substantially better than a smaller change of only 1/3.

I guess it could mean that whatever your routine water change is, it isn't enough and you either need to swap out more water or do them more often until your filter catches up, or you might have exceeded the bioload that the filter is capable of dealing with and just need more filtration, so it will take a bit of monitoring to work out what exactly is going on. Floating plants might help since some of them do consume ammonia directly.

STAC Goat
Mar 12, 2008

Watching you sleep.

Butt first, let's
check the feeds.

Thinking about it I basically did three big unrelated things over the course of the last two weeks or so.

1) Added the black moor.
2) Transferred the black molly.
3) Changed the filter cartridge.

I imagine it's those things just combining to stress the tank and I should have been more careful/diligent. The same period has also been a little hectic and busy and I've had sleep problems so the cleaning/testing routine might have been a little less precise. I should set weekly alerts for that or something.

I also assumed changing the filter would be fine because I have sponges, plants, rocks, etc that I assumed retained the same bacteria. But it's the first time I did it so maybe I underestimated things. So yeah, maybe the new cartridge just needs to catch up or maybe I need a bigger/another filter for more fish. I actually have a spare one I bought for the 5g that didn't fit so I could add that if I have problems. But time will tell.

Either way the water is testing ok now and the fish are acting like themselves again, including the molly being active. So I'll stay diligent but hopefully I avoided any harm.

STAC Goat fucked around with this message at 01:52 on Oct 22, 2018

Luneshot
Mar 10, 2014

Changing the filter cartridge is your problem. A significant portion of the beneficial bacteria live in there; if you change it out for a fresh one, you're suddenly cutting your aquarium's biological filtration capacity.

Despite what the filter manufacturers would like to tell you (so they can sell you more filter cartridges), you shouldn't change your filter media unless it is literally falling apart. When you do a water change, take it out, swish it around in the old tank water to loosen any debris, and put it right back in. If it's brown and gross looking, great! It's supposed to look like that.

STAC Goat
Mar 12, 2008

Watching you sleep.

Butt first, let's
check the feeds.

Ahh, definitely my mistake. My old one was just black and gory and seemed like it just had to be changed, but it was still solid. I guess I screwed up there since the tank was doing great before hand. Like I said, I was a bit nervous but figured the sponges and everything else would help out. Assumptions and all.

I guess at least that means I just have to keep on the water changes until everything is cycling properly again.

The little sponge that's part of the filter is falling apart so I figure I need to change it soon. But I have a bigger sponge of the same quality in the back and I figure I can just cut a piece to size, use it as a replacement, and stick a new sponge in the back.

VelociBacon
Dec 8, 2009

What the hellll. I'm so ready to be done with this algae, I don't know what I'm doing wrong.



Is this related to GH/KH?

Stoca Zola
Jun 28, 2008

Might be too much light, not enough npk/micros. Algae isn't that fussy about conditions it will grow in so if you don't have it right for the plants the algae can outcompete them. Algae can't store energy reserves like plants can so less light or even blacking out the tank for a few days can reduce or kill algae but it will keep coming back until you find the balance that your plants like.

VelociBacon
Dec 8, 2009

Stoca Zola posted:

Might be too much light, not enough npk/micros. Algae isn't that fussy about conditions it will grow in so if you don't have it right for the plants the algae can outcompete them. Algae can't store energy reserves like plants can so less light or even blacking out the tank for a few days can reduce or kill algae but it will keep coming back until you find the balance that your plants like.

The Seachem Flourish should have more than enough micro/npk shouldn't it?

Should I just turn the light off for a couple days maybe?

Stoca Zola
Jun 28, 2008

I haven't ever used Flourish myself, I don't know the dosage or whether sometimes you have to use less or more (anyone else know?) but even just reducing your lights to 6 hours a day or lower, after manually removing as much algae as you can. You should see soon enough whether it comes back.

Bollock Monkey
Jan 21, 2007

The Almighty
Hoping for some freshwater aficionado top tips - I thought the cycle in my axolotl tank had crashed (so we removed him to a temporary tank), but there's zero nitrite and ammonia keeps getting down to 0-0.25ppm with big water changes... But then it's spiking again!

We thought we could reintroduce Max on Saturday morning but today he was playing dead (freaked the gently caress out when I lifted him back onto the sick tank though!) and ammonia was back up to 1ppm.

Any clever ideas about what is going on? Not had to troubleshoot this one before, the tank isn't behaving at all how I expect it to...

Any advice appreciated!

Stoca Zola
Jun 28, 2008

Number one thing I would recommend for mysterious ammonia is to check your source water to make sure there's no ammonia coming in that way. Some tests detect treated chloramine as ammonia too, I think API is notorious for this, so perhaps your water treatment has been switched from chlorine to chloramine for seasonal reasons, and that's what you're seeing?

But you're saying you see the ammonia drop after the water change so it probably isn't that... It's gotta come from somewhere, a blob of uneaten food, a dead snail, a cat peeing into the tank? It's still possible you've lost cycle for some reason, what filtration are you using? Axolotls as far as I know are in the "messy" category of aquarium pets, they make a lot of waste so maybe Max has grown big enough that he's now overwhelming the tank's ability to process his wastes.

Caveat: I've never kept axolotls in my life! But those are my guesses at what might be going on.

schwein11
Oct 13, 2009



So I've been slacking with updating the thread on my goldfish pond adventures since earlier this summer. (https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3554965&userid=156512 for the story up to about June 13 of this year).

Since those posts, the following happened:

- I had to replace my pump because the old one crapped out on me. The old one came with the pond and the house, and I have no idea how old it was, but it stopped working on Father's Day. I think some combination of lava rock piece being sucked in and some sort of electrical problems did it in. This is ok because I ended up buying a nice new pump and was straightened out by the kind folks at the pond shop about not using lava rocks as filtration material.

- The pond shop folks also turned me on to water hyacinths and some other underwater vegetation, the combination of which did wonders to clear up my pond water. I think I failed to get a good picture of these unfortunately - the water hyacinths float on top and tended to clump together. They looked pretty cool when they bloomed. The underwater stuff looked like strings of evergreen branch like seaweed. It was annoying when they managed to float up to the surface, but I think they definitely helped the water. Next year I am going to weigh them down better.

- Taking my kids to the pond shop results in getting a new fish for the pond, I have learned. We added a comet goldfish around the same time I got the new pump, and it did great all summer, and appears to continue to be doing well. This upped the pond population to 4 adult goldfish.

- I forget when it was exactly, but probably in July or so, I noticed a small baby fish in the bucket I use for my pump when I was giving the pump its regular cleaning. I made sure the little guy made it back into the pond safe and sound. The kids were excited to learn about "baby fish" in the pond, and were on the lookout for them thereafter. My wife and kids later saw at least two babies swimming around.

- fast forward to yesterday. It had been getting pretty cold around here, down in to the 30's on Saturday night, the pond plants were definitely getting brown, and leaves were falling into the pond. It was time to winterize the pond. I had been pretty nervous about this all year - not wanting to mess it up and end up with dead fish. The process involves (1) taking out all the water from the pond; (2) putting the fish in a holding area while I work on the empty pond; (3) take out the plants and trim them way back - basically to 2-4 inches above the soil; (4) scrub the sides of the pond; (5) scoop out the muck that gathered on the bottom of the pond; (6) place trimmed plants on bottom of pond (as opposed to on top of stack of bricks); (7) refill pond and add de-chlorinator; (8) add back fish; and (9) put net over pond to prevent falling leaves from getting in.

- in the process of emptying out the pond, as I was getting very near to the bottom of the pond, I noticed a small 3 inch fish flopping about in what was basically mud at that point. This was long after the four grown fish had been placed in a holding tank, and before this I had seen no sign of the previously-sighted babies. I quickly scooped him up and put him in the tank. My six year old son named him "Bravey", which I thought was appropriate. I later found a dead fish of about the same size in the muck, and I hope that it was already dead by the time I did this process and that my failure to find him in time didn't kill him.

- I'm nervous about the de-chlorinator. I added the correct amount according to the instructions on the bottle for the amount of water in the pond, and I did so mid-way through filling the pond so that the added water would mix it up well. I hope that this is ok and that I didn't mess up by waiting until the pond was full to add it. The fish seem ok this morning though.

- based on instructions from the prior owner and from the pond shop, I do not have the pump in the water for the winter. It feels weird to not have it there, but it will allow the pond to ice over.

Here are some pictures from yesterday:


This is the pond almost empty; I discovered the alive juvenile fish after a little more water had been emptied from this point:




Here are a couple pictures of the four grown fish in the holding tank:




Here is a picture of the juvenile. It was dark out and hard to get a good shot, but you can kind of see him:

schwein11 fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Oct 22, 2018

Enos Cabell
Nov 3, 2004


Awesome update on the pond! Glad you're able to make it a family project like that, you're definitely teaching your kids the right way to go about it.

Mozi
Apr 4, 2004

Forms change so fast
Time is moving past
Memory is smoke
Gonna get wider when I die
Nap Ghost
So one of my small fish out of about 60 in the tank turns out to be some other kind of fish (mistakenly included by the seller) that doesn't stay small, it's getting pretty big and at some point I think will start to predate on the others.

It's a heavily planted tank which makes it basically impossible to net it, about 70% of the tank is inaccessible to a net. Just not going to happen.

I tried fashioning a trap out of a soda bottle (by cutting the top off and reversing it), but didn't have success in attracting the fish in question. Before long it'll get too large for that anyways...

Anybody have any ideas? Even if I were to drain half the water, that would just make it more difficult to net.

Bollock Monkey
Jan 21, 2007

The Almighty

Stoca Zola posted:

Number one thing I would recommend for mysterious ammonia is to check your source water to make sure there's no ammonia coming in that way. Some tests detect treated chloramine as ammonia too, I think API is notorious for this, so perhaps your water treatment has been switched from chlorine to chloramine for seasonal reasons, and that's what you're seeing?

But you're saying you see the ammonia drop after the water change so it probably isn't that... It's gotta come from somewhere, a blob of uneaten food, a dead snail, a cat peeing into the tank? It's still possible you've lost cycle for some reason, what filtration are you using? Axolotls as far as I know are in the "messy" category of aquarium pets, they make a lot of waste so maybe Max has grown big enough that he's now overwhelming the tank's ability to process his wastes.

Caveat: I've never kept axolotls in my life! But those are my guesses at what might be going on.

Thank for your response. Someone else I spoke to has me wondering if the substrate (sand) has built up an 'ammonia bubble' so I'm going to agitate everything whilst Max is out and do a couple of agitation-water change cycles to see if that helps. There's no ammonia from the tap, and we're using a filter with sponge that gets the occasional squeeze into tank water to clean. Max hasn't grown over the last year or so really so I doubt it's that he's producing more waste, but I do also wonder if the occasional bit of food is getting lost before it gets eaten or cleaned. Let's see if this ammonia bubble thing holds any water, if not then I'll be back for more mystery water issue troubleshooting!

El Pollo Blanco
Jun 12, 2013

by sebmojo
What is the longest time anyone's Kuhli loaches have vanished for? Got 6 awhile ago for our 40g community tank and have only seen one (at a time) ever since. I did make sure the intake and outtake are covered to prevent them worming their way into the canister.

CrashScreen
Nov 11, 2012


Honestly, this is very cool and I dig how healthy looking they all are. I'm going to 2nd Enos' comment about the family project. It's a shame about that other juvenile, but these are goldfish so you're definitely going to find more at some point. My bunch don't stop trying to breed.

Speaking of my fish, I've got a photo of them in their new tank.



They're pretty happy to have the space, but they're still a terror on the plants. I finally saw the largest one there, on the left called Blueberry, rip a plant apart. She has more strength than it looks.

The only issue with this tank is how quickly we had to move the fish over into it after a severe detritus worm infestation. They outgrew the last tank far quicker than we were prepared for. The new 350 Litre is still cycling, and I'm doing daily water changes. It's a lot of water to change every day, so I'm looking forward to it finally settling. The other day I found it to be at 0 ppm ammonia, but it was somewhere between 2 - 5ppm (closer to 2) nitrites. Whoever said that goldfish require the best water quality to breed was lying though, and that's really not helped the water quality either.

The tank itself is still a little sparse. We're going to eventually redecorate, but I embarrassingly cannot reach the bottom of most of the tank. I'm thinking of just putting Anubias on more stones and rocks for the back and leaving at that. It's less trouble when replanting. We've also decided to give up on floating plants. They're just way too messy with goldfish, and it keeps clogging the filters. This Juwel filter (not pictured) seems to get blocked up especially bad. I believe it might be the same one, or similar, that Stoca Zola has? In any case, we're three weeks into the cycle so I'm hoping that means it ends soon. It's not fun whenever I see them start taking to the surface and I feel bad we've put them in there. I've learned to have the next-stage tank setup a lot sooner after this--though I won't have to worry about that for a long time yet at least.

Bollock Monkey posted:

I'm going to agitate everything whilst Max is out and do a couple of agitation-water change cycles to see if that helps. There's no ammonia from the tap, and we're using a filter with sponge that gets the occasional squeeze into tank water to clean.

How often do you agitate the substrate during cleaning? You'll definitely find a lot of dirt there if you've not done it in a long while, so cleaning it that way should help at least a bit with your spike I reckon?

GoodBee
Apr 8, 2004


papa horny michael posted:

Recently bought a Fluval Spec V, a betta and some plants.

Here's the setup after a week and a half. Little Cheerio loves it so far. I think he builds a bubble nest daily.
Pet store employee may have screwed me over recommending this plant. I think it's a non-aquatic purple waffle plant. Cleaned it from the tank, and rinsed the roots before rehousing it.



This is the setup, and fish, I've been eyeing. What else did you pick up aside from what's in the kit?

Siochain
May 24, 2005

"can they get rid of any humans who are fans of shitheads like Kanye West, 50 Cent, or any other piece of crap "artist" who thinks they're all that?

And also get rid of anyone who has posted retarded shit on the internet."


Lighting question, for those who may know.

Does PAR value stack? IE if I buy a pair of PAR 40 (at 12") LED lights, will I end up with PAR 80 (at 12")? Or is there some weird formula for this that may work?

Stoca Zola
Jun 28, 2008

The issue is that PAR is measured directly below the light source and while you could put a theoretical point light source on top of another one and get double the PAR, in reality the two lights will be only next to each other and most likely you will want a gap between for better coverage. The PAR will drop away at a gradient which will vary from brand to brand, you'll probably get a wider bright band for lights using lenses and reflectors but usually you only see this in DIY or high end LEDs. The two gradients from two lights will overlap and be additive but it's not going to be exactly double. I do think if you put them as close together as possible you'll get a much brighter band in the middle but then the edges of the tank would be darker than if you spaced the lights apart. PAR falls away with distance so the deeper the tank the worse it is too. I found a chart for finnex, the numbers listed are for tank depths but you could easily measure the diagonal distance and use that to look up a "depth" for a par for further away than directly under the light.

https://i.imgur.com/ZPaTFIX.jpg

Siochain
May 24, 2005

"can they get rid of any humans who are fans of shitheads like Kanye West, 50 Cent, or any other piece of crap "artist" who thinks they're all that?

And also get rid of anyone who has posted retarded shit on the internet."


Stoca Zola posted:

The issue is that PAR is measured directly below the light source and while you could put a theoretical point light source on top of another one and get double the PAR, in reality the two lights will be only next to each other and most likely you will want a gap between for better coverage. The PAR will drop away at a gradient which will vary from brand to brand, you'll probably get a wider bright band for lights using lenses and reflectors but usually you only see this in DIY or high end LEDs. The two gradients from two lights will overlap and be additive but it's not going to be exactly double. I do think if you put them as close together as possible you'll get a much brighter band in the middle but then the edges of the tank would be darker than if you spaced the lights apart. PAR falls away with distance so the deeper the tank the worse it is too. I found a chart for finnex, the numbers listed are for tank depths but you could easily measure the diagonal distance and use that to look up a "depth" for a par for further away than directly under the light.

https://i.imgur.com/ZPaTFIX.jpg

Okay, I kind of figured that was the case. I'm debating between two cheaper lights and one expensive one. Pricing up here in Canuckistan is all wonky :/

Stoca Zola
Jun 28, 2008

I'd be tempted by 2 cheap lights over 1 big expensive one (depending on features I guess). We don't have a ton of choice here in Australia, any big name stuff has Australia tax whacked on top AND its not available locally anyway, I'd have to order it online - so any cheap cheerful Chinesium stuff is very tempting. Holy poo poo Fluval 3.0 is $360 for the 24-34 inch version. Kessil is $400+, Finnex doesn't even exist here. The budget brand is $80 for a 2 foot LED light for comparison.

Siochain
May 24, 2005

"can they get rid of any humans who are fans of shitheads like Kanye West, 50 Cent, or any other piece of crap "artist" who thinks they're all that?

And also get rid of anyone who has posted retarded shit on the internet."


We've got the choice, we just get stuffed on pricing.

I'm debating a pair of cheap Nicrew LED's - could get 2 for about $150. Or one good CurrentUSA light with 2000 lumens and 100+ par rating @ 12 inches for $220. The CurrentUSA one is rated extremely well, and has a built-in timer which would be nice.

Enos Cabell
Nov 3, 2004


I've been happy with my CurrentUSA strips. I've got 3 of them now, oldest of which I bought I think 8 years ago, and all are still working great. Compare that to the two Finnex Planted+ 24/7 strips I bought in the last two years and are now both in the trash. Never buying Finnex again.

Siochain
May 24, 2005

"can they get rid of any humans who are fans of shitheads like Kanye West, 50 Cent, or any other piece of crap "artist" who thinks they're all that?

And also get rid of anyone who has posted retarded shit on the internet."


Enos Cabell posted:

I've been happy with my CurrentUSA strips. I've got 3 of them now, oldest of which I bought I think 8 years ago, and all are still working great. Compare that to the two Finnex Planted+ 24/7 strips I bought in the last two years and are now both in the trash. Never buying Finnex again.

Yeah, my 55 has the CurrentUSA +, not the Pro + or whatever, and its been good. Going heavily planted, so I wanted something a bit better.
I've heard great reviews of the Finnex re: Growth, but terrible things about quality - so it seems that's valid.

Alright, forget it, pulling the trigger on the expensive one.

VelociBacon
Dec 8, 2009


Just quoting this so people don't have to hunt for it as I'll be referencing it in this post. I understand my GH is low and so is my KH - although from my reading KH acts like a buffer for pH hits.

I've read online that limestone can be added to tanks to increase GH. Anyone had experiences with that? Is it a pretty simple thing? I was also thinking from reading online that I should be testing ammonia as well but is that pointless with no fish?

I found this online that seemed prudent for where I'm at since I'm struggling to get a cycle going and I'm fishless:

some online poo poo posted:

Fishless Cycle
How to cycle a tank the fishless way:

1) Make sure all equipment is working, fill with water that has all the stuff you will need for the fish you intend to keep. Dechlorinator, minerals for GH or KH adjustments, the proper salt mix, if you are creating a brackish or marine tank...

2) Add some source of the bacteria. Used filter media from a cycled tank is best, gravel or some decorations or a few plants... even some water, though this is the poorest source of the beneficial bacteria.
Bacteria in a bottle can be a source of these bacteria, but make sure you are getting Nitrospiros spp of bacteria. All other ‘bacteria in a bottle’ products have the wrong bacteria. (This step is optional. The proper bacteria will find the tank even if you make no effort to add them)

3) Add ammonia until the test reads 5 ppm. This is the non-sudsing, no surfactants, no-fragrance-added ammonia that is often found in a hardware store, discount stores, and sometimes in a grocery store. The concentration of ammonia may not be the same in all bottles. Try adding 5 drops per 10 gallons, then allowing the filter to circulate for about an hour, then test. If the reading isn't up to 5 ppm, add a few more drops and test again. (Example, if your test reads only 2 ppm, then add another 5 drops) Some ammonia is such a weak dilution you may need to add several ounces to get a reading.

4) Test for ammonia daily, and add enough to keep the reading at 5 ppm.

5) Several days after you start, begin testing for nitrites. When the nitrites show up, reduce the amount of ammonia you add so the test shows 3ppm. (Add only half as much ammonia as you were adding in part 4) Add this reduced amount daily from now until the tank is cycled.

If the nitrites get too high (over 5 ppm), do a water change. It can happen that the bacteria growth is slowed because of the high nitrites. Reducing the level of ammonia to 3 ppm should prevent the nitrite from getting over 5 ppm.

6) Continue testing, and adding ammonia daily. The nitrates will likely show up about 2 weeks after you started. Keep monitoring, and watch for 0 ppm ammonia, 0 ppm nitrite and rising nitrates.

7) Once the 0 ppm ammonia and nitrites shows up it may bounce around a little bit for a day or two. Be patient. Keep adding the ammonia, keep testing ammonia, nitrite and nitrate.
When it seems done you can challenge the system by adding more than a regular dose of ammonia, and the bacteria should be able to remove the ammonia and nitrite by the next day.
If you will not be adding fish right away continue to add the ammonia to keep the bacteria fed.

8) When you are ready to add the fish, do at least one water change, and it may take a couple of them, to reduce the nitrate to safe levels (as low as possible, certainly below 10 ppm) I have seen nitrate approaching 200 ppm by the end of this fishless cycle.

9) You can plant a tank that is being cycled this way at any point during the process. If you plant early, the plants will be well rooted, and better able to handle the disruption of the water change.
Yes, the plants will use some of the ammonia and the nitrates. They are part of the nitrogen handling system, part of the biofilter, they are working for you. Some plants do not like high ammonia, though. If a certain plant dies, remove it, and only replace it after the cycle is done.

Does that seem to make sense?

I'm thinking I should pick up some ammonia for the strategy posted above and also limestone if thread approves (otherwise seems like I need to add something for GH to get my plants healthier/able to outcompete the algae?). Sanity check?

e: Should I also be adding Nitrates/Nitrites somehow? I know that I'm trying to fill the role of fish poop here and that decomposing protein kinda solves this. I could add dried bloodworms that I had for my betta maybe?

e2: my 5g tank is too small for Amano shrimp isn't it :c

VelociBacon fucked around with this message at 18:24 on Oct 23, 2018

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papa horny michael
Aug 18, 2009

by Pragmatica

GoodBee posted:

This is the setup, and fish, I've been eyeing. What else did you pick up aside from what's in the kit?

Check out http://spec-tanks.com/ for lots of really good articles on modifying and maintaining the spec v. It has been an invaluable resource to me for understanding stuff. Much of what I've bought are recommendations from it.

Hydor 25 Watt Submersible Glass Aquarium Heater
Fluval EDGE Pre-Filter Sponge
Wire mesh
Set of 6 Marimo Moss Balls
Variety of plants
Aquascaping tools
Pump cleaner
Freshwater testing kit
Scraper

I have 4 ghost shrimp, 2 amano shrimp, and 2 gold mystery snails all tasked with tank cleanup. Calcium supplements and seaweed are tossed in regularly to ensure their proper growths.

I'd suggest modifying the stock lid of the fluval spec tank. I built a small window screen topper for the open area to dissuade the beta and shrimp from jumping out again. A complete cover would protect against evaporation.

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