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BrigadierSensible posted:If I remember rightly, John Inman said somewhere in an old interview that Mr Humphries was not gay. He was just an effeminate, highly swishy, well dressed young single man who lived with and had an especially close relationship with his mother, *wink wink* We was gay. He was married to woman, but they split and he came out after. The British tradition of cross dressing and camp is a bit of an odd one. The last show to do it was Little Britain I think. Limmy does the cross dressing thing, but delivers the character as about as gruff and masculine as possible. Little Britain is camp as you like, but I think it works because Lucas and Walliams are naturally camp anyway. You couldn't have just anyone play those characters. Here's one that's just come to me - Chris Tucker in Fifth Element. The costume designers apparently had dresses designed for him, but he refused to wear them, hence the body suits. There's also a few scenes that ham fistedly make the point that he's a womaniser. Was that Chris Tucker's doing as well? - "Yes I'll play this character, but I want it to be perfectly clear that I'm NOT GAY". EvilGenius has a new favorite as of 08:21 on Nov 5, 2018 |
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Nov 5, 2018 08:05
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BrigadierSensible posted:Whilst we are on 70s/80s British TV and implied homosexuality: Am I the only one who thought that Kenny Everett was gay? I know his TV show had lots of beautiful women in skimpy clothes, (and young me thanked him for it), but he always seemed to me to be camper than a row of tents. Although given he was a 'weirdo' on UK TV in the 70s/80s, he is actually more likely to be a kiddie diddler than a homosexual. Everett was gay but - from memory - came out late in his career. But you're right, looking at his show now, he comes across very camp and there's lots of cheesecake like a man who trying desperately not to look gay.
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Nov 5, 2018 08:06
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The episode of the Boondocks where Ed and Rummy try to kidnap Oprah but instead end up kidnapping Bill Cosby, then bringing him back when they realized how annoying he was is almost poignant today?
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Nov 5, 2018 08:38
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El Gallinero Gros posted:I wish "Destroy All Movies!" wasn't out of print, I'd buy that. It's a book that catalogues punk rock characters and plots in TV and movies in the 70's and 80's (most of which is incredibly broad and dumb). And it includes THAT episode of Quincy. Since you don't have plat, send me an email, my username atgmail. Such a book is worthy of discussion.
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Nov 5, 2018 09:06
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Ghost Leviathan posted:The Count of Monte Cristo has a lesbian couple (in hilariously obvious yet barely plausibly deniable fashion) that are... probably shockingly progressive by late 1800s standards. Especially since they gently caress off from all the crazy poo poo with Parisian aristocrats to become musicians in Germany, which seems like the most sensible course of action considering one almost got engaged to her sociopath half-brother. That is for better and worse the way the society handled lesbian couples a generation or two ago. "Just a couple of ladies who never seemed to find a suitor to get married, living together because they are such a good friends and it saves them money."
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Nov 5, 2018 09:37
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Der Kyhe posted:That is for better and worse the way the society handled lesbian couples a generation or two ago. Pretty much, though Dumas reeaaally isn't subtle about it. And also have the kinda awkward thing where one one of them is confident and masculine (though still described as attractive, compared repeatedly to Diana the huntress) while the other is shy and feminine. (though I've seen plenty of butch/femme stuff from queer communities without much irony, so I dunno.) Reminded of the Colbert joke where he describes the two main stereotypes of gay men being totally opposite and concludes that we must find them and make them marry each other. Like, slashfic is waaaay ahead of you, Steve.
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Nov 5, 2018 09:48
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nonathlon posted:Everett was gay but - from memory - came out late in his career. But you're right, looking at his show now, he comes across very camp and there's lots of cheesecake like a man who trying desperately not to look gay. Everett came out in the early to mid 80s, as I recall. Nobody gave a drat, because we'd all worked it out years before. And of course, it was all done in the best possible taste.
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Nov 5, 2018 10:35
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Jedit posted:Everett came out in the early to mid 80s, as I recall. Nobody gave a drat, because we'd all worked it out years before. And of course, it was all done in the best possible taste. Apparently he and Freddie Mercury took Princess Diana (disguised as a man) to a gay bar one night in the mid-'80s 
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Nov 5, 2018 11:35
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Pookah posted:Apparently he and Freddie Mercury took Princess Diana (disguised as a man) to a gay bar one night in the mid-'80s Well, I've got a new crazy-rear end Princess Di theory.
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Nov 5, 2018 11:39
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Pookah posted:Apparently he and Freddie Mercury took Princess Diana (disguised as a man) to a gay bar one night in the mid-'80s Is this a scene in Bohemian Rhapsody, and if not, why not?
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Nov 5, 2018 12:08
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Pookah posted:Apparently he and Freddie Mercury took Princess Diana (disguised as a man) to a gay bar one night in the mid-'80s Yeah, they knew each other. Medical tracing shows that they both contracted HIV from the same person. 
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Nov 5, 2018 12:15
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BrigadierSensible posted:Whilst we are on 70s/80s British TV and implied homosexuality: Am I the only one who thought that Kenny Everett was gay? I know his TV show had lots of beautiful women in skimpy clothes, (and young me thanked him for it), but he always seemed to me to be camper than a row of tents. Although given he was a 'weirdo' on UK TV in the 70s/80s, he is actually more likely to be a kiddie diddler than a homosexual. Women in skimpy clothes was a staple of comedy shows in the 70s/80s. Like Benny Hill was probably either gay or asexual, yet half his show was women running round in bikinis. Or him dressed up as a woman. Ghost Leviathan posted:Well, I've got a new crazy-rear end Princess Di theory. I’m calling the Daily Express right now to pitch it to them.
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Nov 5, 2018 13:25
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SEX BURRITO posted:Women in skimpy clothes was a staple of comedy shows in the 70s/80s. Like Benny Hill was probably either gay or asexual, yet half his show was women running round in bikinis. Or him dressed up as a woman. Not to disagree with your point, but Benny Hill used to get regular handjobs from each of the Hills Angels
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Nov 5, 2018 13:31
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Do you people honestly think that 70's audiences didn't obviously think that Mr Humphries was absolutely gay as hell?
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Nov 5, 2018 13:55
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Nutsngum posted:Do you people honestly think that 70's audiences didn't obviously think that Mr Humphries was absolutely gay as hell? Mate, there were people in the 70s so repressed and fearful of homosexuality that they didn't realize that either of Freddie Mercury, or Liberace were gay. Now I am not saying these people were the majority, but I am sure there were grandmas saying to their family "Don't you dare besmirch the name of that nice clean cut young man by calling him a sodomite! He just hasn't found the right girl is all."
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Nov 5, 2018 14:17
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BrigadierSensible posted:Mate, there were people in the 70s so repressed and fearful of homosexuality that they didn't realize that either of Freddie Mercury, or Liberace were gay. I'm speculating, but perhaps people generally didn't have the capacity to fully understand homosexuality, or just how many people out there were gay. Imagine a world where almost everyone is in the closet. You're vaguely aware of it, but you've never come across anyone who was gay (you have, you just don't know it), so it sits at the back of your mind as something that happens elsewhere. I'm sure there was fear, but I think a lot of people were just completely oblivious.
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Nov 5, 2018 15:01
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Jedit posted:Yeah, they knew each other. Medical tracing shows that they both contracted HIV from the same person. Princess Di had HIV?
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Nov 5, 2018 15:05
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The Celluloid Closet talks a lot about earlier 20th century depictions of gay and lesbian depictions in American media.
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Nov 5, 2018 15:07
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Solice Kirsk posted:Princess Di had HIV? It would explain why she was assassinated 
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Nov 5, 2018 15:15
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Solice Kirsk posted:Princess Di had HIV? A Highly Impacted Vehicle? She certainly did.
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Nov 5, 2018 15:30
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Solice Kirsk posted:Princess Di had HIV? She's royal, they're full of blood borne illnesses, but I don't think HIV was one of them. It's weird how many famous people had HIV. Just off the top of my head there are the obvious ones like Arthur Ashe, but then you had the less reported ones such as Issac Asimov and Denholm Elliott and the bad guy in AirBud. It really hollowed out a whole generation.
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Nov 5, 2018 16:01
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BrigadierSensible posted:Mate, there were people in the 70s so repressed and fearful of homosexuality that they didn't realize that either of Freddie Mercury, or Liberace were gay. Can you imagine how much pussy Freddie Mercury would have got back then if he wasn’t gay? I’d guess a lot.
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Nov 5, 2018 19:36
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In fact Kenny Everett played a key role in making "Bohemian Rhapsody" a hit; it wasn't going to be a single because it was too long, but he played the whole thing on his Radio 1 show and it quickly became so requested that they put it out as a single. It's probably in the movie but I don't imagine I'll be going to see it, so there you go.
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Nov 5, 2018 19:54
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Wheat Loaf posted:In fact Kenny Everett played a key role in making "Bohemian Rhapsody" a hit; it wasn't going to be a single because it was too long, but he played the whole thing on his Radio 1 show and it quickly became so requested that they put it out as a single. I totally would have gone to see Sacha Baron Cohen as Mercury, and the movie that he wanted it to be. The other band members sound like they're up their own arses and made the film about them.
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Nov 5, 2018 20:02
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At some point wasn't the movie going to have Mercury die during the first half, with the second half being about the band figuring out how to carry on without him? Don't get me wrong, that could make for a good movie, but if you're making what is basically "the Queen movie" you have to accept the fact that nobody gives a crap about the band's post-Mercury career. (Which, far as I can tell, is one album of reworked demos followed by Greatest Hits concerts where someone cosplays as Mercury.)
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Nov 5, 2018 20:36
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Sir Lemming posted:At some point wasn't the movie going to have Mercury die during the first half, with the second half being about the band figuring out how to carry on without him? That was what led to Sasha Baron Cohen leaving the project and publicly trashing it, yes. Although from what I hear they've ended up more or less making the movie he thought they should make in the first place, instead of the "And the second half is how queen came back without freddy!" they had originally scripted.
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Nov 5, 2018 20:50
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SiKboy posted:That was what led to Sasha Baron Cohen leaving the project and publicly trashing it, yes. Although from what I hear they've ended up more or less making the movie he thought they should make in the first place, instead of the "And the second half is how queen came back without freddy!" they had originally scripted. It was the 'Bouncing Back' version I thought they'd ended up making tbh. Maybe I'll give it a chance. Sacha would have been so perfect as Freddie Mercury though.
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Nov 5, 2018 21:09
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EvilGenius posted:I totally would have gone to see Sacha Baron Cohen as Mercury, and the movie that he wanted it to be. The other band members sound like they're up their own arses and made the film about them. It's odd in retrospect but there was a time in the 70s and 80s when Mercury, while a respected vocalist and performer, was perceived as "just" a flamboyant showman, all flash and little substance; in interviews, he would often actively discourage analysis of his lyrics and insisted none of his songs actually "meant" anything. Conversely, May was seen as the "genius" of the band who could do all these tricks with feedback and poo poo. Meanwhile, Roger Taylor spent a few years insistently introducing himself to interviewers as "the drummer and one of the singers" in Queen (in fairness, he was given a lead vocal spot in most shows up until the Hot Space tour at least - whenever they stopped performing "I'm In Love With My Car", because he always sang that one from the drums, and I'm pretty sure he was the one who was singing all those high notes in "Bohemian Rhapsody" and "In the Lap of the Gods"). Freddie gets his due now but I sometimes wonder if it's swung too far the other way. Whatever Brian May and Roger Taylor may have done the past 25 years or so, I don't think it's entirely fair to suggest that Freddie was just carrying the rest of the band for their entire career. 
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Nov 5, 2018 21:21
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As someone born in 1983, and whose mum was into 80s Queen, the image of Mercury in my head is the Live Aid incarnation. I think 70s Mercury looks wrong, and their music was nobby. I can totally see now you've said it how they were very much a band at the beginning, then became Freddie Mercury and Queen somewhere down line, even though Mercury wasn't even writing everything. Compare Bohemian Rhapsody to Innuendo, two structurally similar songs at either end of their career. One is very much a group song, the other is a platform for Mercury.
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Nov 5, 2018 21:41
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I had a second half of my post about that, but forgot it. No question, there was a lot to the band besides Freddie Mercury, and they don't get nearly enough credit. But it's also fair to say nobody cares about their post-Mercury career, because there really hasn't been much to it.
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Nov 5, 2018 21:47
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Yeah, that's the thing, they just stopped writing for the most part. Right at the start of the band, Freddie proposed a rule which the rest of them accepted which was that whoever wrote the lyrics had written the song, so they got credit and they got the royalties. This was fine because to the extent that they wrote they were writing themselves and it was pretty much the Freddie and Brian show in the early years as far as songwriting went; there's a story about Roger Taylor locking himself in a cupboard and refusing to come out until Freddie agreed to let him put "I'm In Love With My Car" on the b-side to "Bohemian Rhapsody" because that would've entitled him to a share of the royalties. But then in the 80s, they were having these terrible rows over money all the time until they started writing more collaboratively (though you can still see whose fingerprints are on which songs) and crediting all the songs to "Queen" - I think this would've been in the A Kind of Magic era - and they all said they all began having a lot more fun at that point because they didn't feel like they were competing with each other. Unfortunately, that's right when Mercury was diagnosed with AIDS and they had to stop touring. Point being, they were all in the studio together having brought their own ideas and were putting them together into songs by the time they got to The Miracle and Innuendo. When you work like that and you lose half your team (remember Deacon retired after the tribute concert) you can still go out and call yourself Queen and play Queen songs but you can't write as Queen any more. I'd say Brian May's first solo album is worth a listen. His Brixton Academy live record is pretty decent as well. But you know, as a musician, he's gotten a bit lazy in his old age. He's been playing the same basic solo spot in concerts since 1973; it's always been the "Brighton Rock" solo. (I don't really listen to Queen much these days but there was a few years for me when I listened to loads of Queen, read books about them, watched all the videos, sought out documentaries etc. - can you tell?  )
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Nov 5, 2018 21:58
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Wheat Loaf posted:It's odd in retrospect but there was a time in the 70s and 80s when Mercury, while a respected vocalist and performer, was perceived as "just" a flamboyant showman, all flash and little substance; in interviews, he would often actively discourage analysis of his lyrics and insisted none of his songs actually "meant" anything. Conversely, May was seen as the "genius" of the band who could do all these tricks with feedback and poo poo. I think if you ask any gear head guitarist about "who had the best sound" Brian May is going to come up in the conversation.
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Nov 5, 2018 22:04
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EvilGenius posted:We was gay. He was married to woman, but they split and he came out after. Mrs Brown's Boys was after Little Britain.
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Nov 5, 2018 22:17
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It's also an Irish show. And gives us the glorious side effect of having had a character played by Anjelica Houston and Brendan O'Carroll.
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Nov 5, 2018 23:05
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There is a good series on Youtube going through the history of Nickelodeon. Each episode is about a single show starting at the very beginning. He finally got to You Can't Do That On Television and spends a lot of time talking about some less than appropriate features: body shaming, Playboys, and... lots of boys being put in dresses. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl44gvb8b9E The whole thing is good. The coverage of the problematic stuff really starts about 57 minutes in.
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Nov 6, 2018 03:09
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Wheat Loaf posted:I'd say Brian May's first solo album is worth a listen. His Brixton Academy live record is pretty decent as well. But you know, as a musician, he's gotten a bit lazy in his old age. He's been playing the same basic solo spot in concerts since 1973; it's always been the "Brighton Rock" solo. They're about even. Back to the Light has Resurrection, Back to the Light and his version of Too Much Love Will Kill You (which was his to begin with). Another World has Another World, Wilderness and Why Don't We Try Again. I don't know if May's musical stylings are better or worse than Roger Taylor thinking he was a renegade teen forever. He wasn't young when Sheer Heart Attack (the song) came out and he was less young for The Cross' Shove It. At least John Deacon has the sense to just let the paychecks roll in.
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Nov 6, 2018 03:23
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Zero One posted:There is a good series on Youtube going through the history of Nickelodeon. Each episode is about a single show starting at the very beginning. He finally got to You Can't Do That On Television and spends a lot of time talking about some less than appropriate features: body shaming, Playboys, and... lots of boys being put in dresses. he's also a goon 
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Nov 6, 2018 03:26
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I actually liked a few things on Star Fleet Project. I think I've said before "Let Me Out" might have been a relatively popular Queen song if it had been on one of their albums with Freddie singing it.
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Nov 6, 2018 03:36
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oldpainless posted:Can you imagine how much pussy Freddie Mercury would have got back then if he wasn’t gay? I’d guess a lot. Wasn’t he bi?
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Nov 6, 2018 03:55
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He was - he actually left most of his estate (including his mansion, his piano, most of the royalty rights to his songs) to his old girlfriend from the 70s.
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Nov 6, 2018 11:33
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