|
Farmer Crack-rear end posted:"Public shaming"? "Bullying"??! loving come on. I feel like I keep up with this thread pretty well but I must have missed the anti-initiative chat? I mean, unless you're talking about Tim Eyman and if that's the case I agree, gently caress that guy.
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2018 22:56
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 15:26 |
|
|
Maybe it's not this thread then, I know I've seen people argue against initiatives on this forum though. Yeah I got no problem bagging on individuals who won't stop filing making GBS threads initiatives. Bill Sizemore's another rear end in a top hat who comes to mind, though I don't think we've heard much from him lately.
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2018 23:06
|
|
|
Wasn't legal weed an initiative in every state that's gotten it? I'm pretty sure.
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2018 23:07
|
|
|
Javid posted:Wasn't legal weed an initiative in every state that's gotten it? I'm pretty sure.
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2018 23:14
|
|
|
Javid posted:Wasn't legal weed an initiative in every state that's gotten it? I'm pretty sure. Its a mixed bag, really. For every legal weed there was a state out there constitutionally enshrining bigotry into its fundamental laws, or capping property taxes, or I've seen one in Colorado that looks like it's going to bankrupt any town that tries to prevent fracking nearby.
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2018 23:15
|
|
|
Initiatives are bad because they are prone to abuse by bad-faith conservatives trying to restrict taxation, among other things, but not voting on them or automatically voting no on them has zero effect on their continued existence, so you might as well vote yes on the good ones and no on the bad ones
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 01:30
|
|
|
Wasn't there a law on the books in Oregon a while ago where not voting on a ballot measure but turning in a ballot counted as a No vote?
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 01:32
|
|
|
anthonypants posted:Wasn't there a law on the books in Oregon a while ago where not voting on a ballot measure but turning in a ballot counted as a No vote? I distinctly remember that from when I was a kid. SousaphoneColossus posted:Initiatives are bad because they are prone to abuse by bad-faith conservatives trying to restrict taxation, among other things, but not voting on them or automatically voting no on them has zero effect on their continued existence, so you might as well vote yes on the good ones and no on the bad ones otoh the legislature has no problem passing utterly horrific things all on their own so it's not like they really need IPs to continue doing that.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 01:40
|
|
|
Someone linked a poll in the Trump thread that Dino Rossi is down 3 in WA-8 so I'm not temping fate by being happy about it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 01:46
|
|
|
Ballot Initiatives can be a mixed bag just like can be. Ballot Initiatives can grant things like legal weed, legal same sex marriage, or can be used for highly regressive things like.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 04:25
|
|
|
punk rebel ecks posted:Ballot Initiatives can be a mixed bag just like can be. Ballot Initiatives can grant things like legal weed, legal same sex marriage, or can be used for highly regressive things like.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 04:54
|
|
|
Jesus, I shouldn't type on a phone that uses auto-correct. Anyway, in English: Ballot Initiatives can be a mixed bag, they can grant things like legal weed, legal same sex marriage, or can be used for highly regressive things like freezing property taxes or banning affirmative action. Overall I support the idea of ballot initiatives, but how beneficial they are completely depends on the socio-political context of the territory. Then again, you can technically say the same thing about democracy.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 06:11
|
|
|
anthonypants posted:Wasn't there a law on the books in Oregon a while ago where not voting on a ballot measure but turning in a ballot counted as a No vote? There was something like that for property taxes, until this happened: https://ballotpedia.org/Oregon_Property_Tax_Elections_Amendment,_Measure_56_(2008)
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 07:57
|
|
|
At the very least ballot initiatives should probably have something that limits their ability to gently caress with revenue in a negative way, that way you could have good initiatives and not have to worry as much for the idiot conservative tax limiting ones.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 07:59
|
|
|
If you haven't read it yet, The Stranger published an article about a Dom in Seattle who.... pretty much made one of his subs get a dangerous injection that killed him, then tried to cover it up https://www.thestranger.com/features/2018/11/07/35073826/death-of-a-kinkster Or just read the KiwiFarms thread on noodles&beef, it's more to the point
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 10:03
|
|
|
Initiatives are super-lovely, they allow the legislature to sit on their laurels, they end up passing incredibly loving bad laws with unbelievably far-reaching consequences (see: prop 15 in California), and they're a gateway to letting corporations just straight-up buy the laws they want (see: Amazon head tax, soda tax repeal in California, soda tax initiatives in Oregon & Washington). This is not to say that all initiatives are bad, just that allowing initiatives is bad, and in aggregate, they're pretty terrible. That being said, unilateral disarmament is stupid and counterproductive, so voting "no" on every initiative is just shooting yourself in the foot.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 10:11
|
|
|
Thanatosian posted:Initiatives are super-lovely, they allow the legislature to sit on their laurels, they end up passing incredibly loving bad laws with unbelievably far-reaching consequences (see: prop 15 in California), and they're a gateway to letting corporations just straight-up buy the laws they want (see: Amazon head tax, soda tax repeal in California, soda tax initiatives in Oregon & Washington). This is not to say that all initiatives are bad, just that allowing initiatives is bad, and in aggregate, they're pretty terrible. Ugh, I had to tell a co-worker yesterday that our groceries aren't going to suddenly start being taxed out of the blue like the Yes on 1634 ads have been saying. The ads have people afraid that their grocery bills are going to go up even though municipalities currently are able to impose taxes and outside of Seattle's soda tax haven't utilized it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 12:03
|
|
|
Someone on my route to work went to every no on 1631 advertisement and put a giant PAID FOR BY BIG OIL sticker on them. It owns.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 17:01
|
|
|
This post was paid for by Big Oil.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 17:06
|
|
|
Thanatosian posted:Initiatives are super-lovely, they allow the legislature to sit on their laurels, they end up passing incredibly loving bad laws with unbelievably far-reaching consequences (see: prop 15 in California), and they're a gateway to letting corporations just straight-up buy the laws they want (see: Amazon head tax, soda tax repeal in California, soda tax initiatives in Oregon & Washington). This is not to say that all initiatives are bad, just that allowing initiatives is bad, and in aggregate, they're pretty terrible. The Amazon head tax is a horrid idea and should instead be a progressive income tax, but good luck with that.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 17:11
|
|
|
karthun posted:The Amazon head tax is a horrid idea and should instead be a progressive income tax, but good luck with that. yes, please, lets rehash this again.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 17:29
|
|
|
karthun posted:The Amazon head tax is a horrid idea and should instead be a progressive income tax, but good luck with that. It was the worst amazon head tax since Apocalypto.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 17:38
|
|
|
seiferguy posted:Someone on my route to work went to every no on 1631 advertisement and put a giant PAID FOR BY BIG OIL sticker on them. It owns. Out where I am I'm seeing these too.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 17:46
|
|
|
Solkanar512 posted:Also they bragged about spending $100M on “employee facility upgrades” like new chairs in the cafeterias (think tator tots, not free artisan FB bullshit) and inspirational posters thanks to “the new tax cuts” while spending lol yeah and replacing 30 year old bathrooms, dont forget that we cant have facility improvements unless employees beg for it
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 17:53
|
|
$18B
|
DrNutt posted:At the very least ballot initiatives should probably have something that limits their ability to gently caress with revenue in a negative way, that way you could have good initiatives and not have to worry as much for the idiot conservative tax limiting ones. What about things like the Carbon Tax? It's a two way street. It's the Left's fault for not capitalizing on intiatives like the right does.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 18:04
|
|
|
seiferguy posted:Someone on my route to work went to every no on 1631 advertisement and put a giant PAID FOR BY BIG OIL sticker on them. It owns. nice
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 18:05
|
|
|
Solkanar512 posted:Also they bragged about spending $100M on “employee facility upgrades” like new chairs in the cafeterias (think tator tots, not free artisan FB bullshit) and inspirational posters thanks to “the new tax cuts” while spending You have no idea how bad I want to vandalize one of those posters. It's such absolute bullshit. Like they're bragging about making the buildings not look like slumlord housing. Like fixing the bathrooms so poo poo doesn't run down the walls is really something to pop your suspenders about.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 18:21
|
|
|
BraveUlysses posted:lol yeah and replacing 30 year old bathrooms, dont forget that we cant have facility improvements unless employees beg for it We had a guy quit to go work for apple and he made a PowerPoint for senior leadership with pictures of the building explaining why the company is shedding young people like snakeskin.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 18:22
|
|
|
poo poo POST MALONE posted:We had a guy quit to go work for apple and he made a PowerPoint for senior leadership with pictures of the building explaining why the company is shedding young people like snakeskin. I love a good "I quit Boeing" story. There's just this mixture of "they'll let you get away with almost murder" and "I've been here forever so my cynicism is really burned in" that makes for some good times.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 18:30
|
|
|
oh man it only took one year for the cynicism to kick in and about 4 years before it effectively became a face tattoo
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 18:32
|
|
|
punk rebel ecks posted:What about things like the Carbon Tax? It's a two way street. It's the Left's fault for not capitalizing on intiatives like the right does. I mean fair point but there's a not insignificant amount of "liberals" who also bitch constantly about taxes and are extremely likely to vote against measures that increase their own taxes.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 18:39
|
|
|
DrNutt posted:I mean fair point but there's a not insignificant amount of "liberals" who also bitch constantly about taxes and are extremely likely to vote against measures that increase their own taxes. I just want some accountability!!!!!!111 
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 18:42
|
|
|
DrNutt posted:I mean fair point but there's a not insignificant amount of "liberals" who also bitch constantly about taxes and are extremely likely to vote against measures that increase their own taxes. I agree, but you can argue the same about electing representatives in a democracy. It's not like those in the government, including "liberal" Democrats don't work on lowering taxes (especially for corporations) in order to increase "growth". It's up to the Left to take on good messaging and push forward things such as using wages, healthcare coverage, municipal broadband, and ranked choice voting. There has been some progress on this front, but the Left can certainly do more.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 18:44
|
|
|
Teabag Dome Scandal posted:I just want some accountability!!!!!!111 I just want to get rid of all the GUBMENT WAISTE!!!!!! (But I can't name anything specific, or I blame one sitting politician for the actions of the completely different municipality) Spend some time mocking those folks on Facebook, it's good fun pointing out that people are lovely for refusing to invest in their own communities.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 18:45
|
|
|
poo poo POST MALONE posted:We had a guy quit to go work for apple and he made a PowerPoint for senior leadership with pictures of the building explaining why the company is shedding young people like snakeskin. That’s surprisingly mature, last time I quit a job I went for the “turn my exit interview into a 45 minute rant about the personal and professional failings of corporate leadership and management at every level” approach, shockingly it did not bring about the reforms I suggested.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 18:47
|
|
|
punk rebel ecks posted:I agree, but you can argue the same about electing representatives in a democracy. It's not like those in the government, including "liberal" Democrats don't work on lowering taxes (especially for corporations) in order to increase "growth". I think that stuff is true but initiatives are also still garbage.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 18:50
|
|
|
Thaddius the Large posted:That’s surprisingly mature, last time I quit a job I went for the “turn my exit interview into a 45 minute rant about the personal and professional failings of corporate leadership and management at every level” approach, shockingly it did not bring about the reforms I suggested. Lmao Boeing doesn't even do exit interviews as a standard practice.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 19:00
|
|
|
One of my favorite stories at Boeing was when they invited a few of the Seahawks to present after they won the Super bowl, before they came out, Ray Conner (president of Boeing Commercial Airplanes at the time) comes on the stage to introduce them, and gets booed loudly. I clearly remember someone yelling "Ray I want my loving pension back!"
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 19:07
|
|
DrNutt posted:I think that stuff is true but initiatives are also still garbage. Do you always intentionally post like you're the stupidest person on the internet or are you just actually like this
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 22:07
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 15:26 |
|
|
im on the net me boys posted:Do you always intentionally post like you're the stupidest person on the internet or are you just actually like this Take your meds.
|
|
#
?
Nov 6, 2018 22:13
|
|