|
Rand Brittain posted:Should be because it's what people will buy, or should be because it's what they can produce? Both? 1.) People can't afford dozens upon dozens of books anymore. 2.) Free time and how much you have to invest is a game is a factor. 3.) Even factoring when or if that changes, there is too much completion for time and the new thing is people, not just nerds, sampling everything. Even without Social Media or streaming overload, people don't want to read book 500 on Mages do lifeguard duty at the beach. 4.) I read a lot that printing costs are a pain in the rear end. I know they've ditched the retail market, but still.
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 21:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 12, 2024 22:54 |
|
|
Kurieg posted:
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 22:07
|
|
|
I agree people do get too sensitive about characters who are racist or sexist, and confuse having bad people who commit more day to day evil with endorsing such views. Doesn't relate to Vampire's doing 9/11 to hide from the REAL VAMPIRE EVIL
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 22:10
|
|
|
yeah I don't think he gets (or rather refuses to get) that the actual issue is using specific real world ongoing tragedies as set dressing for a tabletop game
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 22:22
|
|
|
I Am Just a Box posted:I don't know how that one didn't occur to me because you're absolutely right. Although my favorite thing about Mekhet pareidolia is the ambiguous question raised over whether there's something more to it by the page Frances includes from Vincent Moon's dumb New Age Mayan prognosticating book. Yeah, it owns so much.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 22:29
|
|
|
Blockhouse posted:yeah I don't think he gets (or rather refuses to get) that the actual issue is using specific real world ongoing tragedies as set dressing for a tabletop game Definitely "refuses to get," probably disingenuous rather than merely self-deluded. His earlier comments indicated he at least understood that the complaint was not "the text of this jerk vampire's article is homophobic" (indeed part of the problem is the jerk vampire hardly has anything to say about the people being persecuted) and the only way an unreliable narrator has anything to do with the problem is if he is claiming that you're supposed to come away from the article thinking the basic premise of the jerk vampire's article is fabricated, in which case why include it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 22:43
|
|
|
Nehru the Damaja posted:LA By Night. The storyteller is Jason Carl from WW. It's only like eight or nine episodes in the first season but I'm enjoying it. I like that it's way less of a big production than CR oooh fun I know what I'm gonna waste my day tomorrow watching, thanks! Kurieg posted:
can someone remind me what marky mark here has worked on in the past like five years that makes him worth having on when he's this stupid, because it feels like he's just coasting on his 90's success.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 22:51
|
|
|
sexpig by night posted:can someone remind me what marky mark here has worked on in the past like five years that makes him worth having on when he's this stupid, because it feels like he's just coasting on his 90's success. Nothing I'd love to find out the internal stuff from WW that led to him leaving, because i'm absolutely positive it was for the same edgelord gamergate bullshit he's been espousing ever since. He's a lovely hack writer who got lucky with a single concept that other people made better.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 22:53
|
|
|
PST posted:Nothing I'm racking my brain here and I wanna say he only even worked on the literal core books for vampire, werewolf, and dark ages, none of the splatbooks or anything like that. Like, he's the creator of those IPs in only the most literal sense, I have no idea why they dug him out with his reputation and all. Are there tons of Mark Rein-Hagen fans in the vampire community who were CLAMORING for this sci-fi movie extra lookin dude to come back? I've never met any but maybe I'm wrong!
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 22:59
|
|
sexpig by night posted:I'm racking my brain here and I wanna say he only even worked on the literal core books for vampire, werewolf, and dark ages, none of the splatbooks or anything like that. Like, he's the creator of those IPs in only the most literal sense, I have no idea why they dug him out with his reputation and all. Are there tons of Mark Rein-Hagen fans in the vampire community who were CLAMORING for this sci-fi movie extra lookin dude to come back? I've never met any but maybe I'm wrong! It's the mythological pre-lapsarian golden age. Product was good when the players were younger and the world was a less complex place, due to their youth and lack of understanding of the world's complexities. Surely something must have happened, some fall from grace, probably caused by all those people clamouring for greater rights and representation now, and the only way to reclaim the quality of their youth is to reclaim the personas and symbology of that earlier age. Mark Rein-Hagen is a symbol of the older, and in the eyes of this portion of the buying populace, untainted World of Darkness, so bringing him on is therefore the best thing to do. This of course fails to recognize how lovely the original editions of the World of the Darkness were, especially for marginalized people. But for the people steeped in privilege and nostalgia, they ignore the flaws and embrace only their feelings about the original works, and then whine about SJWs when someone as lovely as Rein-Hagen creates a work that is just as lovely.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 23:06
|
|
|
He doesn't understand that there's a difference between "This Vampire is evil and does evil things." and "This real world evil person does evil things because he's actually a vampire *WINK WINK*" The first one is, sure, whatever. The second one diminishes the suffering that real people are actually currently experiencing.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 23:07
|
|
|
Meinberg posted:It's the mythological pre-lapsarian golden age. Product was good when the players were younger and the world was a less complex place, due to their youth and lack of understanding of the world's complexities. Surely something must have happened, some fall from grace, probably caused by all those people clamouring for greater rights and representation now, and the only way to reclaim the quality of their youth is to reclaim the personas and symbology of that earlier age. Mark Rein-Hagen is a symbol of the older, and in the eyes of this portion of the buying populace, untainted World of Darkness, so bringing him on is therefore the best thing to do. yea I guess it's because I'm lucky enough that most of my 'young closeted queer kid finding vampire roleplay' experience involved other kids like that so I forget that for a ton of players at that same time they didn't know we were finding a place with those books despite a lot of the writing not...because of it...
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 23:10
|
|
|
sexpig by night posted:yea I guess it's because I'm lucky enough that most of my 'young closeted queer kid finding vampire roleplay' experience involved other kids like that so I forget that for a ton of players at that same time they didn't know we were finding a place with those books despite a lot of the writing not...because of it... When MR*H wrote vampire for the first time, even negative exposure of Queer people was seen as avant garde, because it was acknowledgement that they existed at all. But we're way way WAY past that. Besides, all this angry critique has taken awareness away from the true victim in all of this.  Mark Rein Hagen. 
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 23:19
|
|
|
Apparently page 96 of the camarilla book stops part-way through a story that is then never finished. Ths continuing the trend of the layout/editing/writing of the book being utter poo poo.| Edit: quote:Besides, all this angry critique has taken awareness away from the true victim in all of this. I simply don't believe him. There's been minimal controversy so far, it's still getting started, he's also a repeated liar and fantasist, so i'm unsurprised that the mildest criticism causes him to lie his loving head off.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 23:21
|
|
|
In this metaphor, Mark Rein dot Hagen is physically unable o not produce awful poo poo when hired to write.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 23:28
|
|
|
God drat do I wish I could reply oh don't worry Mark, those death threats are just a vampiric cover up. Put the dog down. MollyMetroid fucked around with this message at 23:40 on Nov 11, 2018 |
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 23:37
|
|
|
NutritiousSnack posted:Yeah. The limited edition release model for Changeling and Promethean is the future. Maybe a couple more books, but the days of buying dozens of books for one game line that is going to cross over to another are long done. At least for now Shadow of the Demon Lord somehow manages to push out like three supplements a year plus however many short four-page adventures the author feels like. They're good supplements too. They're on the shorter side though, like 90 to 200 pages.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 23:40
|
|
|
sexpig by night posted:can someone remind me what marky mark here has worked on in the past like five years I Am Zom— sexpig by night posted:that makes him worth having on Oh, nevermind then.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 23:44
|
|
|
sexpig by night posted:oooh fun I know what I'm gonna waste my day tomorrow watching, thanks! It's pretty good. The real selling point is Erika Ishii as the young Brujah trying to come to grips with everything.
|
|
#
?
Nov 11, 2018 23:47
|
|
|
PST posted:He's a lovely hack writer who got lucky with a single concept that other people made better. hey, don't make fun of my goal in life
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 00:09
|
|
|
bewilderment posted:Shadow of the Demon Lord somehow manages to push out like three supplements a year plus however many short four-page adventures the author feels like. They're good supplements too. They're on the shorter side though, like 90 to 200 pages. yea SotDL has a smart plan with most of their supplements being small buffet style 'does this monster interest you? Pick this up then' things used to fund the more proper 'ok but for real here's an expansion of the game world in a fairly good way' ones.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 00:13
|
|
|
Didn’t MRH get swirlied recently? That was funny.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 00:48
|
|
|
sexpig by night posted:yea SotDL has a smart plan with most of their supplements being small buffet style 'does this monster interest you? Pick this up then' things used to fund the more proper 'ok but for real here's an expansion of the game world in a fairly good way' ones. They've been doing that with Exalted, like 2 monsters and 2 NPCs every month or so.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 01:01
|
|
|
Kurieg posted:
Ah the classic, "groups of people disagreeing with me online is the same as censorship" chestnut. Aggressively stupid since the only solution would be... not allowing disagreements.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 01:14
|
|
|
Mendrian posted:Ah the classic, "groups of people disagreeing with me online is the same as censorship" chestnut. Aggressively stupid since the only solution would be... not allowing disagreements. I mean, this is coming from Mark "The only way to stop nazis is to let them kill you and hope they feel remorse." Rein*Hagen, so it's unsurprising.  
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 01:30
|
|
|
So what the hell does Rein Dot Hagan do for his day job? I don't mean like to doxx him but is he a software developer or a trust fund kid or something? Is he writing for WWE?
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 01:39
|
|
|
nofather posted:They've been doing that with Exalted, like 2 monsters and 2 NPCs every month or so. yea I think that's starting to emerge as a winning plan for these 'we're not D&D big but we're also not literally one guy working on a labor of love' companies. Keep fans engaged and make a nice little menu for people to pick from and that helps fund the 'but no for real if you play this game you should get THIS book though' proper expansions.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 01:42
|
|
|
"Look. Look at that man unconscious on the floor because a black woman cold cocked him in one punch. Observe his power and dignity."
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 01:46
|
|
|
He also made up domestic abuse "rumors" about Olivia Hill when she called him on the aforementioned Nazi appeasement strategy. He then backpedaled hard into "the dark nature of all men, so it made sense to assume*" when called out on that. Being a mealy-mouthed 90's edgelord is one thing, but he can gently caress all the way off forever for that. * And by "assume" I of course mean "make up specific allegations citing anonymous sources."
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 01:51
|
|
|
I presume he made some money off of I Am Zombie and Succubus: The Totally-not-vampires. I wouldn't be surprised if he even made money off of that whole debacle where he claimed that he actually Stole the text for I Am Zombie and released the "original Manuscript" as a crowdfunding thing. edit: and that reminded me of that one time when he got mad at OPP for continuing to put out Vampire: The Requiem books and filling the "Sexy Undead" Niche that he is for some reason incapable of writing outside. Kurieg fucked around with this message at 02:04 on Nov 12, 2018 |
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 01:56
|
|
|
Kurieg posted:When MR*H wrote vampire for the first time, even negative exposure of Queer people was seen as avant garde, because it was acknowledgement that they existed at all. I mentioned it over on RPG.net, but I really think this is the underlying factor that neither MR*H or nuWW as a whole seem to really grasp. All that nostalgia about "social relevance"? It basically boiled down to acknowledging that these minorities existed and were doing stuff. Which wasn't nothing back then for a lot of us. I grew up in nowhere, rural USA, at a time when even if you had internet access you didn't have the wealth of information on everything available to you. Plenty of WW's poo poo with marginalized groups and world events was garbage, but I wouldn't have even known to look for it until college without some of those books. So I can appreciate that, but I can also recognize its value came basically from a time and place where that sort of information was a lot harder to casually come by. Anyone today can find out as much as they'd likely want to know about Chechnya and its current attempts at LGBT extermination with the phone in their pocket. Even if they're unaware of the place at all, they're far more likely to pick up on it through random commentary on social media or tumblr than they are in some obscure book about pretending to be vampires. The kind of "social relevance" that WW had in the 90s is no longer relevant to the population at large. Plus RPGs as a whole have upped their game quite a bit in how to do social commentary in all sorts of directions (at least, some games). M*RH is basically Marilyn Manson in 2018, wondering why no one views him as shocking any more, and instead just sort of pathetic.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 02:55
|
|
|
Kurieg posted:I presume he made some money off of I Am Zombie and Succubus: The Totally-not-vampires. I seem to recall that he's really bad at managing his Kickstarters, and he "only" made a few tens of thousands on them like, what, five or so years ago. Like that time he briefly decided Zombie would be something else completely, but then wasn't. Or his board game about politics that was like three years late, and in response to a very polite Reddit post he went into "how DARE YOU" mode. What ever happened with that "you play the evil cultists" game that licensed his crappy game engine, where they had to assure everyone MRH wasn't in charge of anything important?
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 02:58
|
|
|
Nehru the Damaja posted:Incidentally as someone who's been familiar with basic lore via video games and nerd osmosis but never played, has anyone in your life made an interesting /compelling Malkavian who isn't just self-harm or self-parody? The Anarch leader of the group The Red Question is named "Motorcycle Annie" because she was sired after a motorcycle accident and now has most of a motorcycle incorporated into her physiology.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 03:31
|
|
|
That Old Tree posted:What ever happened with that "you play the evil cultists" game that licensed his crappy game engine, where they had to assure everyone MRH wasn't in charge of anything important? No idea. I tried to go check out on the Make Believe Games website but all of the pages are currently blank. As in literally blank.  I doublechecked on my phone to make sure that it wasn't just my javascript blocker, but no. They're gone. Google Cache has a version from October 27th so... this is relatively recent?
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 03:39
|
|
|
Desiden posted:I mentioned it over on RPG.net, but I really think this is the underlying factor that neither MR*H or nuWW as a whole seem to really grasp. yuuuup. I first played in high school, like any good white wolf origin should be, and that was just literally the first time I remember a game, or really any entertainment that available to me, presenting 'oh yea and your vampire can like dudes, whatever' as a valid option and not a punchline. That alone was revolutionary, it didn't matter that like half of the gay vampires were rapists and the other half were cartoon queers written by straight people, just the fact that a game at all said 'yea gays exist, closeted queer kid, you're fine' was enough. Now...no. You can't just coast on "GAYS" you have to actually not be poo poo and they clearly haven't learned that.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 03:46
|
|
|
bewilderment posted:Shadow of the Demon Lord somehow manages to push out like three supplements a year plus however many short four-page adventures the author feels like. They're good supplements too. They're on the shorter side though, like 90 to 200 pages. Yeah, but that's still not the DnD treadmill or as much as, say, 90's WoD. I think all of us actually agree here
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 04:07
|
|
|
Nehru the Damaja posted:Incidentally as someone who's been familiar with basic lore via video games and nerd osmosis but never played, has anyone in your life made an interesting /compelling Malkavian who isn't just self-harm or self-parody? Plenty, usually when going for an interesting concept rather fishmalk. I've got this concept I wanna play one of a Malkavian who thinks his derangement is the vision of a friend he betrayed that keeps haunting him, when in fact he is actively being haunted by his friend's ghost and hsi actual derangement is something else.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 05:05
|
|
|
There's always the deception Malk - You play as one Derangement to hide the fact your actual one is significantly worse. Y'know, like 'Hoo ha ha I am an adorable Fishmalk' whilst actually just being a huge fuckin' diablerist with poor impulse control.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 05:15
|
|
|
My favourite Malk is the one who just keeps people guessing.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 05:46
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 12, 2024 22:54 |
|
|
I figure the thing to do with Malkavians is to do that thing where the whole troupe has to improvise a famous quotation or song lyrics at the exact same time and then act like the resulting complete mess makes sense
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2018 05:56
|
|
