|
SKULL.GIF posted:I'm not sure the maps are big enough to accommodate 12v12
|
#
?
Nov 16, 2018 23:45
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 21, 2024 16:36 |
|
|
megane posted:GOATS is indeed pretty strong and popular at the top level these past few months. The thing with Dive was that it ONLY existed at the highest level. No one under like GM or maybe Masters could really even bother making it work the way it's supposed to. (And it was Tracer who was completely uncounterable and had no weaknesses, not Winston). Goats you just pick the right characters, hold w and left click and run to the point. Done. A bronze team could do that if they accidentally managed to copy their favorite streamers and the other team just dosn't. And Bridget individually has both the Torb/Bastion problem where she's easier to play than to counter play, letting her stomp people down in the bronze/silver/gold area while ALSO, unlike those two usually, being strong enough to be relevant to higher rank players. It all comes down to the fact that Bridget Tracer and Widow need to be removed from the game and 32 player instant respawn 24/7 hightower/2fort need to be added to the game.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 00:22
|
|
|
Whitenoise Poster posted:Bridget don't mean to single you out, but this right here is the real problem with brigitte. they should have prob picked a name people would be willing to pronounce hammond is kinda similar since nobody will ever call him wrecking ball, regardless of what the name in the hero gallery is
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 00:30
|
|
|
Son of Thunderbeast posted:but that'd be part of the fun No, I get it, I just mean I can immediately see 12v12s degenerate into meatgrinders on maps like Route 66. Imagine dealing with Rein/Orisa/Torb/Bastion every single match, and then also 8 other enemies on top of that. It'd be difficult to even make it out of spawn on offense without instantly getting mulched. 9v9 has just enough elbow space to maneuver, and I could see some weird Highlander-like meta develop out of that like it did with TF2.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 00:37
|
|
|
Whitenoise Poster posted:The thing with Dive was that it ONLY existed at the highest level. No one under like GM or maybe Masters could really even bother making it work the way it's supposed to. (And it was Tracer who was completely uncounterable and had no weaknesses, not Winston). disagree/agree with clarification: Dive only existed at the highest level *in solo queue/ladder play*. In my casting I've found organized teams clear down to low plat executing dive and butchering teams that couldn't counter-dive well at the same SR. So, you're correct for 99% of people who play the game. 
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 02:32
|
|
|
Mukaikubo posted:disagree/agree with clarification: I was playing plat solo queue during the height of dive, and dive very much existed there. OK sure, it didn't resemble the precision of higher ranks, but all it takes is a winston and dva jumping on a healer with a zen orb on the winston. It is super easy. Get 1 pick and win the fight. It was clearly the best plat comp and there were enough "pro genjis" to get you through. Plat GOATS is a disaster by comparison. OK maybe half the time the team has enough focus to get it rolling on offense, but the rest of the time, people wander off or get distracted. There aren't enough people that really know how to heal or tank. They just flail around without focusing fire. They feed the enemy ults up in about 20 seconds. That's my experience at least. headcase fucked around with this message at 03:46 on Nov 17, 2018 |
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 03:43
|
|
|
dive was an accident at like diamond and below, both in composition and in practice
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 05:35
|
|
|
Mehhh running at some helpless robomonk with no mobility and focusing fire between 2 people is not that complicated. Low rank teams can't react property and get split or flustered. Dive definitely has the advantage. Goats takes full teamwork, which is much harder to achieve, even if it's a simple directive.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 05:50
|
|
|
Whitenoise Poster posted:The thing with Dive was that it ONLY existed at the highest level. No one under like GM or maybe Masters could really even bother making it work the way it's supposed to. (And it was Tracer who was completely uncounterable and had no weaknesses, not Winston). Have you ever actually run Goats in bronze? I have. It doesn't work. It like, spectacularly doesn't work. It doesn't even come close to working. Even with full, active voice comms. I will never run Goats in bronze or with friends ever again.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 06:41
|
|
|
I ran goats in gold with a bunch of randos and I played Zarya and I gravved the Bastion and the Orisa. We won anyway. This comprised one of the like three times I have encountered goats in the game so yeah.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 06:59
|
|
|
dive takes way more teamwork and coordination than just walking forward with tanks. realistically, neither is actually happening in the way people think of when you say dive or goats tho. you just run the heroes associated with it. it's not like high level goats is just a deathball with no thought put into it mechanically speaking, dive is way harder. like just having winston/d.va isn't a dive team. your plat tracer/genji is probably not doing as much work as they think they are, and I REALLY doubt 99% of them are actually working with you at any level of play. part of what makes goats so good at low levels is that it's so hard to die. lucio, brigitte, and the cart overlap to have stupid passive healing that doesn't require any real skill to do and half your team has a ton of health. brig and lucio's ults make you even tankier and you'll have shields everywhere. not dying is usually more important than killing people
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 07:15
|
|
|
turtlecrunch posted:I ran goats in gold with a bunch of randos and I played Zarya and I gravved the Bastion and the Orisa. We won anyway. This comprised one of the like three times I have encountered goats in the game so yeah. I mostly played the Lucio and even knowing how to Lucio in Goats (speed boost your Rein every moment you possibly can) didn't make the comp workable in the slightest. Though your average Lucio in bronze isn't going to be speed boosting much, if at all. My friend is a Lucio main in gold and even he pretty much doesn't use speed boost ever.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 07:17
|
|
|
Don't try to force comps in solo queue. If you go 'lets run goats', but nobody on your team has no loving clue how to play rein. Yeah, you're gonna loving lose because it turns out people playing what they're good at is going to be better unless forcing the person to play a role/hero they're uncomfortable with will make up for the loss in effective team SR.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 07:33
|
|
|
I think the takeaway is that trying to run a structured comp of any kind below GM is a crapshoot at best, and trying to see some sort of "meta" in the results is probably an exercise in futility. Play what you're good at and maybe try to not have 6 DPS.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 07:36
|
|
|
Well, I am a bit disappointed that MeI Cannot extinguish burning enemies from Ashe's dynamite or Torbjorn sticky loads. Especially when she is wearing the firefighting skin...
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 14:30
|
|
|
berenzen posted:Don't try to force comps in solo queue. If you go 'lets run goats', but nobody on your team has no loving clue how to play rein. Yeah, you're gonna loving lose because it turns out people playing what they're good at is going to be better unless forcing the person to play a role/hero they're uncomfortable with will make up for the loss in effective team SR. This is also why almost all supposed "hard" counters are actually soft ones, because it's very unlikely that someone will be as effective with the counter as they are with their first pick. People absolutely do not have the same level of skill with all characters, and a comp has to be really effective (or be made up of someone's second-best characters) to make up for the loss of comfort with their preferr3d character.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 14:59
|
|
|
I don't even know what goats is, but I know what dive is, so there is some perspective from bronze.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 15:08
|
|
|
Brigitte is poorly designed because she both encourages you to run a boring phalanx-style team and punishes your opponents for not doing the same. You can adjust her numbers down until she's not a playable hero but it will be hard to make her a hero that's good to have in the game until you fix that problem.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 16:47
|
|
|
Irony Be My Shield posted:Brigitte is poorly designed because she both encourages you to run a boring phalanx-style team and punishes your opponents for not doing the same. You can adjust her numbers down until she's not a playable hero but it will be hard to make her a hero that's good to have in the game until you fix that problem. Brigitte is strongest against quote-unquote boring phalanx style teams, her weakness is people spreading out and shooting her from long distance with Pharah and such. That's a big part of why she's in GOATS, she does best in a big chaotic deathball-on-deathball melee. But I guess we can't loving wait to get back to the "interesting" meta where Tracer and Genji dominated every game, so RIP Brigitte.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 17:03
|
|
|
quote:Incoming PTR Changes
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 17:07
|
|
|
Oh good, now she can't kill Tracer. Wonderful. e: Also, "we're reducing CC" is gonna make everyone super happy I'm sure, but that's a huge buff to Genji and Tracer too, since CC is the only really reliable way to kill them. Maybe they'll get nerfed to compesshaahaha oh god I can't even finish that sentence megane fucked around with this message at 17:23 on Nov 17, 2018 |
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 17:09
|
|
|
So she's Lucio with a club and no speed boost now?
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 17:15
|
|
|
Eox posted:So she's Lucio with a club and no speed boost now? Don't forget about the near immediate fullheal with overheal in the form of armor. That is probably her greatest asset: making one guy impossible to dive.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 17:29
|
|
|
Cool. Glad Tracer isn't allowed a counter ever.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 17:32
|
|
|
Bumper Stickup posted:Cool. Glad Tracer isn't allowed a counter ever. One which basically only did poo poo in a 6m radius, against an opponent who was much more mobile than her. Can't let the supports every actually do something.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 18:01
|
|
|
I know they said they're done doing new gamemodes for a while, but I would love an arcade mode where they give every hero the commonly suggested changes like the Monkey's Paw. CC immune Reinhardt, no falloff McCree and no Widowmaker at all? Have fun kids.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 18:15
|
|
|
Lol xQc got banned again, for 24 days. What a dipshit
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 19:31
|
|
|
Any one particular thing push him over the line, or just that boy being That Boy?
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 20:14
|
|
|
apparently abusive chat (again). he's a repeat offender so his punishments are gonna be longer
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 20:18
|
|
|
Bumper Stickup posted:Cool. Glad Tracer isn't allowed a counter ever. Like Widow, the counter to Tracer is that she's not very effective unless played by a GM.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 20:40
|
|
|
Tracer is straight up hard countered by brig's ult and armor packs. Tracer is effective by going in, bursting someone down, and escaping. It's hard to do that vs. someone with 500+ effective hp.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 20:53
|
|
|
As if xqc won't just be given infinite chances because he's popular and therefore profitable
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 20:59
|
|
|
berenzen posted:Tracer is straight up hard countered by brig's ult and armor packs. Tracer is effective by going in, bursting someone down, and escaping. It's hard to do that vs. someone with 500+ effective hp. Its an Ult. Thats like saying Lucio's ult hard counters Tracer. I mean sure, its semi true while it lasts, but the moment its finished, its no longer an issue. Also, thanks to the nerf, she'll not build ult quite as fast anymore too.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 23:42
|
|
|
I Said No posted:As if xqc won't just be given infinite chances because he's popular and therefore profitable the bans are automated
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 23:51
|
|
|
I'm a Moira main and I absolutelly know that she's the one that's going to be nerfed into the ground after they're done with Brig, it just stands to reason.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 23:55
|
|
|
I have no idea why they would, she’s pretty niche.
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 23:56
|
|
|
I'd be shocked if moira was changed at all ever
|
|
#
?
Nov 17, 2018 23:56
|
|
|
hobbesmaster posted:I have no idea why they would, she’s pretty niche. The Brig changes make her stronger for people playing Goats in higher ranks but totally defangs her in lower ranks where people don't play in any sort of organized way and will not reap the rewards of the buff to her healing aura. The low tier Brig players will not be able to do poo poo to Tracer/Genji, so the next logical step is for them to move to Moira. Cue desperate braying about how Moira is unfun to play against, leading Blizzard to marginally buff her healing abilites while wrecking her offensive abilites.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2018 00:05
|
|
|
she's only good in super tanky comps and ana's still better for that. she's good but not great. there's no reason to nerf her and I've never heard anyone complain about how good moira is, except in dm I guess
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2018 00:07
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 21, 2024 16:36 |
|
|
Moira’s offensive abilities are pretty bad other than for kill conforming which is how she gets so many kills at low level where nobody is aware of their own or their opponents hp levels She’s OP in death match because she can steal other people’s kills
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2018 00:07
|
|