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Phlegmish
Jul 2, 2011



Yeah, I should have done it earlier.

One thing I've noticed is that it's been pretty buggy so far. Are you supposed to cap the frame rate in this game?

e:

Phlegmish fucked around with this message at 23:52 on Nov 24, 2018

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Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Got any deathsticks?
Scorpions and ants falling through geometry is normal.

Cap your framerate to 59FPS

Delacroix
Dec 7, 2010

:munch:
It's an engine specific bug since Oblivion, the solution as always is cap the frame rate. I want to say the near fatal clutter physics that can cause a pot to violently vibrate and take off 80% of your health is tied to the same issue but I don't know for sure.

DACK FAYDEN
Feb 25, 2013

Bear Witness

Raygereio posted:

Concidering he wrote Grieving Mother & Durance in PoE, we're in pot calling the kettle black territory.
fiery whore of a goddess

that's five words, Durance's wordcount must be like ten total right

aniviron
Sep 11, 2014


Delacroix posted:

It's an engine specific bug since Oblivion, the solution as always is cap the frame rate. I want to say the near fatal clutter physics that can cause a pot to violently vibrate and take off 80% of your health is tied to the same issue but I don't know for sure.

It's still an engine bug as of a week ago, since Fallout 76 launched with this problem.

The pots/bones etc freaking out and killing you still happen under 60fps though, you just get weirder and more common issues above 60. It's also tied to a lot of things such as the in-game clock, which means the day night cycle gets hosed up etc if you go above 60.

Fair Bear Maiden
Jun 17, 2013

2house2fly posted:

Did that guy definitely interview Avellone? I got most of that just from reading RPGcodex threads he posts in

It's not that hard to get a hold of Avellone. He's pretty willing to give interviews to people. I doubt there's any big conspiracy, dude just gives the same answers because that's what he thinks.

Phlegmish
Jul 2, 2011



aniviron posted:

It's still an engine bug as of a week ago, since Fallout 76 launched with this problem.

The pots/bones etc freaking out and killing you still happen under 60fps though, you just get weirder and more common issues above 60. It's also tied to a lot of things such as the in-game clock, which means the day night cycle gets hosed up etc if you go above 60.

The worst bugs that I've noticed involve NPC's behaving in strange ways, running endlessly into walls etc.

I'll hold my nose and cap the frame rate to 60

e: what is the best way to actually do this without having to set my 144Hz monitor to a 60Hz refresh rate?

Phlegmish fucked around with this message at 15:55 on Nov 25, 2018

Generic Monk
Oct 31, 2011

Phlegmish posted:

The worst bugs that I've noticed involve NPC's behaving in strange ways, running endlessly into walls etc.

I'll hold my nose and cap the frame rate to 60

e: what is the best way to actually do this without having to set my 144Hz monitor to a 60Hz refresh rate?

graphics driver control panel prob has a framerate limit option

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Got any deathsticks?
New Vegas Stutter Remover has an fps cap function built in

Phlegmish
Jul 2, 2011



This is harder than I remember, these legionary assassins take ages to go down. Before I got the Combat Armor I wasn't even able to beat them at all

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Got any deathsticks?

Phlegmish posted:

This is harder than I remember, these legionary assassins take ages to go down. Before I got the Combat Armor I wasn't even able to beat them at all

Armor piercing .303 rounds and a hunting or Battle rifle do the trick. Aim for the head.

CommissarMega
Nov 18, 2008

THUNDERDOME LOSER
So New California was a big waste of loving time- anyone have any good story mods for New Vegas?

Air Skwirl
May 13, 2007

Neither snow nor rain nor heat nor gloom of night stays these couriers from the swift completion of their appointed shitposting.

CommissarMega posted:

So New California was a big waste of loving time- anyone have any good story mods for New Vegas?

Nope.

Basic Chunnel
Sep 21, 2010

Jesus! Jesus Christ! Say his name! Jesus! Jesus! Come down now!

Bounties is as good as you’re going to get.

Paul Revere 3000
Dec 8, 2007

So like a pimp I'm pimpin'
I got a boat to eat shrimp in
Nothing wrong with my leg
I'm just B-boy limpin'


I remember Autumn Leaves being alright.

chitoryu12
Apr 24, 2014

Paul Revere 3000 posted:

I remember Autumn Leaves being alright.

Yeah, Autumn Leaves is probably the best story mod. It's so good, Bethesda stole it for Far Harbor!

Space Cadet Omoly
Jan 15, 2014

~Groovy~


I just realized that the way you befriend the members of the Think Tank in Old World Blues is by helping them each relearn something related to maintaining a healthy relationship with another person:

Dr. 8 - Communication
Dr. Borous - Compassion
Dr. Dala - Intimacy
Dr. 0 - Respect
Dr. Klein - Compromise

chitoryu12
Apr 24, 2014

Space Cadet Omoly posted:

I just realized that the way you befriend the members of the Think Tank in Old World Blues is by helping them each relearn something related to maintaining a healthy relationship with another person:

Dr. 8 - Communication
Dr. Borous - Compassion
Dr. Dala - Intimacy
Dr. 0 - Respect
Dr. Klein - Compromise

Robo Scorpions - Moving on

BillyC
Feb 19, 2013

everythin' under heaven is in utter chaos, cloud


Bread Liar

chitoryu12 posted:

Robo Scorpions - Moving on

Impossible, I love smashing robo scorpions with my science axe.

chitoryu12
Apr 24, 2014

BillyC posted:

Impossible, I love smashing robo scorpions with my science axe.

Exactly. It's teaching you how to break up.

Discendo Vox
Mar 21, 2013

This does not make sense when, again, aggregate indicia also indicate improvements. The belief that things are worse is false. It remains false.
Yeah, Chris, we really needed the Legion to be more sympathetic, and there was no reason at all they should have been sexist.

cripes.

BillyC
Feb 19, 2013

everythin' under heaven is in utter chaos, cloud


Bread Liar

chitoryu12 posted:

Exactly. It's teaching you how to break up.

:aaa:

Lt. Danger
Dec 22, 2006

jolly good chaps we sure showed the hun

Discendo Vox posted:

Yeah, Chris, we really needed the Legion to be more sympathetic, and there was no reason at all they should have been sexist.

cripes.

weird take considering a common player complaint was precisely that the legion were too unsympathetic to consider supporting, partly because of their attitudes to women

chitoryu12
Apr 24, 2014

Lt. Danger posted:

weird take considering a common player complaint was precisely that the legion were too unsympathetic to consider supporting, partly because of their attitudes to women

JE Sawyer has commented on this here, and he said the Legion was entirely intended to be unsympathetic. They weren't supposed to be yet another morally grey choice like every other option. They were explicitly a force of fascism, but they still allowed you to join just to keep the option open.

The mistake that criticism makes is assuming that the Legion was ever meant to be supported by a reasonable person.

Lt. Danger
Dec 22, 2006

jolly good chaps we sure showed the hun

yes, I know, it's a perfectly fine design choice for one faction to be markedly 'evil'

but I don't think it unreasonable to instead prefer a different design choice where all factions are roughly in the same area in terms of morality - see Pillars of Eternity 2 where even nakedly-imperialist Rauatai gets a few ethical bones thrown its way. neither's better or worse, they're just different design choices (by the same person, in fact!)

discendo vox seemed to think it was beyond the pale to suggest the legion could have been written to be a more palatable choice for players

Rinkles
Oct 24, 2010

What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?
One of the reasons I've yet to get very far in a legion run

El_Elegante
Jul 3, 2004

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Biscuit Hider
Either choice is better than Far Cry 4’s “actually everyone is bad, and the game’s setting is not a better place having you in it.” Spec Ops the line took a similar tack yet they managed to be far less nihilistic.

SlothfulCobra
Mar 27, 2011

It's worth comparing New Vegas with the other RPGs that led up to it. Knights of the Old Republic gave a choice between good and cartoonishly evil. Fallout 3 gave the option to commit genocide against the entire capital wasteland. It's not so much the appeal of the choice, but the fact that the choice is there. It also makes the factional choice between House and the NCR seem more plausible if there's a third option just dangling out there.

It doesn't need to be an appealing option, but the fact that there is the extra option gives more depth to choosing to do what you do. As opposed to the RPGs that let you decide whether you want to be mean or nice as you save the world.

jokes
Dec 20, 2012

Uh... Kupo?

Rinkles posted:

One of the reasons I've yet to get very far in a legion run

It's just not cool, engaging, or fun. Normally cults of personality require a personality that is, well, engaging. Caesar was utterly forgettable. It really begs the question how he was able to command respect by anyone. If anything he seems like an old crabapple. He also looks/behaves like the old guy puppet by that comedian who uses puppets.

Also the Legion doesn't seem cartoonishly evil, jut seem plainly evil. Besides the uniform and the titles, they're not really over the top, they just want to enslave people and take territory.

jokes fucked around with this message at 18:23 on Nov 26, 2018

Malpais Legate
Oct 1, 2014

Rinkles posted:

One of the reasons I've yet to get very far in a legion run

It's a shame that Legion has some of the more fun encounters, in that video game-y sense. Arizona Killer is exciting to pull off, as is the Battle for Hoover Dam on the Legion's side.

I would have liked to see the Legion territories that they talked about having to cut. It would have made the Legion fall more on the human side of evil than that Empire of Evil it ends up more like.

chitoryu12
Apr 24, 2014

El_Elegante posted:

Either choice is better than Far Cry 4’s “actually everyone is bad, and the game’s setting is not a better place having you in it.” Spec Ops the line took a similar tack yet they managed to be far less nihilistic.

Which is also the same option Fallout 4 took. While they responded to criticism of Fallout 3 by giving you the ability to side with different factions, all of them are sort of equally lovely because you're either helping fascists or you're helping good guys who can't actually take care of everything and are forced to slaughter other factions to do so. There's no ending where you can really feel confident that you made the right choice and didn't gently caress over well-meaning people.

Which is still better than Fallout 3, which still railroads you into doing the same stuff and just gives you the option to poison the entire wasteland for no real reason while doing it. Or the Elder Scrolls games that have no options in the main quest.

SlothfulCobra
Mar 27, 2011

Colonel Autumn might be the real hero of Fallout 3.

Acebuckeye13
Nov 2, 2010

Against All Tyrants

Ultra Carp

Lt. Danger posted:

yes, I know, it's a perfectly fine design choice for one faction to be markedly 'evil'

but I don't think it unreasonable to instead prefer a different design choice where all factions are roughly in the same area in terms of morality - see Pillars of Eternity 2 where even nakedly-imperialist Rauatai gets a few ethical bones thrown its way. neither's better or worse, they're just different design choices (by the same person, in fact!)

discendo vox seemed to think it was beyond the pale to suggest the legion could have been written to be a more palatable choice for players

It helps to consider that one of the central themes of New Vegas is that 'civilization' is coming to the Mojave, whether it likes it or not—and ultimately, the courier's decision is what that civilization will look like. As a result, all four endings represent different political philosophies: For NCR, it's liberal Democracy, Caesar is brutal authoritarianism, House is Randian Objectivism, and Independent is anarchism.

Could the devs have softened the Legion by removing or downplaying the sexism and misogyny? Sure, but it's important to note that removes one of the biggest ideological differentiations between the Legion and NCR. NCR is, for all its faults, an egalitarian society, befitting its origins from Vault 15 and Shady Sands—gender and race play relatively little role in Republic society, and even though prejudices exist, marginalized individuals are still allowed to exist and serve in the military openly. The Legion, by contrast, is very classically authoritarian: The leadership is exclusively white and male, gender roles are strictly defined and segregated, and there is no place in Caesar's Rome for the marginalized or oppressed.

It would have absolutely been great to see more of the Legion territory to see more of what life under Caesar is actually like, but ultimately I think they made the right choice: New Vegas is a game about stark choices with few truly 'good' options, and softening the Legion would have only weakened the ideological underpinnings that help to make each faction interesting and unique.

e: Also Deadfire is about colonization, and the different factions represent different modes of colonization: Colonizing for permanent territory, colonizing for profit, being colonized, and ~pirates~, which is why morally they're much closer to each other, as each method is filled with its own internal moralizing and self-justification.

Acebuckeye13 fucked around with this message at 19:00 on Nov 26, 2018

steinrokkan
Apr 2, 2011



Soiled Meat

SlothfulCobra posted:

Colonel Autumn might be the real hero of Fallout 3.

To this day I don't understand what Autumn's / Eden's motivations were as they were portrayed in the game, or what they were supposed to be in the mind of the developers.

So you may very well be right

Acute Grill
Dec 9, 2011

Chomp

steinrokkan posted:

To this day I don't understand what Autumn's / Eden's motivations were as they were portrayed in the game, or what they were supposed to be in the mind of the developers.

So you may very well be right

Eden wanted to do a lot of genocide, killing almost everyone including the player character, while Autumn wants to do less genocide.

Warmachine
Jan 30, 2012



My hot take on this is that creating these dramatic forks such as siding with the legion is an active detractor to the rest of the game experience. Instead of making a full experience for the faction just so "the option is there," make the other options compelling enough that you don't notice to conspicuous lack of a choice. I liked Alpha Protocol for this, since none of the choices created significant deviations in what missions you need to do. You could still choose to join the bad guys in the 11th hour, but the way you get there is the same. The choices change how you get there, of course, but they don't really change the actual path.

The branching paths method just soaks a lot of resources that could be used to make fewer paths more interesting, since instead of changing the reactions of a few characters on that path, you have to write whole new paths. I get prickly when people start talking about choices in video games because more often than not, I think the game suffers for the choice.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

chitoryu12 posted:

Which is also the same option Fallout 4 took. While they responded to criticism of Fallout 3 by giving you the ability to side with different factions, all of them are sort of equally lovely because you're either helping fascists or you're helping good guys who can't actually take care of everything and are forced to slaughter other factions to do so. There's no ending where you can really feel confident that you made the right choice and didn't gently caress over well-meaning people.

Which is still better than Fallout 3, which still railroads you into doing the same stuff and just gives you the option to poison the entire wasteland for no real reason while doing it. Or the Elder Scrolls games that have no options in the main quest.


chitoryu12 posted:

JE Sawyer has commented on this here, and he said the Legion was entirely intended to be unsympathetic. They weren't supposed to be yet another morally grey choice like every other option. They were explicitly a force of fascism, but they still allowed you to join just to keep the option open.

The mistake that criticism makes is assuming that the Legion was ever meant to be supported by a reasonable person.

I hate the legion but i find them interesting. they are basically raiders that have a ideology and a modus operandi and a leadership class. ceasar is just an rear end in a top hat who was well read and cosplay in history that only he can read. the fun thing is he has deluded himself into believing that his little hell society has any chance in the long term. sure he can spew as much hegel as he wants but he has no one really to lead outside giant psychos or dumb lickspitles.

Iretep
Nov 10, 2009
To me Caesar is a bit of a tragic figure. Deep down he seems to still hold similar ideals to the children of the apocolypse but it seems he has decided to reach those ideals no matter the cost. Most likely because he saw his fellow members basically doing nothing but teaching and not accomplishing much of anything.

Paracelsus
Apr 6, 2009

bless this post ~kya
I think the Legion should have been more fleshed out to examine how and why that kind of society emerges, not in the sense of "some people are just bad" but rather "what situations lead ordinary people to decide that having the Legion is better than not having the Legion." Raul hints at it a bit, but more detail would have been nice. A fictional social structure doesn't have to be "good" in order for it to be a useful examination or critique of more familiar structures.

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steinrokkan
Apr 2, 2011



Soiled Meat

Dapper_Swindler posted:

I hate the legion but i find them interesting. they are basically raiders that have a ideology and a modus operandi and a leadership class. ceasar is just an rear end in a top hat who was well read and cosplay in history that only he can read. the fun thing is he has deluded himself into believing that his little hell society has any chance in the long term. sure he can spew as much hegel as he wants but he has no one really to lead outside giant psychos or dumb lickspitles.

The trader you meet at the Fort says the Legion land outside the frontlines is well run - if you are member of the ruling class. With roads, commerce, towns (?) and slaves for everybody. It would be missing the point to assume Caesar was just a flash in the pan raider boss.

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