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Mendrian posted:There is a position between "Obama bad" and "Obama perfect." Since Obama is literally the only modern president to try anything remotely left wing it's probably worth examining his legacy with a more nuanced eye. problem being the person he's responding to did not want people examining obama's legacy
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Dec 5, 2018 21:38
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Vintersorg posted:You're an ungrateful wretch if you poo poo on Obama. Grateful for what exactly? Obama's administration is what brought us here. In the course of his administration, he normalized and expanded upon all the excesses of the previous Republican administration. Understand that while we might survive through the term of another Obama, we absolutely won't survive whatever psycho gets into office after him that will make Trump look like an reasonable statesmen.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:39
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Jesus loving christ was this literally like 10 pages of "actually obama (dems) bad"?
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Dec 5, 2018 21:40
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Condiv posted:Hardball tactics like nominating a republican suggestion to the SCOTUS, then letting the republicans turn the appointment into an election issue It would've been bad if he had any chance of being confirmed, it was a good way to show how batshit insane Republicans were. Also lol @ "letting the Republicans turn the appointment into an election issue" buddy you may as well accuse him of letting the sun rise
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Dec 5, 2018 21:40
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Mendrian posted:Obama was not far left enough, and that's true. But god damned if people aren't just flatly ignoring his strengths and the importance of his election. Meh, subtract his charisma and he's a two term Carter. Saying "he was better than what was up to that point the most useless President in the post-WW2 age and got thousands killed on 9/11 plus thousands more on a war based entirely on lies and bullshit, a war we're STILL FIGHTING RIGHT NOW and btw who lit the economy on fire before peacing out to paint stuff" isn't a "strength." Just like any subsequent president who doesn't wander off during bill signings and mix word salad on Twitter on the shitter every morning shouldn't have not doing those things listed as their "strengths." His election was very important but history will show his presidency was less so. EDIT I should add a caveat that *IF* we get M4A he can be credited with at least getting us one step closer but I'll stop there. VH4Ever fucked around with this message at 21:43 on Dec 5, 2018 |
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Dec 5, 2018 21:40
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While none of the "cool kids" want to deal with the issue because it would interfere with their edgy memes, murdering 3 million people (the 1%) wouldn't be Very Nice. There are probably people in this forum who are the 1%, because their parents are rich or they lucked out with some tech startup or something.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:43
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Dapper_Swindler posted:this. I think despite some of his shittier policies, Obama is genuinely a good man and genuinely tried to help people and tried to do the right thing. yeah i don't like the drones, but all presidents of most nations have gently caress ton of blood on their hands, it sadly comes with the job. i will genuinly feel sad when he dies because he was one of the people who got me motivated to follow politics. the big flaw with obama in my eyes was he was a very empathetic and trusting person, which in normal cases isn't a bad thing. but when the opposing party are Bigoted greedy sociopaths and are open as gently caress about it, then its bad. Obama's fatal flaw was what someone else said; he genuinely believes the ideal of bipartisanship and that you can get things done with this monstrous incarnation of the GOP, when they would rat gently caress him every chance they got. I imagine now he's a little wiser and a little more bitter about the whole process, but it's clear deep down he truly believes there is good in this country's lost principles. He is probably one of the most genuinely decent men to hold office, and that might be what makes him want to see decency in people that don't deserve it.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:44
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https://twitter.com/samstein/status/1070340609695727616?s=19 Donald is a big dumb stupid, but he does have a knack for realizing when he can simply skip out on a debt and make it someone else's problem.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:45
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BarbarianElephant posted:While none of the "cool kids" want to deal with the issue because it would interfere with their edgy memes, murdering 3 million people (the 1%) wouldn't be Very Nice. That's not what the 1% means it's way less people than that.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:45
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Lemming posted:It would've been bad if he had any chance of being confirmed, it was a good way to show how batshit insane Republicans were. hmm yeah all he could do was sit on his butt and let the republicans have their way. oh wait, he could've tried appointing a judge anyway and tested the theory that he could do that since the legislature had shirked its constitutional duties. oh and he could've torched the republicans daily for refusing to perform their constitutional duties. instead we got him sitting on his butt, hillary losing, and the republicans getting 2 supreme court justices (and maybe 3 if ginsberg doesn't outlive trump's presidency)
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Dec 5, 2018 21:45
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Obama was the best president in my lifetime, probably the best president in 50-60 years. He's still a capitalist and a neoliberal. I was also a capitalist and a neoliberal in those years but now I am not. If you still are then of course you like Obama.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:45
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Lemming posted:It would've been bad if he had any chance of being confirmed, it was a good way to show how batshit insane Republicans were. I just want to comment on this strategy. You either know the Republicans are crazy or you don't. Nothing Democrats do is going to do better job of showing that Republicans are crazy than Republicans' craziness. A better strategy would be to offer an alternative to crazy, rather than having non-crazy people defend a guy on the principle that he's nice to crazy people. I was critical at the time when Obama did it and I'm critical today when Democrats do it.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:46
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The Obama's don't really need to pretend that Trump it's a vile shiturd... It's fine.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:46
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When the Viagra kinda starts to kick in
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Dec 5, 2018 21:46
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Jaxyon posted:That's not what the 1% means it's way less people than that. 1%er spotted! I found one! Right here, guys!
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Dec 5, 2018 21:46
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VH4Ever posted:Meh, subtract his charisma and he's a two term Carter. Saying "he was better than what was up to that point the most useless President in the post-WW2 age and got thousands killed on 9/11 plus thousands more on a war based entirely on lies and bullshit, a war we're STILL FIGHTING RIGHT NOW and btw who lit the economy on fire before peacing out to paint stuff" isn't a "strength." Just like any subsequent president who doesn't wander off during bill signings and mix word salad on Twitter on the shitter every morning shouldn't have not doing those things listed as their "strengths." His election was very important but history will show his presidency was less so. Well for instance he attempted proto-socialized healthcare. It was a massive failure and too little/too late but it's impact was incredibly significant both politically and now, historically. He denounced police violence. These things are important. Reducing all speech work to 'charisma' is a bit too simplistic. What you say is also critical.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:46
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BarbarianElephant posted:While none of the "cool kids" want to deal with the issue because it would interfere with their edgy memes, murdering 3 million people (the 1%) wouldn't be Very Nice. my heart bleeds for the poor 1% who are leading us into a ecological apocalypse 
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Dec 5, 2018 21:46
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FizFashizzle posted:No, he may have grown frustrated towards the end, but Obama absolutely saw himself as someone who could bridge the divide and find common ground. Yea, I mean his most famous speech, the DNC 2004 speech, had a central theme of "there is no blue states or red states, but the united states of America". I don't see how anyone watches that speech, and many of his campaign speeches, and think Obama isn't going to do everything possible to bridge divides. Honestly that's what drew me to him, as finding common ground and healing divisions is probably my biggest passion.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:46
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Hellblazer187 posted:Obama was the best president in my lifetime, probably the best president in 50-60 years. Yeah this is just about right. Not empty-quoting.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:47
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Groovelord Neato posted:deleda est wells fargo This is from a few pages back, but The Dollop episode about Wells Fargo is a pro-click and will make you want to punch every Wells Fargo banker in the mouth until your hand is reduced to a bloody stump. https://soundcloud.com/the-dollop/350-wells-fargo
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Dec 5, 2018 21:47
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Chimp_On_Stilts posted:https://twitter.com/samstein/status/1070340609695727616?s=19 Yeah, it's basically his only expertise.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:48
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Mendrian posted:Well for instance he attempted proto-socialized healthcare. It was a massive failure and too little/too late but it's impact was incredibly significant both politically and now, historically. ppaca is not proto-socialized healthcare. unless you mean socialism for corporations, in which case i agree
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Dec 5, 2018 21:48
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Condiv posted:hmm yeah all he could do was sit on his butt and let the republicans have their way. oh wait, he could've tried appointing a judge anyway and tested the theory that he could do that since the legislature had shirked its constitutional duties. oh and he could've torched the republicans daily for refusing to perform their constitutional duties. instead we got him sitting on his butt, hillary losing, and the republicans getting 2 supreme court justices (and maybe 3 if ginsberg doesn't outlive trump's presidency) Democrats absolutely would have punished a completely justified, reasonable power grab like that (I'm not being sarcastic, in a just world it would have been a reasonable response to the situation). They have a hard on for decorum and it would have depressed turnout even worse. Edit: also it probably wouldn't have worked
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Dec 5, 2018 21:48
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I'm glad my daughter grew up under an Obama presidency. Really afraid of what she sees now as the leader of our country.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:49
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 When someone has to take the time to try to convince america that the president of the United States can read https://mobile.twitter.com/GreggJarrett/status/1070416303696080896
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Dec 5, 2018 21:49
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Condiv posted:ppaca is not proto-socialized healthcare. unless you mean socialism for corporations, in which case i agree It's the closest thing anybody had tried. It isn't good! But the intersection of Obamacare and Bernie is where the national conversation on MFA comes from.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:50
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Giggy posted:Has Dole denounced the current Republican Party or his part in creating it? I'm genuinely asking, cause he probably should have when the GOP voted down that disability legislation right in front of him.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:51
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Chimp_On_Stilts posted:https://twitter.com/samstein/status/1070340609695727616?s=19
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Dec 5, 2018 21:52
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theblackw0lf posted:
You can't heal America's current "divisions." You have to overcome them, because right now the divisions are "should we make it intolerable for the majority of people to live or not." It was already clear in 2008 that the GOP was a death cult. I find it hard to praise Obama for believing in the ideals of America and working with his opponents when his opponents literally want what's worse for everyone.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:52
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TulliusCicero posted:Obama's fatal flaw was what someone else said; he genuinely believes the ideal of bipartisanship and that you can get things done with this monstrous incarnation of the GOP, when they would rat gently caress him every chance they got. i mean, even i still believe in the principles, even if america doesn't and never has. I just believe we can't trust the other side to do the right thing so gently caress them. because what the gently caress is left if you abandon the lie.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:53
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Jaxyon posted:That's not what the 1% means it's way less people than that. I wouldn't bother continuing with them. You can only be that obtuse by trying.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:53
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Mendrian posted:It's the closest thing anybody had tried. It isn't good! But the intersection of Obamacare and Bernie is where the national conversation on MFA comes from. Yeah honestly this is fair and should probably go in the "positive" column for him.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:53
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theblackw0lf posted:Yea, I mean his most famous speech, the DNC 2004 speech, had a central theme of "there is no blue states or red states, but the united states of America". what does healing divisions even mean in this context? what is it you're hoping for with "healing divisions"? there are divisions in this country for a very good reason. there are people that want to do terrible things. as long as those people exist and are trying to use our government to tear apart families, kill black people with impunity, make sure women have to give birth to rape babies and pay for rape kits, etc. then those divisions are good
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Dec 5, 2018 21:53
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Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:Trump has the posture of an 13 year old Trump has haemorrhoids the size of pomegranates. They probably had to make a hole in the chair for him to sit down.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:54
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Condiv posted:what does healing divisions even mean in this context? what is it you're hoping for with "healing divisions"? "stop yelling at white people for all the awful poo poo we did"
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Dec 5, 2018 21:55
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https://mobile.twitter.com/starsandstripes/status/1070294717210869761 I am sure philadelphia will welcome him
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Dec 5, 2018 21:56
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Lumpy posted:Given we in the US are limited to choose between a Neoliberal and a white nationalist agent of the capital class for our Presidents, Obama was the best we could have hoped for. Yeah I kind of feel this. Everyone is flawed, I’ll take Obama with his flaws over the apparent alternatives. Also, holy poo poo was he an amazing orator. Like, I saw him speak in person once and god loving drat could that man address a crowd with respect, passion and eloquence. Then you all elected DJT. So yeah, drone strikes and such suck rear end, but that’s not on him either. He’s not a lovely person, he was the president of kind of a lovely country.
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Dec 5, 2018 21:56
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Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:https://mobile.twitter.com/AP_Top25/status/1070146099497832448 Somebody tell Gritty
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Dec 5, 2018 21:56
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Unormal posted:Jesus loving christ was this literally like 10 pages of "actually obama (dems) bad"? well yeah, it's a wednesday Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:https://mobile.twitter.com/AP_Top25/status/1070146099497832448 too bad it's not in a couple weeks, i'll be up visiting family and i could go protest with them
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Dec 5, 2018 21:57
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Lemming posted:Democrats absolutely would have punished a completely justified, reasonable power grab like that (I'm not being sarcastic, in a just world it would have been a reasonable response to the situation). They have a hard on for decorum and it would have depressed turnout even worse. i don't disagree with any of this, but I still think obama should have tried. trying and failing is better than not trying imo Mendrian posted:It's the closest thing anybody had tried. It isn't good! But the intersection of Obamacare and Bernie is where the national conversation on MFA comes from. i'm not sure that obamacare was a middle step we actually needed. it's certainly better than the status quo, but it wasn't enough back when it was passed, and there's resistance to moving beyond it cause "we just passed ppaca! it just needs a few tweaks and it will work perfectly!"
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Dec 5, 2018 21:57
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