|
A two colour scale is always easier to read and you'd have thought this would be a pretty solved problem in their engine by this point
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 14:17
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 12, 2024 01:42 |
|
|
is a dark blue<-->light blue<-->light red<-->dark red gradient the most safe choice for colorblindness?
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 14:31
|
|
|
It’s easy to fix in isolation but I wouldn’t be surprised if they’re trying to keep each map mode visually distinct, which is a lot easier with single colour.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 14:34
|
|
|
I'm really looking forward to seeing how the soundtrack turns out, I don't believe any music teasers have been released yet?
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 14:47
|
|
|
Groogy posted:Oh... okay
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 15:54
|
|
|
Groogy posted:Oh... okay Red - purple - blue is kang
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 16:19
|
|
|
Groogy posted:Oh... okay Don't listen to these guys groogs, I know you've always wanted to do a scale using just the hue with constant saturation and value. Don't let your dreams be memes
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 17:33
|
|
|
AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:Just lol if you let posters on this website determine how you work. Just lol if you design any UI elements as a developer without first checking with your UX team.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 21:49
|
|
|
GrossMurpel posted:Just lol if you design any UI elements as a developer without first checking with your UX team.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 21:51
|
|
|
AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:Just lol if you have a UX team. Just lol if you have a team.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 22:54
|
|
|
All these posts remind me that it was a good idea to retire from IT.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 22:56
|
|
|
I wonder if Paradox has any dedicated cartographers on staff?
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 23:08
|
|
|
VostokProgram posted:Don't listen to these guys groogs, I know you've always wanted to do a scale using just the hue with constant saturation and value. Don't let your dreams be memes A variant of this seems like an easy way to show multiple orthogonal bits of information in a single mapmode.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2018 23:19
|
|
|
VostokProgram posted:Don't listen to these guys groogs, I know you've always wanted to do a scale using just the hue with constant saturation and value. Don't let your dreams be memes ... I need this now.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 00:40
|
|
|
SlothfulCobra posted:I wonder if Paradox has any dedicated cartographers on staff?
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 04:00
|
|
|
SlothfulCobra posted:I wonder if Paradox has any dedicated cartographers on staff? You don't have to look much past the relative position of the continents in EU4 to conclude that no, they do not.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 18:08
|
|
Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
|
SlothfulCobra posted:I wonder if Paradox has any dedicated cartographers on staff? Some content designers (and the occasional QA) have a bigger interest in map work than others. I honestly don't think a full cartography degree would add a whole lot, the same as a history degree: useful to have but not necessary or even particularly relevant in daily operations.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 20:52
|
|
|
PittTheElder posted:You don't have to look much past the relative position of the continents in EU4 to conclude that no, they do not. I've never played EU4 and just looked up the map, and lmao
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 21:32
|
|
|
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 21:53
|
|
|
The only right ones are the Med and Africa??? 
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 22:29
|
|
|
There is no "right" map projection, only the ones that promote your specific political / operational requirements (such as a huge scandinavia)
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 22:31
|
|
|
Well, for EU, they have gameplay reasons for shifting the Americas north.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 22:33
|
|
|
Yeah, Baronjutter's got a different projection there. I think Paradox used Miller? I'm fairly certain the only map fuckery they've actually done is shifting the Americas north (so colonial ranges shake out the way they want?) and shortening South America (so it fits on the map?)
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 22:34
|
|
|
Couldn't they have solved the problem by changing the sizes and shapes of sea zones? Or is it that players will naturally assume 'Go straight west to get to where you want to be' and they'd end up in Newfoundland rather than Florida? Even that, I think, could be resolved by sea zone shaping. It might lead to some weird looking zones, though.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 22:37
|
|
|
They could have solved it by using a globe instead of a map
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 22:38
|
|
|
 Here's a better comparison with the HOI4 map (same projection). I was wrong: Australia and New Zealand also get squidged up a little and Kamchatka gets squashed a bit (Britain is further out to sea in HOI so they can cram more provinces into the Channel). Note to Paradox: put the meridian through Florence, that way the map breaks across the Bering Strait and not any landmasses.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 22:40
|
|
|
EricBauman posted:Couldn't they have solved the problem by changing the sizes and shapes of sea zones? Or is it that players will naturally assume 'Go straight west to get to where you want to be' and they'd end up in Newfoundland rather than Florida? Even that, I think, could be resolved by sea zone shaping. It might lead to some weird looking zones, though. It doesn't count seazones to calculate distance, but uses some kind of pixel counting formula, which is a pretty simple/easy way to do things. Honestly I don't have any issue with the Americas being shifted north. It works. It's fine.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 22:42
|
|
|
More political bias is contained in relative province size reinscribing the "fullness" of the metropole compared to the "emptiness" of the periphery, imo
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 22:44
|
|
|
ArchangeI posted:Some content designers (and the occasional QA) have a bigger interest in map work than others. 😅
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 23:00
|
|
|
CharlieFoxtrot posted:More political bias is contained in relative province size reinscribing the "fullness" of the metropole compared to the "emptiness" of the periphery, imo hell yeah, just check how squeezed Africa is Besides globes being naturally more awesome, I am curious to know the technicalities of making a globe map for a game instead of the usual flattening projection, is it way worse in terms of performance, rendering fuckery or something like that?
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 23:33
|
|
|
dead comedy forums posted:hell yeah, just check how squeezed Africa is Biggest issue is usability- players are used to 2d maps and have more trouble grokking globes or 3d maps.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 23:37
|
|
|
It's also impossible to get an overview of everything since it doesn't even show half, the bits near the sides won't be clear enough to be useful. I hope they never use globes.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2018 23:51
|
|
|
This thread has gone crazy. Globes for strategy games are the worst possible idea, and fiddling with projections to improve gameplay is actually smart design. Just make sure Stalingrad is in the right spot and away you go.
|
|
#
?
Dec 6, 2018 00:01
|
|
|
dead comedy forums posted:hell yeah, just check how squeezed Africa is In the first map posted, grey is the game's map, blue is the actual world map, according to some kind of projection at least (I'm not a map nerd, idk). So Africa is actually larger in game than in the real world. And the stretching that's happening seems largely uniform across the board. The HoI4 map has africa being just about spot on. Some Europa Engine/early Clausewitz Engine games had some truly hideous map projections, but honestly, Paradox's current map projections are basically fine. Some things are stretched out a little in EU4, but I don't find that to be a big deal. And I don't mind shifting the Americas north if there are valid gameplay reasons for it. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 00:13 on Dec 6, 2018 |
|
#
?
Dec 6, 2018 00:11
|
|
|
Imperator's map seems to slightly rotate as you pan across it, its neat.
|
|
#
?
Dec 6, 2018 00:21
|
|
|
Mantis42 posted:Imperator's map seems to slightly rotate as you pan across it, its neat. I thought they were mapping it onto a slice of the globe or something at first, but apparently it's just camera trickery. Either way, it looks really awesome.
|
|
#
?
Dec 6, 2018 00:23
|
|
|
Autonomous Monster posted:Note to Paradox: put the meridian through Florence, that way the map breaks across the Bering Strait and not any landmasses. That would mean putting Denmark in the middle of the map.  Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Some Europa Engine/early Clausewitz Engine games had some truly hideous map projections, but honestly, Paradox's current map projections are basically fine. Some things are stretched out a little in EU4, but I don't find that to be a big deal. And I don't mind shifting the Americas north if there are valid gameplay reasons for it. AFAIK the shifting is not really a gameplay reason, it's to make it fit into a smaller rectangular area so you need less map. It actually fucks up the game play (in a very limited way) in that colonial distances are weird as hell. PittTheElder fucked around with this message at 00:52 on Dec 6, 2018 |
|
#
?
Dec 6, 2018 00:48
|
|
|
Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Some Europa Engine/early Clausewitz Engine games had some truly hideous map projections, but honestly, Paradox's current map projections are basically fine. Some things are stretched out a little in EU4, but I don't find that to be a big deal. And I don't mind shifting the Americas north if there are valid gameplay reasons for it. It way overinflates the size of Europe, which directly affects how regions get addressed, since people's interest in province density is generally based on how big the provinces look in game rather than the actual land area in reality. When I was doing my Korea suggestion (and a bunch since too) there were a lot of comments about how tiny the provinces are there now; it's got 20, on a peninsula that in reality is larger than Great Britain, which in game has 40, and not even super tiny ones either, whereas a lot of Korea's are. The same sorts of comments for places like Japan and Java; if you adjust those to the sizes they are in reality, their provinces be huge compared to most places in Europe, but because in game they look tiny, people think they're represented just as well. Now there's an argument that this is fine considering most of Paradox's games' focus, but it definitely has an impact.
|
|
#
?
Dec 6, 2018 02:30
|
|
|
NWS' Steam and Iron and Rule the Waves use an actual globe. Granted in RtW its mostly unnecessary cause most of the time you'll be zoomed in to an area only a few dozen kilometers across.  It plays a bigger role in Steam and Iron's historical campaigns though, making sure travel ranges and such are correct.
|
|
#
?
Dec 6, 2018 02:31
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 12, 2024 01:42 |
|
|
Is Imperator equal-area? It looks conic to me, and I've advocated for the Albers Conic before. Arabia looks like it's about the right size relative to Europe, which is how I usually try to judge these things.
|
|
#
?
Dec 6, 2018 02:52
|
|