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Ardlen
Sep 30, 2005
WoT



Are small pulses considered support weapons?

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Amechwarrior
Jan 29, 2007

Pattonesque posted:

lots of default mechs have ammo in very bad places. One Thunderbolt and Shadow Hawk and the Hatchetman all have them in the center torso. If you do nothing else, move them to legs or side torsos, but CT ammo means every hit after your CT armor opens up is a potential kill-shot

Hell, TWO of the campaign starters have them, the BJ-1 and SHD-2H. Moving those area day 1 customization every playthough.

FiddlersThree
Mar 13, 2010

Elliot, you IDIOT!
Is there something janky with the AI since this last patch? I've been playing this game since launch, and last night I suddenly started seeing a lot of weird behavior with enemy mechs frequently just Bracing (with no visible reason to do so) rather than moving and/or attacking. I noticed this most in the Steel Beast and Bourbon and Beer flashpoints, and it made the battles pretty trivial.

PoptartsNinja
May 9, 2008

He is still almost definitely not a spy


Soiled Meat

deathbagel posted:

But at least you got a sweet small pulse laser out of it!
It gets funnier in hindsight.

Ardlen posted:

Are small pulses considered support weapons?
Yeah, they're support weapons.

Hawgh
Feb 27, 2013

Size does matter, after all.
I just got my first heavy in my first career run, a Cataphract. Now I can spend my whole working day thinking about what to do with it.

Anyone got cool ideas?

Also got a Dragon, but, you know :/

Radio Free Kobold
Aug 11, 2012

"Federal regulations mandate that at least 30% of our content must promote Reptilian or Draconic culture. This is DJ Scratch N' Sniff with the latest mermaid screeching on KBLD..."




Hawgh posted:

I just got my first heavy in my first career run, a Cataphract. Now I can spend my whole working day thinking about what to do with it.

Anyone got cool ideas?

Also got a Dragon, but, you know :/

Stock weapon config is probably alright. It's AC/10 + PPC, right? Can't go wrong there. Maybe pull a few of the secondary weapons and refit with jets?

For the Dragon, I refitted mine with SRMs, and I think small lasers? It really suffers from only 2 hardpoints of each type as well as awkward tonnage, and having an AC/5 for a main gun (as a heavy 'mech!) really doesn't help the tonnage issue.

Radio Free Kobold fucked around with this message at 00:45 on Dec 9, 2018

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Max armor. Stick in an ac20 and two tons of ammo, a LL, and round it out with ML and heat sinks.

Runs a tich hot but that MLs can be shut down easy enough to deal with that. Once you’re fielding heavies the AC20 punch is very welcome.

mods changed my name
Oct 30, 2017
my first heavy in career is a loving quickdraw

ditty bout my clitty
May 28, 2011

by FactsAreUseless
Fun Shoe

Breetai posted:

Reinforcement bug?

It wouldn't bother me so much if I got to, say, deploy more than four mechs to even the odds. It seems like a really stupid hill for the devs to die on. That and the "bad intel, lol" feature.

Pattonesque
Jul 15, 2004
johnny jesus and the infield fly rule

ditty bout my clitty posted:

It wouldn't bother me so much if I got to, say, deploy more than four mechs to even the odds. It seems like a really stupid hill for the devs to die on. That and the "bad intel, lol" feature.

I just need two things:

1. In that target acquisition mission don't put two zones in places of relative safety and one zone in a crossfire of seven mechs

2. Extraction zones should spawn in sane places and not THROUGH the enemy

LostCosmonaut
Feb 15, 2014

In what might be a record of some kind, Dekker survived 1100 days in my Roguetech campaign.

I'm more upset that I accidentally cored the engine on the AWS-9M, leaving me unable to salvage it, than I am that the AWS-9M put a round from an ER PPC through Dekker's face.

BadAstronaut
Sep 15, 2004

is there a way to cheat and win a mission? Flashpoint for Davion IV, where you have to plant the beacons against, what, 12 Assault mechs, in 8 rounds, makes me want to quit, uninstall, complain to the Internet in general, and play something else. gently caress this mission.

Pattonesque
Jul 15, 2004
johnny jesus and the infield fly rule

BadAstronaut posted:

is there a way to cheat and win a mission? Flashpoint for Davion IV, where you have to plant the beacons against, what, 12 Assault mechs, in 8 rounds, makes me want to quit, uninstall, complain to the Internet in general, and play something else. gently caress this mission.

for those ones I think you need to do the mission where you yoink the Star League Griffin because it's really the only thing that has the survivability to tank two rounds on the hottest beacon and the mobility/jets to GTFO

Tiger Crazy
Sep 25, 2006

If you couldn't find any weirdness, maybe we'll just have to make some!
Dekker died to my sheer stupidity. I got hit by a flamer in a jenner. Overheat then proceeded to fire lasers the on next shot and blow up the legs. Then I get targeted by the 3 mechs who call shots. Plus I have cored mechs are destroyed and Dekker died in a scream of agony.

Gwaihir
Dec 8, 2009
Hair Elf

Hawgh posted:

I just got my first heavy in my first career run, a Cataphract. Now I can spend my whole working day thinking about what to do with it.

Anyone got cool ideas?

Also got a Dragon, but, you know :/

I ran my cataphract with AC20 and 4-5 medium lasers, but this was pre ML nerf/LL buff, so YMMV.

I R SMART LIKE ROCK
Mar 10, 2003

I just want a hug.

Fun Shoe
I'm also a fan of AC/20, ML's and JJ's with HS and armor to taste

Amechwarrior
Jan 29, 2007

BadAstronaut posted:

is there a way to cheat and win a mission? Flashpoint for Davion IV, where you have to plant the beacons against, what, 12 Assault mechs, in 8 rounds, makes me want to quit, uninstall, complain to the Internet in general, and play something else. gently caress this mission.

I know there was a BT Debug Mod that made the debug options more user friendly. I did that FP with two BLRs a GRN-1N and a FS9. The BLRs took the open 2 turner, GRF to the center close and the FS9 to the far. The two BLRs got wrecked even when I hot-swapped them in the zone to keep both of them at max evasion. One lost a leg but had the jets in the torso just for this situation. Both of them lost a side torso and one was very, very close to destruction. The GRF ended up having to hot-swap with the FS9 that got its leg clipped by a Demolisher and thus had to spend like 3 turns in the two zones, which mean it was nearly dead. Somehow, all of them made it to the extraction point and I got it on the first try. I killed maybe two units, the Demo and one lucky headshot on something. I lost a ton of +++ SRMs and MLs and the FP rewards were nowhere near replacing it all.

I think the problem is that 4 -5 skull Trg.Acks still have 4 - 5 skull OPFOR and the mission format seems build to bring smaller/faster units that have nearly no place in a 4 - 5 skull match where the best option is to just sprint/jump and Brace to minimize incoming damage. If they either gave more turns to complete the main objectives, or lowered the OPFOR a skull or two I think it would work like they suggested on the streams. But right now they are beatable, but not profitable, which leads to all the posts on the PDX forums about how everyone is skipping them as it's not worth it.

BadAstronaut
Sep 15, 2004

Thanks - so is this something that needs to be patched to actually be a reasonable battle? I failed it so I'm hoping it comes up again in future. I am allied with Davion and now see zero other Flashpoints on the map at all. When will some new ones come up?

Horace Kinch
Aug 15, 2007

So apparently PPCs make enemies less accurate now? Is that a thing or are they still a complete waste of tonnage?

Beer4TheBeerGod
Aug 23, 2004
Exciting Lemon

Koorisch posted:

Has anyone had a 4v12 yet?

I had a 4v13 assassination mission. It was bullshit.

Technowolf
Nov 4, 2009




And Tyler Too! posted:

So apparently PPCs make enemies less accurate now? Is that a thing or are they still a complete waste of tonnage?

They always did that, but before the game didn't give an indicator that it happened.

Amechwarrior
Jan 29, 2007

BadAstronaut posted:

Thanks - so is this something that needs to be patched to actually be a reasonable battle? I failed it so I'm hoping it comes up again in future. I am allied with Davion and now see zero other Flashpoints on the map at all. When will some new ones come up?

I think it could be done profitably, but you will have to be really good at it and probably build a custom Lance for those alliance Trg.Acks. I think in a week or so, some of the BT youtubers will have it figured out and everyone can copy from them. There is a limit of 5 FPs that can be available at any time, they will eventually cycle through until you complete them if you fail them or let them expire. If you break the alliance, you won't be offered that one until you become allied again at least a year later.


Technowolf posted:

They always did that, but before the game didn't give an indicator that it happened.

The big change from before 1.3 to now is that the PPC effect stacks where it was only good once. Sensor Lock is now worth 2 PPC hits on the enemy too and also stack with regular PPC degradation.

Narsham
Jun 5, 2008

deathbagel posted:

It is and it definitely changes. The first time I tried it, the first group was a Thunderbolt, a disco-hunchback and a Jenner. Then 4 more mediums spawned on top of the hill then 4 vehicles spawned behind the mountain they blew up the buildings and there was nothing I could do about it.

The second time I tried it, it was something like a Hatchetman, a Vindicator and a Spider down below and then nothing spawned on top of the mountain and behind the mountain spawned a few vehicles and a couple more medium mechs and I breezed through it.

Just cleared it: my force was the provided Hatchetman, plus an LRM Centurion, a Shadowhawk-2D (only hawk I had managed to salvage), and an Orion-1V.

I failed to engage the op force on the first turn and they promptly destroyed a building. (Two Shadowhawks, one Wolverine, and a Trebuchet.) I kept the Orion on the ridge, engaged with the Shadowhawk, recklessly engaged with the Hatchetman. It lasted almost three turns taking fire from the first lance. The second dropped right by the Orion: a Cicada, a Hatchetman, and something that died very fast (maybe a Vindicator? It never fired a shot). My Hatchetman had pulled the original lance farther away from the base, and I'd killed the Treb and half-killed the Wolverine. The Orion and Centurion wrecked the Cicada and the other medium, while the enemy Hatchetman decided it wanted to join the first lance instead of doing anything effective.

The final lance coming up from the rear had three mechs and a Demolisher. The Demolisher didn't get in range of the base before the scenario ended. The underarmored Centurion ended up distracting the other three mechs, which were mediums (a Griffin, another Wolverine and one mech I forget). Meanwhile, my heavily damaged Shadowhawk was evading and running back to the base. At time-out, my two mediums were both almost dead. The Orion was virtually untouched thanks to the second opforce lance disintegrating so rapidly.

So, tactical tip: fire on enemy mechs to draw their attention, and send one of your mechs to draw off a lance if it's too tough to engage and kill quickly. They will happily follow you far enough from the base that they can't get back in time.

Best Friends
Nov 4, 2011

"the prototype" mech joined my base defense and wouldn't you know, the randomly generated opposing force had one too. That prototype secret did not keep well. Both died from ammo explosions within 3 rounds.

Dude after the fight: ah, I wanted to test it in combat conditions. My friend, it did not do well.

Nasgate
Jun 7, 2011

And Tyler Too! posted:

So apparently PPCs make enemies less accurate now? Is that a thing or are they still a complete waste of tonnage?

The change to allowing the debuff to stack means early game is a fresh new hellscape because you're always going to have 3+Panthers give or take a pilot or two with sensor lock.

Though personally I kinda like it in combination with multishot. It almost makes having multiple ranges of weapons on one mech decent.

Raged
Jul 21, 2003

A revolution of beats
Should I buy the expansion now or wait till HB fixes the crap missions? Really don't want to deal with some of the BS you guys are talking about.

Virulence
Jun 14, 2012

Got an Orion K as my first heavy mech in career. I hadn't even found any AC20s yet so I just slapped three large lasers, two SRMs on it with a little bit of ammo and filled out the rest of the space with heatsinks thinking I'd refit it again when I had an AC20 available.

It seems like it's been doing pretty well as-is; large lasers are a lot more solid than I expected.

Conspiratiorist
Nov 12, 2015

17th Separate Kryvyi Rih Tank Brigade named after Konstantin Pestushko
Look to my coming on the first light of the fifth sixth some day

Virulence posted:

Got an Orion K as my first heavy mech in career. I hadn't even found any AC20s yet so I just slapped three large lasers, two SRMs on it with a little bit of ammo and filled out the rest of the space with heatsinks thinking I'd refit it again when I had an AC20 available.

It seems like it's been doing pretty well as-is; large lasers are a lot more solid than I expected.

Damage efficiency:
6 SRMs
5 MLas
4.4 LRM15
4 AC20
3.8 AC5
3.6 LL

They're pretty good. They don't deal any stab damage, but they leave more room for heatsinks so your real-world efficiency is higher (better "off" rounds), as well as generally higher damage than advertised due to their inherent accuracy bonus. The LL+++ in particular kicks rear end, delivering 50 damage with a +4 accuracy bonus.

sean10mm
Jun 29, 2005

It's a Mad, Mad, Mad, MAD-2R World
I don't know what I am doing yet but blowing poo poo up with robots in this game is deeply satisfying.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Raged posted:

Should I buy the expansion now or wait till HB fixes the crap missions? Really don't want to deal with some of the BS you guys are talking about.

Honestly I haven’t had half the problems some people seem to.

Narsham
Jun 5, 2008

Beer4TheBeerGod posted:

I agree that tonnage limits in general are silly. If I have 400 tons of mech to bring to a fight, why would I bring 300? Unless there's a financial or tactical motivation there's no compelling reason to do it. That said I think there are ways to make it more interesting:

1. Make the battle computer an option for scout mechs, but have it only work on medium or larger vehicles. Now you've done something that actually represents the scouting influence of a scout mech.

2. Incorporate more varied missions that actually require something other than an assault lance to complete. Right now the game compels you to bring as much firepower as possible because that "assassination" mission could easily have another EIGHT loving MECHS NOT AT ALL BITTER ABOUT THAT HBS that makes life hell. More missions that encourage a diverse range of play, such as chasing after an escaping mech/vehicle or scouting a region without being detected, would be more interesting.

3. Give the player more information about what to expect so they can tailor their force to address it instead of just assuming they'll have to murder everything with overwhelming firepower.

4. Consider adding a deployment cost, balanced out with increased payments.

Well, there's still the artificial lance limit. If I have 12 pilots and mechs, I can still only have four deployed. Even if you assume a dropship limitation, some battles you should have had enough time to make multiple drops before going in.

I think the best solution is to have some missions that are "multiple lance" missions, either where you have to be able to form multiple lances to conduct them or you get a bonus if you do. Then force the player to actually make up the multiple lances, and either have you play out multiple fights or say "only one lance saw combat" and pick the lance randomly. If you have eight assaults or more, that still doesn't encourage a mixed lance format, but there should be a way to build on the flashpoint structure to do that.

Sky Shadowing
Feb 13, 2012

At least we're not the Thalmor (yet)

Cyrano4747 posted:

Honestly I haven’t had half the problems some people seem to.

The most recent mission I saw someone complaining about (fairly, for the record, that seems like an impossible mission) was an alliance flashpoint mission, which Kiva deliberately made to be gently caress-you hard.

So far none of the flashpoints I've found have been too bad.

Amechwarrior
Jan 29, 2007

Nasgate posted:

The change to allowing the debuff to stack means early game is a fresh new hellscape because you're always going to have 3+Panthers give or take a pilot or two with sensor lock.

The Jenner is the natural predator to the Panther. Known for pouncing to the flanks of the PNT-9R at close range, the JR7-D rips off the right side leaving the PNT defenseless. The JR7s use their impressive jumping distance to close the gaps and prevent injury through speed. Some have even evolved to remove the SRM-4 in place of more armor and in some cases also a Heat Sink.

The_Angry_Turtle
Aug 2, 2007

BLARGH
I started a new campaign and just got to the Panzyr Defense mission. I'd forgotten how bad this one is. Nothing about it makes sense. Why is there a full lance of mechs hanging out in the center of your base? Why do you need to stop the APC when the barracks is already overrun with a troop APC sitting a few meters outside the gate? Why are the turrets offline? Why can the turrets only be turned on when APCs are gone especially when half of them are "surprise drops? Why are the APCs able to unload their troops immediately and safely while a hostile mech covered in anti-personnel weapons is standing nearby?

I've had to restart it six times now because of bad luck. The APCs move so fast that a single missed attack can bring a failure.

spiritual bypass
Feb 19, 2008

Grimey Drawer
Gotta bring a Jenner on that one imo

The_Angry_Turtle
Aug 2, 2007

BLARGH
I gave up on defending the barracks after realizing how frustrating it is. Its just that I keep whiffing melee attacks on the APCs. And once the Catapult tanked three full salvos by my Highlander and blew up up my gauss cannon.

Psycho Landlord
Oct 10, 2012

What are you gonna do, dance with me?

I imagine your avatar was very apropos in that moment.

ditty bout my clitty
May 28, 2011

by FactsAreUseless
Fun Shoe
Is there some sale on shitdraws I don't know about? Every other heavy spawn gives me more of the useless wolverine-a-likes.

ulmont
Sep 15, 2010

IF I EVER MISS VOTING IN AN ELECTION (EVEN AMERICAN IDOL) ,OR HAVE UNPAID PARKING TICKETS, PLEASE TAKE AWAY MY FRANCHISE

Amechwarrior posted:

Some have even evolved to remove the SRM-4 in place of more armor and in some cases also a Heat Sink.

I think I built all my Jenners as M laserx4, Jump Jet x4, max armor. Worked very well in the light mech phase.

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Best Friends
Nov 4, 2011

Is there a bug on target acquisitions or am I playing them wrong? About one out of three times, my turn of standing in the hex isn't counting. One of those times I had two mechs in the hex and I worried the "2/1 mechs for one turn remaining" was a red flag, but once I got skipped for at least one turn standing still. Got a mission failure after spending 4 turns in the last hex.

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