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wizzardstaff posted:I am at the point in season 4 where the Internet says I should watch Thirdspace. So I watched Thirdspace. It felt like a 90-minute rehash of Infection. Are the other movies better? Don't listen to the internet. Look up original release dates and watch movies when they came out. That said, Thirdspace seemed mostly pointless (not bad just kind of not aimed at anything) and this is a very good summary of the others: Jedit posted:In The Beginning is backstory filling. There's some interesting stuff in there, and Reiner Schone, one of the less remembered victims of the B5 Curse. River of Souls has the holobrothel and Martin Sheen in one of his last roles before The West Wing made him famous again. A Call to Arms is the pilot for Crusade.
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Dec 9, 2018 00:50
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dreadmojo posted:punch! kick! punch punch! SUPER KICK!!!! It's the best example ever of something that probably sounded fine on paper but holy poo poo did it not work on screen.
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Dec 9, 2018 01:18
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Grand Fromage posted:It's the best example ever of something that probably sounded fine on paper but holy poo poo did it not work on screen. I maintain it was an excuse to get the female lead hot, shiny, and breathing hard at least once an episode. Straight up nerd boner fodder.
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Dec 9, 2018 01:34
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Midjack posted:I maintain it was an excuse to get the female lead hot, shiny, and breathing hard at least once an episode. Straight up nerd boner fodder. What, were they all out of decontamination gel?
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Dec 9, 2018 01:52
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Vavrek posted:Don't listen to the internet. Look up original release dates and watch movies when they came out. That said, Thirdspace seemed mostly pointless (not bad just kind of not aimed at anything) and this is a very good summary of the others: Except most of those movies are set mid-series, so if you have the choice why wouldn't you watch them at their intended points in the series chronology? 
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Dec 9, 2018 02:07
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Neddy Seagoon posted:Except most of those movies are set mid-series, so if you have the choice why wouldn't you watch them at their intended points in the series chronology? Thirdspace could fit in almost anywhere as long as Lyta's back and Ivanova hasn't left. There's only really continuity flags to place it specifically between 4X08 and 4X09. I'd just watch it as a Lost Tale after S4.
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Dec 9, 2018 02:18
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Grand Fromage posted:Legend of the Rangers is the bad one. Legend of the Rangers is not bad. It's incredibly bad.
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Dec 9, 2018 02:58
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Neddy Seagoon posted:Except most of those movies are set mid-series, so if you have the choice why wouldn't you watch them at their intended points in the series chronology? Childhood experience with the Chronicles of Narnia (and adulthood experience seeing publishers put the wrong numbers on books) giving me an abnormally strong preference for release-order chronology. To the actual point, it's that I enjoy looking at long series as artifacts, where you can also consider the circumstances that led to the book, movie, whathaveyou, getting made. Thirdspace being made, released, and initially viewed about a season after it was set is, to me, one aspect of the story. Thinking about it more, I'd probably watch it after finishing season 5, as something to watch when you want a bit more Bab5 content and have heard that they did some TV movies. Anything else disrupts the narrative flow. Thread knowledge check: Was Thirdspace the third time John Sheridan solved his problems with a nuclear bomb? I think it was, but hadn't made the connection before.
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Dec 9, 2018 03:02
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Vavrek posted:
Fourth  :The Black Star Z'ha'dum Coriana Six And the Thirdspace battle Boxleitner didn't call him "Nuke 'em" Sheridan for nothing.
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Dec 9, 2018 05:27
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It's strange because "pass the nuke" is Ultra Magnus' solution to big beautiful problems but he's much more like Sinclair than Sheridan.
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Dec 9, 2018 11:31
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Jedit posted:In The Beginning is backstory filling. There's some interesting stuff in there, and Reiner Schone, one of the less remembered victims of the B5 Curse. I'm not sure in what sense you mean that because he's not dead.
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Dec 9, 2018 11:49
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Neddy Seagoon posted:Except most of those movies are set mid-series, so if you have the choice why wouldn't you watch them at their intended points in the series chronology? For one, because In The Beginning spoils massive swaths of the story. For second, as someone says they interrupt the flow of the series. With the exception of In The Gathering, I would agree that they should just be watched after.
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Dec 9, 2018 13:34
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Dirty posted:I'm not sure in what sense you mean that because he's not dead. Checking IMDb you are right, but I swear to God there was news that he died 15 years ago.
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Dec 9, 2018 13:44
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I’m starting to think that Delenn is just loving with Sheridan about these courtship rituals. “When two Minbari become close, as we have become close, there is an ancient and respected tradition known as bofa.”
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Dec 9, 2018 17:48
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wizzardstaff posted:I’m starting to think that Delenn is just loving with Sheridan about these courtship rituals. You're about to see one of Lennier's best lines in the show  .
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Dec 9, 2018 17:51
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wizzardstaff posted:I’m starting to think that Delenn is just loving with Sheridan about these courtship rituals. I can't remember. Does this come before or after Ivanova convincing that alien to do it 'human style'?
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Dec 9, 2018 18:03
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Who's teaching all these people how to jump kick?
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Dec 10, 2018 04:01
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That mating ritual  .
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Dec 10, 2018 04:25
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ThingOne posted:That mating ritual Still a better love story than Twilight.
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Dec 10, 2018 04:29
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His servant totally gets that he's being had and is loving every moment of it.
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Dec 10, 2018 04:44
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One of my favourite fuckin' sequences in the entire series.
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Dec 10, 2018 05:46
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It was a good bit of levity after The Coming of the Shadows and Gropos.
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Dec 10, 2018 06:00
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Bieeanshee posted:I can't remember. Does this come before or after Ivanova convincing that alien to do it 'human style'? Long after (ThingOne is mid series 2, wizzardstaff is mid series 4)
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Dec 10, 2018 11:22
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"We're not some deep-space franchise" Shots fired. I'm starting to think that Clark's people are living in a different universe than everyone else. They all lived through the war with the Minbari and many of them fought in it yet here they are thinking they can order around the ambassador of the Vorlons. Kosh's ship alone could probably wipe out Earthforce's fleet never mind an actual Vorlon battleship.
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Dec 11, 2018 00:39
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Right? In the entire Minbari war, Earth only took out a single Minbari cruiser, and the Vorlons are as far beyond (if not farther) the Minbari as the Minbari were beyond Earth.
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Dec 11, 2018 00:42
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ConfusedUs posted:Right? Re: Earth ships' effectiveness against the Minbari: Earth ships weren't completely helpless but they could only damage Minbari ships at close range due to the Minbari stealth tech, or by temporarily overwhelming them in desperate suicide attacks like swarming the first ship in range before the rest could respond. Earth ships could destroy Minbari ships but they couldn't get victories, except for the Black Star incident every engagement was a pyrrhic victory at the very best, and always a strategic loss. That's from various JMS statements collected in the Lurker's Guide. All that said, it seemed pretty clear to me that the political situation ThingOne's referring to was supposed to be more than a little reminiscent of post-WWI Germany, or more generally a whole lot of peoples throughout history on the losing side who look anywhere other than the actual causes of their loss, because scapegoating and persecution are easier and more comforting than admitting you simply got defeated by a superior opponent.
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Dec 11, 2018 01:26
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That Psycorps commercial was suitably creepy, it feels like Earthgov is teetering on the edge of going full  . Also, the justifications the Centauri (and the Narn to be fair) give for the atrocities they commit are uncomfortably familiar.
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Dec 11, 2018 02:52
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McSpanky posted:Re: Earth ships' effectiveness against the Minbari: Earth ships weren't completely helpless but they could only damage Minbari ships at close range due to the Minbari stealth tech, or by temporarily overwhelming them in desperate suicide attacks like swarming the first ship in range before the rest could respond. Earth ships could destroy Minbari ships but they couldn't get victories, except for the Black Star incident every engagement was a pyrrhic victory at the very best, and always a strategic loss. That's from various JMS statements collected in the Lurker's Guide. I'm like 90% sure JMS has mentioned that Earth would have won the Earth-Minbari War (or at least fought the Minbari to a standstill) if it wasn't for Minbar's stealth tech that kept Earthforce weapons from locking on. For all their technological superiority the Minbari aren't all that good at fighting and Earth warships were incredibly heavily-armed.
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Dec 11, 2018 03:19
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Polaron posted:I'm like 90% sure JMS has mentioned that Earth would have won the Earth-Minbari War (or at least fought the Minbari to a standstill) if it wasn't for Minbar's stealth tech that kept Earthforce weapons from locking on. For all their technological superiority the Minbari aren't all that good at fighting and Earth warships were incredibly heavily-armed. Yeah, EarthForce had already pasted another older, higher-tech enemy in the Dilgar War, so it's not out of the realm of possibility that they might have been able to beat the Minbari in a straight slugging match. B5 always did have a sort of "humans are special badasses" aesthetic that reminds me of some of the "Humanity, gently caress yeah!" stuff from Tumblr, 4chan and the like that gets passed around. Yes, including the vaguely fascist feel.
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Dec 11, 2018 03:30
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Polaron posted:I'm like 90% sure JMS has mentioned that Earth would have won the Earth-Minbari War (or at least fought the Minbari to a standstill) if it wasn't for Minbar's stealth tech that kept Earthforce weapons from locking on. For all their technological superiority the Minbari aren't all that good at fighting and Earth warships were incredibly heavily-armed. It wasn't that, per se. I believe JMS said that Earth would be able to get the Minbari bogged into a war of attrition and would be able to out-produce them as their economy was more suited to ramping up for war production than the stratified Minbari one was. And, without the stealth, the EA ships would actually be able to hurt the Minbari ships consistently, which they did quite well in the first contact. I'm not sure how well it actually meshes with what we see in the show itself, though. Such as Sheridan dismissing any claim that Earth could stand against the Minbari, even with Omega-class ships and systems that could track the Minbari, as a delusion. Milkfred E. Moore fucked around with this message at 05:21 on Dec 11, 2018 |
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Dec 11, 2018 05:17
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Of course he doesn't know they are producing Shadow-technology ships. So hilariously that might have been one of the few non-bullshit things they actually said.
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Dec 11, 2018 05:23
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Milkfred E. Moore posted:I'm not sure how well it actually meshes with what we see in the show itself, though. Such as Sheridan dismissing any claim that Earth could stand against the Minbari, even with Omega-class ships and systems that could track the Minbari, as a delusion. Are you sure the Omega-class could talk Minbari ships? I don't recall the show ever establishing that.
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Dec 11, 2018 05:55
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Zorak of Michigan posted:Are you sure the Omega-class could talk Minbari ships? I don't recall the show ever establishing that. They could not. It's even a plot point in season 3 when Delenn ends the siege of B5 by telling Earthforce to gently caress off or get hosed by four of their cruisers.
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Dec 11, 2018 06:14
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Zorak of Michigan posted:Are you sure the Omega-class could talk Minbari ships? I don't recall the show ever establishing that. Well, yeah, that's the whole point. There's a bit in Season 2 (And Now For A Word, I think?) where some warhawk Senator claims that with their new ships and weapons they could handle the Minbari, which Sheridan dismisses as crazy talk. The Omega-class can track Minbari warships (Season 2, first episode) and can presumably hurt them better than the old Hyperion-class, but it still wouldn't matter because the Minbari still outclass the Earth Alliance by a significant factor and presumably have advantages beyond their stealth system.
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Dec 11, 2018 06:40
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Milkfred E. Moore posted:Well, yeah, that's the whole point. There's a bit in Season 2 (And Now For A Word, I think?) where some warhawk Senator claims that with their new ships and weapons they could handle the Minbari, which Sheridan dismisses as crazy talk. The Omega-class can track Minbari warships (Season 2, first episode) and can presumably hurt them better than the old Hyperion-class, but it still wouldn't matter because the Minbari still outclass the Earth Alliance by a significant factor and presumably have advantages beyond their stealth system. As I recall too, the Minbari have gravitic shielding on top of raw armor, so I think it's mainly their superior defense that makes them so tough.
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Dec 11, 2018 07:18
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Milkfred E. Moore posted:The Omega-class can track Minbari warships (Season 2, first episode) http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/guide/023.html JMS posted:Correct above; Sheridan says, quite specifically, in the conference room with Ivanova after the Grey Council guy is gone, "they used some kind of stealth technology WE'VE NEVER BEEN ABLE TO BREAK." It's not a matter of old or cheaper tech; we just haven't broken their technology yet. JMS says different! MrL_JaKiri fucked around with this message at 10:57 on Dec 11, 2018 |
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Dec 11, 2018 10:52
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That makes the line where Sheridan has to ask what kind of sensor system Babylon 5 is using a bit strange, then. The fact that he asks about the hardware B5 has implies that the EA has the capability to detect them and it's a matter of tech. Otherwise, you'd think he'd just be mystified that they can detect them at all. In Season 4, there's mention made of the Agamemnon being able to track Sheridan's forces with their sensors, too. That and the several times where EA ships don't have much problem detecting, tracking, and shooting down White Stars, of course.
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Dec 11, 2018 11:18
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Also, JMS recollection of the line doesn't seem accurate with what Sheridan actually says in the show, which is very much past tense.quote:"One problem during the war was that none of our weapon systems could lock on to the Minbari vessels. They used some kind of stealth technology we were never able to break." Additionally, the line is uttered on the command deck, not in the conference room. In the conference room, Sheridan still couches it in language that basically says locking onto the Minbari was a wartime problem. "We tried everything, but none of our weapons would lock on to their ships." Milkfred E. Moore fucked around with this message at 11:55 on Dec 11, 2018 |
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Dec 11, 2018 11:32
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Milkfred E. Moore posted:Also, JMS recollection of the line doesn't seem accurate with what Sheridan actually says in the show, which is very much past tense. i'm gonna say: eh
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Dec 11, 2018 11:44
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Milkfred E. Moore posted:That makes the line where Sheridan has to ask what kind of sensor system Babylon 5 is using a bit strange, then. The fact that he asks about the hardware B5 has implies that the EA has the capability to detect them and it's a matter of tech. Otherwise, you'd think he'd just be mystified that they can detect them at all. In Season 4, there's mention made of the Agamemnon being able to track Sheridan's forces with their sensors, too. In season 4 they had a mixed fleet from a wide variety of races, and they were pretty trackable just by the destruction they were racking up. Sheridan's fleet was out to make a statement and wanted Clark to know they were coming for him  .
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Dec 11, 2018 11:57
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