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https://www.cbr.com/batman-atheism-tom-king-response/ That got walked back.
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Dec 7, 2018 09:51
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vseslav.botkin posted:https://www.cbr.com/batman-atheism-tom-king-response/ That got sales pitched. 'I didn't read it that way?' Dude you wrote it. You know what you meant to say, you just want more people to buy it. Good on you for selling and all but yeah, no.
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Dec 7, 2018 17:40
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Oracle posted:That got sales pitched. 'I didn't read it that way?' Dude you wrote it. You know what you meant to say, you just want more people to buy it. Good on you for selling and all but yeah, no. Maybe they're just gonna go even more hardcore: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_K5PGWZ0DWI Nobody seemed to give a poo poo about Christ Joker in Batman: Damned, so might as well have fun with it.
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Dec 7, 2018 18:05
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vseslav.botkin posted:https://www.cbr.com/batman-atheism-tom-king-response/ I didn’t read that as him being atheist at all - I read it as him saying what he needed to say to convince the jurors to do what he wanted them to do.
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Dec 8, 2018 02:45
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Latest Justice League may be one of my favorite Joker stories ever. He just checkmates the entire Legion of Doom plus a giant chunk of the villain community "just" to let Lex know that he loving "can" and that the Batman Who Laughs is even more dangerously competent. This is what happens when he gets mad and super competent. Don't gently caress with the Joker. It doesn't matter who you are, what your name is, or how many high-tier threats are in your crew. It's also a good mirror to Batman also finding a way to beat the Legion of Doom with no arms and legs, just guts and scary levels of competency. The Batman Who Laughs is still ridiculous and kinda bad in a super edgy 90s way. But I'll stick with it. Great run so far. But....I'm also not jaded yet on comics.
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Dec 8, 2018 22:31
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The entire universe conspiring itself to make Batman and Joker the bestest at everything is what I've hated about both of them for years.
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Dec 9, 2018 01:09
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Yeah the Jokers biggest problem is the only way for people to show him as a threat is for him to be super competent. Instead of unpredictable and arbitrary.
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Dec 9, 2018 01:13
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Two Tone Shoes posted:The entire universe conspiring itself to make Batman and Joker the bestest at everything is what I've hated about both of them for years. While I do love the issue and Scott Snyder has been great, I have to second this post. I mean, if you think about it, Lex Luthor should actually be the more competent one. He's perfectly sane, a genius, and is the one who more often deals with Cosmic and hirelevel threats. Actually is kind of weird to think that Joker and Batman are so good at dealing with such individuals when you remember that they primarily deal with Mafia level thugs. Like, if you strip away all the Fanboy love for the characters, it doesn't logically make sense that they are so use and so much better than everyone else at dealing it with such high-level threats, especially the Joker who isn't even regularly on a team that deals with such threats. I'm actually go so far as to say I think this overhype is actually detrimental to the characters. The reason everyone loves these characters, and some Fanboy poo poo on other Heroes, is because they have no powers and that they're normal people. Well, normal people can't pull this poo poo off. Like, it's arguable that they're more overpowered then any other hero just because of how much writers will bend reality to make them the best at everything. And, when you're the best at everything, you do start to get kind of boring. Which is ironic because that's usually why people say Batman is better than Superman, because Superman so powerful that he's boring. But frankly, at this point, I think Batman is way more overpowered than Superman. Recent events have made Batman a little less bat God, but I've been reading some Grant Morrison books from the 90s and it's in full effect there.
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Dec 9, 2018 01:35
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Frankly I don't care if it make Joker too competent, I love any story that clowns on Luthor. He is so great to watch lose.
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Dec 9, 2018 02:10
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Why would you even put the Joker on your team unless you wanted someone there to betray you in the eleventh hour?
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Dec 9, 2018 02:40
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TheHan posted:Why would you even put the Joker on your team unless you wanted someone there to betray you in the eleventh hour? Look at the final page of Final Crisis. Alexander is murdered by the Joker (and the real Lex Luthor.) The reason the Joker kills him is specifically because the Secret Society didn't him to be a part of it.
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Dec 9, 2018 09:22
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TheHan posted:Why would you even put the Joker on your team unless you wanted someone there to betray you in the eleventh hour? In the Justice League comic Lex says that he sees Joker as the Pinnacle of humanity or something like that. Maybe he bought into that hyper sanity thing that I think Morrison floated around ages ago.
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Dec 9, 2018 09:25
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I think one time Luthor says that it's better to invite the Joker than have him find out that you didn't.
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Dec 9, 2018 09:42
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Doctor Spaceman posted:I think one time Luthor says that it's better to invite the Joker than have him find out that you didn't. That’s was in Infinite Crisis. You let the Joker play in your Injustice League. Unrelated, but it’s kind of awesome to have Tom King Batman, Grant Morrison Green Lantern, and Geoff Johns Shazam all on the same day.
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Dec 9, 2018 10:04
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Covok posted:I'm going to take this moment to remind everyone that the judeo Christian islamic God is confirmed to exist in the DC Universe and is referred to as the presence. I was just reading JLA by Grant Morrison so I just read the story where they fought the angels. I like the issue where Zauriel is getting tossed out of a convent after having an argument with the Mother Superior and at one point they have the exchange: "But it's true, I swear!" "Angels do not swear!" "What? Who says?" "It is written!" "But where is it written?" "..." <slams door> And then he explains (to J'onn?) that he was explaining that humans shouldn't assign a human gender to God because God is beyond human comprehension.
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Dec 9, 2018 11:27
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Covok posted:I'm actually go so far as to say I think this overhype is actually detrimental to the characters. The reason everyone loves these characters, and some Fanboy poo poo on other Heroes, is because they have no powers and that they're normal people. Well, normal people can't pull this poo poo off. Like, it's arguable that they're more overpowered then any other hero just because of how much writers will bend reality to make them the best at everything. And, when you're the best at everything, you do start to get kind of boring. Which is ironic because that's usually why people say Batman is better than Superman, because Superman so powerful that he's boring. But frankly, at this point, I think Batman is way more overpowered than Superman. Superman only requires a few steps, they are just fantastical ones. But it's fiction, right? So he's sent to Earth, he has super-powers, but he's not fundamentally more moral or good than Mr. Rogers or Norman Borlaug; he just has the power of Super-Powers instead of crop breeding or public television. So you really only need to have two issues: a guy with super-powers can exist, and that person can be a good person. Batman needs like twelve things to cut his way; leaving aside any advanced ninja assassin training or whatever, he has to be exposed to a particular trauma, fracture in a particular way from that trauma, have the fortitude to train himself up as Batman and have all the resources to let himself do it, and also not have any critical flaws or "realistic" issues along the way. This only becomes slightly easier if you would consider a benchwarming super-detective or a guy in Iron Man-style armor to "count" as Batman.
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Dec 9, 2018 13:56
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Martian Manhunger tho
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Dec 10, 2018 19:36
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^burtle posted:Martian Manhunger tho This is the name of J'onn's branded canned sloppy joe mix
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Dec 10, 2018 20:54
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The way I see it is that Batman's (and Joker's) power isn't that he's a human powered by technical gadgets, skill, and genius. His power is that he's The Best in the universe at what he does. With all the privileges, rights, and bullshit that comes with it.
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Dec 11, 2018 13:52
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Dishwasher posted:The way I see it is that Batman's (and Joker's) power isn't that he's a human powered by technical gadgets, skill, and genius. His power is that he's The Best in the universe at what he does. With all the privileges, rights, and bullshit that comes with it.
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Dec 11, 2018 15:18
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Halloween Jack posted:Well, Infinite Crisis basically happened because of Batman's personal issues, and I thought it kind of sucked, so for that reason I think there's a limit on how far you should take Batman's "The Best, But Also Sad Orphan" power suite. -Your JLA teammates holding you down and brainwashing you so you'd forget they're lobotomizing supervillains -Your best friend from childhood re-entering your life only to have created an elaborate ruse to murder and replace you, implicating several of your friends in the conspiracy -Dick Grayson publicly renouncing you and working with Deathstroke -Jason Todd coming back from the dead and is out to get you -Tim Drake's dad died because one of your friends was a blabbermouth and his crazy ex-wife hired someone to murder Tim Drake's dad so that she could get laid -Stephanie Brown stole some of your plans and ignited a deadly gang war behind your back. -Everyone blame you for the gang war, so a lot of your friends have abandoned you and you're considered an enemy of the GCPD now! -Oh also the closest thing you have to a mother deliberately let Stephanie die to teach you a lesson. -Superman being mind controlled into trying to kill you at least three times in the span of a year, sometimes mind controlled by someone you thought was a friend. -Essentially every single person you know has betrayed you one or more times in the last few months, everyone except trusty Alfred - ... who was kidnapped by Hush and replaced with Clayface for months But hey, you're being PARANOID, Batman! Sure, there's this weird "Superboy" around but you've got to trust him! What could possibly go wrong with Superboy Prime and Alexander Luthor? LEARN. TO. LOVE."
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Dec 11, 2018 16:06
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I've no doubt that you remember it a lot better than I do. I just remember the Identity Crisis brainwashing being the impetus for Batman to create OMAC. Hm, a post-apoc Elseworld where Batman accidentally created Skynet would be pretty cool.
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Dec 11, 2018 16:38
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Halloween Jack posted:I've no doubt that you remember it a lot better than I do. I just remember the Identity Crisis brainwashing being the impetus for Batman to create OMAC. I could've sworn there was a Batman Beyond tie-in with Brother Eye where this happened. I don't remember it's name though.
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Dec 11, 2018 17:55
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Edge & Christian posted:I know I'm a broken record but I kind of love how the narrative of that is "Look Batman, you've got to learn to let love into your heart and trust people! Don't let a few little hiccups like Alfred is the only person who has never betrayed Bruce.
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Dec 11, 2018 17:59
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Halloween Jack posted:I've no doubt that you remember it a lot better than I do. I just remember the Identity Crisis brainwashing being the impetus for Batman to create OMAC. good day for a bris posted:I could've sworn there was a Batman Beyond tie-in with Brother Eye where this happened. I don't remember it's name though. Isn't this just Future's End?
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Dec 11, 2018 17:59
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Covok posted:Isn't this just Future's End? We're all trying to forget that happened
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Dec 11, 2018 18:06
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Covok posted:Alfred is the only person who has never betrayed Bruce. In one story in Whatever Happened to the Caped Crusader he turns out to have been the Joker all along.
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Dec 11, 2018 18:31
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Covok posted:Isn't this just Future's End?
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Dec 11, 2018 18:38
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Covok posted:Isn't this just Future's End? That's the one!
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Dec 11, 2018 18:46
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Covok posted:Alfred is the only person who has never betrayed Bruce. I don't want to have to think about the Outsider today but here we are.
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Dec 11, 2018 19:35
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Is Future's End the one where Batman is eventually just chilling in Metatron's chair?
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Dec 11, 2018 19:55
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MetaBat is one of the high points of Justice League: Darkseid War.
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Dec 11, 2018 19:59
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Covok posted:Alfred is the only person who has never betrayed Bruce. Alfred spent like six months tied up by Hush who was gaslighting Batman trying to convince him that he (Hush) was Thomas Wayne back from the dead and out to destroy his son, while Clayface pretended to be a vengeful traitor Alfred. The problem with Batman for the past 20-30 years (up to and including the current runs) is that one of the stories everyone wants to tell is "Batman you've got to stop being so paranoid!" while simultaneously giving him the most motivation of maybe any character outside of Number 6 to be paranoid.
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Dec 11, 2018 20:03
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Alfred has never betrayed Batman but I think it was around/after the Officer Down event where Alfred quit.
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Dec 11, 2018 20:12
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Space Fish posted:MetaBat is one of the high points of Justice League: Darkseid War. Cool, is there anything vital to read first for context. I'm usually pretty good about just going with the flow, but I've read very, very little New 52 stuff before rebirth.
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Dec 11, 2018 20:51
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The lasting legacy of Future's End is a single ongoing that occasioanlly forgets the whole thing ever happened.
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Dec 11, 2018 21:29
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Skwirl posted:Cool, is there anything vital to read first for context. I'm usually pretty good about just going with the flow, but I've read very, very little New 52 stuff before rebirth. Give a glance at Crisis on Infinite Earths to get to know the Anti-Monitor, and maybe check out the first Geoff Johns Justice League arc for them meeting Darkseid for the first time. I think there was stuff with Superwoman and Ultraman, but I wouldn't advise anyone read Forever Evil, though JL was quite good between there and Darkseid War with Lex on the team and such.
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Dec 11, 2018 21:31
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Teenage Fansub posted:Give a glance at Crisis on Infinite Earths to get to know the Anti-Monitor, and maybe check out the first Geoff Johns Justice League arc for them meeting Darkseid for the first time. My favorite part of Forever Evil will always be the page of Ultraman huffing Kryptonite and declaring "I'M THE STRONGEST AGAIN." It's just so... goofy.
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Dec 12, 2018 01:17
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Argue posted:In one story in Whatever Happened to the Caped Crusader he turns out to have been the Joker all along. Also, I think I actually remember that Alfred died in the pre-crisis universe and then became an evil monster before being saved. So I don't know if that counts.
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Dec 12, 2018 01:35
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Dec 12, 2018 15:33
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