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I like to play with no start bias, and (in the case of these Incas) go find and conquer my drat hills if I'm not lucky enough to spawn on them. It's a fun challenge for me but unfortunately just makes the computer even worse.
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Dec 18, 2018 20:28
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turboraton posted:You know I actually was born in a place that was conquered by Pachacutec but what the hell I salute our new Incan overlords. As is tradition with all civ games, all Peruvians will play the Incas, found a religion and invade/destroy Spain. I'm definitely going Inca immediately. The terrace farms were really good in V, and I like how they blend in a little more this time.
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Dec 18, 2018 20:54
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For people who can't watch the video, what are the stuff Inca gets?
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Dec 18, 2018 20:56
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Inca can work mountains, which give +2 production, and +food for every adjacent terrace farm. Terrace farm can only be built on hills, and give +food for every adjacent mountain, +3 production for an adjacent aqueduct, and +1 production for adjacent fresh water (but the aqueduct bonus overrides the fresh water bonus). They get a medieval era reconnaissance unit that can attack twice a turn if it still has movement over after attacking once. They also get +1 food for every mountain tile in the city of origin in internal trade routes. Can also build an Inca version of the new mountain tunnel improvement much earlier than other civs can build tunnels. Some of those bonuses require certain techs that I can't recall right now.
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Dec 18, 2018 21:03
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chaosapiant posted:I still don’t know if I like natural disasters in a CIV game but everything else in this expansion looks awesome and actually takes the game in a different direction to prior releases. Yea, it's one of those things where it sounds like a really cool idea but actually playing it is probably going to be super annoying. The Glumslinger posted:For people who can't watch the video, what are the stuff Inca gets? All your questions and more are answered at Well of Souls He's got another bullshit random thing for his Agenda though. Taear fucked around with this message at 21:06 on Dec 18, 2018 |
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Dec 18, 2018 21:04
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That's a lot of food.
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Dec 18, 2018 22:44
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chaosapiant posted:I still don’t know if I like natural disasters in a CIV game but everything else in this expansion looks awesome and actually takes the game in a different direction to prior releases. If the random events only caused destruction it would feel pretty bad, but from playing a heap of R&F recently I think they understand pretty well that you can't just have entirely negative events which only punish the player. Dark Ages are disadvantageous, especially if you're trying to conquer anything (the loyalty penalty can make it very hard to occupy enemy cities), but you do get the special civic cards during them to offset some of the downsides. Not that I ever really find them useful. But then if you manage to score enough points for a golden age you actually get a heroic age instead and can choose three dedications, which is really powerful. Sometimes you can plan to have a dark age and a corresponding heroic age, but most of the time I find they tend to happen randomly due to whatever circumstances you find yourself in. Even so, there's usually ways to play around the harmful effects. In Gathering Storm, the volcano eruptions and floods wreck some of your poo poo, but then you get more fertile land afterwards so depending on how prepared you are or how well you managed the negative effects you get a long-lasting benefit that may actually outweigh the downside. You can avoid droughts by using a governor ability or not chopping trees (maybe there's a building that cancels them out too) but I don't think there's any advantage to getting smashed by storms. I guess the gameplay lever there is CO2 emissions. It will be interesting to see how common they are as your industry ramps up; I expect sacrificing production to possibly reduce the frequency of storms is not a choice most of us are going to make, but I do hope there's a new casus belli for being an environmental degenerate.
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Dec 19, 2018 01:45
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Kalko posted:depending on how prepared you are or how well you managed the negative effects you get a long-lasting benefit civ didn't scale effects to game speed very well in 5, and didn't even bother in civ 6, so i doubt it i look forward to a drought that destroys your population and gives you +1 hammer to grasslands tiles for 10 turns on both quick and marathon
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Dec 19, 2018 01:58
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Civ 1 had random natural disasters and it was the best game in the series so I think we'll be fine  In seriousness though they were all (except Earthquakes) preventable by building certain buildings so there was at least an interesting decision to make re: prioritizing those. And earthquakes only happened based on city placement so you had a choice there too. Pakistani Brad Pitt fucked around with this message at 02:08 on Dec 19, 2018 |
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Dec 19, 2018 02:05
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I always play on Epic in Civ 6, which is only 50% longer but I think it was 100% in Civ 5, which makes me think at one point it was the default game length and then they scaled it back for release. Standard just feels too fast, especially on Immortal where the AI advantages skyrocket them ahead. I remember reading back during Civ 5 that increasing the game length has a dampening effect on the AI for some reason (I guess it doesn't know how to deal with the increased costs) and I assume the same is true in Civ 6, so Immortal/Epic feels just right to me in that you can choose to do interesting (aka suboptimal) things some of the time and still have a good chance of winning.
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Dec 19, 2018 02:08
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If you get natural disasters the other civs will give you free gold.
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Dec 19, 2018 02:10
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Kalko posted:I remember reading back during Civ 5 that increasing the game length has a dampening effect on the AI for some reason (I guess it doesn't know how to deal with the increased costs) and I assume the same is true in Civ 6, so Immortal/Epic feels just right to me in that you can choose to do interesting (aka suboptimal) things some of the time and still have a good chance of winning. I believe the official Goon Hivemind answer is that longer games magnify the importance of war, as individual units move around and gain experience "faster" than at the normal speeds. Naturally this helps the player, who is smarter about keeping units alive and using them effectively.
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Dec 19, 2018 02:19
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Krazyface posted:I believe the official Goon Hivemind answer is that longer games magnify the importance of war, as individual units move around and gain experience "faster" than at the normal speeds. Naturally this helps the player, who is smarter about keeping units alive and using them effectively. That's roughly half of it. The rest is because active units will get more actions per tech tier, so it expands your timing windows. On Quick, you have maybe twenty turns before your most basic Archers get teched out by other ranged units and overwhelmingly powerful melee guys. That's barely enough time to take down four or five cities if you're lucky. On Marathon, you have what five? ten times that? That's more than enough time to clear out your entire continent, in the stone age, with Archers. At other speeds, you'll have to stop, regroup, and spend hundreds, if not thousands, of gold outfitting your army to the new global power standard. It's so expensive you might have to spend an entire era banking and teching up. But on Epic or Marathon? Brah no worry, produce an Archer on turn 100 and get him there by 150 and he'll still be golden Fur20 fucked around with this message at 02:36 on Dec 19, 2018 |
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Dec 19, 2018 02:33
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So, is Rise & Fall worth getting yet or should I just presumably wait for the newest expansion?
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Dec 19, 2018 02:44
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What do you guys think will be more fun in GS? Sending your troops across the map only for them to die from a volcano along the way, or sending your troops across the map only to have them die from a tornado along the way?
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Dec 19, 2018 02:52
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It honestly reminds me of desertification and nuclear meltdowns from Civ4, which I had to mod out for being stupid, so hopefully I can turn these off as well.
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Dec 19, 2018 02:55
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Deakul posted:So, is Rise & Fall worth getting yet or should I just presumably wait for the newest expansion? It was always worth getting
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Dec 19, 2018 03:07
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Deakul posted:So, is Rise & Fall worth getting yet or should I just presumably wait for the newest expansion? If you don't want to play Civ VI now.. wait for the expansion to go on sale? If you want to wait until the next expansion, you'll still need to buy Rise and Fall to use that content, which was good. This question comes up every couple of pages, and the decision is 100% in your eyes 'do i want to play civ vi?' or not. I'll cover the answers for you: "Civ vi sucks, go play V" or "Civ vi is a lot of fun" Pick which one you want to hear most and that is your answer. Personally, I think it's a lot of fun and gets the most playtime in Steam lately for me. So far, I'm most excited for the Maori out of what we have so far.. i'm a bit of a sucker for the naval focus and unique start they have. Inca looks really interesting, especially the early mountain pass improvement they get. That could open up for some fun combat opportunities provided terrain makes sense for it. I'm the least interested in Hungary, mostly due to City States being kind of meh, but perhaps they can convince me otherwise. Canada also feels like it could be super useful-- but it pretty much promises the mapgen will also always put you in Tundra starting plots. Oddly enough, this is an amazing choice for a random PYDT game since too many random hosts don't check starting plots.. onesixtwo fucked around with this message at 03:13 on Dec 19, 2018 |
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Dec 19, 2018 03:08
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The Human Crouton posted:What do you guys think will be more fun in GS? Sending your troops across the map only for them to die from a volcano along the way, or sending your troops across the map only to have them die from a tornado along the way? Getting declared on and seeing the enemy army at your gates get wiped out by a volcano. Then your gates get wiped out by the volcano. Eh, probably worth.
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Dec 19, 2018 04:04
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I really hope these idiots expose the amount of damage storms do to units in the XML so I can make a mod that reduces that damage to 0. But I have a feeling this is going to be in the DLL for some dumb reason.
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Dec 19, 2018 04:12
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onesixtwo posted:If you don't want to play Civ VI now.. wait for the expansion to go on sale? If you want to wait until the next expansion, you'll still need to buy Rise and Fall to use that content, which was good. Fair enough, I've played Civ5 to death and got Civ6 in a humble monthly thing awhile back and just never got around to playing it much.
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Dec 19, 2018 04:16
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Deakul posted:So, is Rise & Fall worth getting yet or should I just presumably wait for the newest expansion? You can skip it if you don’t care to play any of the expansions civs as all of the gameplay mechanics from rise fall will be included in gathering storm.
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Dec 19, 2018 04:39
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Deakul posted:So, is Rise & Fall worth getting yet or should I just presumably wait for the newest expansion? Yeah, it's great. I didn't play it much after release but since the new expac announcement I've picked it back up again. I've been playing Spain (not an expac civ, I know) and you kind of have to work to make use of their bonuses. You really want a religion but you don't get any ability-based help with it so it feels like a huge opportunity cost in the early game. The trade route bonus is great when your capital sits on a continental divide and you can game it right from the start, but for some reason every game I begin in that situation I get wiped out by a super early DoW from a close civ or the dreaded barbarian clown car full of horsemen. For all their early game woes, when Spain hits the Renaissance they get a massive power spike. Conquistadors with a religious unit on the same tile (+10), with the Theocracy (+4) combat card plus their starting trait (+4), plus Defender of the Faith or Crusade (another +10) are a force to be reckoned with. They can shrug off multiple Infantry attacks per turn, then when you take an enemy city you get +3 era score for converting it. That's a guaranteed golden age if you take a bunch of cities, which you should.
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Dec 19, 2018 04:54
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If you like Civ 6, rise and fall is a better version of it. Also the more civs to play as and against, the better. I actually wished Firaxis would hold polls for most desired new Civs and then implemented them as DLC.
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Dec 19, 2018 06:55
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One of the major issues with R&F is that it didn't address the flaws of the vanilla game, unlike Civ V's first expansion that actually did things like rewrite combat. R&F didnt' change any fundamental issue in vanilla. It leaves its lovely UI, lovely AI, great prophet points that accumulate into nothing, and many other things that I'm sure would slap me in the face if I felt like starting a game up right now. So it is really accurate to say that if you liked vanilla VI and just want some more of it, then R&F is for you. Because it is exactly Civ VI with an extra floor built on top of your dirty old kitchen Leaving behind old mistakes in the next expansion is a scary pattern. The R&F systems like loyalty, governors, and golden ages are okay; but they can certainly use some changes that they won't get in GS. So you'd better enjoy those systems as they are because that's how they are staying.
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Dec 19, 2018 07:12
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Man the civilopedia/in-game help in Civ 6 is awful. I try to look up what kind of tile a Natural Park needs and there's no 'Natural Park' entry, only 'Naturalist' and even that doesn't tell you what the terrain requirements are. Then I tried to look up how to found a religion and literally the first words in the entry are 'After founding your Religion," 
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Dec 19, 2018 08:31
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Away all Goats posted:Man the civilopedia/in-game help in Civ 6 is awful. Yeah, it blows. I had the exact same issues when I first played! Naturalists are in the Buy with Faith tab after some policy or another. Founding a religion same deal, buy a Great Prophet with Faith or through the GP menu, then scoot him to a holy site and have him declare this the holy city of Crabopolis all hail Crab Pope. Stonehenge comes with a free Prophet, but yikes at trying to rush that.
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Dec 19, 2018 08:45
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National Parks are funny. Here's what you need: -4 adjacent tiles in a vertical diamond shape. -All tiles must have an appeal of charming or greater. -No tiles can have improvements on them -All of these tiles must be in the same city In exchange for all of this, you get tourism or something. The bolded requirement is what makes it really stupid. You can't work national park tiles, so what's the point of having them all in the same city? If anything, having a national park outside your cities would give some use to the land outside of your cities.
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Dec 19, 2018 09:27
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Yeah it's basically an extremely fortunate set of terrain or quite a bit of effort like building the Eiffel Tower. If you have, say, a diamond tile of natural wonders (like the marshy thing that gives bonus culture) or a trio of mountains with a single tile sticking out one side, you're laughing. I remember in one game I had to clear a bunch of jungle tiles to make the terrain nice enough. I can't decide if that's completely ridiculous or exactly the kind of bullshit a world power would do while patting itself on the back. If you're not playing for a cultural victory (and good god every game I play ends up that way), is there any benefit? +5 era points (assuming you're the first, never seen an AI build one) is decent I guess. My latest pedia gripe: I couldn't read what one of the benefits for Communism was while deciding what to changw my government to, so I looked at the pedia entry for it. Absolute garbage, doesn't tell you anything about what the government actually does.
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Dec 19, 2018 11:55
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Also the only way to find out how air units actually work is to find the Air Combat header under the gameplay section of the index. Which used to be somewhere near the bottom, but it's at least been moved up so you don't necessarily have to scroll down to find it. None of the entries on air units or their promotions explain any of this or link to it. There's also no entry for spy actions or the "plant woods" worker actions. The only way to find out what the "fabricate scandal" action is or does is by putting a spy in a city state, and I still have no idea why some tiles can't have woods planted on them even if they're entirely similar to adjacent tiles which can.
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Dec 19, 2018 12:08
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I just love the search box that's the exact same colour as the background edit; also in the least-obvious spot for a search box webmeister fucked around with this message at 12:40 on Dec 19, 2018 |
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Dec 19, 2018 12:38
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:Also the only way to find out how air units actually work is to find the Air Combat header under the gameplay section of the index. Which used to be somewhere near the bottom, but it's at least been moved up so you don't necessarily have to scroll down to find it. None of the entries on air units or their promotions explain any of this or link to it. I was wondering this a while ago, and found out that you can't have a forest next to a lake. I have no idea why. I don't think it's mentioned in-game at all.
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Dec 19, 2018 15:50
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The Human Crouton posted:National Parks are funny. Here's what you need: To be fair, if you really want a park, it's not hard to assign a tile from another city in order to complete. If all four tiles are already in your borders and fit the other three requirements, there's no reason not to. Unless you want useful additions in those tiles instead.
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Dec 19, 2018 16:02
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Another shout out to Civ4's in game civilopedia. As if that game doesn't already have enough that makes it better then all that have come after it and before it.
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Dec 19, 2018 16:44
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dy. posted:I can't wait to see how the AI will fail to use these features. Yeah this.
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Dec 19, 2018 19:50
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chaosapiant posted:To be fair, if you really want a park, it's not hard to assign a tile from another city in order to complete. If all four tiles are already in your borders and fit the other three requirements, there's no reason not to. Unless you want useful additions in those tiles instead. What if there's no city that's within 3 hexes of all four hexes? I don't think it's possible to assign all of them to one city in that case, and you can't make the park.
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Dec 19, 2018 21:41
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The answer is you don’t build a national park and move on to other prospects. I’ve never built one, or felt a reason to use it so that’s kind of an adorably dumb requirements list to learn of for myself. Hell no I’m not harvesting improvements to plant forests. I chopped those for a reason early game. Hopefully with GS they tweak national parks, considering the eco friendly / favor currency that they (should?) probably generate as well? But in general I don’t see it as a problem if you can’t always use a given/every mechanic in a city or game, except this is a dumb mechanic through and through fully agreed even if you had an ideal setup tearing out improvements to build a national park is super dumb. Maori would be the only civ I can imagine leaves enough trees for it to even be viable without terraforming.
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Dec 19, 2018 21:57
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National parks don't bother me much, since you can just ignore them, but archeologists are just the worst. If you completely ignore it some of your hexes become permanently unimprovable since they have artifacts. Last game I played I was close to Kumasi so I had all the culture I needed from their suzerain ability, so I wasn't really interested in building theater squares (well actually I was playing Gorgo so whatever the Greek replacement is called), and the artifacts were just annoying. I did end up getting a couple museums, but honestly I'm not convinced they were worth it since the actual archeologists are so expensive too.
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Dec 19, 2018 23:00
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Civ4 had a better take on the national park national wonder. It wasn't super great there either, but it was interesting fun for a late game city and of course ultimately pointless.
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Dec 20, 2018 00:31
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Staltran posted:I was wondering this a while ago, and found out that you can't have a forest next to a lake. I have no idea why. I don't think it's mentioned in-game at all. Huh, that's probably it. I'll keep an eye on the map next time I play. Cheers. chaosapiant posted:To be fair, if you really want a park, it's not hard to assign a tile from another city in order to complete. If all four tiles are already in your borders and fit the other three requirements, there's no reason not to. Unless you want useful additions in those tiles instead. That only works if all the tiles are within one city's workable area. Cities will claim tiles up to five hexes away, and there's no reassigning those. Plus, as someone said, you might wanna put a park somewhere that's in the 3-hex area of multiple cities. ate poo poo on live tv posted:Another shout out to Civ4's in game civilopedia. As if that game doesn't already have enough that makes it better then all that have come after it and before it. V's civilopedia is also real good and has always had the answer to any question I've needed to ask it, plus a shitton of good flavor text.
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Dec 20, 2018 01:26
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