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PDS easily replaces the turret anyway.
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Jan 4, 2019 15:32
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FFF #276: https://www.factorio.com/blog/post/fff-276 For 0.17 they're updating the spacing between items on a belt so that a compressed belt always holds exactly 8 items per tile and throughput is in multiples of 15 instead of 13.33. This pleases me greatly.
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Jan 4, 2019 17:23
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Paper Tiger posted:FFF #276: https://www.factorio.com/blog/post/fff-276 This is a good change. Now I'll need to redo all my belt furnace blueprints to fully utilize the new throughput.
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Jan 4, 2019 19:39
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Invincible tank thanks to repair drones is the best. just  them all, you don't even need ammo!
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Jan 4, 2019 20:33
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Count Roland posted:Just toss grenades. The best part of the tank is that it isn't made of glass. True, the ability to toss grenades out of the tank is pretty great
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Jan 5, 2019 02:44
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Thanks Gargantua, the latch works, as well as some other gadgets such as a sushi belt, a timer, something that divides output into chests evenly. Those seemed to be the more helpful combinator recipes from the wiki. Are there any other common uses of combinators in the pre-robotics stage? I get how these work but I'm not sure the mechanics are clear enough for me to make original constructions yet.
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Jan 5, 2019 05:07
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So I started a game on the "Train" setting to try and space things out a bit and encourage train usage, since I find them interesting....but I can't find oil anywhere - is it possible to turn off the oil display? Could I have done that somehow? Or am I just getting really, really unlucky with where I'm exploring?  e: I've explored this much so far with no oil that I can see... e2: gently caress, the map generation just hates me, I finally found some... Magus42 fucked around with this message at 06:58 on Jan 5, 2019 |
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Jan 5, 2019 06:51
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Ha, that's pretty funny. With defaultish world settings I usually find oil much closer than that so I'm holding out hope there is some nearby your base. You could explore in a circle or throw up a couple radars for a few minutes to scan things out. Or, use... trains?
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Jan 5, 2019 08:52
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I did finally find more patches, including some quite a bit closer, but I'm having trouble deciding how to setup trains to get things going. I've never done a main bus before, but it seems to be the most common way to rig things up, so I'm considering finding room to do that, but not sure how to work it with trains involved and with my map layout... open to suggestions I suppose I could just find a more open area and start bringing in ore for smelting? Magus42 fucked around with this message at 11:50 on Jan 5, 2019 |
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Jan 5, 2019 11:48
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Magus42 posted:I did finally find more patches, including some quite a bit closer, but I'm having trouble deciding how to setup trains to get things going. I usually do something like this:  If you want some inspiration you can go check out KatherineOfSky or whoever you prefer on YouTube and watch some choice bits of a megabase let's play and you'll see plenty of bus. e: also, build radars TheFluff fucked around with this message at 13:34 on Jan 5, 2019 |
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Jan 5, 2019 12:52
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Thanks, I'll see if I can work something like thatTheFluff posted:e: also, build radars I'm in a no-biter game for now while I get the hang of things
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Jan 5, 2019 23:19
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Magus42 posted:I'm in a no-biter game for now while I get the hang of things Radars give remote vision around them, which you'll be able to use to remotely build things when you get robots, and also passively "explore" surrounding areas for you. They're great no matter if you have biters or not, you should throw them up around any mining outposts and train tracks you build just to find more stuff.
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Jan 5, 2019 23:38
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Radars are worth building everywhere, just for the remote vision they provide! Check the minimap as you're placing them to see the area they will reveal on the map for you.
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Jan 5, 2019 23:43
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Since it took me forever to work it out, you can use remote vision by scrolling in on the map screen. If a radar is nearby you'll scroll all the way in to the regular view. Great for when you get a biter attack warning and want to go have a peek at how serious it is.
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Jan 5, 2019 23:44
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Fans posted:Since it took me forever to work it out, you can use remote vision by scrolling in on the map screen. If a radar is nearby you'll scroll all the way in to the regular view. Great for when you get a biter attack warning and want to go have a peek at how serious it is. And while in this view you can remotely place blueprints for your bots! full automation now
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Jan 5, 2019 23:51
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Are there any cons to bussing iron gears besides, well, having a wider bus? Seems like the things are loving everywhere so I thought I'd dedicate a bus lane or two this time
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Jan 6, 2019 00:23
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One potential con is that your gear production is decoupled from the consumption so keeping production up requires more vigilance than just plopping down some perfect ratio blueprint that generates gears inline
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Jan 6, 2019 00:28
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Ciaphas posted:Are there any cons to bussing iron gears besides, well, having a wider bus? Seems like the things are loving everywhere so I thought I'd dedicate a bus lane or two this time No cons, gears are much more compact that plates. Just don't accidentally convert all your iron into gears and then into blue belts I guess? Blue belts eat up an incredible amount of iron if you're not paying attention.
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Jan 6, 2019 00:52
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Ciaphas posted:Are there any cons to bussing iron gears besides, well, having a wider bus? Seems like the things are loving everywhere so I thought I'd dedicate a bus lane or two this time Iron gears are more compact than iron plates so they make your bus narrower
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Jan 6, 2019 00:55
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M_Gargantua posted:No cons, gears are much more compact that plates. Just don't accidentally convert all your iron into gears and then into blue belts I guess? Blue belts eat up an incredible amount of iron if you're not paying attention. Hell, I made that mistake with red on my last save, I shudder to think of doing that on blue. Chest inventory limits (or circuits) are your friend~
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Jan 6, 2019 01:09
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Ugh I got the itch to restart playing only two days ago and now I keep telling myself to wait for the update. I wonder if Angelbob's function will be undisturbed by the update, given that it's probably all novel entities and recipes  .
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Jan 6, 2019 01:17
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Speaking of mistakes made, ugh, build a drat radar at the start. I'd have seen all these massive loving cliff ranges to my west, right on the bus line, if I had. 
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Jan 6, 2019 06:40
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Ciaphas posted:Speaking of mistakes made, ugh, build a drat radar at the start. I'd have seen all these massive loving cliff ranges to my west, right on the bus line, if I had.
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Jan 6, 2019 08:47
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God I fucking love Diablo 3 gold, it even paid for this shitty title
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That's post-oil, right? I hit the end of the line after just barely getting green science going, so I either have to turn the bus and rebuild or, uh, restart with cliffs off in mapgen
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Jan 6, 2019 09:01
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LLSix posted:Iron gears are more compact than iron plates so they make your bus narrower Just also remember that 1 lane of gears takes two lanes of plate (before production modules) to make. So if you only have, say, 4 smelter lanes of iron plate coming out, and send two to make a lane of gears, it doesn't matter how many belts are on your bus since if those gears get consumed you've only really got 2 lanes of iron plate on your bus. Biggest advantage of having a dedicated gear bus is being able to easily upgrade it to use prod later on - all the gears are made in one place, so it's easy to just rebuild that area instead of going around finding all the individual gear assemblers spread around. Also, when planning your bus, no matter how well you think you've planned everything, leave room for at least 50% more lanes, if not double, than initially planned for. Leave room for pipes - each "lane" of pipe should have room for at least two tiles so you don't have to do weird squiggly things to get your undergrounds lined up without intersecting other pipes. If you end up not needing the room, all you've done is spent a few extra belt, but if you do you save a lot of time in not having to tear up and rebuild half a bus. In this base, my bus runs left to right.  That big section of vertical lines to the right of the copper smelters is just a giant runoff area I left room for expanding my bus if I need to.  (Almost) all of my intermediates are made below the bottom stone path. I didn't leave enough room to put plastics on the bus before red chips wanted to take them off, which is why they're shoved in the top left corner. Good thing I had extra unused space there! Blue chips are temporary just to get me through pre-space science until I can clear that copper patch. Another option for bus design/spacing is to leave an extra set of lanes open between each planned lane - this gives you more room to both add lanes in the future as well as route products off the bus. If you're going to have a consumer use a mixed belt, why send 2 full belts out from the bus when you could mix it inside the bus and send just one belt. I kind of do this in my current design (2 tiles is just enough space if you get creative) but having an extra space there would make it easier. Otherwise it can turn into very spaghetti very quickly: 
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Jan 6, 2019 09:29
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Roflex posted:Another option for bus design/spacing is to leave an extra set of lanes open between each planned lane - this gives you more room to both add lanes in the future as well as route products off the bus. If you're going to have a consumer use a mixed belt, why send 2 full belts out from the bus when you could mix it inside the bus and send just one belt. I kind of do this in my current design (2 tiles is just enough space if you get creative) but having an extra space there would make it easier. Otherwise it can turn into very spaghetti very quickly: Obligatory screenshots: Map:  Bus:  To the far right on the iron plates you can see three lanes going off into the military science factory (which does eat three full yellow belts if it's running all out) so after that there's not much left of those belts. Still, a few splitters and it all gets consolidated into the top lane. Currently bottlenecked by miners - I have plenty of ore but I need to go find more patches to put more miners on so I can have more throughput. Also, wriggling yourself out of not having quite enough space is at least a third of the fun with the game  (another third is trainsperging)
TheFluff fucked around with this message at 11:44 on Jan 6, 2019 |
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Jan 6, 2019 11:37
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Big buses can be really deceptive because they make things look plentiful when they're backed up, and then you add something that actually consumes things and suddenly the entire bus is empty. If you have four belts of iron plate coming out of your smelters, you should not still have four belts of iron plate halfway down your bus. I stick with max two belts of any given product (which works well when you're putting gaps at yellow-underground-length - each product can split off from one side, then you can rebalance the "inside" belt to the outside) - if you need more than that further down the line, add more lanes further out and then merge them back into the bus itself at they point they become necessary.
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Jan 6, 2019 11:50
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It begins! (it feels backwards building this out with red belts already, due to my loving around early-game without a bus)
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Jan 6, 2019 12:07
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Jabor posted:Big buses can be really deceptive because they make things look plentiful when they're backed up, and then you add something that actually consumes things and suddenly the entire bus is empty. If you have four belts of iron plate coming out of your smelters, you should not still have four belts of iron plate halfway down your bus. The point of having lots of belts on a bus is being able to support lots of heavy consumers, as long as not every single one of them is active at the same time (and to have all your smelters and train stations in the same place, I guess). If full capacity for every consumer on the bus is necessary, then a bus probably isn't the right tool for the job at all, and it'll be more fun and use a lot less belts to just go all in on local dedicated production. In my case though I know my science stuff will eat almost exactly eight full yellow belts of iron because I designed it that way, but I don't run it all out all the time so I've attached a whole bunch of other poo poo to the bus as well. With splitter output priority it's super easy to have priority consumers if you want them. (Or in other words, I agree with you that buses should taper off down the line.) Magus42 posted:(it feels backwards building this out with red belts already, due to my loving around early-game without a bus) Red belts are good for buses, you'll use half as much space as with yellows. TheFluff fucked around with this message at 12:29 on Jan 6, 2019 |
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Jan 6, 2019 12:24
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I wish there was a better way to generate mud later in Bob's. If you're doing anything with farming at a large scale, the size of your mud production area ends up absolutely massive (yes, I know, beacons ).
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Jan 6, 2019 13:07
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Ciaphas posted:That's post-oil, right? I hit the end of the line after just barely getting green science going, so I either have to turn the bus and rebuild or, uh, restart with cliffs off in mapgen You can also use underground belts to go through cliffs.
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Jan 6, 2019 15:28
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Magus42 posted:It begins! I would save myself so much trouble if I made each belt on the bus an underground belt apart, instead of just picking something arbitrarily big.
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Jan 6, 2019 16:32
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simble posted:You can also use underground belts to go through cliffs. Good to know! It was like a fuckin forest of cliffs that way though, no room for new builds even with undergrounding Later today I was thinking I might restart with that Quick Start mod on medium; apparently that gives you, among a bunch of other poo poo to kinda skip past the burner phase, 50 construction bots with generator, batteries and personal roboports to run em. It's rare that I get to the Bot Phase of gameplay so might be an interesting changeup
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Jan 6, 2019 16:45
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Ciaphas posted:skip past the burner phase Oh you mean 15 minutes into a new game without mods  Really wish the burner phase was longer, there is the AII mod that does that but it is hilariously unbalanced to the point of some of the supposed burner stuff being better than vanilla electricity. I see people saying that .17 is coming out this month, any specific wording or actual planning for that? I saw on the December FF that they said it would be a couple months more but they were probably referring to.18
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Jan 6, 2019 17:24
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Jeesis posted:Oh you mean 15 minutes into a new game without mods hey it's
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Jan 6, 2019 17:27
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Magus42 posted:It begins! You can get those circuits to fill both sides of the output belt if you switch the iron supply to use underground belts near the second assembler and then output that assembler with a regular inserter onto a belt that is side loading on the output belt.
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Jan 6, 2019 17:49
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I get the feeling I'm stretching on this one, but: is there any way to lay down blueprint ghosts and NOT have them immediately fulfilled by construction bots, besides deconstructing the robotics network in the area? For visualizing layouts and the like.
Ciaphas fucked around with this message at 18:09 on Jan 6, 2019 |
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Jan 6, 2019 17:58
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Ciaphas posted:I get the feeling I'm stretching on this one, but: is there any way to lay down blueprint ghosts and NOT have them immediately fulfilled by construction bots, besides deconstructing the robotics network in the area? For visualizing layouts and the like. I've always had to go off to another empty area outside the network to futz with my blueprints. If I'm doing something where I have to try and fit it into an existing part of my base I'll make a blueprint of that area, then paste that into the empty area before trying to build within/around the ghosts.
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Jan 6, 2019 18:18
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Ciaphas posted:hey it's Mine the big rocks. Each one gives enough stone for multiple furnaces, and sometimes you get coal.
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Jan 6, 2019 18:33
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oh, you CAN mine those 
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Jan 6, 2019 18:52
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