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Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.
Mario Odyssey is a great refinement of the Banjo-Kazooie formula.

steinrokkan posted:

I refuse o play any game that doesn't allow me to invert colors

This is a default option on the Switch!

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!Klams
Dec 25, 2005

Squid Squad

jokes posted:

I said this since Halo:CE, but gently caress games that have hitscan sniper rifles. Or just sniper rifles in general.

I sincerely believe if you added widowmaker's ult on to someone else's (probably mercy tbh) and got rid of widowmaker, the game would be much much better. It's not so much that I don't like playing against her (though I don't really), it's more that I hate having one on my team, where it either feels like we're a person down, or we ARE a person down.

Shibawanko
Feb 13, 2013

13Pandora13 posted:

I'm about to the point of refusing the game that doesn't allow you to turn off head bob in first person. Who the gently caress decided that was a good way to make it more "realistic," my loving vision doesn't bob up and down when I'm walking around.

Similarly I hate that games nowadays have body awareness, like where your own character has a fully rendered body with arms and legs that affect movement rather than just being a hovering eyeball camera like in earlier games. It's so annoying and unnecessary since you will never be able to recreate the actual bodily awareness you have with your own body in a game, so it always just ends up hindering you. Thief Deadly Shadows was one of the first games to do that and mostly sucked because of it.

Shibawanko
Feb 13, 2013

signalnoise posted:

Jet Set Radio Future is significantly worse than Jet Set Radio

Ive only really played JSRF and I liked it a lot although I recognize that it's at its core a bad collectathon type game that's on rails where you mash buttons to go faster. It's just so well presented that I don't care about that.

I tried the first game a bit on steam but can't get the hang of graffiti combos.

Rutibex posted:

Dr Mario is better than tetris

Dr Mario, or, as I refer to it, The Thinking Man's Tetris

Shibawanko fucked around with this message at 10:08 on Jan 7, 2019

BeanpolePeckerwood
May 4, 2004

I MAY LOOK LIKE SHIT BUT IM ALSO DUMB AS FUCK



Shibawanko posted:

Ive only really played JSRF and I liked it a lot although I recognize that it's at its core a bad collectathon type game that's on rails where you mash buttons to go faster. It's just so well presented that I don't care about that.

I tried the first game a bit on steam but can't get the hang of graffiti combos.


First game has far better level design.

naeka
Sep 1, 2008

Shibawanko posted:

Similarly I hate that games nowadays have body awareness, like where your own character has a fully rendered body with arms and legs that affect movement rather than just being a hovering eyeball camera like in earlier games. It's so annoying and unnecessary since you will never be able to recreate the actual bodily awareness you have with your own body in a game, so it always just ends up hindering you. Thief Deadly Shadows was one of the first games to do that and mostly sucked because of it.

Counterpoint: Jurassic Park Tresspasser. Also Dark Messiah oh god the kicks.

BeanpolePeckerwood
May 4, 2004

I MAY LOOK LIKE SHIT BUT IM ALSO DUMB AS FUCK



naeka posted:

Counterpoint: Jurassic Park Tresspasser. Also Dark Messiah oh god the kicks.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tb3gf-d-MyA

abigserve
Sep 13, 2009

this is a better avatar than what I had before

Verisimilidude posted:

You don’t really need to because you find new gear constantly

And gear degradation in most games is just a money sink with no effect on gameplay. At least weapons breaking makes you have to consider how you approach fights and when to use what weapons.

I know this is technically true but it just drove me up the wall in BoTW because choosing between two weapons, that for all intents and purposes are identical except one has bigger number but will break soon isn't an interesting choice at all. It always felt like you had two health bars, one was your actual health and the other was how many non-garbage weapons you had stockpiled in your insanely massive inventory space.

This is something RDR2 got right (if they hadn't hosed it up with the stupid horse JUST LET ME KEEP MY DANG GUNS) where you get two pistols, two rifles and you can only realistically choose them at one point per mission. It felt like you had a real choice to make and it always felt baller using the double barrel when walking into some pricks house and then swapping to the springfield out in the open

A Smoke Break
Feb 28, 2009

*snicker*
Why watch GDQ when ESA does it 1000% better and has more personality.

Shibawanko
Feb 13, 2013

Jontron is dumb as a person but I enjoy his videos and think they're mostly funny.

Whorelord
May 1, 2013

Jump into the well...

the only good streamer is danny brown

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.

!Klams posted:

I sincerely believe if you added widowmaker's ult on to someone else's (probably mercy tbh) and got rid of widowmaker, the game would be much much better. It's not so much that I don't like playing against her (though I don't really), it's more that I hate having one on my team, where it either feels like we're a person down, or we ARE a person down.

Sounds like the same problem as TF2 Snipers, though seems like the alternative with bows isn't necessarily much better. Bad Spies are worse though.


Shibawanko posted:

Similarly I hate that games nowadays have body awareness, like where your own character has a fully rendered body with arms and legs that affect movement rather than just being a hovering eyeball camera like in earlier games. It's so annoying and unnecessary since you will never be able to recreate the actual bodily awareness you have with your own body in a game, so it always just ends up hindering you. Thief Deadly Shadows was one of the first games to do that and mostly sucked because of it.

If you can actually see your feet while platforming though...

bradzilla
Oct 15, 2004

veni veni veni posted:

I wish they'd port this to switch, because my favorite mario game next to the 2 Galaxy games is 3D land, and I want to play World. I like all three of them significantly more than Odyssey. Odyssey was a still a dope game though.

Also Galaxy 2 is the best Mario and it deserves more love.

They need to port Galaxy 1, 2 and 3D World as a bundle. Now that's a Switch game worth $60.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Ghost Leviathan posted:

Sounds like the same problem as TF2 Snipers, though seems like the alternative with bows isn't necessarily much better. Bad Spies are worse though.

All the cool spies never used disguises or cloaked.

Magnitogorsk.
Nov 14, 2004

Global warming is barely a big deal at all compared to the trajectory we used to be on. We'll have to do a lot of environmental engineering projects along certain shorelines and it will be a little warmer and wetter in some places, big fucking deal.

jimmyjams posted:

do any of these complete loving idiots who are mad about "weapons breaking waaaah!!!!!" not realize the whole loving point is to get you to win battles via more unorthodox methods

like luring a guy next to a cliff and smacking him once to send him over. or sniping an explosive barrel from really far off. or rolling a massive boulder down a hill to take out the entire enemy camp, etc etc

imo the point was you save your really good weapons for the pitched battles where you have to stand and fight, like when you get trapped in a gatehouse with a lynel at the castle

You could also incentivize that type of gameplay by making the game a challenge rather than trying to force it with lovely game mechanics

Tim Burns Effect
Apr 1, 2011

still better than twilight princess, the worst zelda game

Waltzing Along
Jun 14, 2008

There's only one
Human race
Many faces
Everybody belongs here

veni veni veni posted:

I wish they'd port this to switch, because my favorite mario game next to the 2 Galaxy games is 3D land, and I want to play World. I like all three of them significantly more than Odyssey. Odyssey was a still a dope game though.

Also Galaxy 2 is the best Mario and it deserves more love.

The fact that they are porting the other Wii U mario is a good sign.

Verisimilidude
Dec 20, 2006

Strike quick and hurry at him,
not caring to hit or miss.
So that you dishonor him before the judges



Magnitogorsk. posted:

You could also incentivize that type of gameplay by making the game a challenge rather than trying to force it with lovely game mechanics

The mechanics are good tho. Maybe you’re just too good at video games.

I found it refreshing that I could beat a difficult encounter by being clever. Cutting down trees to create giant rolling pins, finding boulders that could roll where I wanted them to, luring enemies into traps, setting the grass on fire to give myself a viable jumping point, leaving metal weapons on the ground during a thunderstorm, etc. All the people complaining about this seem to forget that the old combat system still exists, but now you have a variety of weapons to choose from, along with a seemingly infinite number of potential options.

Towards the middle of the game you start finding so many weapons you never really run out, unless you somehow never learned to be careful and resourceful.

It’s basically an ammo system.

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.
Even in the old Zelda games you get a variety of tools and weapons, it's kind of Link's thing, so that seems like a pretty fitting extension of the traditional mechanics too.

Halser
Aug 24, 2016

Verisimilidude posted:

Towards the middle of the game you start finding so many weapons you never really run out, unless you somehow never learned to be careful and resourceful.

Though I never played breath of the wild myself, that's what I see as a problem with resource scarcity in open world games. They often just result in annoyance since it's always inevitable that you'll end up with absurd amounts of <item> eventually. Stuff like that is better saved for games with a set time limit, where the devs can more carefully tune the resource gathering thing so it doesn't turn into background noise eventually.

BioMe
Aug 9, 2012


Halser posted:

Though I never played breath of the wild myself, that's what I see as a problem with resource scarcity in open world games. They often just result in annoyance since it's always inevitable that you'll end up with absurd amounts of <item> eventually. Stuff like that is better saved for games with a set time limit, where the devs can more carefully tune the resource gathering thing so it doesn't turn into background noise eventually.

Yeah, I've wondered about that myself when I hear people defend BotW by saying the scarcity quickly turns into a non-issue. Why even put in the game then?

I mean I know why, open world games need to generate endless busywork to mask the fact they are much smaller games than they pretend to be.

Rutibex
Sep 9, 2001

by Fluffdaddy

BioMe posted:

I mean I know why, open world games need to generate endless busywork to mask the fact they are much smaller games than they pretend to be.

this sort of "open world" needs to just go away. putting 10x the empty space between quest markers does not make for an open world it just makes the game take longer.

The latest dynasty warriors did this. DW games always had big maps full of soldiers to kill, but in order to make an "open world" version of DW the made the map 10x bigger and spaced out the soldiers. now you have to ride your horse for 10 min watching empty terrain between fights, what immersion!

Wrath of the Bitch King
May 11, 2005

Research confirms that black is a color like silver is a color, and that beyond black is clarity.

Rutibex posted:

this sort of "open world" needs to just go away. putting 10x the empty space between quest markers does not make for an open world it just makes the game take longer.

The latest dynasty warriors did this. DW games always had big maps full of soldiers to kill, but in order to make an "open world" version of DW the made the map 10x bigger and spaced out the soldiers. now you have to ride your horse for 10 min watching empty terrain between fights, what immersion!

I used to love Dynasty Warriors, but I feel like they haven't had anything worth playing since 6. And 6 itself wasn't much of a step-up from 5 iirc. Was that Zelda musou game worth the time?

jokes
Dec 20, 2012

Uh... Kupo?

Hyrule warriors rules you won't be disappointed if you like dynasty warriors or zelda at all.

Sardonik
Jul 1, 2005

if you like my dumb posts, you'll love my dumb youtube channel
GDQ is cool and all, an impressive display of both knowledge and execution

But I'm really watching for the cringe. Sweet Jesus is that pure-grade A cringe sometimes. It's a massive shame they seem to have successfully clamped down on that in recent years.

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.

Sardonik posted:

GDQ is cool and all, an impressive display of both knowledge and execution

But I'm really watching for the cringe. Sweet Jesus is that pure-grade A cringe sometimes. It's a massive shame they seem to have successfully clamped down on that in recent years.

Kind of the thing is they end up with the most bland and inoffensive runners and all.


Rutibex posted:

this sort of "open world" needs to just go away. putting 10x the empty space between quest markers does not make for an open world it just makes the game take longer.

The latest dynasty warriors did this. DW games always had big maps full of soldiers to kill, but in order to make an "open world" version of DW the made the map 10x bigger and spaced out the soldiers. now you have to ride your horse for 10 min watching empty terrain between fights, what immersion!

Reminded of how Subnautica, which you may or may not guess I'm crazy about, has an open world that's downright pokey, but disguises it pretty well with short draw distance, verticality and fairly gradually giving you access to faster means of getting around. (also you don't wanna be too hasty going around lest you meet sea monsters)

Rutibex
Sep 9, 2001

by Fluffdaddy

Wrath of the Bitch King posted:

I used to love Dynasty Warriors, but I feel like they haven't had anything worth playing since 6. And 6 itself wasn't much of a step-up from 5 iirc. Was that Zelda musou game worth the time?

when I want to play some DW I play Warriors Orochi 3 Ultimate. they haven't made a better one since imho

poverty goat
Feb 15, 2004



Skyrim does a good job of filling the empty space with stuff that will at least grab your attention and tell you more about the world than simply walking from A to B down a road and encountering some monsters. Almost nobody ever sees them, because they fast travel, but if you actually travel the roads on a horse as Talos intended there are hundreds of random NPC encounters that can occur along the roads, and little non-quest map locations en route with silly tableaus about how the previous owner came to be eaten by his pet rats or whatever. It's silly, and bethesda can't write so it's all done poorly, but this bare minimum of content slathered all over the map is transformative compared to an empty open world full of procedural busywork with no character. It just goes to show how low this bar is

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Sardonik posted:

GDQ is cool and all, an impressive display of both knowledge and execution

But I'm really watching for the cringe. Sweet Jesus is that pure-grade A cringe sometimes. It's a massive shame they seem to have successfully clamped down on that in recent years.

Dont tell me they started vetting donation messages everytime a girl sits down on the couch. It was always weird to watch them uncomfortably squirm as nerds made donation promises that specifically called them out and or called for them to do something.

It made me feel like a right lady killer in comparison.

Twelve Batmans
Dec 24, 2009

by FactsAreUseless
AGDQ has had its teeth and claws and everything interesting about it ripped out and replaced with bland jokes and unexciting commentary.

I treat it like e3 now- skip the event itself and then find a curated collection of the cringiest parts.

poverty goat
Feb 15, 2004



friday at 8pm EST is the TASBot block

A Smoke Break
Feb 28, 2009

*snicker*

poverty goat posted:

friday at 8pm EST is the TASBot block

Who cares.

I'll watch ESA instead

SpazmasterX
Jul 13, 2006

Wrong about everything XIV related
~fartz~

poverty goat posted:

friday at 8pm EST is the TASBot block

It's all of two games and the last year and a half have been pretty boring TAS runs instead of game breaking code injections that were wayyyyyy more interesting.

The Pirate Captain
Jun 6, 2006

Avast ye lubbers, lest ye be scuppered!
The point of BotW weapon degradation is to get the player to try new stuff, but in practice it doesn't work at all. Within a few hours your inventory will be full of items and good weapons, and one breaks every time you start a fight. You trade it out for whatever the enemy was carrying, but those are almost always trash weapons, so why would I do that? Within a couple of hours of starting the game, I had an inventory full of weapons that I liked that I never wanted to use because they would break, so I just skipped 99% of battles, doing only those I had to for the plot or that I knew would give me better gear. There's no incentive to do otherwise, especially since the combat mechanics themselves are simplistic and not much fun. Every encounter left me with worse equipment than I had before it.

Instead of that, they could do something like Diablo, or Nioh, or any other of the thousands of loot games (BotW is a loot game, it's just bad at doing loot) and give you progressively better equipment of different types as you progress and encourage experimentation that way.

The puzzles/shrines were entertaining enough, and the world was very pretty, but I guess I'm an edgelord for recognizing that a popular game has problems and is "just ok".

ditty bout my clitty
May 28, 2011

by FactsAreUseless
Fun Shoe

Whorelord posted:

the only good streamer is danny brown

O’ danny brown, the views the views are fallin’

bradzilla
Oct 15, 2004

The Pirate Captain posted:

The point of BotW weapon degradation is to get the player to try new stuff, but in practice it doesn't work at all. Within a few hours your inventory will be full of items and good weapons, and one breaks every time you start a fight. You trade it out for whatever the enemy was carrying, but those are almost always trash weapons, so why would I do that? Within a couple of hours of starting the game, I had an inventory full of weapons that I liked that I never wanted to use because they would break, so I just skipped 99% of battles, doing only those I had to for the plot or that I knew would give me better gear. There's no incentive to do otherwise, especially since the combat mechanics themselves are simplistic and not much fun. Every encounter left me with worse equipment than I had before it.

Instead of that, they could do something like Diablo, or Nioh, or any other of the thousands of loot games (BotW is a loot game, it's just bad at doing loot) and give you progressively better equipment of different types as you progress and encourage experimentation that way.

The puzzles/shrines were entertaining enough, and the world was very pretty, but I guess I'm an edgelord for recognizing that a popular game has problems and is "just ok".

Nintendo culls a very special type of brokebrain.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Other ways to incentivize weapon switching is to make combat good and varied such that you constantly change what weapon you're using to fit the enemy you're fighting. And to make doing so a single button tap. Imagine if they put some effort into making the combat good and all of those cool items you normally find playing a part in it.

a bone to pick
Sep 14, 2011

by FactsAreUseless
The weapon system in New Vegas is perfect, second-best goes to the STALKER games.

The Pirate Captain
Jun 6, 2006

Avast ye lubbers, lest ye be scuppered!

FoolyCharged posted:

Other ways to incentivize weapon switching is to make combat good and varied such that you constantly change what weapon you're using to fit the enemy you're fighting. And to make doing so a single button tap. Imagine if they put some effort into making the combat good and all of those cool items you normally find playing a part in it.

Yeah, I've always liked the Ratchet & Clank games for doing exactly this, there are lots of different weapons at your disposal and each of them is useful in different situations, so you end up constantly switching stuff up. Very well designed.

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Olaf The Stout
Oct 16, 2009

FORUMS NO.1 SLEEPY DAWGS MEMESTER
It's a fine and minor system. Just reminds me of all my friends who would never play majoras mask because of the timer and day reset design. People just can't handle even the tiniest of constraints.

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