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Sinteres posted:Good thing someone succeeded in getting cspam posters to show up and turn this into a referendum on the US rather than anything having to do with Venezuela. Whether or not the U.S. intervenes in Venezuela has a hell of a lot to do with Venezuela. 
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Jan 23, 2019 21:06
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Flip Yr Wig posted:I loving hate minorities and loving hate poor people having access to free medicine and loving hate it more than anything that the 2% don’t get to gut the country while laughing at the pain of poor people as they starve to death
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Jan 23, 2019 21:06
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Sinteres posted:Good thing someone succeeded in getting cspam posters to show up and turn this into a referendum on the US rather than anything having to do with Venezuela. The US chose to get involved so 
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Jan 23, 2019 21:06
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ChaseSP posted:Literally propaganda Maduro uses that any opposition are far right radicals rather than poor people tired of mass corruption. I mean https://twitter.com/telesurenglish/status/1088144777336504324
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Jan 23, 2019 21:07
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sorry venezuela you're stuck with your existing military supported dictatorship who seized power through a coup because, gently caress, it could be worse!
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Jan 23, 2019 21:07
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Got me.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:07
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Nevermind, I guess the people who are leading the opposition in Venezuela are well meaning social democrats, and not the right-wing oligarchs who have been trying to win back power for 20 years. Looking forward to the policies of the new regime.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:07
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There are tons of images of people protesting against Maduro despite people showing up with guns to kill them when they do, but your picture of the fraction of the country that still supports Maduro turning out definitely means he's super popular.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:08
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Seven Hundred Bee posted:sorry venezuela you're stuck with your existing military supported dictatorship who seized power through a coup because, gently caress, it could be worse! Do you think the U.S. intervening will help? Sinteres posted:There are tons of images of people protesting against Maduro despite people showing up with guns to kill them when they do, but your picture of the fraction of the country that still supports Maduro turning out definitely means he's super popular. This is a false binary; counter-protesters can not like Maduro, but still oppose a far-right coup.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:08
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ah, so you’re saying you support Qadafi?? You want the Libyan people to suffer underneath his dictatorship?
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Jan 23, 2019 21:09
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THS posted:Nevermind, I guess the people who are leading the opposition in Venezuela are well meaning social democrats, and not the right-wing oligarchs who have been trying to win back power for 20 years. Looking forward to the policies of the new regime. Yes, they actually are Perhaps you should inform yourself before forming an opinion on something. Oh wait you say you’re both white AND a gringo? Nevermind do whatever you want mister sir
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Jan 23, 2019 21:09
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Majorian posted:Do you think the U.S. intervening will help? Recognizing the last person to be democratically elected in the country isn't a far right coup.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:10
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1. Maduro is an illegitimate dictator who has usurped the constitutional order 2. The protests in the streets and the opposition in the AN are actual legitimate protest movements seeking to restore self-determination to the Venezuelan people 3. The US and Bolsonaro are horrible fascists whose intervention is vehemently opposed to None of these positions is mutually exclusive
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Jan 23, 2019 21:10
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Sinteres posted:The US says all options are on the table about everything. Bush, Obama and Trump have all said it about Iran a billion times and we never invaded Iran. Considering that noted US ally Israel routinely bombed Iran and the US government under Bush clearly wanted to, I don’t think this is a great example. Majorian posted:I think we all agree Maduro's bad I think this is optimistic tbh.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:10
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Lightning Knight posted:As a general rule, I think encouraging military coups in other countries is not a good thing. The military coup already happened several years ago, the formal abandonment of the legal constitution occurred on August 8, 2017. That seems to be what you're missing here. The country is already run by a dime store Pinochet. Venezuela is, right now, already at the level of the worst of the cold war capitalist military dictatorships of South America. Under Maduro's hand all of the advances Hugo Chavez achieved in combating poverty have been shredded, and on top of that the major economic sectors have been gutted in the name of lining the pockets of high regime officials.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:10
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Majorian posted:Do you think the U.S. intervening will help? I think direct, military intervention would be a huge mistake. I also think that the US recognizing the actual democratically elected President in conjunction with many other countries is neither a coup nor intervention.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:10
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Sinteres posted:There are tons of images of people protesting against Maduro despite people showing up with guns to kill them when they do, but your picture of the fraction of the country that still supports Maduro turning out definitely means he's super popular. why don't you post them
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Jan 23, 2019 21:11
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fishmech posted:The military coup already happened several years ago, the formal abandonment of the legal constitution occurred on August 8, 2017. That seems to be what you're missing here. The country is already run by a dime store Pinochet. You don’t give a gently caress about the legacy of Hugo Chavez you cretin.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:11
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Lightning Knight posted:Considering that noted US ally Israel routinely bombed Iran and the US government under Bush clearly wanted to, I don’t think this is a great example. Israel doesn't bomb Iran, they bomb Iranian forces in Syria. I'm not saying that's wonderful either, but there's a pretty significant difference.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:12
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Seven Hundred Bee posted:I think direct, military intervention would be a huge mistake. The recognition is a tool to justify further us action in the area, nothing more. The us has never once given a gently caress about legitimate democracy in South American and any action should be seen as an attempt at furthering it's own economic interestes.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:13
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Kurnugia posted:why don't you post them https://twitter.com/TheAtlPhoto/status/851847506359181313
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Jan 23, 2019 21:14
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Sinteres posted:Israel doesn't bomb Iran, they bomb Iranian forces in Syria. I'm not saying that's wonderful either, but there's a pretty significant difference. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Opera?wprov=sfti1 fishmech posted:The military coup already happened several years ago, the formal abandonment of the legal constitution occurred on August 8, 2017. That seems to be what you're missing here. The country is already run by a dime store Pinochet. I don’t think the US should intervene regardless tbh. The US government is not a good faith actor. I also think the best case scenario would’ve been for Maduro to step down. I think that ship sailed with the foreign recognition.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:15
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Seven Hundred Bee posted:I think direct, military intervention would be a huge mistake. The only thing that makes me at all doubt this administration won't go in for an actual intervention has been their inability to pull off any kind of sustained and complex operation. They've telegraphed their desire to intervene for the last two years.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:15
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Kurnugia posted:why don't you post them Why don't you read the thread? Or at least Chuck Boone's posts? I guess its easier to randomly get in here when a crisis happens and poo poo up the thread though.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:15
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You didn't get the country right this time either. That was Iraq, and 1981 isn't a timely reference.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:16
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I’m glad to know American exceptionalism is alive and well and that Venezuelans are NOT allowed to make their own decisions
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Jan 23, 2019 21:19
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Sinteres posted:You didn't get the country right this time either. That was Iraq, and 1981 isn't a timely reference. Oh darn it I copied the wrong thing. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.timesofisrael.com/israel-destroyed-irans-nuclear-program-already-last-year-leaked-intelligence-claims/amp/ But lol that Israel bombs so many of its neighbors with impunity.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:19
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Furia posted:I’m glad to know American exceptionalism is alive and well and that Venezuelans are NOT allowed to make their own decisions The last time Venezuelans were allowed to freely vote, the opposition won, which is why this guy's the legitimate leader of the country. Of course there should be new elections once the Maduro military regime collapses though.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:19
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Furia posted:I’m glad to know American exceptionalism is alive and well and that Venezuelans are NOT allowed to make their own decisions No one in America is keeping Maduro in power.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:20
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Sinteres posted:The last time Venezuelans were allowed to freely vote, the opposition won, which is why this guy's the legitimate leader of the country. Of course there should be new elections once the Maduro military regime collapses though. And when, inevitably, this does not happen, and conveniently the new Venezuelan dictator is friendly to the US? Aw, darn, so sad, what a terrible outcome, I’m sure.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:21
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Sinteres posted:The last time Venezuelans were allowed to freely vote, the opposition won, which is why this guy's the legitimate leader of the country. Of course there should be new elections once the Maduro military regime collapses though. Yeah, I know. I’m making fun of the people that come in here pretending to care about what happens to us once we are in the news
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Jan 23, 2019 21:21
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Furia posted:I’m glad to know American exceptionalism is alive and well and that Venezuelans are NOT allowed to make their own decisions Who do you think is actually arguing this? Quote their posts, please.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:22
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THS posted:No one in America is keeping Maduro in power. Then there is no issue with recognizing his re-election as illegitimate, given the fraud that took place, right?
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Jan 23, 2019 21:22
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Lightning Knight posted:Aw, darn, so sad, what a terrible outcome, I’m sure This but unironically because I actually give a poo poo about my friends and family and am not an extremely online american
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Jan 23, 2019 21:22
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Lightning Knight posted:Oh darn it I copied the wrong thing. uh, a rumored commando raid isnt really the same thing as a bombing campaign
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Jan 23, 2019 21:22
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Lightning Knight posted:And when, inevitably, this does not happen, and conveniently the new Venezuelan dictator is friendly to the US? Aw, darn, so sad, what a terrible outcome, I’m sure. I agree that the global climate for democracy is worse than it's been in decades, but I don't think that means we need to hope today's dictators stay in power forever. This isn't a country with ethnic and sectarian divisions that's likely to tear itself apart the second the people are allowed to decide, so I think there's more hope for Venezuela than many places. I don't think US intervention is the right way to get there, but I do think diplomatic gestures are appropriate.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:23
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Lightning Knight posted:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Opera?wprov=sfti1 So Venezuelans should embrace their military dictatorship that starves and oppresses them because right wing governments oppose him? Gotcha.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:23
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poo poo.stay safe venezuelogoons.hope you kick maduros poo poo in and please dont replace him with a right wing fascist.by the law of averages, one of these days something will have to turn out ok in latin america. solidarity.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:23
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American involvement in Central and South America has always turned out well, and I'm looking forward to the continuation of our long history of positive impact in the region.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:25
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Lightning Knight posted:I also think the best case scenario would’ve been for Maduro to step down. I think that ship sailed with the foreign recognition. The idea that Maduro would be willing to simply "step down" under any circumstances is almost endearing in its naivete.
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Jan 23, 2019 21:25
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