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docbeard posted:Overwrite is basically where anything run through Mod Organizer throws log files/output files/etc. What you've got looks like SSEEdit working files (though I'm not really sure what those cache files are, though some casual googling suggests they're used by SSEEdit to speed up load times should you need to reopen those mods) and the backup it made of BSHeartland.esm before modifying it. It's probably not super wise but I just deleted those since there were no specific instructions and haven't had any issues since.
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Jan 25, 2019 15:32
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ProfessorCirno posted:Basically, TES modding has only gotten more weird, technical, and complicated since Morrowind, in large part because of how bad the modding tools are. But also because the ESM/ESP format is fundamentally flawed. Its main problem is that it doesn't have a concept of a partial record. Like if you change an NPC's name, it'll create a mod that contains the updated record for that NPC with their new name, but also everything else -- their inventory, statistics, race, sex, hair style, skin tone, facegen data, etc. That's why you have all these mod conflicts and you need third-party patcher tools that will compare records to see what they actually changed and allow to merge the changes. You could entirely eliminate the need for Wrye Bash/Mator Smash/etc. just by changing how the engine and the editor handle data records. This alone would make mod management a lot simpler and make load order less important.
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Jan 25, 2019 16:14
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Lol if Bethesda is ever gonna deviate from the garbage fire they call an "engine" though
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Jan 25, 2019 17:12
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Cat Mattress posted:But also because the ESM/ESP format is fundamentally flawed. Its main problem is that it doesn't have a concept of a partial record. Like if you change an NPC's name, it'll create a mod that contains the updated record for that NPC with their new name, but also everything else -- their inventory, statistics, race, sex, hair style, skin tone, facegen data, etc. That's why you have all these mod conflicts and you need third-party patcher tools that will compare records to see what they actually changed and allow to merge the changes. Never mind the new "ESPFE" and "ESL" format(s) that Bethesda threw into the mix with the Creation Kit releases, which apparently allow extending mod lists past 255. The debate over the usefulness of this new format header has caused another huge divide in the community, with Mator and company refusing to recognize any ESL files, and a lot of the old school mod tool/patch writers jumping on board with both feet and embracing it as the Silver Bullet that would fix all the mod management issues. Then it turned out that the new format only works for certain types of patches and mods that are "content only", and there are a number of unintentional side effects because no one really *knows* just wtf Bethesda did with regard to the new format, so people are starting to pull back quick on overweening use of the ESL format.
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Jan 25, 2019 18:32
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Addamere posted:I'll give this a look since it is apparently getting nothing but praise in this thread. I trust you not to let me fall. It's very much a "preview" of Beyond Skyrim: Cyrodiil. There's hints of larger storylines going on that don't really have any payoff yet. There's also not a "main quest" there so to speak (although I'd consider the quest chain from the guard captain that), but I thought it was very well done. I feel like it handles the Thalmor / Talos / White-Gold Concordat situation way way better than vanilla Skyrim in that it's actually of any consequence whatsoever. Beyond Skyrim is super ambitious in general and feels like it has the capacity to eclipse Skyrim altogether for future playthroughs but who knows if they can pull it off. Iverron fucked around with this message at 18:36 on Jan 25, 2019 |
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Jan 25, 2019 18:32
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Also - Jesus Christ, I leave this forum post for a week and 10 new pages are added? I can't keep up! But taking a week off to play RDR2 has been rather soul-cleansing, as I avoided entirely dealing with the oft-mentioned toxicity of the community. Wanted to comment on DrNutt's issues though - did you ever fix your blackface issues? I have managed to be free of them, but that may be due more to avoiding most mods that change the same NPCs (mods that add new NPCs don't overlap). I was schooled fairly well on the cause of those by some experienced folks on the Modding Tools Discord (which I wouldn't recommend unless you have a lot of patience for people who lack patience). At a high level, it has mostly to do with how the engine prioritizes "archives" over "loose files" for face data files. This screws with the expected handling of file conflicts. If you've been doing any sort of modding before, you're probably aware of how the "last installed" mod/file "wins" because it's the last file changed. And mod organizers have gone a long way towards helping us manage this behavior, as we can easily re-organize "loading order" of mods so that the engine prioritizes the mods we want, without having to worry about the exact installation order (as the mod organizers effectively handle the file copying for us). The problem is that some mods are made up of "loose files", others "archives" (the *.bsa format you see). And when Skyrim sees a BSA, it unpacks the contents, but prioritizes an identical file in a BSA over its non-archived duplicate. For NPC files, this is a problem because "NPC Joe" might have its mesh/texture data files in both a mod with a BSA extension, *and* archived in a BSA mod. These texture/mesh files are what's used to give the NPC model its shape and coloring. Now the mesh/texture references are in the *.esp files for these mods - so the 2 mods in conflict both point to the same NPC files, but which one gets loaded (the one in the BSA vs the loose file one) is potentially up in the air. IF the "install" order, and the "load" order of these conflicting plugins are out of sync, you end up with the engine, when it looks at the "winning" *.esp file, getting confused. TLDR: make sure your install order (aka Mod Priority in MO2, the lefthand pane) matches the load order.
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Jan 25, 2019 18:54
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so going back to modlists for a minute, it looks like nordic skyrim has been taken down over some drama
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Jan 25, 2019 19:21
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Red Metal posted:so going back to modlists for a minute, it looks like nordic skyrim has been taken down over some drama Should be back soon, apparently someone pointed out a bunch of typos and the author went a bit nuts. Gotta love this community.
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Jan 25, 2019 19:29
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DuchessOfKvetch posted:Also - Jesus Christ, I leave this forum post for a week and 10 new pages are added? I can't keep up! I "fixed it" by getting rid of all my character overhaul mods and just rolling with diversity only. It works well enough for what I want and I don't have to worry about those conflicts anymore. Definitely the biggest pain in the rear end I ran into with modding, and that includes messing around with FNIS stuff.
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Jan 25, 2019 19:33
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docbeard posted:Overwrite is basically where anything run through Mod Organizer throws log files/output files/etc. What you've got looks like SSEEdit working files (though I'm not really sure what those cache files are, though some casual googling suggests they're used by SSEEdit to speed up load times should you need to reopen those mods) and the backup it made of BSHeartland.esm before modifying it. Thanks! Another issue just arose as soon as I moved on to the TreeLOD billboards for Beyond Skyrim Bruma: when trying to Query Info for that mod, I get the error in MO2: 13:27:35.961 [D] Failed to request file info from nexus: empty response. Can I just double-click to Install as normal, or should I give it a few minutes/hours for some Nexus-specific foible to clear itself, or what?
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Jan 25, 2019 20:29
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Addamere posted:Thanks! Yeah I ran into that a couple times and as far as I can tell there are just one or two mods that retain the red exclamation point and do not query info correctly from Nexus. I just ignored them and didn't ever really run into any problems.
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Jan 25, 2019 20:41
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DrNutt posted:Yeah I ran into that a couple times and as far as I can tell there are just one or two mods that retain the red exclamation point and do not query info correctly from Nexus. I just ignored them and didn't ever really run into any problems. Thanks again. Should get much modding in today and perhaps play skyrim this weekend
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Jan 25, 2019 21:03
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Addamere posted:Thanks again. Should get much modding in today and perhaps play skyrim this weekend Ha ha, sure, sure you are.
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Jan 25, 2019 21:10
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Jan 25, 2019 21:44
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My ancestors actually play the game after modding it, imperial. Can you say the same?!
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Jan 25, 2019 21:45
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Addamere posted:Thanks again. Should get much modding in today and perhaps play skyrim this weekend Friend, you've been playing Skyrim. There's also the minigame where you get to run around stabbing dragons and maybe you'll get to play that too.
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Jan 25, 2019 22:00
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Red Metal posted:so going back to modlists for a minute, it looks like nordic skyrim has been taken down over some drama Rip 
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Jan 25, 2019 22:04
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Cat Army 
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Skyrim modding and petty tyranny go hand in hand unfortunately.
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Jan 25, 2019 22:22
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lmao never change nexus. Please, for the love of gently caress, change. That poo poo is annoying.
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Jan 25, 2019 22:43
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Red Metal posted:so going back to modlists for a minute, it looks like nordic skyrim has been taken down over some drama Welp, there goes that. Glad I already did it. Time to preserve this MO2 profile and never touch anything.
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Jan 25, 2019 22:44
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is this just a guide not even an actual mod
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Jan 25, 2019 23:39
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Berke Negri posted:is this just a guide not even an actual mod yes, from when i looked at it.
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Jan 25, 2019 23:43
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Oh no a certain string of words that were on the internet oh no how will I ever get them again???
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Jan 26, 2019 00:01
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KakerMix posted:Oh no a certain string of words that were on the internet oh no how will I ever get them again??? "No, you don't understand, these are MY words, you simpleton, you child! Don't you know who I am? I'm sakura_vamp97. Yes, THE sakura_vamp97, author of the famous Improved Argonian Right Thumb Texture Pack (which I have de-listed due to blatant disrespect such as 'asking questions'), and you WILL show me the respect I deserve!"
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Jan 26, 2019 00:17
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If people care here's a PDF https://mega.nz/#!dQEXEaTB!N6PMexp8J4aA7n60hotaKElmzoQREjvjwwp9g7BRz-Y
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Jan 26, 2019 00:39
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Node posted:Is it important to clean master files and make a merged patch with SSEdit? I have a fairly light mod list. Anybody know?
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Jan 26, 2019 00:41
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Node posted:Anybody know? Yes and yes - but you don't need a merged patch. You want a smashed patch, followed by a bash patch with just level list and actor merges (i.e. only select those two when building your bashed patch, it's an option).
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Jan 26, 2019 00:43
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The Iron Rose posted:Yes and yes - but you don't need a merged patch. You want a smashed patch, followed by a bash patch with just level list and actor merges (i.e. only select those two when building your bashed patch, it's an option). Thanks. Unfortunately the game glitches out at the intro scene and the horse cart flips all around, people fly off horses and the cart, and it eventually stops and doesn't move. I don't want to use the alternate start mod to work around this. Is this a fix for this? I have the game capped at 60 frames per second like google says but that hasn't helped.
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Jan 26, 2019 01:54
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Node posted:Thanks. Unfortunately the game glitches out at the intro scene and the horse cart flips all around, people fly off horses and the cart, and it eventually stops and doesn't move. I don't want to use the alternate start mod to work around this. Is this a fix for this? I have the game capped at 60 frames per second like google says but that hasn't helped. Only way I've found is to disable all/some mods (easy in MO2), start a new game, save as soon as you can, quit, and then enable all the mods and start playing again. Unfortunately this does not work for every mod, so this might not work for you. I'd hate to suggest this, you get 20 hours into playing, and then it falls apart because something needed to be running from the start. Hit or miss.
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Jan 26, 2019 02:06
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HoboTech posted:Only way I've found is to disable all/some mods (easy in MO2), start a new game, save as soon as you can, quit, and then enable all the mods and start playing again. https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/8004/?tab=description This fixed it for me. So far.
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Jan 26, 2019 02:34
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Node posted:https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/8004/?tab=description Well... I guess they never miss, huh? Seriously, I can't believe it didn't occur to me that to fix issues with mods, you just need more mods. Right on.
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Jan 26, 2019 02:38
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HoboTech posted:Well... I guess they never miss, huh? Yeah, when I was having the black face issue, I found a mod that claimed to fix it, but it didn't work.
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Jan 26, 2019 02:43
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DrNutt posted:Yeah, when I was having the black face issue, I found a mod that claimed to fix it, but it didn't work. Isn't there like a million possible causes for that bug, though? All I know is I've seen a dozen different ways to fix it from a dozen different mods, but I'm not well-versed in this poo poo so I don't know. edit: i also don't know what causes the cart freakouts but from the mod posted I'm guessing it's a mesh issue?
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Jan 26, 2019 02:48
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HoboTech posted:Isn't there like a million possible causes for that bug, though? All I know is I've seen a dozen different ways to fix it from a dozen different mods, but I'm not well-versed in this poo poo so I don't know. Well I don't know about million causes, the cause is usually that there is a mesh conflict with two or more mods. But depending on your mod setup it could be a pain in the rear end to track down exactly where the conflict is coming from, so a mod that was claiming to fix it seemed neat. The mod author was totally upfront about it not working for everyone, so it's not like I was that disappointed or upset or anything. Would have certainly made things easier though!
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Jan 26, 2019 02:52
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DrNutt posted:Well I don't know about million causes, the cause is usually that there is a mesh conflict with two or more mods. This is probably what made it seem like that to me, because it was mentioned on every NPC mod, either on the description page or the posts section. This explains a lot of those "go into the mod and hide/delete all these folders" I ended up doing in the guide.
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Jan 26, 2019 02:56
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HoboTech posted:This is probably what made it seem like that to me, because it was mentioned on every NPC mod, either on the description page or the posts section. Yeah that's one part of tucoguide I still don't understand. He has you install all of the Bijin stuff, but then has you hide the relevant esps, and then has you download the all in one. Am I insane for thinking if you wanted the lovely Bijin real doll mods that you could just download, you know, the all in one to begin with?
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Jan 26, 2019 02:59
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cart freakouts actually do have a million different causes if i remember correctly because how they're programmed is held together by make believe and its why you never see one actually moving outside the opening cinematic
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Jan 26, 2019 03:02
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DrNutt posted:Yeah that's one part of tucoguide I still don't understand. He has you install all of the Bijin stuff, but then has you hide the relevant esps, and then has you download the all in one. Am I insane for thinking if you wanted the lovely Bijin real doll mods that you could just download, you know, the all in one to begin with? the all-in-one is just a combined esp, no face textures or meshes
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Jan 26, 2019 03:05
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HoboTech posted:edit: i also don't know what causes the cart freakouts but from the mod posted I'm guessing it's a mesh issue? The most common way being the cart's physics freaking out. That mod messes with the cart's mesh and tweaks the Havok settings so it should be less prone to freaking out. But it's not really a fix. In most cases it's better to activate mods that can break the intro sequence after it's over and you've left the cave.
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Jan 26, 2019 03:14
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Red Metal posted:the all-in-one is just a combined esp, no face textures or meshes Oh what a weird thing. Raygereio posted:Basically the whole Helgen-introduction sequence is very sensitive. In the default, vanilla state it will work fine. But mods that touch physics, skeletons, spawn points, leveled lists and probably some other things I'm forgetting can cause something to break in some way. Thanks to Live Another Life I'm never sitting through that loving thing ever again.
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Jan 26, 2019 03:26
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